Tein SS Coilovers
#81
Please, by all means, continue to bring input to this thread. All is appreciated. I just don't want this to turn into people knocking what he specifically asked for but at the same time giving great options to choose from along with what they think about the Tein SS setup amongst others. I didn't start this thread but i like the route it has taken with the information aspect.
#82
Well I see there are ALOT of Tein ****** here. Which is fine, by all means you are entitled to your opinion. Each one of you, BUT that is just it... YOUR opinion. The only person that could speak up here and say one way or the other definitively that one offers the supreme stock feeling of one vs. the other is someone who has had evey combination possible on their ride and had time to test each one and give a unbiased review. I say who on here has had every combination??? Very few have had more than 2 different combo's and I would venture to say that those where so un-happy with the one they had ANYthing would have been better.
Now, I'm not saying the Tein's are bad by any means, because I don't know. Where would one find the R&D that has been done on all these available suspension combo's on our specific car hmmmmmm. I would say nowhere, so people come here, take the word of mouth as the gospal and might end up with something they didn't exactly want, but now have so much money in it that its to late to turn back.
The OP gave us a pretty decent idea of what he was looking for and who here based on his original needs can say for certain that the Tein's are for him? Maybe so, maybe no I think balance is lacking in the thread on what could offer the OP ideas as to his upcoming set up.
So I'll offer my lopsided opinion FTMFW, check my sig...... again. Here's my thoughts of the set up I have:
Lowered, 2" in the front 1 1/2" in the back. Filled the wheel wells nicely and no rub, period!
About as damn close as you can get for a stock ride. But a stock ride is just that, STOCK. I have no hard bumps, jarrs, bouncing, sway... nothing.
No, I mean NO body roll. You lay in the turn and you will have sore arms from trying to hold yourself in the seat BEFORE the car rolls. If there is some its minute, and the amount wouldn't benefit a street car.
I have no sag... no acceleration sink, or whatever you like to call it. If I shoot off the line then yeah it'll sink a little bit. But won't any car, thats not set up to run circuit races???
The optical illusion I spoke of, thanks that was confirmed also. The car sits level.
And my test included many high speed passes to which the car felt planted and stable. I felt very comfortable running at the speed I was. Have no doubts about running her up to 140.
As for side bite, I have took the highway off ramps (you know the ones that basically do a full circle back onto themselves, below the rode you where on) at a comfortable 80mph and the only thing I noticed where the tires begging for mercy. It had NO under-steer and NO oversteer (common with mis-matched suspension components). It simply stayed in place the whole time. I believe at anytime I could have kept asking her to do more and she would have come along. The tires would fail first before the suspension.
Thats what I believe the OP is looking for unbaised looks at his alternatives, not something being thrown down his throat because its the "flavor of the month."
FTW.
Now, I'm not saying the Tein's are bad by any means, because I don't know. Where would one find the R&D that has been done on all these available suspension combo's on our specific car hmmmmmm. I would say nowhere, so people come here, take the word of mouth as the gospal and might end up with something they didn't exactly want, but now have so much money in it that its to late to turn back.
The OP gave us a pretty decent idea of what he was looking for and who here based on his original needs can say for certain that the Tein's are for him? Maybe so, maybe no I think balance is lacking in the thread on what could offer the OP ideas as to his upcoming set up.
So I'll offer my lopsided opinion FTMFW, check my sig...... again. Here's my thoughts of the set up I have:
Lowered, 2" in the front 1 1/2" in the back. Filled the wheel wells nicely and no rub, period!
About as damn close as you can get for a stock ride. But a stock ride is just that, STOCK. I have no hard bumps, jarrs, bouncing, sway... nothing.
No, I mean NO body roll. You lay in the turn and you will have sore arms from trying to hold yourself in the seat BEFORE the car rolls. If there is some its minute, and the amount wouldn't benefit a street car.
I have no sag... no acceleration sink, or whatever you like to call it. If I shoot off the line then yeah it'll sink a little bit. But won't any car, thats not set up to run circuit races???
The optical illusion I spoke of, thanks that was confirmed also. The car sits level.
And my test included many high speed passes to which the car felt planted and stable. I felt very comfortable running at the speed I was. Have no doubts about running her up to 140.
