flooring an auto
???
06-27-2010, 09:13 PM
#43
06-27-2010, 09:43 PM
#44
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Location: Stone Mountain, Georgia
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My opinion: Nissan included the 1, 2, and 3 gate on the shifter, so you might as well use them!
06-28-2010, 07:26 AM
#47
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There is a difference between driving hard (but smoothly) and driving harshly. Trannies are for the most part fairly durable, but their life will be shortened if they are always shifting with heavy impact loads happening. Occasional forced downshifts aren't nearly as bad as wheel hop or spinning on snow/ice/wet and suddenly catching a dry bare patch of pavement.
Norm
06-28-2010, 07:40 AM
#48
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Probably both.
Sure, I'll floor any car if I have reason to, most likely for a moment or so on corner exit once I'm not cornering so hard that it'll either plow or loop on me. But just jumping on it in a straight line over and over again for no apparent reason is boring, kind of mindless, and not worth my while.
Norm
Sure, I'll floor any car if I have reason to, most likely for a moment or so on corner exit once I'm not cornering so hard that it'll either plow or loop on me. But just jumping on it in a straight line over and over again for no apparent reason is boring, kind of mindless, and not worth my while.
Norm
06-28-2010, 07:46 AM
#49
Probably both.
Sure, I'll floor any car if I have reason to, most likely for a moment or so on corner exit once I'm not cornering so hard that it'll either plow or loop on me. But just jumping on it in a straight line over and over again for no apparent reason is boring, kind of mindless, and not worth my while.
Norm
Sure, I'll floor any car if I have reason to, most likely for a moment or so on corner exit once I'm not cornering so hard that it'll either plow or loop on me. But just jumping on it in a straight line over and over again for no apparent reason is boring, kind of mindless, and not worth my while.
Norm
06-28-2010, 09:02 PM
#51
personally i drive all cars rough...from my moms beater corolla to my 96 hp civic hatch to my maxima and my altimas.
each car when driven by me gets pedal to the metal treatment. no issues here.
the day i get a 911 carerra (when i do) with so much power on tap maybe i wont have to floor it lolz
each car when driven by me gets pedal to the metal treatment. no issues here.
the day i get a 911 carerra (when i do) with so much power on tap maybe i wont have to floor it lolz
06-28-2010, 11:37 PM
#52
personally i drive all cars rough...from my moms beater corolla to my 96 hp civic hatch to my maxima and my altimas.
each car when driven by me gets pedal to the metal treatment. no issues here.
the day i get a 911 carerra (when i do) with so much power on tap maybe i wont have to floor it lolz
each car when driven by me gets pedal to the metal treatment. no issues here.
the day i get a 911 carerra (when i do) with so much power on tap maybe i wont have to floor it lolz
same here
06-29-2010, 12:01 AM
#54
if you say so
i like all the comment that say that driving your car hard is "abusive" and "******* it"...you can drive your car hard with no abuse...just take care of it...i drove my car hard all the time...high rev shifting...downshifting (with rev match) into a corner...late braking...but when I wasnt driving it, I was babying it...did all my own maintenance, etc...best fluids and parts...so I knew that the car was fine and could handle the way I drove it...yes I had to replace "wear items" (brake pads, rotors, tires, struts, etc) more often...but that isnt "abuse"...those are wear items...nothing big went bad because of how i drove...i guarantee my car was in better condition then most cars on here...and it wasnt because of how i drove it...it was because of how i took care of it
Last edited by SoonerFan; 06-29-2010 at 12:11 AM.
06-29-2010, 04:14 AM
#55
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Hard driving does not have to be abusive, but it frequently is if the driver cannot drive hard, smoothly. Rev-matching a MT is as smooth as the driver is at doing it and OE automatic tranny shifting is mostly smooth, but shifting with aftermarket shift kits frequently is not (the more you can feel the shift, the less smooth it is and the more impact was involved).
Not every part in your car has an infinite fatigue life, and the short story about fatigue is that fatigue life can be tremendously shortened by relatively small increases in loading that is repeated over and over. Put double the cyclic stress in a part (as impact loading can easily do) every single time and the part won't last half as long like you might think - it'll be lasting more like only 3% to 5% as long. Maybe even 3% component life will outlast your ownership of the car, but I won't be betting my retirement on it.
My day job actually does involve performing fatigue life evaluations from time to time, so I'm not making this stuff up.
That said, whether one considers accelerated wear to be abusive or not depends mostly on the individual person's concept of what constitutes acceptable wear rates. But this isn't outright failure, just its wear life being used up faster.
Norm
Not every part in your car has an infinite fatigue life, and the short story about fatigue is that fatigue life can be tremendously shortened by relatively small increases in loading that is repeated over and over. Put double the cyclic stress in a part (as impact loading can easily do) every single time and the part won't last half as long like you might think - it'll be lasting more like only 3% to 5% as long. Maybe even 3% component life will outlast your ownership of the car, but I won't be betting my retirement on it.
My day job actually does involve performing fatigue life evaluations from time to time, so I'm not making this stuff up.
