300ZX Calipers with 12.5" 3000GT Rotors
03-27-2002, 11:34 AM
#1
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 7
300ZX Calipers with 12.5" 3000GT Rotors
A little while back, Ginn Motorsports posted a thread on the Parts For Sale forum advertising a 12.5" rotor upgrade for those with the 300ZX calipers. Since I occasionally track the car, and was in the market for a big brake upgrade, I volunteered to be the guinea pig.
The brake kit fit without a hitch, the only modifications necessary being a different caliper bolt and shaving 3mm from the radius of the rotor. Wheel spacers were not necessary for my application, though they in all likelihood will be for most others. Surprisingly enough, the control arms did not have to be grinded down, which is a common 5th Gen solution to prevent rotor contact while turning.
Total parts came out to roughly $700 shipped to my door. This includes everything sans the steel braided brake lines, which I already possessed.
As for performance, initial impressions are that they are definitely superior to the stock braking system. Initial bite, overall distance, and resistance to fade have all improved noticeably. The only downside is the increased pedal travel, which is common to big brake upgrades. However, in my opinion, this is actually preferred, as it allows for additional feel.
I'll be posting a more detailed follow up after the 18th of April, during which I'll be visiting Willow Springs. At that time, I'll have a more accurate measurement of braking performance, as I've been there several times with the stock braking system, and have a relatively good idea of the prior braking points used.
If anyone is willing to post a few pictures for me, I'll go ahead and e-mail them over.
The brake kit fit without a hitch, the only modifications necessary being a different caliper bolt and shaving 3mm from the radius of the rotor. Wheel spacers were not necessary for my application, though they in all likelihood will be for most others. Surprisingly enough, the control arms did not have to be grinded down, which is a common 5th Gen solution to prevent rotor contact while turning.
Total parts came out to roughly $700 shipped to my door. This includes everything sans the steel braided brake lines, which I already possessed.
As for performance, initial impressions are that they are definitely superior to the stock braking system. Initial bite, overall distance, and resistance to fade have all improved noticeably. The only downside is the increased pedal travel, which is common to big brake upgrades. However, in my opinion, this is actually preferred, as it allows for additional feel.
I'll be posting a more detailed follow up after the 18th of April, during which I'll be visiting Willow Springs. At that time, I'll have a more accurate measurement of braking performance, as I've been there several times with the stock braking system, and have a relatively good idea of the prior braking points used.
If anyone is willing to post a few pictures for me, I'll go ahead and e-mail them over.
03-27-2002, 11:39 AM
#2
Wow! Nice job! Questions though:
1) What wheels are you running?
2) I wonder if I can just buy the rotors and adaptors if I have the calipers already?
3) Why did you need a different caliper bolt? Too short?
Thanks for the info.
1) What wheels are you running?
2) I wonder if I can just buy the rotors and adaptors if I have the calipers already?
3) Why did you need a different caliper bolt? Too short?
Thanks for the info.
03-27-2002, 11:52 AM
#3
Re: 300ZX Calipers with 12.5" 3000GT Rotors
Originally posted by mxm_2k
A little while back, Ginn Motorsports posted a thread on the Parts For Sale forum advertising a 12.5" rotor upgrade for those with the 300ZX calipers. Since I occasionally track the car, and was in the market for a big brake upgrade, I volunteered to be the guinea pig.
The brake kit fit without a hitch, the only modifications necessary being a different caliper bolt and shaving 3mm from the radius of the rotor. Wheel spacers were not necessary for my application, though they in all likelihood will be for most others. Surprisingly enough, the control arms did not have to be grinded down, which is a common 5th Gen solution to prevent rotor contact while turning.
Total parts came out to roughly $700 shipped to my door. This includes everything sans the steel braided brake lines, which I already possessed.
As for performance, initial impressions are that they are definitely superior to the stock braking system. Initial bite, overall distance, and resistance to fade have all improved noticeably. The only downside is the increased pedal travel, which is common to big brake upgrades. However, in my opinion, this is actually preferred, as it allows for additional feel.
I'll be posting a more detailed follow up after the 18th of April, during which I'll be visiting Willow Springs. At that time, I'll have a more accurate measurement of braking performance, as I've been there several times with the stock braking system, and have a relatively good idea of the prior braking points used.
If anyone is willing to post a few pictures for me, I'll go ahead and e-mail them over.
A little while back, Ginn Motorsports posted a thread on the Parts For Sale forum advertising a 12.5" rotor upgrade for those with the 300ZX calipers. Since I occasionally track the car, and was in the market for a big brake upgrade, I volunteered to be the guinea pig.
The brake kit fit without a hitch, the only modifications necessary being a different caliper bolt and shaving 3mm from the radius of the rotor. Wheel spacers were not necessary for my application, though they in all likelihood will be for most others. Surprisingly enough, the control arms did not have to be grinded down, which is a common 5th Gen solution to prevent rotor contact while turning.
