THE 02 03 Max running 350Z ECU with UpRev Osiris thread CHECK IT OUT
10-15-2011, 05:30 PM
#1
THE 02 03 Max running 350Z ECU with UpRev Osiris thread CHECK IT OUT
Finally made some good progress on this, so its that time again! I've hinted at me trying this again, but this time its a lot different!
This time its not a ecu replacement, its keeping the stock ecu to run all stock functions ( Cruise, A/C, emissions, all that, even pass OBD2) And only using the Z ecu to run the motor but most importantly TUNE with OSIRIS!!!!
www.UpRev.com for info on Osiris!
Taking my basic Maxima Patch harness, then adding the Z ecu connector it with some wiring magic ofcourse! One key component is a Device Emulator made by Haltech, i hook the IGN coils and Injectors from the stock ecu to this unit and it fools the stock ecu into thinking its running the motor. BUT the Z ecu is actually hooked up to the coils and injectors! Basically wiring the stock ecu inline with the Z ecu like a haltech,utec, emanage, is wired up.
I also wire up a obd2 connector to the Z ecu so they are separate connectors. Hook to the stock max obd2 for that ecu, and hook to the added obd2 for the Z ecu.
Couple things about these black connector ecu's. The older ones 03 04 have oxygen sensors like the 5.5 gen max. That is narrowband sensors. Some newer and other cars have factory wideband o2 sensors, that means if used on a 5.5 gen the widebands have to be added. Factory widebands are for each bank and make tuning with osiris very nice!
A major thing with doing this is picking out the right ecu to use. In my case i chose a 350Z REV up ECU, because i have 09 max motor that has exhaust valve timing, and i have a single DBW TB. Just like the rev up 350Z. And it has factory widebands which i want.
Here is where i'm at:
Motor runs and revs up.
Stock gauges work
Stock ECU thinks its running the motor (but its not)
No o2 sensors are hooked up to the Z ecu (soon to be)
EVT is not hooked up to the Z ecu (after o2's)
I haven't fully tested stock functions such as Cruise, Fan control, Since i dont have o2s hooked up i haven't let the motor run for a long period of time, i haven't driven it at all.
Here is a quick pic
Its messy because ive been uninstalling and installing over the past few weeks. Lots of testing!
Few notes on wiring a ecu with another ecu:
Temp sensors dont like this, currently i have IAT (intake air temp) only going to the Z ecu, this triggers a code on the max ecu, will address this later as the max really dont need IAT as its not running the motor.
Coolant temp is hooked to the Max ecu only, because it controls fans. The Z ecu having no CTS hooked up believes its at 104 degrees and it actually climbs up some when i cranked the motor. Ill add a coolant temp sensor just for the Z ecu later on. This is actually normal, having to add temp sensors, lots of standalone when ran with stock ecu require this.
When the motor is not running Calculated Load value is 0. This is fine. but when its running it goes to 100 (on the Z ecu) and stays there no matter what rpm, tps, anything. It might be due to no o2 sensors? Im not sure.
Lots more testing is needed but that's where this is at right now! I'm going to add dual factory widebands to the Z ecu and see how load value changes if it does, and also logg some AFR. Possibly drive it down the road also.
Here is a Cipher log from today, motor cranked up, ran , gave a little throttle. Excel .csv download
This time its not a ecu replacement, its keeping the stock ecu to run all stock functions ( Cruise, A/C, emissions, all that, even pass OBD2) And only using the Z ecu to run the motor but most importantly TUNE with OSIRIS!!!!
www.UpRev.com for info on Osiris!
Taking my basic Maxima Patch harness, then adding the Z ecu connector it with some wiring magic ofcourse! One key component is a Device Emulator made by Haltech, i hook the IGN coils and Injectors from the stock ecu to this unit and it fools the stock ecu into thinking its running the motor. BUT the Z ecu is actually hooked up to the coils and injectors! Basically wiring the stock ecu inline with the Z ecu like a haltech,utec, emanage, is wired up.
I also wire up a obd2 connector to the Z ecu so they are separate connectors. Hook to the stock max obd2 for that ecu, and hook to the added obd2 for the Z ecu.
Couple things about these black connector ecu's. The older ones 03 04 have oxygen sensors like the 5.5 gen max. That is narrowband sensors. Some newer and other cars have factory wideband o2 sensors, that means if used on a 5.5 gen the widebands have to be added. Factory widebands are for each bank and make tuning with osiris very nice!
