Mystery Leak
06-09-2012, 08:29 PM
#41
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 93
Well I do all my maintenance flush fluids and all that stuff. I just like to know as much as possible and ask all the questions I can to make sure I know everything I can about it. I saw the video and on how to change the ring on the oil cooler and that looks really easy. The hose I would have to look at in person to know more about it.
In the interest of honesty you are coming off very arrogant and cocky. Its come off very badly and you are talking down to everyone form your high horse. So tone it back. Its not good and I know I do not appreciate it. I know your saying your trying to not be but it is. Sorry dude.
In the interest of honesty you are coming off very arrogant and cocky. Its come off very badly and you are talking down to everyone form your high horse. So tone it back. Its not good and I know I do not appreciate it. I know your saying your trying to not be but it is. Sorry dude.
Maybe it's time we get a better estimate of your skills, Dude. I think you had asked at one point how hard it would be to change a hose.
If you've never done something that basic and have no experienced person to assist you..... I'm going to go ahead and say it. You just need to stop and take the car to a mechanic. I do NOT want to discourage anyone (you) from doing their own work. However, I am having serious concerns that you are unable to resolve the simplest issue we have discussed.
I sincerely say this to be the most helpful to you. Clean things up, see of you can find the leak. But I highly recommend, if you are not confident in your skills, you then just take it to a shop.
If you've never done something that basic and have no experienced person to assist you..... I'm going to go ahead and say it. You just need to stop and take the car to a mechanic. I do NOT want to discourage anyone (you) from doing their own work. However, I am having serious concerns that you are unable to resolve the simplest issue we have discussed.
I sincerely say this to be the most helpful to you. Clean things up, see of you can find the leak. But I highly recommend, if you are not confident in your skills, you then just take it to a shop.
06-09-2012, 08:44 PM
#42
Then apologies to all.
Getting a better feel of your knowledge and confidence does change things significantly. Difference between giving you information and feedback that
remains helpful vs setting you up to fail.
Getting a better feel of your knowledge and confidence does change things significantly. Difference between giving you information and feedback that
remains helpful vs setting you up to fail.
06-09-2012, 10:04 PM
#43
Well now that I can finally see the pictures that you have posted and more important the degree of leakage you have been describing. Might I suggest that given the amount of material that has leaked all over everything that you get a good engine degreaser and completely remove (clean) all the area's that have been coated, rag and towel dry up everywhere so that you are viewing (as clean as possible) all of the affected area.
The guys have come up with all kinds of possibilities and areas that have been proven to be failure areas, but given what I see in your picture's this leakage has been going on for some time and the exact area is now so badly contaminated it is making it very difficult to determine the exact location.
The guys have come up with all kinds of possibilities and areas that have been proven to be failure areas, but given what I see in your picture's this leakage has been going on for some time and the exact area is now so badly contaminated it is making it very difficult to determine the exact location.
Even if you take it to a mechanic for the repair, the first thing they'll do is clean it off and pressure test the cooling system, then they'll run it and see if they can spot any clear oil leaks.
Chris is giving good advice. It's very easy for a poster to be led in a million directions and get various answers and opinoins, most just lead to further confusion about which route to take next.
It's the internet, there's no real emotions just text, it's difficult to interpret things in the way they were intended. When someone says something blatantly wrong but the way they say it sounds intellegent, it is going to lead the OP to consider or maybe even take that advice. In this case an a/c system, which is a ridiculous thing to consider at fault.
Chris is steering you in the right direction, OP, he's trying to keep you on track and save you time/money. When those of us that know different read something false on here, we correct each other. Some take it better than others.
In the end, it's all in the interest of learning, and teaching PROPER stuff, not opinions.
The truth isn't always sugar coated but that doesn't make it less helpful. You'd do best to just say thanks.
Last edited by TunerMaxima3000; 06-09-2012 at 10:17 PM.
06-10-2012, 10:12 AM
#44
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 93
Can someone enlighten me as to what OP stands for?
I have thanked him for the advice and guidence and I thank him again. It is going to come in handy. Unfortunately this all happened the day before I went on vacation so I have to wait to get cleaning the engine so I can diagnose it.