Total parts came out to roughly $700 shipped to my door. This includes everything sans the steel braided brake lines, which I already possessed.
As for performance, initial impressions are that they are definitely superior to the stock braking system. Initial bite, overall distance, and resistance to fade have all improved noticeably. The only downside is the increased pedal travel, which is common to big brake upgrades. However, in my opinion, this is actually preferred, as it allows for additional feel.
I'll be posting a more detailed follow up after the 18th of April, during which I'll be visiting Willow Springs. At that time, I'll have a more accurate measurement of braking performance, as I've been there several times with the stock braking system, and have a relatively good idea of the prior braking points used.
If anyone is willing to post a few pictures for me, I'll go ahead and e-mail them over.
If possible you should do a write up on how to install these for some of us less mechanically inclined.
03-27-2002, 11:57 AM
#4
Re: Re: 300ZX Calipers with 12.5" 3000GT Rotors
I would assume the aluminum turbo versions but it's a good question
Originally posted by IceY2K1
Did you use 300Z Turbo or N/A calipers? I believe they are different.
If possible you should do a write up on how to install these for some of us less mechanically inclined.
Did you use 300Z Turbo or N/A calipers? I believe they are different.
If possible you should do a write up on how to install these for some of us less mechanically inclined.
03-27-2002, 12:13 PM
#5
Re: Re: Re: 300ZX Calipers with 12.5" 3000GT Rotors
Originally posted by Jeff92se
I would assume the aluminum turbo versions but it's a good question
I would assume the aluminum turbo versions but it's a good question
I assumed 91-93 ABS versions only, but they did have non-ABS. Also, '92 has 3-different calipers: up to 3/92, from 4/92(non-Turbo), and from 4/92(Turbo).
I'm just wondering what's the best ones to try and find.
03-27-2002, 03:04 PM
#6
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Posts: 7
Jeff92se: 1) TechnoMotorWorks HyperSpeed, 17" x 8", 35 mm offset.
2) You certainly can. In fact, the kit does not include the 300ZX calipers. Rather, it comes with the brackets, rotors, and brake pads. If you prefer, each piece can be ordered individually, if you already have the rotors and/or brake pads.
3) The stock caliper bolts do not have enough thread towards the heads of the bolts. The brackets are rather thin, and would have too much play if the stock bolts are used. I suppose a washer would suffice, however, considering the importance of the braking system to safety, I opted for new bolts.
IceY2K1: The aluminum turbo versions.
2) You certainly can. In fact, the kit does not include the 300ZX calipers. Rather, it comes with the brackets, rotors, and brake pads. If you prefer, each piece can be ordered individually, if you already have the rotors and/or brake pads.
3) The stock caliper bolts do not have enough thread towards the heads of the bolts. The brackets are rather thin, and would have too much play if the stock bolts are used. I suppose a washer would suffice, however, considering the importance of the braking system to safety, I opted for new bolts.
IceY2K1: The aluminum turbo versions.
03-27-2002, 03:28 PM
#7
03-27-2002, 06:33 PM
#9
Originally posted by Y2KevSE
3000 GT rotors? Cool.
I forgot how large the 300 ZX rotors were.
3000 GT rotors? Cool.
I forgot how large the 300 ZX rotors were.
I think the 'shaved' 300ZX calipers ended up slightly smaller than the stock 11" rotors.
03-27-2002, 08:19 PM
#10
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Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 8
I will sell the kit for $450 + shipping.
It includes:
All hardware
2 dimpled and/or slotted rotors
Front Metal Masters pads
What else do you need?
2 front 300zx calipers from a 90-96 300zxTT or from a 91-96 Non-turbo. These are 30mm calipers, the calipers from a 90 non-turbo are not as wide and WILL NOT FIT. Iron or aluminum is your decision, they both work.
I get my used parts from zxparts@mindspring.com, tell Russel that chip @ ginnmotorsports sent you
It includes:
All hardware
2 dimpled and/or slotted rotors
Front Metal Masters pads
What else do you need?
2 front 300zx calipers from a 90-96 300zxTT or from a 91-96 Non-turbo. These are 30mm calipers, the calipers from a 90 non-turbo are not as wide and WILL NOT FIT. Iron or aluminum is your decision, they both work.
I get my used parts from zxparts@mindspring.com, tell Russel that chip @ ginnmotorsports sent you
03-28-2002, 06:08 AM
#12
Old Fuddy Duddy
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,712
Originally posted by GinnMotorsports
I will sell the kit for $450 + shipping.
It includes:
All hardware
2 dimpled and/or slotted rotors
Front Metal Masters pads
What else do you need?