A major thing with doing this is picking out the right ecu to use. In my case i chose a 350Z REV up ECU, because i have 09 max motor that has exhaust valve timing, and i have a single DBW TB. Just like the rev up 350Z. And it has factory widebands which i want.
Here is where i'm at:
Motor runs and revs up.
Stock gauges work
Stock ECU thinks its running the motor (but its not)
No o2 sensors are hooked up to the Z ecu (soon to be)
EVT is not hooked up to the Z ecu (after o2's)
I haven't fully tested stock functions such as Cruise, Fan control, Since i dont have o2s hooked up i haven't let the motor run for a long period of time, i haven't driven it at all.
Here is a quick pic
Its messy because ive been uninstalling and installing over the past few weeks. Lots of testing!
Few notes on wiring a ecu with another ecu:
Temp sensors dont like this, currently i have IAT (intake air temp) only going to the Z ecu, this triggers a code on the max ecu, will address this later as the max really dont need IAT as its not running the motor.
Coolant temp is hooked to the Max ecu only, because it controls fans. The Z ecu having no CTS hooked up believes its at 104 degrees and it actually climbs up some when i cranked the motor. Ill add a coolant temp sensor just for the Z ecu later on. This is actually normal, having to add temp sensors, lots of standalone when ran with stock ecu require this.
When the motor is not running Calculated Load value is 0. This is fine. but when its running it goes to 100 (on the Z ecu) and stays there no matter what rpm, tps, anything. It might be due to no o2 sensors? Im not sure.
Lots more testing is needed but that's where this is at right now! I'm going to add dual factory widebands to the Z ecu and see how load value changes if it does, and also logg some AFR. Possibly drive it down the road also.
Here is a Cipher log from today, motor cranked up, ran , gave a little throttle. Excel .csv download
10-15-2011, 05:39 PM
#2
Very nice man. Could this same concept be applied (in some weird way) to run a 95-01 Maxima with a full 3.5 swap? So we wouldn't have to run 3.0 timing. Excuse my lack of logic when it comes to electronics. It's not my forte as you know. Lol.
I was actually discussing running mega squirt in line with the stock ecu on a Maxima with a friend of mine while he was wiring one up to his 240sx the other day. So its funny that you POP up with s thread like this.
I was actually discussing running mega squirt in line with the stock ecu on a Maxima with a friend of mine while he was wiring one up to his 240sx the other day. So its funny that you POP up with s thread like this.
Last edited by essential1; 10-15-2011 at 05:44 PM.
10-15-2011, 05:48 PM
#3
Very nice man. Could this same concept be applied (in some weird way) to run a 95-01 Maxima with a full 3.5 swap? So we wouldn't have to run 3.0 timing. Excuse my lack of logic when it comes to electronics. It's not my forte as you know. Lol.
I was actually discussing running mega squirt in line with the stock ecu on a Maxima with a friend of mine while he was wiring one up to his 240sx the other day. So its funny that you POP up with s thread like this.
I was actually discussing running mega squirt in line with the stock ecu on a Maxima with a friend of mine while he was wiring one up to his 240sx the other day. So its funny that you POP up with s thread like this.
Well if its a FULL 3.5 swap then that means running a 5.5 gen ecu right? Im not sure if your talking about that or running a Z ecu for the full swap and not messing with a maxima ecu?
10-15-2011, 06:13 PM
#7
Me either!!! haha
True! But we do have tuning its pricey!
Hahaha
One ecu is for NA my other ecu is for NOSS
Hahaha
One ecu is for NA my other ecu is for NOSS
10-15-2011, 06:28 PM
#8
yess!!! you weren't kidding when you said you'd try again in october! i can't wait to see progress on this. i'd love to try this when i'm done as well! my friend runs osiris on his 06 auto g35 coupe and i love it.
10-15-2011, 08:03 PM
#10
Well the Z ecu wont be codeless, well kinda (osiris can turn them off) but a lot is simply not hooked up to the Z ecu. For OBD2 inspection itll be the MAX ecu that needs to be codess.
10-16-2011, 08:13 AM
#14
Would this somehow eliminate the need for the NATS, programmed key, etc? If I make no sense just carry on without me. Lol.