No one has still told me why they think my CV boots are going bad and the sympotmes. If someone can please inform me I would greatly appreciate it.
Please excuses typos I'm on the beach and a little distracted. Hahaha
I have thanked him for the advice and guidence and I thank him again. It is going to come in handy. Unfortunately this all happened the day before I went on vacation so I have to wait to get cleaning the engine so I can diagnose it.
No one has still told me why they think my CV boots are going bad and the sympotmes. If someone can please inform me I would greatly appreciate it.
Please excuses typos I'm on the beach and a little distracted. Hahaha
06-10-2012, 11:56 AM
#45
Original Poster unless I'm mistaken.
In the images, it seemed there may be, or at one time, there was a leaky axle or cv boot. A leaky or torn boot will allow greese to splatter onto surrounding components.
I've personally found (especially in images) it's sometimes hard to tell greese globs from oil mixed in with debri and dirt. I just touch it and check it's consistency. If it feels like Elmer's glue with gritty sand, it's oil and dirt/debris. If it feels like Vaseline, it's greese.
If there is greese, you should just be mindful of how much accumulates by inspecting at each oil change.
In the images, it seemed there may be, or at one time, there was a leaky axle or cv boot. A leaky or torn boot will allow greese to splatter onto surrounding components.
I've personally found (especially in images) it's sometimes hard to tell greese globs from oil mixed in with debri and dirt. I just touch it and check it's consistency. If it feels like Elmer's glue with gritty sand, it's oil and dirt/debris. If it feels like Vaseline, it's greese.
If there is greese, you should just be mindful of how much accumulates by inspecting at each oil change.
06-10-2012, 12:05 PM
#46
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Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: MN and MI
Posts: 35
Can someone enlighten me as to what OP stands for?
I have thanked him for the advice and guidence and I thank him again. It is going to come in handy. Unfortunately this all happened the day before I went on vacation so I have to wait to get cleaning the engine so I can diagnose it.
No one has still told me why they think my CV boots are going bad and the sympotmes. If someone can please inform me I would greatly appreciate it.
Please excuses typos I'm on the beach and a little distracted. Hahaha
I have thanked him for the advice and guidence and I thank him again. It is going to come in handy. Unfortunately this all happened the day before I went on vacation so I have to wait to get cleaning the engine so I can diagnose it.
No one has still told me why they think my CV boots are going bad and the sympotmes. If someone can please inform me I would greatly appreciate it.
Please excuses typos I'm on the beach and a little distracted. Hahaha
I'm going to agree with TunerMaxima3000 and say interpreting text is a bunch of bologna. I will also assure you that no one here purposely talks down to people. We just enjoy giving the RIGHT help and advice and if anyone is incorrect it's usually pointed out in a nice manner. Just like you we like to gather as much info about the situation also to help give you that advice.
TunerMaxima3000 and Chris Gregg are the ones who suggested it might be a CV boot. They didn't say they were going bad, just that it was another possible culprit. At this point I think the consensus is oil leak. When you eventually get down there just check to see if the boot is torn or if the clamps/seals on either end has failed. When these fail they throw **** everywhere and it's basically little clumps of grease all around.
When you do clean everything up I would take it for a small drive and see if that results in anything. Someone else please point out if this is not necessary.
Edit: Chris beat me to it.
06-10-2012, 01:43 PM
#47
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: vancouver
Posts: 336
i can agree that there are no emotions, but u can determine an attitude with the way words are put together in text form, regardless i did not see the pictures, i can agree that its not the lube used in a/c units. i can say to tunermax3000 that r134a refrigerant lube is infact a neon green substance, i can say to chrisgregg that as i stated, where im from (canada) r134a rigfrigerant is what we have to use now.. because it is not ozone depleting or as volitile. it is not "illegal" to discharge it into the atmosphere, and why i told him to see what refrigerant he was using first. im not here to argue, i offered up a peice of info based on what was said by the OP not seeing the pictures, yes it may not have lead him in the right direction. but there was no harm in offering up that peice of info. thats what this site is for.... some info u get is accurate some isnt. and being that i didnt see pics in the beginning it was something i simply threw out there that takes a matter of 2 mins to check.. so was it really that horrible of advice?? anyways.not here to argue. OP i hope you resolve the issue. lots of good advice.