As for side bite, I have took the highway off ramps (you know the ones that basically do a full circle back onto themselves, below the rode you where on) at a comfortable 80mph and the only thing I noticed where the tires begging for mercy. It had NO under-steer and NO oversteer (common with mis-matched suspension components). It simply stayed in place the whole time. I believe at anytime I could have kept asking her to do more and she would have come along. The tires would fail first before the suspension.
Thats what I believe the OP is looking for unbaised looks at his alternatives, not something being thrown down his throat because its the "flavor of the month."
FTW.
Stock
Cut stock springs
Eibach
Sprints
S-techs
H-techs
K-sport
K-sport Coilovers on 2 different generation max and an acura
D2 Coilovers
Tein SS (rears blown)
Tein Basics not offered for 5.5
Jic- Flt-A1 (i think lol)
(Want to try, progress, Megan coilovers, NEX GT coilovers, and Boss Chen coilovers and of coarse the new JIC FLT-TAR vip coilovers)
Honestly my first choice in coilovers were the tein SS, i agree that info is kinda being forced but i also agree that its good info, however i've said this to the OP before, do your research coilovers may not be for you depending on what you are looking for... i know most ppl talk about this "OEM ride" thing but imho nothing is as soft to potholes as those huge OEM springs... now whichever route you go or wherever the budget leads just make sure you research, last thing you wanna do is spend 1000$ on suspension because ppl say this ppl say that (even though to most extent that is what you will have to do) nothing rides like stock except stock, so if you love your ride comfort stock (except the height) i really dont know what to tell you... if you dont mind sacrifising a bit in that comfort for a lower or more sporty look i stick to my opinion and say get the illuminas with Eibachs or tein H-techs (cant really speak on progress because i've never rode on em, but according to reviews here they are great) so i would say try those too.... im done.... oh and i said JIC's as another option and hotshot overlooked me
#89
- I had H&Rs ($250) on tokico blues ($300) - the ride was bone-jarring. Everyone says H&Rs are "stock-like"...IMO thats so not true
- I thought maybe I should get illuminas so the ride wouldnt be that bad. So I bought illuminas ($430) and even on the softest settings the ride was horrible.
- I figured "hey I still look stock height and the ride sucks so f*** it let me just get springs that drop the car lower...how much worse can the ride quality get?".
- So I got htechs ($200) and paired them with my illuminas. As expected, the ride was harsh, about the same quality ride the H&Rs w/ illuminas gave me.
So $1180 on suspension setups none of which satisfied me. Why did the alleged H&R w/ illuminas not provide any comfort??? Everyone swears by this very setup.
Then I got my tein SS coilovers and all I will say is that was BY FAR the best mod I ever did to my car, even better than the full cattman exhaust. With the money I spent on all those suspension setups I could have easily bought tein SS coilovers from the very beginning.
So, contrary to what you indicate, I believe my opinion is helpful to the OP. I wouldnt want the OP to spend $$ on countless setups and still not be happy especially since he is looking at comfort being of primary importance.
People seem to be irritated when I say teins offer a "stock-like" ride so I will say this: The ride is VERY comfortable and it by far better than spring/strut setups IMO. I was a nonbeliever at one time and I never believed coilovers could be as comfortable as a few of the NYC members said...Now Im a believer and I will make it a point to buy tein SS coilovers for my future cars if available. Now those are strong words
Last edited by pbn85; 09-23-2009 at 04:45 PM.
#91
Why do we sound like a colt... i swear, once people ride in a Max with Tein SS they'll never go back. Everyone wheni had a blown damper said my ride was smooth and had great handling. wait till my repaired dampers come in this Friday...wonder what the response will be now...lol
funny how no one has anything bad to say about them. The only way it will show up on the FS area is if someone is parting out...isnt that something.
Last edited by Phantom-V; 09-23-2009 at 06:29 PM.
#92
Why do we sound like a colt... i swear, once people ride in a Max with Tein SS they'll never go back. Everyone wheni had a blown damper said my ride was smooth and had great handling. wait till my repaired dampers come in this Friday...wonder what the response will be now...lol
funny how now one has anything bad to say about them. The only way it will show up on the FS area is if someone is parting out...isnt that something.
funny how now one has anything bad to say about them. The only way it will show up on the FS area is if someone is parting out...isnt that something.
#94
#95
Confused, maybe... More to think about, YES!
But, I think I'm going to take a leap of faith and try the Tein SS. WTF; worst case is that I hate them, pull them off, go back to stock and hook one of you guys up with an awesome deal on them.
