MASSIVE Electrical Failure
05-13-2014, 09:09 PM
#1
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MASSIVE Electrical Failure
Okay... so here we go.
My girlfriends 03 Nissan Maxima is having a massive amount of electrical failure almost all at once. About two weeks ago there was absolutely no issues with the car whatsoever and it ran like a champ. I have a pretty extensive auto mechanic background so I will attempt to provide as much info as possible and be as clear as I can... I am just about at wits end, and I could use any help or thoughts that might be provided.
Here is the list of check engine light codes that I pulled. (It is pretty large... almost all electrical related and all happening within the last two weeks)
P0500- Vehicle speed sensor failure. Im thinking its related to the ABS sensors
P1212- No info transfer from ECM to ABS control module.. possibly CAN system related
P0455- EVAP leak... Not very worried about this one at the moment.
P0460- Faulty fuel level sensor. This is the most recent code.
U1001- CAN communication failure...
P1574- This seems to be related to both ABS control failure, and CAN failure
and nearly all of these are pending.
Here is a list of the current symptoms.
-Power loss
-transmission downshift lag
-TERRIBLE gas mileage
-Currently speedo is not working, at the time the speedo is not working the ABS and TCS lights will be on. Sporadically the speedo will work at which time the ABS light will turn off and the SLIP light turns on.
-When the vehicle is started, the AT CHECK light blinks for about 10 seconds.
-ALL power windows will not work from ANY switch, there is power to and through ALL fuses both in the cabin and under the hood. Power to and through the power window relay, and power to and through the e90 circuit breaker.
-Moonroof does not work.
-Heated steering wheel does not work
-Headlights AUTO ON/OFF does not work
Here is what I have checked so far.... I checked the AT fluid level which was good.
Battery main ground to chassis was corroded pretty bad, I cleaned it down to bare shiny metal and re installed. No change in any symptoms. ECM ground is clean, main fuseblock ground is clean. New spark plugs (NGK stock plugs). New coilpacks.
What I am thinking is that there must be some common ground somewhere that is corroded or loose from the battery ground being so bad. Possibly the ground for the TCM\ABS control module as well as the smart entrance control module might be faulty... I do not know where to look though, and I HAVE read through the wiring schematic from the FSM. When it comes to the speedo not working and the ABS\TCS problems I think one of the ABS wheel sensors may be faulty.
Also I will note that I did the test where you ground pin 9 of the diag. connector and count the flashes. I got a code 88, which as far as I can find is not a proper code. Just to clarify.... 8 slow flashes, 8 fast flashes.
Like I said I am at wits end... any pointers will be greatly appreciated.
My girlfriends 03 Nissan Maxima is having a massive amount of electrical failure almost all at once. About two weeks ago there was absolutely no issues with the car whatsoever and it ran like a champ. I have a pretty extensive auto mechanic background so I will attempt to provide as much info as possible and be as clear as I can... I am just about at wits end, and I could use any help or thoughts that might be provided.
Here is the list of check engine light codes that I pulled. (It is pretty large... almost all electrical related and all happening within the last two weeks)
P0500- Vehicle speed sensor failure. Im thinking its related to the ABS sensors
P1212- No info transfer from ECM to ABS control module.. possibly CAN system related
P0455- EVAP leak... Not very worried about this one at the moment.
P0460- Faulty fuel level sensor. This is the most recent code.
U1001- CAN communication failure...
P1574- This seems to be related to both ABS control failure, and CAN failure
and nearly all of these are pending.
Here is a list of the current symptoms.
-Power loss
-transmission downshift lag
-TERRIBLE gas mileage
-Currently speedo is not working, at the time the speedo is not working the ABS and TCS lights will be on. Sporadically the speedo will work at which time the ABS light will turn off and the SLIP light turns on.
-When the vehicle is started, the AT CHECK light blinks for about 10 seconds.
-ALL power windows will not work from ANY switch, there is power to and through ALL fuses both in the cabin and under the hood. Power to and through the power window relay, and power to and through the e90 circuit breaker.
-Moonroof does not work.
-Heated steering wheel does not work
-Headlights AUTO ON/OFF does not work
Here is what I have checked so far.... I checked the AT fluid level which was good.
Battery main ground to chassis was corroded pretty bad, I cleaned it down to bare shiny metal and re installed. No change in any symptoms. ECM ground is clean, main fuseblock ground is clean. New spark plugs (NGK stock plugs). New coilpacks.
What I am thinking is that there must be some common ground somewhere that is corroded or loose from the battery ground being so bad. Possibly the ground for the TCM\ABS control module as well as the smart entrance control module might be faulty... I do not know where to look though, and I HAVE read through the wiring schematic from the FSM. When it comes to the speedo not working and the ABS\TCS problems I think one of the ABS wheel sensors may be faulty.
