this discussion is over.

 

thank you

check 4th Gen Forum..

 

If "we" agree on a definition of what is "Fast" maybe this could be a little clearer.

0-60; 5.4 - 5.8 Spirit wins
1/4 mile; 14.5~ GTP until I find the other mag if not it wins by a hair.

Take both measurements together the Spirit is still the Fastest FWD Ever.

We should look at How it's so fast. Gearing ... Because it's weight is close if not heavier than the Max. A turbo 4 is a fair fight with a NA V6. This thing on a stop light to stop light race will beat (=) a 300zx TT (3.0 V6 RWD and two turbos) damn, I would be ****ed.

What I think is amusing, is the fact that we tune our cars $$, and still cann't(most)hit the mark.

Gearing (3.85: 3.00(40),1.89(63), ,1.28(93),0.94(127),0.72(141))
Tires: 205/60 -15 Michelin XGT V4

The car redline in 2nd just before after 60, hence using the most of it's powerband up to 60.

The car has 15s, this is the most noticeable difference between this car and most others. Reduce air psi a bit and you get very good grip even with 205s. They are almost like "drag slics".

When I put Wide 16's on my old Max and reduced air psi, I gained .3 .4 tenths on 0-60 instantly.

 

Uh I think not. There is no way on God's green earth a R/T runs anywhere near a 5.4-5.8 stock. My boss has one. Chrysler didn't make such lofty claims. Nor did any of the car magazines get anywhere near the 5's. That is mid 6 second car.

Stereodude

 

ya the spirit is a 6 sec 0-60 and the GTP is still slower then my max, 14.3 so max is the fastest.

 

What about The VW Corrado G60 or the VR6 not much hp but they were fast

 

It may be the cheapest but it is also among the worst, dont get me wrong max hid are better than most halogens but compared to the HID on other cars they don't illuminate as well (does anyone know why?) I am one of those people who can instantly tell the difference between real HID's and the fake ones; when I see a A6,LS430,3-series,TL/CL they seem to give off a brighter light than the Max’s

 

i dun tink the TL HIDS are that bright

 

The spirit was tested by two independant mags in sub 6 second 0-60, and both got 14.5 and below on 1/4.

Sorry but it's the fastest. I love maximas but the truth is the truth.

It's hard to take, when I saw it I said "say it ain't so bibby, say it ain't so "

Let's not get focused on pure speed vs "the best overall car" which is the Max.

Again the facts are the facts regardless of how we feel about it, just don't take that pride to the track and get spanked by that ugly A@@ Dodge spirit R/T


Stereodude: Uh, yeah there is, I have the mag (actually both, but I have a lot of old boxes to go threw for the second one), how much are you willing to bet on this!! Sorry dude you are wrong on this one, and if your boss has one he didn't take care of it, and/or doesn't know how to drive it.

If you guys want to feel good about your car, then pretend you never read this, and hope that most of those POS are in a junk somewhere, and pray you never have to race one.

 

My Boss has one. Mod'd too. He thinks my Maxima will be faster than it, and he's never seen or driven it.

Oh what have we here.

http://www.stereo.d2g.com/91rtad.jpg

15.2 in the 1/4 mile and 6.5 0-60MPH.

I believe you've been 0wned.

Stereodude

 

That is one ooglie A$$ car. It has less HP than the new 2k2 Max's, a little more torque, but it looks like it is a lot older. I would like to think that in those years they would have made advancements in cars, and the Max would be faster with these comparable numbers.

 

 

since when did a 14.5 which was prolly corrected turn into a ACTUAL 14.3 with a new driver to a stick

 

Steve, stop letting facts get in the way of a good story.

 

Not that I really care, but there is that 14.1 sec 1/4 mile blast a stock GTP seems to have pulled off. Seems it has gone ignored. That's not a mag racer time, nor is it likely corrected. And before everyone comes to attack me I think that a 2002 6-speed would beat it's time if tested on the same track with the same conditions. However there are no time slips of Max's beating that time (yet). I think it's just a matter of time until it happens (no pun intended).