10-16-2011, 08:16 AM
#15
Ive thought about it, not gonna work because VQ30 and 35 have way different cam and crank sensors.
10-16-2011, 03:00 PM
#16
Great work as always man. Definitely anticipating each update as they come. I admire your hard work, determination, and motivation to continue pioneering this. Its people like you that open doors for the entire community.
Regarding the odd load readings from the ECU, which ECU is seeing MAF voltage? It was my understanding that the MAF voltage is required for the load calculation?
Regarding the odd load readings from the ECU, which ECU is seeing MAF voltage? It was my understanding that the MAF voltage is required for the load calculation?
10-16-2011, 03:50 PM
#17
Wonder how the engine will run when you turn on the A/C since the Z ECU controls the engine while max ECU controls the actual A/C function ect. After all, there is a slight bump in RPM when A/C is on, wonder how that will work out...
10-16-2011, 08:44 PM
#21
Pretty much irrelevant. You should probably being idling higher than stock anyway for a bit more oil pressure, which a baby could do on osiris.
10-16-2011, 11:03 PM
#22
Coolant temp is hooked to the Max ecu only, because it controls fans. The Z ecu having no CTS hooked up believes its at 104 degrees and it actually climbs up some when i cranked the motor. Ill add a coolant temp sensor just for the Z ecu later on. This is actually normal, having to add temp sensors, lots of standalone when ran with stock ecu require this.
When the motor is not running Calculated Load value is 0. This is fine. but when its running it goes to 100 (on the Z ecu) and stays there no matter what rpm, tps, anything. It might be due to no o2 sensors? Im not sure.
Excel .csv download
When the motor is not running Calculated Load value is 0. This is fine. but when its running it goes to 100 (on the Z ecu) and stays there no matter what rpm, tps, anything. It might be due to no o2 sensors? Im not sure.
Excel .csv download
Instead of adding an additional sensor can't you just splice into the wire going into the max ecu and connect it to the Z?
It makes sense that it'll show 100. When you disconnect the primary O2s on the max it forces the ECU into open loop. So it's possible that it simulates the open loop by manipulating the load input. It is the load, after all, that determines the switch between open and closed loop.
10-17-2011, 06:49 PM
#23
Great work as always man. Definitely anticipating each update as they come. I admire your hard work, determination, and motivation to continue pioneering this. Its people like you that open doors for the entire community.
Regarding the odd load readings from the ECU, which ECU is seeing MAF voltage? It was my understanding that the MAF voltage is required for the load calculation?
Regarding the odd load readings from the ECU, which ECU is seeing MAF voltage? It was my understanding that the MAF voltage is required for the load calculation?
Thanks !!!!
Both ECU's are getting MAF signal.
Instead of adding an additional sensor can't you just splice into the wire going into the max ecu and connect it to the Z?
It makes sense that it'll show 100. When you disconnect the primary O2s on the max it forces the ECU into open loop. So it's possible that it simulates the open loop by manipulating the load input. It is the load, after all, that determines the switch between open and closed loop.
It makes sense that it'll show 100. When you disconnect the primary O2s on the max it forces the ECU into open loop. So it's possible that it simulates the open loop by manipulating the load input. It is the load, after all, that determines the switch between open and closed loop.
Sry i thought i explained that.
Temperature sensors cannot be hooked up to both ecus at same time, it changes the resistance of them thus wont temps. A lot of standalone s require adding IAT and CTS .
Possibly right on the o2's i sure hope so!!! Will hopefully hook the dual widebands up soon!
11-06-2011, 07:57 AM
#26
Little update:
Got dual factory widebands hooked up.
Calculated load is still at 100, the car runs but throttle response is just not there (it revs up but rpm comes down very slow).
Ive got a Z MAF on its way, only issue with that is i cant use my LR MAF housing, anyone know of a larger housing for that maf? Its different then 5.5 gen's I thought about getting a flange for it and putting it in my 3.5 intake piping also.
My plan is to remove this ecu and tune with a UTEC i have now. I will be sorting out MAF and Coolant temp sensor stuff in the mean time. Id still really like to get this setup working!!!!
Got dual factory widebands hooked up.
Calculated load is still at 100, the car runs but throttle response is just not there (it revs up but rpm comes down very slow).