OP stands for 'original poster' and in this case it is you because you started the thread.
I'm going to agree with TunerMaxima3000 and say interpreting text is a bunch of bologna. I will also assure you that no one here purposely talks down to people. We just enjoy giving the RIGHT help and advice and if anyone is incorrect it's usually pointed out in a nice manner. Just like you we like to gather as much info about the situation also to help give you that advice.
TunerMaxima3000 and Chris Gregg are the ones who suggested it might be a CV boot. They didn't say they were going bad, just that it was another possible culprit. At this point I think the consensus is oil leak. When you eventually get down there just check to see if the boot is torn or if the clamps/seals on either end has failed. When these fail they throw **** everywhere and it's basically little clumps of grease all around.
When you do clean everything up I would take it for a small drive and see if that results in anything. Someone else please point out if this is not necessary.
Edit: Chris beat me to it.
I'm going to agree with TunerMaxima3000 and say interpreting text is a bunch of bologna. I will also assure you that no one here purposely talks down to people. We just enjoy giving the RIGHT help and advice and if anyone is incorrect it's usually pointed out in a nice manner. Just like you we like to gather as much info about the situation also to help give you that advice.
TunerMaxima3000 and Chris Gregg are the ones who suggested it might be a CV boot. They didn't say they were going bad, just that it was another possible culprit. At this point I think the consensus is oil leak. When you eventually get down there just check to see if the boot is torn or if the clamps/seals on either end has failed. When these fail they throw **** everywhere and it's basically little clumps of grease all around.
When you do clean everything up I would take it for a small drive and see if that results in anything. Someone else please point out if this is not necessary.
Edit: Chris beat me to it.
06-10-2012, 02:26 PM
#49
Junior Member
Join Date: Jan 2011
Location: MN and MI
Posts: 35
i can agree that there are no emotions, but u can determine an attitude with the way words are put together in text form, regardless i did not see the pictures, i can agree that its not the lube used in a/c units. i can say to tunermax3000 that r134a refrigerant lube is infact a neon green substance, i can say to chrisgregg that as i stated, where im from (canada) r134a rigfrigerant is what we have to use now.. because it is not ozone depleting or as volitile. it is not "illegal" to discharge it into the atmosphere, and why i told him to see what refrigerant he was using first. im not here to argue, i offered up a peice of info based on what was said by the OP not seeing the pictures, yes it may not have lead him in the right direction. but there was no harm in offering up that peice of info. thats what this site is for.... some info u get is accurate some isnt. and being that i didnt see pics in the beginning it was something i simply threw out there that takes a matter of 2 mins to check.. so was it really that horrible of advice?? anyways.not here to argue. OP i hope you resolve the issue. lots of good advice.
I didn't emphasize RIGHT advice because you may or may not be wrong. Wasn't directed at you or anyone else. We all like to make sure people get the right advice so they aren't going in the wrong direction and throwing money down the toilet.
Remember everyone, it's perfectly okay for someone to disagree with you lol.
06-10-2012, 04:16 PM
#50
Yes, it is. 100% illegal. It's not good for the environment, it's just better than R12 was.
Nail on the head, sir.
Nail on the head, sir.
Last edited by TunerMaxima3000; 06-10-2012 at 04:54 PM.
06-10-2012, 05:21 PM
#51
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Join Date: May 2012
Location: vancouver
Posts: 336
Top of page
The Prohibition on Venting
Effective July 1, 1992, Section 608 of the Act prohibits individuals from intentionally venting*ozone-depleting substances
*used as refrigerants (generally*CFCs
*and*HCFCs
) into the atmosphere while maintaining, servicing, repairing, or disposing of air-conditioning or refrigeration equipment (appliances
). Only four types of releases are permitted under the prohibition:
"De minimis" quantities of refrigerant released in the course of making good faith attempts to recapture and recycle or safely dispose of refrigerant.