Also I will note that I did the test where you ground pin 9 of the diag. connector and count the flashes. I got a code 88, which as far as I can find is not a proper code. Just to clarify.... 8 slow flashes, 8 fast flashes.
Like I said I am at wits end... any pointers will be greatly appreciated.
05-14-2014, 07:37 AM
#3
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Posts: 8
I would prefer not to junk a perfectly good car over electrical issues. I will buy all new wiring harnesses if that is what it takes to fix it. Both me and my girlfriend drive 45 mins to work and back every day with very differing schedules so it is very important we have two cars.
Today I will be tearing the dash out and looking over all of the wiring harnesses that are under it. I will be inspecting for burned plugs or wires.
Will post back hopefully later tonight with good news.
Still anyone with any thoughts would be appreciated, thanks.
Today I will be tearing the dash out and looking over all of the wiring harnesses that are under it. I will be inspecting for burned plugs or wires.
Will post back hopefully later tonight with good news.
Still anyone with any thoughts would be appreciated, thanks.
05-14-2014, 07:45 AM
#4
^^ don't listen to Geroge_.
Focus on the wires out of the battery..battery to chassis, battery to alternator, to starter bolt, etc.....both positive and ground cables.
What precipitated the failure?
Focus on the wires out of the battery..battery to chassis, battery to alternator, to starter bolt, etc.....both positive and ground cables.
What precipitated the failure?
05-14-2014, 02:46 PM
#5
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Location: NM
Posts: 2,145
You got a electrical gremlin but sure heck not been engineered by the Germans. I think you might overlook the most important part besides the ECM since ECM is primarily for the engine management controls. You have a BCM issues, since you mention your instrument cluster, headlights, heated seat, power seats, moonroof. To find that BCM is actually in the trunk I believe it on the passenger side of the firewall, hiding behind the trunk linear near where the jack is. That would be your Body Control Module. You would need to check the harness or the wiring since the BCM is actually bolted on to a bracket on the wall of the trunk.
05-14-2014, 04:09 PM
#6
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As for the BCM I had no idea about that one so I will have to check that as well. I thought the smart entrance control module up under the drivers side was what the BCM is. Thanks for the replies everyone!
Any comments on the transmission weirdness or abs weirdness?
05-14-2014, 05:24 PM
#7
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Join Date: Nov 2005
Location: Austin
Posts: 1,155
The good news is it does not sound like you have many problems. Sounds like you have one that is effecting many things. Fuses and relays all good?
As for dumping things, I wish this forum would dump george.
As for dumping things, I wish this forum would dump george.
05-14-2014, 06:59 PM
#9
Do all these problems occur simultaneously? If so I would try and fix one of the simpler problems by looking at a fairly simple circuit such as the moon roof or heated steering wheel. If you determine the cause of the one simple problem you may find the cause of all of them.
I would probably work on the heated steering wheel circuit page 37 of the FSM. It is a relatively simple circuit. If you figure out why that is not working you may also end up fixing the cause of all the other problems. When you are trying to fix 12 problems at once it becomes very difficult.
So back to the heated steering wheel. Do you have power at all three fuses of that circuit on pg 37? Does the wheel heat light turn on? Notice that the ignition switch is part of that circuit. The ignition switch is also a part of the moonroof and power window circuit. Have you tried jiggling the key?
Otherwise my suggestions would be 1) I would start by checking the fusible links. Remove and reinstall them. 2) possibly the ignition switch or ignition relay. If it is faulty it can disrupt many circuits, as Chevy Cobalt owners have learned.
This sounds like a fun problem to fix. I have to study the wiring diagrams. See if I can come up with anything. At this point it seems that you are all over the place. In the end the cause of the problem will probably be pretty simple. Don't think BCM's or ECU's for now. The problem is most likely a fuse, switch or relay.
I would probably work on the heated steering wheel circuit page 37 of the FSM. It is a relatively simple circuit. If you figure out why that is not working you may also end up fixing the cause of all the other problems. When you are trying to fix 12 problems at once it becomes very difficult.
So back to the heated steering wheel. Do you have power at all three fuses of that circuit on pg 37? Does the wheel heat light turn on? Notice that the ignition switch is part of that circuit. The ignition switch is also a part of the moonroof and power window circuit. Have you tried jiggling the key?
Otherwise my suggestions would be 1) I would start by checking the fusible links. Remove and reinstall them. 2) possibly the ignition switch or ignition relay. If it is faulty it can disrupt many circuits, as Chevy Cobalt owners have learned.
This sounds like a fun problem to fix. I have to study the wiring diagrams. See if I can come up with anything. At this point it seems that you are all over the place. In the end the cause of the problem will probably be pretty simple. Don't think BCM's or ECU's for now. The problem is most likely a fuse, switch or relay.
Last edited by Nopike; 05-14-2014 at 08:13 PM.
