Just installed a Progress RSB – Thoughts and Questions
07-07-2009, 03:15 PM
#1
Just installed a Progress RSB – Thoughts and Questions
This morning I had a brand new Progress Rear Sway Bar installed; purchased from Cattman Performance. (Brian Catts rocks.) I brought it to my mechanic because he has a lift, tools, experience, etc. He’s a great guy, and it was certainly worth the $50.
Afterward, I drove around a lot, hitting all the familiar roads, highway ramps and sweeping turns. The feel of the RSB is subtle, but significant in what it makes possible. Body roll is noticeably reduced, elevating the extents to which I can take a wide turn. It allows for appreciatively higher speeds where I would normally be screeching the tires and dancing at the edge of control. In a nutshell, I can take wide turns much faster than before… which is way fun.
But it also allows me to power out of those sweeping turns without having to fight for control. Coming out of a wide turn and accelerating is now more of a point-n-shoot experience. There’s much more refinement in the handling.
In all, the RSB is a fine addition to the Racingline FSTB and ES motor mount bushings, maximizing grip on those Eagle F1’s. I’m pretty happy.
One question, however… we positioned the side brackets so the bar ends just past the bushings. The other approach would be to move the side brackets about 3” towards the axle. We assumed the current position would allow for the most flex, whereas the other position would be stiffer. I'm going to drive it for a few weeks and decide if I want more. (I rather think I do, but it’s early.)
So where did you guys position the side-brackets… at the end of the bar, or back a few inches towards the bend? Has anyone tried both extents, and do you have any opinions on one over the other?
Afterward, I drove around a lot, hitting all the familiar roads, highway ramps and sweeping turns. The feel of the RSB is subtle, but significant in what it makes possible. Body roll is noticeably reduced, elevating the extents to which I can take a wide turn. It allows for appreciatively higher speeds where I would normally be screeching the tires and dancing at the edge of control. In a nutshell, I can take wide turns much faster than before… which is way fun.
But it also allows me to power out of those sweeping turns without having to fight for control. Coming out of a wide turn and accelerating is now more of a point-n-shoot experience. There’s much more refinement in the handling.
In all, the RSB is a fine addition to the Racingline FSTB and ES motor mount bushings, maximizing grip on those Eagle F1’s. I’m pretty happy.
One question, however… we positioned the side brackets so the bar ends just past the bushings. The other approach would be to move the side brackets about 3” towards the axle. We assumed the current position would allow for the most flex, whereas the other position would be stiffer. I'm going to drive it for a few weeks and decide if I want more. (I rather think I do, but it’s early.)
So where did you guys position the side-brackets… at the end of the bar, or back a few inches towards the bend? Has anyone tried both extents, and do you have any opinions on one over the other?
07-07-2009, 03:31 PM
#2
I have the brackets close the bend in the bar. Partially for stiffness mostly for the fast that the bushings were hitting my exhaust at one point when they were farther forward. I noticed no difference in day to day driving. But Im sure there is one at the limits.
07-08-2009, 05:35 AM
#3
Anyone else have an opinion on side-bracket placement?
07-08-2009, 05:54 AM
#4
I haven't played around with my bracket placing too much, but this is where they are located:
I know, I realize that they are not evenly spaced from the ends, I'll get to that when I have the motivation...
I know, I realize that they are not evenly spaced from the ends, I'll get to that when I have the motivation...
07-08-2009, 06:01 AM
#5
Thanks, Puppetmaster. However, it's the side-bracket placement that I'm hoping to get opinions on. There's about a 3" variation on where to position the side-brackets, which then determines how much the ends of the sway-bar are sticking through the bushings.
07-08-2009, 06:51 AM
#6
Oops, sorry. I didn't read through the post carefully, all I saw was the picture you posted. I'll see if I can snap some pictures of where the side brackets are when I take the rear wheels off.