That said, whether one considers accelerated wear to be abusive or not depends mostly on the individual person's concept of what constitutes acceptable wear rates. But this isn't outright failure, just its wear life being used up faster.
Norm
Last edited by Norm Peterson; 06-30-2010 at 09:04 AM.
06-30-2010, 07:45 AM
#57
With this out of the way, other posters not making blanket statements are correct. There is hard driving, and there is abusive driving. Some driving styles considered "easy" are also abusive, like the DC area "slow mosey" off of the red lights here (almost impossible in a max, and infuriating to follow in an automatic max), or driving at a speed where the automatic transmission hunts for a gear.
There is nothing wrong with driving a car hard. Some designs even benefit from changes in usage patterns once in a while - like tires, using the same mechanism exactly the same way if it's built to cover a range of uses tends to hurt longevity rather than help, which is why tires are rotated. Most car user's manuals state that during break-in, avoid running the engine at exactly the same speed for extended periods. This is also why in many cases a car seems to run better after a run on the highway to "blow out the carbon."
I personally tend to avoid hard down-shifts if I can, but if I am in second gear and the on-ramp is clear, I open it up smoothly to WOT. You won't hurt the engine any, and you won't hurt anything else if you're not making the transmission shift and you're not running the engine at redline for extended periods.
06-30-2010, 09:09 AM
#58
Most of the time I drive my max like a bat out of hell. 120K and knock on wood 0 problems. From what I understand the Max auto trannies are pretty tough. Hell look at that Aron92SE guy he went through what? 3 engines? before he nuked the AUTO tranny. To me that type of longevity under track conditions is a testament tot he auto trans.
As for harming the max depends on how you drive it. The Max is a machine. Machines not only break down but they wear in. If you drive like a grandma going to church every day, the day you drive like Steve McQueen you're going to break something. But if you drive like Steve McQueen on a regular basis, you will still break stuff but the car will be more used to your driving habits.
Another aspect of driving aggressively, you will feel more of your car and be in a closer tune with what it is telling you. Therefore by driving aggressively you will know your motor mounts are getting tired, you will know a coil is getting weak you will know a cat is getting plugged.
As for harming the max depends on how you drive it. The Max is a machine. Machines not only break down but they wear in. If you drive like a grandma going to church every day, the day you drive like Steve McQueen you're going to break something. But if you drive like Steve McQueen on a regular basis, you will still break stuff but the car will be more used to your driving habits.
Another aspect of driving aggressively, you will feel more of your car and be in a closer tune with what it is telling you. Therefore by driving aggressively you will know your motor mounts are getting tired, you will know a coil is getting weak you will know a cat is getting plugged.
07-06-2010, 03:35 AM
#61
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That is, of course, the catch.
Until rather recently, automated capability to rev-match on downshift (with powertrains like the OP's that do not have a clutch pedal) did not exist. I know of exactly one person who has rev-matched an automatic tranny while downshifting it using the shift lever (and just like downshifting a MT, timing/coordination is everything where smoothness counts).
Norm
Until rather recently, automated capability to rev-match on downshift (with powertrains like the OP's that do not have a clutch pedal) did not exist. I know of exactly one person who has rev-matched an automatic tranny while downshifting it using the shift lever (and just like downshifting a MT, timing/coordination is everything where smoothness counts).
Norm
Last edited by Norm Peterson; 07-06-2010 at 03:37 AM.
07-06-2010, 10:50 AM
#62
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Location: Nashville
Posts: 52
07-06-2010, 11:51 AM
#63
I don't see why it's an issue. The main reason I keep buying a Nissan is b/c the odds of breaking it are slim to none (as long as it's maintained obviously, which is little and get rid of bull**** like cats).
I redline my car dozens of times daily, slam it into gear, etc without worry. If I wanted to worry I would've bought a domestic (yes, I'm a profound hater, deal with it
).
Drive it like you want. That's why you bought the car. If you're afraid to drive it, then sell it.
I'm not trying to be a ****, but that's my .02. The engine and to a lesser extent, the car itself, was designed to be performance orientated. 171k on the this one and I rip it as if it was gonna blow up tomorrow. But it won't haha
I redline my car dozens of times daily, slam it into gear, etc without worry. If I wanted to worry I would've bought a domestic (yes, I'm a profound hater, deal with it
).Drive it like you want. That's why you bought the car. If you're afraid to drive it, then sell it.
I'm not trying to be a ****, but that's my .02. The engine and to a lesser extent, the car itself, was designed to be performance orientated. 171k on the this one and I rip it as if it was gonna blow up tomorrow. But it won't haha
07-06-2010, 03:07 PM
#64
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That is, of course, the catch.
Until rather recently, automated capability to rev-match on downshift (with powertrains like the OP's that do not have a clutch pedal) did not exist. I know of exactly one person who has rev-matched an automatic tranny while downshifting it using the shift lever (and just like downshifting a MT, timing/coordination is everything where smoothness counts).
Norm
Until rather recently, automated capability to rev-match on downshift (with powertrains like the OP's that do not have a clutch pedal) did not exist. I know of exactly one person who has rev-matched an automatic tranny while downshifting it using the shift lever (and just like downshifting a MT, timing/coordination is everything where smoothness counts).