05-14-2014, 11:43 PM
#11
P0500 Vehicle speed sensor - this signal comes from the ABS unit.
P1212 ABS/TCS communication with ECM
P1574 No speed signal from TCM - this is via the CAN network
U1001 CAN network is down.
Solving the U1001 will probably take care of the other 3. But the service manual is not particularly helpful for the P1001 code. In so many words it says that it is a bad wiring connection. It does not mention that a part could fail, which I suspect has happened.
Because of the keyfob remote being able to roll the windows down, the CAN lines are used by the power windows. But I thought it was only the front windows. Similarly, I don't know if the sunroof opens from the keyfob.
The 5th gen's SECU (Smart Entrance Control Unit) was called the BCM (Body Control Module) in the 3rd and 4th gen models. When Nissan changes the name of something, sometimes we forget and use the wrong name. Your car does not have a BCM.
With all the things going on in your car, I suspect that the SECU is the problem. It has the CAN communications, it controls power to the lights in AUTO mode. The SECU gets power on pins 49 and 51. Pin 51 is from the same circuit breaker that powers the seats and windows. Pin 49 is from a fuse that I can't identify at the moment.
The EVAP leak, fuel sensor code and the heated steering wheel don't interact with the SECU as far as I know.
It sounds like you have the service manual, but in case you don't, you can get one here:
http://boredmder.com/FSMs/Nissan/Maxima/2003
P1212 ABS/TCS communication with ECM
P1574 No speed signal from TCM - this is via the CAN network
U1001 CAN network is down.
Solving the U1001 will probably take care of the other 3. But the service manual is not particularly helpful for the P1001 code. In so many words it says that it is a bad wiring connection. It does not mention that a part could fail, which I suspect has happened.
Because of the keyfob remote being able to roll the windows down, the CAN lines are used by the power windows. But I thought it was only the front windows. Similarly, I don't know if the sunroof opens from the keyfob.
The 5th gen's SECU (Smart Entrance Control Unit) was called the BCM (Body Control Module) in the 3rd and 4th gen models. When Nissan changes the name of something, sometimes we forget and use the wrong name. Your car does not have a BCM.
With all the things going on in your car, I suspect that the SECU is the problem. It has the CAN communications, it controls power to the lights in AUTO mode. The SECU gets power on pins 49 and 51. Pin 51 is from the same circuit breaker that powers the seats and windows. Pin 49 is from a fuse that I can't identify at the moment.
The EVAP leak, fuel sensor code and the heated steering wheel don't interact with the SECU as far as I know.
It sounds like you have the service manual, but in case you don't, you can get one here:
http://boredmder.com/FSMs/Nissan/Maxima/2003
05-15-2014, 08:17 PM
#12
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P0500 Vehicle speed sensor - this signal comes from the ABS unit.
P1212 ABS/TCS communication with ECM
P1574 No speed signal from TCM - this is via the CAN network
U1001 CAN network is down.
Solving the U1001 will probably take care of the other 3. But the service manual is not particularly helpful for the P1001 code. In so many words it says that it is a bad wiring connection. It does not mention that a part could fail, which I suspect has happened.
Because of the keyfob remote being able to roll the windows down, the CAN lines are used by the power windows. But I thought it was only the front windows. Similarly, I don't know if the sunroof opens from the keyfob.
The 5th gen's SECU (Smart Entrance Control Unit) was called the BCM (Body Control Module) in the 3rd and 4th gen models. When Nissan changes the name of something, sometimes we forget and use the wrong name. Your car does not have a BCM.
With all the things going on in your car, I suspect that the SECU is the problem. It has the CAN communications, it controls power to the lights in AUTO mode. The SECU gets power on pins 49 and 51. Pin 51 is from the same circuit breaker that powers the seats and windows. Pin 49 is from a fuse that I can't identify at the moment.
The EVAP leak, fuel sensor code and the heated steering wheel don't interact with the SECU as far as I know.
It sounds like you have the service manual, but in case you don't, you can get one here:
http://boredmder.com/FSMs/Nissan/Maxima/2003
P1212 ABS/TCS communication with ECM
P1574 No speed signal from TCM - this is via the CAN network
U1001 CAN network is down.
Solving the U1001 will probably take care of the other 3. But the service manual is not particularly helpful for the P1001 code. In so many words it says that it is a bad wiring connection. It does not mention that a part could fail, which I suspect has happened.
Because of the keyfob remote being able to roll the windows down, the CAN lines are used by the power windows. But I thought it was only the front windows. Similarly, I don't know if the sunroof opens from the keyfob.
The 5th gen's SECU (Smart Entrance Control Unit) was called the BCM (Body Control Module) in the 3rd and 4th gen models. When Nissan changes the name of something, sometimes we forget and use the wrong name. Your car does not have a BCM.