What other parts would you guys recommend for the installation (i.e. shock mounts, etc)? Specifics and where to buy would be very helpful. FYI: its is a 2002 6-spd maxima with 100k miles on her.
You guys have been great in providing some great info!
But, I think I'm going to take a leap of faith and try the Tein SS. WTF; worst case is that I hate them, pull them off, go back to stock and hook one of you guys up with an awesome deal on them.
What other parts would you guys recommend for the installation (i.e. shock mounts, etc)? Specifics and where to buy would be very helpful. FYI: its is a 2002 6-spd maxima with 100k miles on her.
You guys have been great in providing some great info!
#98
installing the coilovers is easy, just a matter of changing out the current ones and adjusting the ride height... EDFC im not sure about, i've never installed em... your most likely going to need an alignment after the install
#100
What other parts would you recommend for the installation (i.e. shock mounts, etc)? Specifics and where to buy would be very helpful. FYI: its is a 2002 6-spd maxima with 100k miles on her.
#101
hey perfect i hate to try and confuse you more. but i gotta do it for your sake. if you want an awesome suspension and not kill the bank check out the bc coilovers. ive had numerous set ups not on different cars but on the max i currently own.i did my suspension mainly for apperance,everyonce in a while hit the turns.
stock springs/illuminas: 4x4, great ride, great handling
tien s-tech/illuminas: great drop, crappy ride, sloppy handling
tien h-tech/illuminas: good drop, less crappy ride, aiight handling
eibachs/illuminas: aiight drop, better ride, great handling
h&rs/illuminas: crappy drop, just ok ride, just ok handling
h&rs/blues: crappy drop, harsh ride, just ok handling
maxspeeds/illuminas: aiight drop, harsh ride, crappy handling
k-sports coilovers: awesome drop, really crappy ride, great handling
tiens ss: great drop, really good ride, ok handling
BC RACING COILOVERS: AWESOME DROP, BEST RIDE, GREAT HANDLING. PRICE
just for clarification im not knocking the tiens they were nice, but at $1300 really pricey. the bcs in my opinion were alot better. they rode better, rebounded better, have more height adj. and at 950 shipped to my door left alot of cash in my pocket for other things.
im not comparing different suspension in different cars cause thats gonna have different
results. every car rides different.im comparing one car different suspensions. the other nice thing about the bcs are they are a complete set up top to bottom meaning you dont have to dismantle your stock set up if you ever decide to go back which you wont. i just sold my bcs about 2 months ago and went back to stock and i couldnt be more dissapointed, people are looking for close to stock ride the bcs were as good or better than stock. no bulls***.if i cant sell my car i will definitly be getting another set unless i get a great deal on some teins. i wouldnt buy them new again.
stock springs/illuminas: 4x4, great ride, great handling
tien s-tech/illuminas: great drop, crappy ride, sloppy handling
tien h-tech/illuminas: good drop, less crappy ride, aiight handling
eibachs/illuminas: aiight drop, better ride, great handling
h&rs/illuminas: crappy drop, just ok ride, just ok handling
h&rs/blues: crappy drop, harsh ride, just ok handling
maxspeeds/illuminas: aiight drop, harsh ride, crappy handling
k-sports coilovers: awesome drop, really crappy ride, great handling
tiens ss: great drop, really good ride, ok handling
BC RACING COILOVERS: AWESOME DROP, BEST RIDE, GREAT HANDLING. PRICE
just for clarification im not knocking the tiens they were nice, but at $1300 really pricey. the bcs in my opinion were alot better. they rode better, rebounded better, have more height adj. and at 950 shipped to my door left alot of cash in my pocket for other things.
im not comparing different suspension in different cars cause thats gonna have different
results. every car rides different.im comparing one car different suspensions. the other nice thing about the bcs are they are a complete set up top to bottom meaning you dont have to dismantle your stock set up if you ever decide to go back which you wont. i just sold my bcs about 2 months ago and went back to stock and i couldnt be more dissapointed, people are looking for close to stock ride the bcs were as good or better than stock. no bulls***.if i cant sell my car i will definitly be getting another set unless i get a great deal on some teins. i wouldnt buy them new again.
Last edited by maximumobsesion; 10-18-2009 at 09:33 AM.
#102
^^^
That's a very impressive history of suspension configurations.