Ive got a Z MAF on its way, only issue with that is i cant use my LR MAF housing, anyone know of a larger housing for that maf? Its different then 5.5 gen's I thought about getting a flange for it and putting it in my 3.5 intake piping also.
My plan is to remove this ecu and tune with a UTEC i have now. I will be sorting out MAF and Coolant temp sensor stuff in the mean time. Id still really like to get this setup working!!!!
12-03-2011, 06:03 PM
#28
Update
Been looking into stuff, seems the z not controlling the TB is where the problem is. Even tho i deleted the codes for that stuff it still seems to throw the ecu in a limp mode (weird throttle response)
So ima hook the tb to the Z ecu, that means cruise is broke! for now its ok, ima try and get this running better and tune some, then possibly a cruise fix!
If i can get it running good, and tune some, then ill do some dyno testing also! Esp with my car and EVT!!
Been looking into stuff, seems the z not controlling the TB is where the problem is. Even tho i deleted the codes for that stuff it still seems to throw the ecu in a limp mode (weird throttle response)
So ima hook the tb to the Z ecu, that means cruise is broke! for now its ok, ima try and get this running better and tune some, then possibly a cruise fix!
If i can get it running good, and tune some, then ill do some dyno testing also! Esp with my car and EVT!!
12-04-2011, 08:05 AM
#30
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2009
Location: Dallas, TX
Posts: 489
Man once you get everything worked out, you need to sell that 5.7 to me. 
I think you car will be so mean once you get everything worked out. And with a lot of peoples 5th gens getting older, this could be a nice engine upgrade in the future for some.
I think you car will be so mean once you get everything worked out. And with a lot of peoples 5th gens getting older, this could be a nice engine upgrade in the future for some.
12-04-2011, 02:13 PM
#32
Hahaha it wont be cheap i can tell ya that!
12-04-2011, 03:48 PM
#33
I hate to be ignorant and I'm not looking to get flamed here BUT would someone be able to explain why this is better than getting a standalone ECU and just tuning that to your hearts desire? I understand why this the osiris tuning is popular for the 350z crowd but I can't see the gain in going through all the work to convert a maxima to run with this ECU and then having to tune it.
If this is just one of those "because I can" type things then I totally understand but I just want to get some clarification.
If this is just one of those "because I can" type things then I totally understand but I just want to get some clarification.
12-04-2011, 03:55 PM
#34
I hate to be ignorant and I'm not looking to get flamed here BUT would someone be able to explain why this is better than getting a standalone ECU and just tuning that to your hearts desire? I understand why this the osiris tuning is popular for the 350z crowd but I can't see the gain in going through all the work to convert a maxima to run with this ECU and then having to tune it.
If this is just one of those "because I can" type things then I totally understand but I just want to get some clarification.
If this is just one of those "because I can" type things then I totally understand but I just want to get some clarification.
Well its some of both!
There are racecars that have VQ35's that run a z ecu with osiris! FWD racecars (sentras)
Osiris ecu swap, is less $$$ then a standalone. But offers serious tuning capabilities!
Osiris offers MANY great features that are comparable to a standalone! If i can get osiris ecu working good along with other stuff, then osiris will offer pretty much all the tuning i need. (for boosted cars it might be different)
We all know Maxima people are some of the cheapest modding people EVER! How many will actually spend $2g on a full standalone? Shoot there is even some serious modded maximas that dont even have a standlone! Those guys SHOULD be the first to have standalones! -Rant
12-05-2011, 03:06 PM
#38
Although I don't have any personal experience, it looks like a standalone as well as osiris allows you to modify any parameter of the engine which includes fuel, timing etc at different loads and conditions without limitations which is essentially what tuning is about.
12-12-2011, 04:21 AM
#39
I think getting an 09 Maxima 3.5L V-6 ,with an 09 wiring harness and ecu would have been easier....But you're doing a superb job dude and wow the flow of those heads should put that 5.5 chassis into the mid 13's in stock form....
12-12-2011, 07:12 AM
#40
That might seem easier but its not at all, using the 5.5 cluster, abs, ac, stuff would really cause problems with the 09 ecu.
Now if i was swapping all the 09 stuff, cluster, abs, etc, then i could use the ecu too.
Since i have the 02 ecu working with the motor, its basically a REV up engine, that means 06 350z with the older cam sensors, but, EVT. and a single TB, single MAF too. But ofcourse its a 09 motor with the better heads and such.