2 front 300zx calipers from a 90-96 300zxTT or from a 91-96 Non-turbo. These are 30mm calipers, the calipers from a 90 non-turbo are not as wide and WILL NOT FIT. Iron or aluminum is your decision, they both work.
I get my used parts from zxparts@mindspring.com, tell Russel that chip @ ginnmotorsports sent you
I will sell the kit for $450 + shipping.
It includes:
All hardware
2 dimpled and/or slotted rotors
Front Metal Masters pads
What else do you need?
2 front 300zx calipers from a 90-96 300zxTT or from a 91-96 Non-turbo. These are 30mm calipers, the calipers from a 90 non-turbo are not as wide and WILL NOT FIT. Iron or aluminum is your decision, they both work.
I get my used parts from zxparts@mindspring.com, tell Russel that chip @ ginnmotorsports sent you
03-28-2002, 06:40 AM
#13
Old Fuddy Duddy
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,712
Originally posted by Colonel
So if I read this correctly (I hope)... The kit includes everything needed to mount the calipers and new beefier rotors. Meaning the only part I need outside this kit to mount the whole kit and kaboodle is to get the calipers from somewhere...right?
So if I read this correctly (I hope)... The kit includes everything needed to mount the calipers and new beefier rotors. Meaning the only part I need outside this kit to mount the whole kit and kaboodle is to get the calipers from somewhere...right?
But a question...this kit is built for a 5th gen with ABS?
03-28-2002, 08:32 AM
#15
Originally posted by Y2KevSE
With or without ABS... it doesn't matter. The ABS sensor is not on the caliper.
How much for only the bracket? Thanks.
With or without ABS... it doesn't matter. The ABS sensor is not on the caliper.
How much for only the bracket? Thanks.
I know you were not commenting when you first did the swap, but now that you've gotten used to it, how do you like it?
03-28-2002, 09:05 AM
#16
Old Fuddy Duddy
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,712
Originally posted by IceY2K1
How's the pedal travel?
I know you were not commenting when you first did the swap, but now that you've gotten used to it, how do you like it?
How's the pedal travel?
I know you were not commenting when you first did the swap, but now that you've gotten used to it, how do you like it?
03-28-2002, 09:30 AM
#17
Anytime you switch to calipers that feature more area in the piston, the pedal travel will increase.
Originally posted by Colonel
Yeah...yeah...what he said...how is the pedal travel...Do you think it might be master cyclinder related?
Yeah...yeah...what he said...how is the pedal travel...Do you think it might be master cyclinder related?
03-28-2002, 09:38 AM
#18
...
Originally posted by Jeff92se
Anytime you switch to calipers that feature more area in the piston, the pedal travel will increase.
Anytime you switch to calipers that feature more area in the piston, the pedal travel will increase.
03-28-2002, 10:30 AM
#19
Old Fuddy Duddy
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,712
Originally posted by Jeff92se
Anytime you switch to calipers that feature more area in the piston, the pedal travel will increase.
Anytime you switch to calipers that feature more area in the piston, the pedal travel will increase.
Yes, you could still stop. Kinda like filling up two balloons with a certain PSI. With 1 balloon it will have more pressure behind it and fill up quicker. With two balloons, it wont fill as quick or be as solid.
Agree/Disagree? I am not trying to be combative...just trying to understand. Because if it goes along example 2...then really you are going to shave much braking distance off...? Or am I just smoking crack again?
03-28-2002, 10:37 AM
#20
Most brake calipers of this size use a master cylinder that either is longer or features a bigger bore. So using the same caliper on a car that has a master cylinder w/ ie.. smaller bore, will increase brake pedal travel. Most don't mind it because they know why it's happening.
Originally posted by Colonel
But would that not indicate an improperly setup system? If you had proper pressure/fluid in the system, more piston area should not be a problem UNLESS the current system cannot handle the additional area.
Yes, you could still stop. Kinda like filling up two balloons with a certain PSI. With 1 balloon it will have more pressure behind it and fill up quicker. With two balloons, it wont fill as quick or be as solid.
Agree/Disagree? I am not trying to be combative...just trying to understand. Because if it goes along example 2...then really you are going to shave much braking distance off...? Or am I just smoking crack again?
But would that not indicate an improperly setup system? If you had proper pressure/fluid in the system, more piston area should not be a problem UNLESS the current system cannot handle the additional area.
Yes, you could still stop. Kinda like filling up two balloons with a certain PSI. With 1 balloon it will have more pressure behind it and fill up quicker. With two balloons, it wont fill as quick or be as solid.
Agree/Disagree? I am not trying to be combative...just trying to understand. Because if it goes along example 2...then really you are going to shave much braking distance off...? Or am I just smoking crack again?