Stereodude

 

Props to the GTP. But I'm trying to figure out why someone is trying to tell us that a car that could only run 14.5 in the 1/4 is faster than something that runs 14.3. ***cough***jbgoodmax***cough***

 

Yep, for some reason everyone keeps on skipping over the stock low 14 second GTPs. It's been verified and recorded. There are ultra low 14 second GTPs. They're rare, but they are out there. The Shadow R/T is quick, but still isn't the 1/4 mile machine the GTP is. Big torque and good hp is what wills in the 1/4. Big topend hp is what wins top speed contests.


Dave

 

I think the problem is that the original poster didn't clarify why they meant by "fastest". His contention is that if you go by 0-60 it is faster (which I think we have disproven). I still contend that the 2002 6 speed could/will probably win all 3 categories (if it doesn't have a limiter at 149). The three categories being 0-60, 1/4, and top speed.

Stereodude

 

i think the limiter is 157. that's where the tires run out. V-rated

 

V rated tires are rated to 149, not 157. So figure the limiter is there.

Stereodude

 

****, my bad. your right.

 

I don't think its even limited at all....if it you went past like 140 then i don't think there is a limiter

 

Well the 01 sticks didn't have the HP to make to the tire's rating, so it makes sense they don't have a limiter (why limit the car to 149 when it can only go 143). The 02's do however have the HP to make it past the tires rating, so it is very possible there is a limiter on 02 sticks.

Stereodude

 

Don't think I made myself clear. I will only quote the stats I remember, and can prove.

I CAN prove 5.8, and 14.5 Car and Driver
I cann't find the 5.4 and 14.~ , I did not remember the 1/4 time, that's why I have Never qouted it.

What I did say in my post was:
The spirit was tested by two independant mags in sub 6 second 0-60, and both got 14.5 and below on 1/4. (Assuming, I find the Autoweek to get the exact #'s, which "should" be below 14.5 given the 5.4 0-60)

The post before that I said:

0-60; 5.4 - 5.8 Spirit wins
1/4 mile; 14.5~ GTP until I find the other mag if not it wins by a hair.
Hence, the Spirit gets 14.5 (that I can prove), but given the post by someone ? GTP is faster around 14.0 - 14.2, which means the GTP is faster on the 1/4, ie "it(GTP) wins".

My other statement that followed simply deduces the fact that if:
Spirit gets 0-60: 5.8 (Faster than max and GTP) Yet gets 14.5 (slower than GTP and Max) by a slim margin, then it's faster. until I find the other mag, this is it. I did some more research and found some sites that has the R/T doing the 1/4@101mph, and times in the 13's. Which is much faster than what Autoweek tested (my second mag that's causing me to tear up my house).

**** cough *** miss read *** cough ****
medicsonic

Props to the GTP. But I'm trying to figure out why someone is trying to tell us that a car that could only run 14.5 in the 1/4 is faster than something that runs 14.3. ***cough***jbgoodmax***cough***

Chance for all who don't believe the 5.8/14.5 times of the R/T to save face. If I find the other you will really need to save face. Just post saying it could happen, and I will be nice when I scan the pages in. Uh I think not. There is no way on God's green earth a R/T runs anywhere near a 5.4-5.8 stock.


My boss has one. Chrysler didn't make such lofty claims. . Nor did any of the car magazines get anywhere near the 5's. That is mid 6 second car.

Stereodude

 

i believe those Holdens are RWD with the same 5.7L found in teh C5 Corvettes. it's like an Australien 4 dorr Corvette. I was watching SpeedVision and a whoel pack of them were racing. They looks sweet too.

 

J-
Although there aren't really definitive times on the 0-60 of a stock GTP, I did do this to find a good approximation. I tried a program called draguess.exe and inputted the track times from the GTP in the post I made earlier and came up with a 0-60 of 5.8 seconds. Now I know that this is by no means scientific, but the program is pretty accurate; more accurate than a lot of Internet/Java calculators. Here are some screenshots and stuff. And no, I didn't write it.