Refrigerants emitted in the course of normal operation of air-conditioning and refrigeration equipment (as opposed to during the maintenance, servicing, repair, or disposal of this equipment) such as from mechanical purging and leaks. However, EPA requires the repair of leaks above a certain size in large equipment (see*Refrigerant Leaks
).
Releases of CFCs or HCFCs*that are not used as refrigerants. For instance, mixtures of nitrogen and R-22 that are used as holding charges or as leak test gases may be released.
Small releases of refrigerant that result from purging hoses or from connecting or disconnecting hoses to charge or service appliances will not be considered violations of the prohibition on venting. However, recovery and recycling equipment manufactured after
November 15, 1993, must be equipped with low-loss fittings. am i reading this wrong? this is of the EPA. im not telling the guy to purge the entire 20 odd lbs into the atmosphere..the pen test releases a max of a oz. when quickly pressing on the release valve. pretty sure it says " de minimus" amounts allowed. if im reading this wrong then sorry.
The Prohibition on Venting
Effective July 1, 1992, Section 608 of the Act prohibits individuals from intentionally venting*ozone-depleting substances
*used as refrigerants (generally*CFCs
*and*HCFCs
) into the atmosphere while maintaining, servicing, repairing, or disposing of air-conditioning or refrigeration equipment (appliances
). Only four types of releases are permitted under the prohibition:
"De minimis" quantities of refrigerant released in the course of making good faith attempts to recapture and recycle or safely dispose of refrigerant.
Refrigerants emitted in the course of normal operation of air-conditioning and refrigeration equipment (as opposed to during the maintenance, servicing, repair, or disposal of this equipment) such as from mechanical purging and leaks. However, EPA requires the repair of leaks above a certain size in large equipment (see*Refrigerant Leaks
).
Releases of CFCs or HCFCs*that are not used as refrigerants. For instance, mixtures of nitrogen and R-22 that are used as holding charges or as leak test gases may be released.
Small releases of refrigerant that result from purging hoses or from connecting or disconnecting hoses to charge or service appliances will not be considered violations of the prohibition on venting. However, recovery and recycling equipment manufactured after
November 15, 1993, must be equipped with low-loss fittings. am i reading this wrong? this is of the EPA. im not telling the guy to purge the entire 20 odd lbs into the atmosphere..the pen test releases a max of a oz. when quickly pressing on the release valve. pretty sure it says " de minimus" amounts allowed. if im reading this wrong then sorry.
06-10-2012, 05:55 PM
#53
yes.
Read it again. And again, until you get it.
It clearly states in your quote that it's allowable to have minor purge leaks during normal operation of a PROPER REFRIDGERANT RECOVERY/FILLING DEVICE while trying to recycle or recover Refridgerant.
Not a fuaking pen dude.
A "pen test" is something some Neufie backyard mechanic does (illegally) to see if there's refridgerant in the system. This same guy has no idea what he's doing. It proves nothing.
Funny that you quoted something that proves what you said wrong though
Read it again. And again, until you get it.
Not a fuaking pen dude.
A "pen test" is something some Neufie backyard mechanic does (illegally) to see if there's refridgerant in the system. This same guy has no idea what he's doing. It proves nothing.
Funny that you quoted something that proves what you said wrong though
06-10-2012, 06:09 PM
#54
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: vancouver
Posts: 336
well my bad i guess.
we have all done this in the bodyshop i work at,our refrigerant companies have done it. and ask us to do it befor coming down to discharge them.
we have all done this in the bodyshop i work at,our refrigerant companies have done it. and ask us to do it befor coming down to discharge them.
yes.
Read it again. And again, until you get it.
It clearly states in your quote that it's allowable to have minor purge leaks during normal operation of a PROPER REFRIDGERANT RECOVERY/FILLING DEVICE while trying to recycle or recover Refridgerant.
Not a fuaking pen dude.
A "pen test" is something some Neufie backyard mechanic does (illegally) to see if there's refridgerant in the system. This same guy has no idea what he's doing. It proves nothing.
Funny that you quoted something that proves what you said wrong though
Read it again. And again, until you get it.
It clearly states in your quote that it's allowable to have minor purge leaks during normal operation of a PROPER REFRIDGERANT RECOVERY/FILLING DEVICE while trying to recycle or recover Refridgerant.