10-06-2010, 04:50 PM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Leicester, Ma
Posts: 1,124
i have my brackets as far out as i can go to the bends before it interferes with the axle during the susp travel. also i have actually 4 brackets holding the ends on the trailing arms,\..2 on each side. I elongate the holes on the axle bracket so i could move the bar a little more forward as well. This gave a noticeably stiffer feel when driving. i feel when i loosen things up the car feels sloppy .
10-06-2010, 04:52 PM
#8
im still debating this mod 2 yrs later...., heard/read alot about it. but its been a little while now. ... how do you guys think it plays with the oversteer/understeer ratios...?,
....I know any mod helps our feeble box but really..... If you had to rate what kinda feel it gave on a scale 1-10 what would you give it. (i e I would thnk springs/sturts are a 9 out of 10)
..how does it feel switching lanes...
...how does it feel making hard almost 90 deg turns...
...i have it stiff back there with the illuminas on 5, it feels like a heavy rock that trails behind the ltb2 quick agile front
....I know any mod helps our feeble box but really..... If you had to rate what kinda feel it gave on a scale 1-10 what would you give it. (i e I would thnk springs/sturts are a 9 out of 10)
..how does it feel switching lanes...
...how does it feel making hard almost 90 deg turns...
...i have it stiff back there with the illuminas on 5, it feels like a heavy rock that trails behind the ltb2 quick agile front
10-06-2010, 05:15 PM
#9
Wow. Very weird to see this old thread of mine bumped. And even though I initially asked where to bolt it up, I've done nothing to adjust the RSB since it was installed. Truth be told, I really can't comment on it as a mod with any new insights... because I've never removed it.
All I remember is that sweeping highway ramps that would normally max out around 50 mph could be easily handled at 65 with the RSB. There's a whole lot more confidence with the reduced body roll.
That, and Prophecy's burger-less grill is strangely attractive.
All I remember is that sweeping highway ramps that would normally max out around 50 mph could be easily handled at 65 with the RSB. There's a whole lot more confidence with the reduced body roll.
That, and Prophecy's burger-less grill is strangely attractive.
Last edited by Rochester; 10-06-2010 at 05:33 PM.
10-06-2010, 07:24 PM
#10
Wow. Very weird to see this old thread of mine bumped. And even though I initially asked where to bolt it up, I've done nothing to adjust the RSB since it was installed. Truth be told, I really can't comment on it as a mod with any new insights... because I've never removed it.
All I remember is that sweeping highway ramps that would normally max out around 50 mph could be easily handled at 65 with the RSB. There's a whole lot more confidence with the reduced body roll.
That, and Prophecy's burger-less grill is strangely attractive.
All I remember is that sweeping highway ramps that would normally max out around 50 mph could be easily handled at 65 with the RSB. There's a whole lot more confidence with the reduced body roll.
That, and Prophecy's burger-less grill is strangely attractive.
hand made burgerless is hot sheet
10-06-2010, 09:33 PM
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2005
Location: Leicester, Ma
Posts: 1,124
im still debating this mod 2 yrs later...., heard/read alot about it. but its been a little while now. ... how do you guys think it plays with the oversteer/understeer ratios...?,
....I know any mod helps our feeble box but really..... If you had to rate what kinda feel it gave on a scale 1-10 what would you give it. (i e I would thnk springs/sturts are a 9 out of 10)
..how does it feel switching lanes...
...how does it feel making hard almost 90 deg turns...
...i have it stiff back there with the illuminas on 5, it feels like a heavy rock that trails behind the ltb2 quick agile front
....I know any mod helps our feeble box but really..... If you had to rate what kinda feel it gave on a scale 1-10 what would you give it. (i e I would thnk springs/sturts are a 9 out of 10)
..how does it feel switching lanes...
...how does it feel making hard almost 90 deg turns...
...i have it stiff back there with the illuminas on 5, it feels like a heavy rock that trails behind the ltb2 quick agile front
Wow. Very weird to see this old thread of mine bumped. And even though I initially asked where to bolt it up, I've done nothing to adjust the RSB since it was installed. Truth be told, I really can't comment on it as a mod with any new insights... because I've never removed it.