ClubGP original post

EDIT: In a stock GTP, there is a speed limiter at 126. If you have that removed, a stock GTP will stop pulling somewhere between 147 and 150 depending on conditions. There are modified ones that have gotten over 160 though, and could have gone for more. But top speed is kind of dumb anyway, at least IMO.

 

uhh...okay...101mph trap speed in a car with only 240hp?!
Pardon me if I find that a little difficult to believe.

Besides, I doubt a GTP could hit 14's without the aide of some very sticky (i.e. neither stock nor streetable) tires

 

Heres my R/T dyno plot on 93 pump gas. Ive spent $250 in mods. I am not kidding.


As you can clearly see in the plot, the stock turbo (Garrett T3 55 trim) is maxxed out! The reason the torque curve drops so fast is because the boost is falling rapidly from 22 psi at 3500 rpm to 13 psi at 6700 rpm. It simply cant flow enough. A nice T04E 57 trim or so will solve that and add about 75-100 wheel hp.

Thats part of the deal! Its a sleeper for sure.

Reliability on my car has been pretty good. But, I dont use it as a daily driver.

DYNO PLOT:
http://slapshot.20m.com/whitertrun9.gif

 

My friend's bone stock one ran 14.65@95 on stock tires. When he added a smaller pulley, he went 13.85@99, still on the stock tires. I even made a few runs in his car when it was stock and my first time down the track with it ran a 14.8@95.

 

Dont forget us 1991 Spirit R/T's!

 

Well, Im not going to critique your boss's driving skills, but my car with just an exhaust ran 13.8. Bone stock, they are usually in the very low 14's.

Ive got both a 2000 Max 5 speed and a 1991 Spirit R/T sitting in my garage. There is no comparison. The Spirit walks all over the Max. Its not even close.

 

On paper the R/T and WRX are close. I raced a lightly modded one (boost controller) on the street and ran away by about 8 cars by 100 mph. The AWD kills them once they get going.

 

LOL!

Or, anyone can come down here and pick one of the cars in my garage (The 2000 Max or the 1991 R/T) and well run em. The Max is no slouch, but it just cant run with the R/T.

I can say this without bias as I like and own both cars! But, for outright acceleration, the R/T is leagues ahead. But, as a daily driver, the Max wins hands down. The R/T is 10 years old now.

In any case, the R/T was years ahead of itself back in the very early 90's. The fact that a 1991 model is even being compared to a 2002 model is quite an accomplishment.

 

LOL. Manufacturer's literature is the least reliable source of performance info out there.

 

Or, anyone in the Tampa area can come to my house and pick the Max or the R/T out of the garage and well see who wins. Or bring any Max you like.

 

Take yer' pick! If you are racing I suggest the one on the right.

 

Dodge Omni GLH-S
the s is a big difference.
i suggest you find out about this car

will romp the R/T, maxima, AND GTP in stock form.

 

Yes, the GLHS is also very quick in stock form and even more so modded. But, stock for stock, it wont romp the R/T models.

My previous "toy" car was an Omni GLH which I converted to GLHS. The major difference between a GLH and GLHS is an intercooler. The GLHS thus has about 30 more hp.

A friend of mine has a Charger GLHS. (In 1986 the GLHS were in the Omni body style, in 1987 there were in the Charger body style.) With nothing but a set of larger injectors ($100), a cheap manual boost controller ($6), dumping the exhaust, and a set of slicks, he ran a 12.85@109 mph.

 

I rest my case!!!!

I have thought about buying one and taking it to the track, and taking peoples money!!!

These are little known secrets that most people don't know until they get burned.

You know that look on peoples face when you dust them in a max. Well long ago I said I don't want to make that face when a car destroys me, soooo I read read read to learn the competion, and thus have never lost a race.

 

Doh, I'm sorry, I meant low 14's (i.e. 14.1)