Not a fuaking pen dude.
A "pen test" is something some Neufie backyard mechanic does (illegally) to see if there's refridgerant in the system. This same guy has no idea what he's doing. It proves nothing.
Funny that you quoted something that proves what you said wrong though
06-10-2012, 06:57 PM
#55
don't get me wrong I've done it too, but it's illegal. If you didn't need to recover it properly you wouldn't ever need a recovery/charging machine.
And whoever is filling your A/C knows better than to suggest such a thing. Also you can have say 1/10 of a charge and still have lots of pressure, so that test is pointless, all it tells you is that there is SOMEthing in there, not how much or if the system is working properly or leaking or really anything useful.
Refridgerant is meaured in weight. Normal charge is around 1lb. but pressure in the system is the same regardless of the weight.
And whoever is filling your A/C knows better than to suggest such a thing. Also you can have say 1/10 of a charge and still have lots of pressure, so that test is pointless, all it tells you is that there is SOMEthing in there, not how much or if the system is working properly or leaking or really anything useful.
Refridgerant is meaured in weight. Normal charge is around 1lb. but pressure in the system is the same regardless of the weight.
06-10-2012, 07:05 PM
#56
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2012
Location: vancouver
Posts: 336
good to know, tnx
don't get me wrong I've done it too, but it's illegal. If you didn't need to recover it properly you wouldn't ever need a recovery/charging machine.
And whoever is filling your A/C knows better than to suggest such a thing. Also you can have say 1/10 of a charge and still have lots of pressure, so that test is pointless, all it tells you is that there is SOMEthing in there, not how much or if the system is working properly or leaking or really anything useful.
Refridgerant is meaured in weight. Normal charge is around 1lb. but pressure in the system is the same regardless of the weight.
And whoever is filling your A/C knows better than to suggest such a thing. Also you can have say 1/10 of a charge and still have lots of pressure, so that test is pointless, all it tells you is that there is SOMEthing in there, not how much or if the system is working properly or leaking or really anything useful.
Refridgerant is meaured in weight. Normal charge is around 1lb. but pressure in the system is the same regardless of the weight.
06-10-2012, 07:37 PM
#57
Perhaps I was a bit harsh in my statement. However, this is getting rediculous, so let's put this to rest and move on.
User: Your post was informative and I understand why you went there based on the initial post. Your quoting law/rules is accurate, to a point. That appears more about the law, and I'm going to assume that the laws and rules are similar to Canada.
Although the newer refrigerants (134a) are safe on the environment and in the US I know of no law on venting it.....the policies and usage guidelines still mandate that all refrigerants are to be reclaimed, even 134a. This is so that people who don't know what they are doing do not learn to vent 134a and then also apply that knowledge ignorantly to ozone depleting gases.
Therefore, it was my judgement at the time to voice this feedback as illegal for this reason so people reading the advice do not try/apply it inappropriately.
So, there may be no law for 134a, but any hvac guy knows venting under any other conditions than cannot otherwise be avoided (ie., placing/removing test hoses) is against regulation and usage.
So, no more about this unless the op finds a/c to be an issue. I've also apologized for my approach, so moving on. Focus on helping Dude when he gets sand out of his crack!
Errr, back from vacation!
User: Your post was informative and I understand why you went there based on the initial post. Your quoting law/rules is accurate, to a point. That appears more about the law, and I'm going to assume that the laws and rules are similar to Canada.
Although the newer refrigerants (134a) are safe on the environment and in the US I know of no law on venting it.....the policies and usage guidelines still mandate that all refrigerants are to be reclaimed, even 134a. This is so that people who don't know what they are doing do not learn to vent 134a and then also apply that knowledge ignorantly to ozone depleting gases.
Therefore, it was my judgement at the time to voice this feedback as illegal for this reason so people reading the advice do not try/apply it inappropriately.
So, there may be no law for 134a, but any hvac guy knows venting under any other conditions than cannot otherwise be avoided (ie., placing/removing test hoses) is against regulation and usage.
So, no more about this unless the op finds a/c to be an issue. I've also apologized for my approach, so moving on. Focus on helping Dude when he gets sand out of his crack!