Do you think all those "crappy ride" opinions with aftermarket struts are due to their pairing with aftermarket springs so that you can lower the car?
For example, if you match Blues to OEM springs, wouldn't you get a better ride and improved handling over the stock SE Tokico struts? (Certainly not handling like coilovers offer, of course.)
That's a very impressive history of suspension configurations.
Do you think all those "crappy ride" opinions with aftermarket struts are due to their pairing with aftermarket springs so that you can lower the car?
For example, if you match Blues to OEM springs, wouldn't you get a better ride and improved handling over the stock SE Tokico struts? (Certainly not handling like coilovers offer, of course.)
#103
while I do respect Maximumobsesion's opinion on the tein SS coilovers, I, along with 99% of other people who have had the tein SS and spring/strut/coilover combos, agree that the tein SS are the best coilover setup in terms of comfort. I hope the OP isnt discouraged. There have been countless praises for the teins in this thread alone. I bet if you were to search outside this thread you would find the same. Get the Teins...I guarantee you'll be happy.
I've ridden in an i35 with BCs (username on this site: din9leberry) and a 4th gen (username: Xtinctws6). The ride just cannot compare to my teins.
I've ridden in an i35 with BCs (username on this site: din9leberry) and a 4th gen (username: Xtinctws6). The ride just cannot compare to my teins.
#104
^^^
That's a very impressive history of suspension configurations.
Do you think all those "crappy ride" opinions with aftermarket struts are due to their pairing with aftermarket springs so that you can lower the car?
For example, if you match Blues to OEM springs, wouldn't you get a better ride and improved handling over the stock SE Tokico struts? (Certainly not handling like coilovers offer, of course.)
That's a very impressive history of suspension configurations.
Do you think all those "crappy ride" opinions with aftermarket struts are due to their pairing with aftermarket springs so that you can lower the car?
For example, if you match Blues to OEM springs, wouldn't you get a better ride and improved handling over the stock SE Tokico struts? (Certainly not handling like coilovers offer, of course.)
#105
i not knocking your opinion pbn. part of the reason teins get so much hype is due the name and beacause they have been around for a while, they are a great set up. the bcs dont get the advertising that the teins get. you can check on nycmaximas.com and read alot of reviews on the bcs who have steped out of the trend and went with them and are very happy with them. i actually sold my bcs to nishfish871 and he absolutly loves them. so much that he wont sell them back to me. lol. everyone is entitled to thier opinion. bottom line is if "I" was offerd both sets regardless of price i would take the bcs hands down. saving $400 is just a great bonus. and im makeing my judgement haveing both on MY car not riding in others. and as far as running upgraded struts on stock springs i think that was the third best set up. great ride great handling 4x4 height.
Last edited by maximumobsesion; 10-18-2009 at 09:33 AM.
#107
did you even read one of my responses where I said I had various spring/strut setups? I believe out of everyone, I have a very unbiased opinion regarding the tein SS coilovers. Here is why:
- I had H&Rs ($250) on tokico blues ($300) - the ride was bone-jarring. Everyone says H&Rs are "stock-like"...IMO thats so not true
- I thought maybe I should get illuminas so the ride wouldnt be that bad. So I bought illuminas ($430) and even on the softest settings the ride was horrible.
- I figured "hey I still look stock height and the ride sucks so f*** it let me just get springs that drop the car lower...how much worse can the ride quality get?".
- So I got htechs ($200) and paired them with my illuminas. As expected, the ride was harsh, about the same quality ride the H&Rs w/ illuminas gave me.
So $1180 on suspension setups none of which satisfied me. Why did the alleged H&R w/ illuminas not provide any comfort??? Everyone swears by this very setup.
Then I got my tein SS coilovers and all I will say is that was BY FAR the best mod I ever did to my car, even better than the full cattman exhaust. With the money I spent on all those suspension setups I could have easily bought tein SS coilovers from the very beginning.
So, contrary to what you indicate, I believe my opinion is helpful to the OP. I wouldnt want the OP to spend $$ on countless setups and still not be happy especially since he is looking at comfort being of primary importance.