Norm
07-06-2010, 09:17 PM
#67
07-06-2010, 11:33 PM
#68
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Not a lot of experience with STP, but I've used the big bottles of Lucus Fuel additive and after 2-3 tanks I noticed a 2-3 mpg increase (I'm one of those that measure EVERY tank). Stopped using it, and my mpg dropped by 1 mpg. I'm currently getting between 21-22 mpg........depending on how often I floor my automatic. True story!
07-07-2010, 04:39 AM
#69
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But there are a few of us who are hardwired to downshift before entering a slowish corner and have the car in the right gear while going through the turn rather than let the transmission dictate that you drive with either too few engine revs (while it is refusing to downshift) or too many too suddenly (when it finally does).
I don't think I could force myself to creep around most of an on-ramp at 25-ish mph in 5th, finally step down on the gas when the road is perfectly straight again and put up with the resulting too-late downshift or double downshift. That's just a horribly un-smooth stomp or steer approach to driving that makes me cringe inside when I ride with somebody who drives that way.
Norm
Last edited by Norm Peterson; 07-07-2010 at 04:43 AM.
07-07-2010, 07:16 PM
#70
Other than for reasons of wanting or needing engine compression braking (thanks, Z), that is entirely true for those who are content to use only the 'P', 'R', and 'D' positions anyway. Most people fit here, looking at the AT either for its convenience or its dragstrip suitability. No flame intended.
But there are a few of us who are hardwired to downshift before entering a slowish corner and have the car in the right gear while going through the turn rather than let the transmission dictate that you drive with either too few engine revs (while it is refusing to downshift) or too many too suddenly (when it finally does).
I don't think I could force myself to creep around most of an on-ramp at 25-ish mph in 5th, finally step down on the gas when the road is perfectly straight again and put up with the resulting too-late downshift or double downshift. That's just a horribly un-smooth stomp or steer approach to driving that makes me cringe inside when I ride with somebody who drives that way.
Norm
But there are a few of us who are hardwired to downshift before entering a slowish corner and have the car in the right gear while going through the turn rather than let the transmission dictate that you drive with either too few engine revs (while it is refusing to downshift) or too many too suddenly (when it finally does).
I don't think I could force myself to creep around most of an on-ramp at 25-ish mph in 5th, finally step down on the gas when the road is perfectly straight again and put up with the resulting too-late downshift or double downshift. That's just a horribly un-smooth stomp or steer approach to driving that makes me cringe inside when I ride with somebody who drives that way.
Norm
there is no better feeling than to go in to acorner hot...late brake...downshift from 4th to second with a perfetc throttle blip...then get back on the throttle as you exit the turn.
you cant do that in an auto
07-07-2010, 07:31 PM
#71
Converting to manual was the most satisfying change to my car so far. I'll be right back.
07-07-2010, 07:48 PM
#73
07-07-2010, 08:51 PM
#75
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Location: Stone Mountain, Georgia
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To SoonerFan, I agree. People that are really into driving should be driving a car with a MT. Unfortunately, 6MT Maximas are getting hard to find, and in my case, some of my family members drive my car occasionally and they have no idea what to do with a clutch pedal. But the next time around, I'm buying a car with a manual transmission for sure. 6MT 135i FTW.
07-08-2010, 12:23 AM
#76
To SoonerFan, I agree. People that are really into driving should be driving a car with a MT. Unfortunately, 6MT Maximas are getting hard to find, and in my case, some of my family members drive my car occasionally and they have no idea what to do with a clutch pedal. But the next time around, I'm buying a car with a manual transmission for sure. 6MT 135i FTW.
6MT S5
07-08-2010, 04:21 AM
#77
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...and normal auto isnt made to manually downshift frequently
there is no better feeling than to go in to acorner hot...late brake...downshift from 4th to second with a perfetc throttle blip...then get back on the throttle as you exit the turn.
you cant do that in an auto
you cant do that in an auto
Since your timing still matters, there is still some satisfaction to be had when you get it right.
Norm
07-08-2010, 08:51 AM
#78
As most others have said: Take care of your car and drive it the way you want. I take care of my car, warm it up properly and then drive the living hell out of it as I please. My previous max (00 SE 5spd) was taken to redline every single time I drove it for 2 years and never had an issue. Yes wear items wear out, its to be expected.
With my 5.5 I warm it up, use good oil, good gas and I've replaced a lot of the potential wear items in advance...but really, I bought a 6MT to DRIVE and that is exactly what I am going to do. Drive your car ! it pains me to see people spending big bucks on a high HP car to baby it and never actually use what they bought.
Be responsible and enjoy your car !
With my 5.5 I warm it up, use good oil, good gas and I've replaced a lot of the potential wear items in advance...but really, I bought a 6MT to DRIVE and that is exactly what I am going to do. Drive your car ! it pains me to see people spending big bucks on a high HP car to baby it and never actually use what they bought.
Be responsible and enjoy your car !