Errr, back from vacation!
06-10-2012, 08:29 PM
#58
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 93
06-16-2012, 01:40 PM
#61
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 93
So I am in the process of cleaning it. The substance seems to be more of a greenish colored paste. There is a little bit of oil in there. I am going to try and add photos.
BTW Idk if anyone realized my car is a 5th gen not 5.5. I don't have that part that rusts very often. Or at least I don't see it.
BTW Idk if anyone realized my car is a 5th gen not 5.5. I don't have that part that rusts very often. Or at least I don't see it.
06-17-2012, 08:00 AM
#65
Wow, what did you use? Purple Power works great, there's also some foam spray that breaks oil and grease down, pulling it off surfaces. Going to have to get some manual labor in the form of elbow grease. No pun.
That axle boot seems to be one culprit of at least slinging junk around. The angle of trash on top the oil filter is indication, as well as the build up on the left of the boot. Whether that is the source though, is in question. But that area looks to have a lot of grease. Anything I see leads back to speculation at this time. Sorry.
That axle boot seems to be one culprit of at least slinging junk around. The angle of trash on top the oil filter is indication, as well as the build up on the left of the boot. Whether that is the source though, is in question. But that area looks to have a lot of grease. Anything I see leads back to speculation at this time. Sorry.
06-17-2012, 08:03 AM
#66
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 93
Wow, what did you use? Purple Power works great, there's also some foam spray that breaks oil and grease down, pulling it off surfaces. Going to have to get some manual labor in the form of elbow grease. No pun.
That axle boot seems to be one culprit of at least slinging junk around. The angle of trash on top the oil filter is indication, as well as the build up on the left of the boot. Whether that is the source though, is in question. But that area looks to have a lot of grease. Anything I see leads back to speculation at this time. Sorry.
That axle boot seems to be one culprit of at least slinging junk around. The angle of trash on top the oil filter is indication, as well as the build up on the left of the boot. Whether that is the source though, is in question. But that area looks to have a lot of grease. Anything I see leads back to speculation at this time. Sorry.
I haven't finished the cleaning. I had a few things come up.
I did pressure test the system and it has a very tiny slow leak. Which could be the tool I used to. I think one of the CV boots is making the mess down there.
06-17-2012, 12:26 PM
#68
Wire brush, scrub heavy stuff off.
Then general purpose or Engine degreaser, let soak for 5-10 mins then scrub again to get the rest loose, then rinse off with pressurized stream of water. If all you have is your finger over a garden hose, that will have to do! If it's not clean, spray with degreaser again and let sit for 5 mins, scrub again, spray with degreaser again, then hose off.
Then put a pressure tester on the Coolant cap and bump it up to 24 PSI, watch for leaks.
Then general purpose or Engine degreaser, let soak for 5-10 mins then scrub again to get the rest loose, then rinse off with pressurized stream of water. If all you have is your finger over a garden hose, that will have to do! If it's not clean, spray with degreaser again and let sit for 5 mins, scrub again, spray with degreaser again, then hose off.
Then put a pressure tester on the Coolant cap and bump it up to 24 PSI, watch for leaks.
06-17-2012, 06:32 PM
#69
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Join Date: Oct 2011
Posts: 93
I already Pressure tested. There was a very minute leak. So small that it took over 20 minuets for me to even begin to notice the slightest change. I believe I know what part might be leaking. I am trying to upload it now.
06-17-2012, 08:03 PM
#74
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Join Date: Oct 2011
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Idk what the level is at I haven't looked there. I will go check tomorrow when I can get it on a level surface.
06-19-2012, 06:28 AM
#75
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06-19-2012, 03:45 PM
#77
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06-20-2012, 08:48 PM
#78
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Take it to a $5.00 pressure washer and hose the whole side down then run the engine for a bit and see what comes out. It looks like a blown oil and coolant gasket. Gee any thoughts? forget refrigerant Try low end gasket is blown as in more oil than coolant.
06-21-2012, 08:42 AM
#79
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Join Date: Oct 2011
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Im lifting it up today and gonna hose it all off and just watch it as it runs to see what might be leaking