All I remember is that sweeping highway ramps that would normally max out around 50 mph could be easily handled at 65 with the RSB. There's a whole lot more confidence with the reduced body roll.
That, and Prophecy's burger-less grill is strangely attractive.
All I remember is that sweeping highway ramps that would normally max out around 50 mph could be easily handled at 65 with the RSB. There's a whole lot more confidence with the reduced body roll.
That, and Prophecy's burger-less grill is strangely attractive.
10-06-2010, 10:13 PM
#12
im still debating this mod 2 yrs later...., heard/read alot about it. but its been a little while now. ... how do you guys think it plays with the oversteer/understeer ratios...?,
....I know any mod helps our feeble box but really..... If you had to rate what kinda feel it gave on a scale 1-10 what would you give it. (i e I would thnk springs/sturts are a 9 out of 10)
..how does it feel switching lanes...
...how does it feel making hard almost 90 deg turns...
...i have it stiff back there with the illuminas on 5, it feels like a heavy rock that trails behind the ltb2 quick agile front
....I know any mod helps our feeble box but really..... If you had to rate what kinda feel it gave on a scale 1-10 what would you give it. (i e I would thnk springs/sturts are a 9 out of 10)
..how does it feel switching lanes...
...how does it feel making hard almost 90 deg turns...
...i have it stiff back there with the illuminas on 5, it feels like a heavy rock that trails behind the ltb2 quick agile front
This was my initial feel: The back end seemed to want to hold the ground better. Putting the car to full lock left or right and pushing to the point where the front tires started to complain had a lot more of a sure and stable feel to it than it did without the sway bar installed.
I guess in short, the rear end wanted to stay planted with the RSB on where as before it kind of wanted to bounce around a bit.
The effects of the RSB aren't anything huge, by any means. But it's definitely noticeable.
Another pointless note: Driving through the mountains on the interstate between Knoxville and Nashville felt totally different after the RSB.
Last edited by Mr. Brett; 10-06-2010 at 10:19 PM.
10-07-2010, 05:36 AM
#13
I think "debate" isn't really the right word, because there's no one arguing the RSB is pointless or detrimental when applied to the 5th gen Maxima. Some people actually do say that about the RSTB, but not the RSB.
Time for you to call Brian Catts and order your Progress Rear Sway Bar. He has sales every now and then, but generally it goes for $160.
Or you could burn your money by gifting Stillen $307 for absolutely no added value whatsoever. Because unless you've got a woody for pretty blue brackets, at the end of the day it's just a sway bar.
But don't listen to me, Prophecy. I've been blowing money on titanium nuts & bolts for my engine bay... so my values are kind of hard to pin down, LOL.
Time for you to call Brian Catts and order your Progress Rear Sway Bar. He has sales every now and then, but generally it goes for $160.
Or you could burn your money by gifting Stillen $307 for absolutely no added value whatsoever. Because unless you've got a woody for pretty blue brackets, at the end of the day it's just a sway bar.
But don't listen to me, Prophecy. I've been blowing money on titanium nuts & bolts for my engine bay... so my values are kind of hard to pin down, LOL.
10-07-2010, 06:54 AM
#15
Heh - funny how this mod doesn't get talked about anymore....it's just a GIVEN that we all got one.
Agree with Rochester: don't buy the Stillen unless you want to pay more and get BLUE BLing.
I think Mr. Millen will forgive me for not pluggin' his operation....he's GOT that kind of cash.
gr
Agree with Rochester: don't buy the Stillen unless you want to pay more and get BLUE BLing.
I think Mr. Millen will forgive me for not pluggin' his operation....he's GOT that kind of cash.
gr
10-07-2010, 10:53 AM
#17
I've installed about 6 of these, and I put the side brackets where the brake cable attaches to the trailing arm, then drill and tap a new hole for the cable bracket. For the U shaped pieces I divide the bar into 3 pieces and put the U's at the division points.