People seem to be irritated when I say teins offer a "stock-like" ride so I will say this: The ride is VERY comfortable and it by far better than spring/strut setups IMO. I was a nonbeliever at one time and I never believed coilovers could be as comfortable as a few of the NYC members said...Now Im a believer and I will make it a point to buy tein SS coilovers for my future cars if available. Now those are strong words
- I had H&Rs ($250) on tokico blues ($300) - the ride was bone-jarring. Everyone says H&Rs are "stock-like"...IMO thats so not true
- I thought maybe I should get illuminas so the ride wouldnt be that bad. So I bought illuminas ($430) and even on the softest settings the ride was horrible.
- I figured "hey I still look stock height and the ride sucks so f*** it let me just get springs that drop the car lower...how much worse can the ride quality get?".
- So I got htechs ($200) and paired them with my illuminas. As expected, the ride was harsh, about the same quality ride the H&Rs w/ illuminas gave me.
So $1180 on suspension setups none of which satisfied me. Why did the alleged H&R w/ illuminas not provide any comfort??? Everyone swears by this very setup.
Then I got my tein SS coilovers and all I will say is that was BY FAR the best mod I ever did to my car, even better than the full cattman exhaust. With the money I spent on all those suspension setups I could have easily bought tein SS coilovers from the very beginning.
So, contrary to what you indicate, I believe my opinion is helpful to the OP. I wouldnt want the OP to spend $$ on countless setups and still not be happy especially since he is looking at comfort being of primary importance.
People seem to be irritated when I say teins offer a "stock-like" ride so I will say this: The ride is VERY comfortable and it by far better than spring/strut setups IMO. I was a nonbeliever at one time and I never believed coilovers could be as comfortable as a few of the NYC members said...Now Im a believer and I will make it a point to buy tein SS coilovers for my future cars if available. Now those are strong words
Last edited by nismomaxgtr18; 10-18-2009 at 07:38 PM.
#108
hey perfect i hate to try and confuse you more. but i gotta do it for your sake. if you want an awesome suspension and not kill the bank check out the bc coilovers. ive had numerous set ups not on different cars but on the max i currently own.i did my suspension mainly for apperance,everyonce in a while hit the turns.
stock springs/illuminas: 4x4, great ride, great handling
tien s-tech/illuminas: great drop, crappy ride, sloppy handling
tien h-tech/illuminas: good drop, less crappy ride, aiight handling
eibachs/illuminas: aiight drop, better ride, great handling
h&rs/illuminas: crappy drop, just ok ride, just ok handling
h&rs/blues: crappy drop, harsh ride, just ok handling
maxspeeds/illuminas: aiight drop, harsh ride, crappy handling
k-sports coilovers: awesome drop, really crappy ride, great handling
tiens ss: great drop, really good ride, ok handling
BC RACING COILOVERS: AWESOME DROP, BEST RIDE, GREAT HANDLING. PRICE
just for clarification im not knocking the tiens they were nice, but at $1300 really pricey. the bcs in my opinion were alot better. they rode better, rebounded better, have more height adj. and at 950 shipped to my door left alot of cash in my pocket for other things.
im not comparing different suspension in different cars cause thats gonna have different
results. every car rides different.im comparing one car different suspensions. the other nice thing about the bcs are they are a complete set up top to bottom meaning you dont have to dismantle your stock set up if you ever decide to go back which you wont. i just sold my bcs about 2 months ago and went back to stock and i couldnt be more dissapointed, people are looking for close to stock ride the bcs were as good or better than stock. no bulls***.if i cant sell my car i will definitly be getting another set unless i get a great deal on some teins. i wouldnt buy them new again.
stock springs/illuminas: 4x4, great ride, great handling
tien s-tech/illuminas: great drop, crappy ride, sloppy handling
tien h-tech/illuminas: good drop, less crappy ride, aiight handling
eibachs/illuminas: aiight drop, better ride, great handling
h&rs/illuminas: crappy drop, just ok ride, just ok handling
h&rs/blues: crappy drop, harsh ride, just ok handling
maxspeeds/illuminas: aiight drop, harsh ride, crappy handling
k-sports coilovers: awesome drop, really crappy ride, great handling
tiens ss: great drop, really good ride, ok handling
BC RACING COILOVERS: AWESOME DROP, BEST RIDE, GREAT HANDLING. PRICE
just for clarification im not knocking the tiens they were nice, but at $1300 really pricey. the bcs in my opinion were alot better. they rode better, rebounded better, have more height adj. and at 950 shipped to my door left alot of cash in my pocket for other things.
im not comparing different suspension in different cars cause thats gonna have different
results. every car rides different.im comparing one car different suspensions. the other nice thing about the bcs are they are a complete set up top to bottom meaning you dont have to dismantle your stock set up if you ever decide to go back which you wont. i just sold my bcs about 2 months ago and went back to stock and i couldnt be more dissapointed, people are looking for close to stock ride the bcs were as good or better than stock. no bulls***.if i cant sell my car i will definitly be getting another set unless i get a great deal on some teins. i wouldnt buy them new again.