03-28-2002, 10:52 AM
#21
Old Fuddy Duddy
Join Date: Feb 2001
Posts: 2,712
Originally posted by Jeff92se
Most brake calipers of this size use a master cylinder that either is longer or features a bigger bore. So using the same caliper on a car that has a master cylinder w/ ie.. smaller bore, will increase brake pedal travel. Most don't mind it because they know why it's happening.
Most brake calipers of this size use a master cylinder that either is longer or features a bigger bore. So using the same caliper on a car that has a master cylinder w/ ie.. smaller bore, will increase brake pedal travel. Most don't mind it because they know why it's happening.
Which brings up point. Anybody find or do a test that proves if the bigger brakes do anything besides not warp and look cool?
03-28-2002, 10:53 AM
#22
Originally posted by Jeff92se
Most brake calipers of this size use a master cylinder that either is longer or features a bigger bore. So using the same caliper on a car that has a master cylinder w/ ie.. smaller bore, will increase brake pedal travel. Most don't mind it because they know why it's happening.
Most brake calipers of this size use a master cylinder that either is longer or features a bigger bore. So using the same caliper on a car that has a master cylinder w/ ie.. smaller bore, will increase brake pedal travel. Most don't mind it because they know why it's happening.
You are getting more friction from the larger pads/rotors, yet you are not applying as much pressure due to inadequate fluid volume of the MC/lines. Right?
By increasing brake pedal travel are you overworking/overcompressing the MC? I know first hand this shortens the life of the MC.
I know Big Brakes add to the looks, decrease fade, and probably have a longer rotor life than POS OEM rotors, but I only really care if it is going to DRAMATICALLY decrease stopping distance.
Roughly, how much decreased stopping distance are we talking about from say 60mph? 90mph?
Thanks.
03-28-2002, 10:55 AM
#23
Originally posted by Colonel
Got it...so it IS a pressure issue, but not specifically a safety issue. Just not up to the "perfect" spec.
Which brings up point. Anybody find or do a test that proves if the bigger brakes do anything besides not warp and look cool?
Got it...so it IS a pressure issue, but not specifically a safety issue. Just not up to the "perfect" spec.
Which brings up point. Anybody find or do a test that proves if the bigger brakes do anything besides not warp and look cool?
Basically, what you said in 2-sentences before I finished posting.
03-28-2002, 10:58 AM
#24
Yes, it's just simple physics. Larger pad area, greater piston area to push the pad, larger diameter rotors allow more braking torque on the pad/rotor. Do some searches, it's all there(.org and internet in general)
Originally posted by Colonel
Which brings up point. Anybody find or do a test that proves if the bigger brakes do anything besides not warp and look cool?
Which brings up point. Anybody find or do a test that proves if the bigger brakes do anything besides not warp and look cool?
03-28-2002, 11:11 AM
#26
It should do a great job. Just search all the others have opted for other big brake kits. Willwood/Stillen etc.. (on their stock master cylinder)
I "assume" w/ the bigger/more pistons, you will have to apply more force to the brake pedal to equal the force of a similar set-up w/ a larger MS, but it's just a matter of pushing down harder.
I can't say even in rough terms, how much better the braking will be. That's a pretty technical question w/ many varibles
I "assume" w/ the bigger/more pistons, you will have to apply more force to the brake pedal to equal the force of a similar set-up w/ a larger MS, but it's just a matter of pushing down harder.
I can't say even in rough terms, how much better the braking will be. That's a pretty technical question w/ many varibles
Originally posted by IceY2K1
Ok, so is it or is it NOT going reduce stopping distance?
You are getting more friction from the larger pads/rotors, yet you are not applying as much pressure due to inadequate fluid volume of the MC/lines. Right?
By increasing brake pedal travel are you overworking/overcompressing the MC? I know first hand this shortens the life of the MC.
I know Big Brakes add to the looks, decrease fade, and probably have a longer rotor life than POS OEM rotors, but I only really care if it is going to DRAMATICALLY decrease stopping distance.
Roughly, how much decreased stopping distance are we talking about from say 60mph? 90mph?
Thanks.
Ok, so is it or is it NOT going reduce stopping distance?
You are getting more friction from the larger pads/rotors, yet you are not applying as much pressure due to inadequate fluid volume of the MC/lines. Right?
By increasing brake pedal travel are you overworking/overcompressing the MC? I know first hand this shortens the life of the MC.
I know Big Brakes add to the looks, decrease fade, and probably have a longer rotor life than POS OEM rotors, but I only really care if it is going to DRAMATICALLY decrease stopping distance.
Roughly, how much decreased stopping distance are we talking about from say 60mph? 90mph?
Thanks.
04-01-2002, 07:45 AM
#27
Originally posted by IceY2K1
How's the pedal travel?
I know you were not commenting when you first did the swap, but now that you've gotten used to it, how do you like it?
How's the pedal travel?
I know you were not commenting when you first did the swap, but now that you've gotten used to it, how do you like it?
I'm fine with it.
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