10-07-2010, 11:03 AM
#19
I think "debate" isn't really the right word, because there's no one arguing the RSB is pointless or detrimental when applied to the 5th gen Maxima. Some people actually do say that about the RSTB, but not the RSB.
Time for you to call Brian Catts and order your Progress Rear Sway Bar. He has sales every now and then, but generally it goes for $160.
Or you could burn your money by gifting Stillen $307 for absolutely no added value whatsoever. Because unless you've got a woody for pretty blue brackets, at the end of the day it's just a sway bar.
But don't listen to me, Prophecy. I've been blowing money on titanium nuts & bolts for my engine bay... so my values are kind of hard to pin down, LOL.
Time for you to call Brian Catts and order your Progress Rear Sway Bar. He has sales every now and then, but generally it goes for $160.
Or you could burn your money by gifting Stillen $307 for absolutely no added value whatsoever. Because unless you've got a woody for pretty blue brackets, at the end of the day it's just a sway bar.
But don't listen to me, Prophecy. I've been blowing money on titanium nuts & bolts for my engine bay... so my values are kind of hard to pin down, LOL.
10-07-2010, 11:04 AM
#20
10-07-2010, 11:07 AM
#21
10-07-2010, 12:56 PM
#24
Nice, Roy. It never occurred to me to put the PROGRESS decal on the bar itself. That looks great, although I'm dubious how well it will hold up to the elements.
I put mine under the hood, on the fender lip.
I put mine under the hood, on the fender lip.
Last edited by Rochester; 10-07-2010 at 12:58 PM.
10-07-2010, 12:56 PM
#25
Like the new sig rroderiques77. Ever consider painting the intercooler black?
Rochester- I didnt realize the Progress was adjustable. I stand corrected. Have you ever played with it to find a real difference with the different adjustments?
Rochester- I didnt realize the Progress was adjustable. I stand corrected. Have you ever played with it to find a real difference with the different adjustments?
10-07-2010, 01:03 PM
#26
For obvious reasons.Rhyno, post #9, where I said I've never adjusted it. But all this talk with this bumped thread has me thinking I should now.
10-07-2010, 01:27 PM
#27
10-07-2010, 05:40 PM
#28
FWIW, when I first put the RSB on, I had the bushing adjusted as far back as they could go toward the rear of the car. When I got the time, I slid them more toward the front. I don't recall feeling any huge difference in handling, however.
My guess is that the farther they're slid back toward the rear, the less play the bushing will allow for. (Kind of like tightening a bolt with a ratchet versus trying to turn it by hand. The less leverage you have, the less play there will be).
My guess is that the farther they're slid back toward the rear, the less play the bushing will allow for. (Kind of like tightening a bolt with a ratchet versus trying to turn it by hand. The less leverage you have, the less play there will be).
10-07-2010, 09:58 PM
#31
No. Intercooler is staying its natural color.
10-13-2010, 06:56 PM
#32
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 637
Damn thanks for the input guys.. I was debating to get the Progress RSB... but I don't really see a down side to getting one. I was researching how it would effect handling during wet / icy roads.. but it seems that it's more valuable during such conditions for the sake of traction.
10-14-2010, 06:26 AM
#34
Supporting Maxima.org Member
iTrader: (5)
Join Date: Jul 2007
Location: North Shore, MA
Posts: 1,795
Damn.......where is your rust???
every time my car goes on a lift I start cursing the new england winters
As for placement of the bushings on the rear beam, they should be pushed out towards the wheels as far as they can go without interfering with anything. Moving them in further creates more flexibility in the bar at the ends, and it will become less effective.
As for the placement of the bushings on the trailing arm, that is a lot more complicated......i would need to know the relativity of the bushing's compressive stiffness and the bars flexural stiffness. But I would think the farther towards back you locate them, the stiffer it will be.
every time my car goes on a lift I start cursing the new england winters
As for placement of the bushings on the rear beam, they should be pushed out towards the wheels as far as they can go without interfering with anything. Moving them in further creates more flexibility in the bar at the ends, and it will become less effective.