#109
#110
i not knocking your opinion pbn. part of the reason teins get so much hype is due the name and beacause they have been around for a while, they are a great set up. the bcs dont get the advertising that the teins get. you can check on nycmaximas.com and read alot of reviews on the bcs who have steped out of the trend and went with them and are very happy with them. i actually sold my bcs to nishfish871 and he absolutly loves them. so much that he wont sell them back to me. lol. everyone is entitled to thier opinion. bottom line is if "I" was offerd both sets regardless of price i would take the bcs hands down. saving $400 is just a great bonus. and im makeing my judgement haveing both on MY car not riding in others. and as far as running upgraded struts on stock springs i think that was the third best set up. great ride great handling 4x4 height.
#111
A quick question about height adjustment on the Tein SS. From what I can tell, when you increase the height of these coilovers, you're effectively increasing the preload of the spring by raising the spring perch.
Is this true?
Or is there clearance for the rod in the strut/shock to move up with the spring?
Is this true?
Or is there clearance for the rod in the strut/shock to move up with the spring?
#112
i not knocking your opinion pbn. part of the reason teins get so much hype is due the name and beacause they have been around for a while, they are a great set up. the bcs dont get the advertising that the teins get. you can check on nycmaximas.com and read alot of reviews on the bcs who have steped out of the trend and went with them and are very happy with them. i actually sold my bcs to nishfish871 and he absolutly loves them. so much that he wont sell them back to me. lol. everyone is entitled to thier opinion. bottom line is if "I" was offerd both sets regardless of price i would take the bcs hands down. saving $400 is just a great bonus. and im makeing my judgement haveing both on MY car not riding in others. and as far as running upgraded struts on stock springs i think that was the third best set up. great ride great handling 4x4 height.
Im no longer slammed...I passed that phase. I think it looks ghetto. I have a 1 1/2 finger gap and I think it looks better actually. Rides better too and I dont have to drive around being paranoid all the time
I STILL THINK THE OP SHOULD GET THE TEIN SS THOUGH!!
#115
Modding isnt cheap....if you arent prepared to spend good money on quality mods, then keep your car stock.
/thread
#116
There are plenty of other high-quality suspension mods to suit a variety of budgets and needs. I'm sure the Tein SS is an awesome package, but that doesn't make it an exclusive option for everyone.
#117
By that reasoning, if you're not prepared to spend good money on a M5, then stop trying to turn your Maxima into one.
There are plenty of other high-quality suspension mods to suit a variety of budgets and needs. I'm sure the Tein SS is an awesome package, but that doesn't make it an exclusive option for everyone.
There are plenty of other high-quality suspension mods to suit a variety of budgets and needs. I'm sure the Tein SS is an awesome package, but that doesn't make it an exclusive option for everyone.
Exactly, tein SS arent for everyone. People complain to me ALL the time that they want their cars to ride like mine after they have ridden inside but when they hear the price tag they start complaining. I dont get it. I also dont think any spring/strut combination can offer better ride quality than the tein SS. Those who have this setup will agree.
All my future cars will have the Tein SS setup, if made for them. Theyre just that damn good.
For reference:
http://forums.maxima.org/advanced-su...-under-1k.html
#119
And really, coilovers is not something anyone should take the cheap route on, or any suspension component actually.
#120
I believe we're saying pretty much the same thing. Here's what made me draw that M5 analogy:
As to the M5 analogy, c'mon and admit it, we're all trying to improve upon the OEM design of our Maximas, to bring it up to the level where more worthy cars originate.
"if you arent prepared to spend good money on quality mods, then keep your car stock."
Instead, let's rephrase that in the context of this thread, as:"if you arent prepared to spend good money on quality coilovers, then keep your struts and springs."
Makes a whole lot more sense that way, don't you think?As to the M5 analogy, c'mon and admit it, we're all trying to improve upon the OEM design of our Maximas, to bring it up to the level where more worthy cars originate.