With all the things going on in your car, I suspect that the SECU is the problem. It has the CAN communications, it controls power to the lights in AUTO mode. The SECU gets power on pins 49 and 51. Pin 51 is from the same circuit breaker that powers the seats and windows. Pin 49 is from a fuse that I can't identify at the moment.
The EVAP leak, fuel sensor code and the heated steering wheel don't interact with the SECU as far as I know.
It sounds like you have the service manual, but in case you don't, you can get one here:
http://boredmder.com/FSMs/Nissan/Maxima/2003
05-16-2014, 08:37 AM
#13
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Join Date: May 2002
Location: Atlanta
Posts: 1,815
Okay so from there I gather that since CAN is either down or not working, l can assume that the whole thing doesn't work if the system loses even one module. Could this happen if the secu lost power from either pin 49 or pin 51? If so I'll need to check for voltage there. Which of the 3 plugs going into the secu is the one I need to check those pins on?
Also there are 2 grounds that you should look at M25 (Pin 43 In connector M144) and M87 (Pin 64 in connector M144)
Lastly there is a diagram and trouble shooting form for the CAN system. For the TCS model you have the pages start at EL-437 of the FSM
Hope this helps, good luck.
05-24-2014, 03:37 PM
#14
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Looks like there are 2 grey connectors on the SECU, M144 (Larger 24pins) & M145 (Smaller 16pins). Your looking for M145 and the pinout is on EL-353 of the FSM. There is also a breaker in 51 somewhere. The 3rd connector is white and has pins 1-24.
Also there are 2 grounds that you should look at M25 (Pin 43 In connector M144) and M87 (Pin 64 in connector M144)
Lastly there is a diagram and trouble shooting form for the CAN system. For the TCS model you have the pages start at EL-437 of the FSM
Hope this helps, good luck.
Also there are 2 grounds that you should look at M25 (Pin 43 In connector M144) and M87 (Pin 64 in connector M144)
Lastly there is a diagram and trouble shooting form for the CAN system. For the TCS model you have the pages start at EL-437 of the FSM
Hope this helps, good luck.
Since I have hit a road block there I will try to tackle the SECU issue and report back.
Again, thanks for all the help!
05-24-2014, 04:42 PM
#15
You do have the wire harness disconnected from both the ECU and the TCM, right? Just double checking.
ECM pin 109 goes to TCM pin 5.
ECM pin 113 goes to TCM pin 6.
Those 2 wires are the CAN lines. Since the connector on the ECM is a big pain, I would start working from the TCM to visually look for the short.
Also, unplug the SECU and see if your ground on pin 113 goes away. The CAN lines go to the SECU too.
ECM pin 109 goes to TCM pin 5.
ECM pin 113 goes to TCM pin 6.
Those 2 wires are the CAN lines. Since the connector on the ECM is a big pain, I would start working from the TCM to visually look for the short.
Also, unplug the SECU and see if your ground on pin 113 goes away. The CAN lines go to the SECU too.
05-29-2014, 07:42 AM
#16
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You do have the wire harness disconnected from both the ECU and the TCM, right? Just double checking.
ECM pin 109 goes to TCM pin 5.
ECM pin 113 goes to TCM pin 6.
Those 2 wires are the CAN lines. Since the connector on the ECM is a big pain, I would start working from the TCM to visually look for the short.
Also, unplug the SECU and see if your ground on pin 113 goes away. The CAN lines go to the SECU too.
ECM pin 109 goes to TCM pin 5.
ECM pin 113 goes to TCM pin 6.
Those 2 wires are the CAN lines. Since the connector on the ECM is a big pain, I would start working from the TCM to visually look for the short.
Also, unplug the SECU and see if your ground on pin 113 goes away. The CAN lines go to the SECU too.
Okay so I tested the pinouts for power to the SECU and determined the 12v+ Ign source was missing. I repaired the shorted wire and now everything in the interior works again! Woohoo.
Im still fighting with the CAN system issues. I was testing with both the ECM and TCM connectors unplugged as per the FSM, however not with the SECU unplugged. I will try that when I get some time off work this weekend.
As a new symptom, over the past week the gas mileage has tanked. It now gets around 100 miles per tank...
That is about 6.7 MPG. I need to fix this thing ASAP. The car smells like it is running EXTREMELY rich. Im worried about this ruining the cat... However as there are no new codes I am a little stumped as to what could be causing this new issue. Just to reitterate... The car has brand new OEM coilpacks as well as brand new NGK platnium plugs. I did not gap the plugs as they came pre gapped.
09-08-2014, 07:14 PM
#17
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Wife's 03 is having similar code issues. I have read this thread and plan to check this out tomorrow:
https://maxima.org/forums/5th-genera...ights-etc.html
https://maxima.org/forums/5th-genera...ights-etc.html
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