As for the placement of the bushings on the trailing arm, that is a lot more complicated......i would need to know the relativity of the bushing's compressive stiffness and the bars flexural stiffness. But I would think the farther towards back you locate them, the stiffer it will be.
10-14-2010, 07:16 AM
#35
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 637
Damn.......where is your rust???
every time my car goes on a lift I start cursing the new england winters
As for placement of the bushings on the rear beam, they should be pushed out towards the wheels as far as they can go without interfering with anything. Moving them in further creates more flexibility in the bar at the ends, and it will become less effective.
As for the placement of the bushings on the trailing arm, that is a lot more complicated......i would need to know the relativity of the bushing's compressive stiffness and the bars flexural stiffness. But I would think the farther towards back you locate them, the stiffer it will be.
every time my car goes on a lift I start cursing the new england winters
As for placement of the bushings on the rear beam, they should be pushed out towards the wheels as far as they can go without interfering with anything. Moving them in further creates more flexibility in the bar at the ends, and it will become less effective.
As for the placement of the bushings on the trailing arm, that is a lot more complicated......i would need to know the relativity of the bushing's compressive stiffness and the bars flexural stiffness. But I would think the farther towards back you locate them, the stiffer it will be.
10-14-2010, 07:33 PM
#37
Supporting Maxima.org Member
iTrader: (1)
Join Date: Nov 2002
Location: Montreal, QC,Canada
Posts: 253
Allright, something confuses me..
I had a Progress rear swaybar parked in my basement for 3 years, which I had originally bought for my now defunct 99. I never installed it because the verdict was split between the pros and the cons when installed on a 4th generation. Most disquieting was the observation by some that it added some harshness to the rear suspension when on uneven roads, and if I recall correctly, that it tended to make the car a bit skittish on icy roads. Now that I have an 02, and after Brian C kindly informed me the bar will fit this car as well, I'm considering installing it, but a bit confused by what seems to be only positive comments about it on a 5/5,5 generation. Did some searching and found little info to help me understand this- since I see the suspensions as being very similar between 4th and 5th gens, why so few cons re it's application on a 5th, or have I missed some important feedback from those who have installed it?
10-14-2010, 08:16 PM
#38
And yes, you're right. The closer to the back of the car the bushings are, the tighter the RSB will feel.
Like I said in an earlier post, think of it like using a wrench. Driving a bolt into something with your grip on the very end of the ratchet is much easier than trying to grip the ratchet at the knuckle and produce the same results.
Same concept...with the bushings slid toward the bends in the RSB, there's less of a "torque arm" that can twist around under heavy pressure.
10-14-2010, 08:22 PM
#39
I had a Progress rear swaybar parked in my basement for 3 years, which I had originally bought for my now defunct 99. I never installed it because the verdict was split between the pros and the cons when installed on a 4th generation. Most disquieting was the observation by some that it added some harshness to the rear suspension when on uneven roads, and if I recall correctly, that it tended to make the car a bit skittish on icy roads. Now that I have an 02, and after Brian C kindly informed me the bar will fit this car as well, I'm considering installing it, but a bit confused by what seems to be only positive comments about it on a 5/5,5 generation. Did some searching and found little info to help me understand this- since I see the suspensions as being very similar between 4th and 5th gens, why so few cons re it's application on a 5th, or have I missed some important feedback from those who have installed it?
I'm never taking mine off. That would be nuts.
10-14-2010, 08:39 PM
#40
That is kind of curious. I know there are some people who feel that way about a rear strut tower brace, but I've never read anything bad about having a rear sway bar on a 5th Gen. That doesn't mean there isn't someone somewhere who's less than happy.
I'm never taking mine off. That would be nuts.
I'm never taking mine off. That would be nuts.
I can understand the potential for a RSB to make a car slightly skittish over rough roads..but only at high rates of speed. I've never noticed any issues with it on my car.