OUCH! 6th gen review
04-24-2003, 12:06 PM
#41
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,282
Originally posted by Jaeger
Hey coffeeshark,
Yeah, he made a mistake on the technical specifications re. which transmission is available with which model. Could have been a typo, or he could have been misinformed.
Hey coffeeshark,
Yeah, he made a mistake on the technical specifications re. which transmission is available with which model. Could have been a typo, or he could have been misinformed.
So, either 1) He did drive both and made up the part about the manumatic (no idea how he could have done this)
2) He drove 1 and wanted to add more to his story so he added/made up the part about the manumatic in the SL (obviously not realising that there is none)
3) He actually drove 2 SEs (1 auto, 1 man), in which case he has no idea what he is talking about when he mentions the differences in handling
If he did his research before driving the car, this could have never happened and the combination of the errors is what discredits his review. A good journalist does his homework, and he didn't.
That being said, I hope he was driving 2 SEs and is just inept, rather than the idea that he just made up the SL parts. This is why I would trust a Car and Driver writer more. If you newspaper columnist, you want to write for the NY Times, the Washington Post, etc. Not some little town paper in Alaska. If you are good, you write for the times, if you aren't, then you write for that paper in Alaska. The same is true here.
04-24-2003, 01:18 PM
#42
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Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 125
Hey gmc74,
I don't know the reason why the guy got it wrong, I don't pretend to know, and in fact we may never know. Could be any of the reasons you suggested, or it could be that he drove all three (6sp. SE, auto SE, auto SL and is confusing the transmissions of the latter two). Doesn't much matter to me because:
1) At best it is sloppy journalism for which there is no real excuse - he should get the facts right, that's his job. On this, I think we agree.
2) It doesn't detract one bit from the things he did observe and didn't like about the Maxima, namely (and I'm paraphrasing here):
a) lofty price;
b) hodgepodge styling / overdone grille (I'm with him on the grille);
c) Silly sky-view roof (I also found this pointless - at least it is optional);
d) impractical split-buckets in rear for the Elite package (I agree again, but it can also be avoided);
e) serious torque-steer (He's right here as well - though, like me, he may not have driven a car with the HLSD)
You may place greater reliance on Car and Driver, Road and Track, Motor Trend and others (as do I, generally), but have a flip through the letters to the editor section of these magazines - these guys get some not-insignificant facts wrong all the time and constantly have people writing / e-mailing in to point out their errors (in a manner that can range from a helpful heads-up to derisive gloating).
So when you make a comment like:
"I wouldn't put too much stock into that article... hmmm car and driver or money magazine. I wouldn't take stock tips from car and driver..."
I suggest that a categorical rejection of the content of the article on this basis is something less than a principled approach, though I certainly acknowledge that you are free to accept or dismiss what anyone says for whatever reason you choose.
Put another way, if this guy had raved and heaped praises on the Maxima as the best thing ever with four doors and four wheels, would you have been so conclusively dismissive of his comments even if he did screw up what type of auto tranny was in the SL versus the SE?
Regards,
Jaeger
I don't know the reason why the guy got it wrong, I don't pretend to know, and in fact we may never know. Could be any of the reasons you suggested, or it could be that he drove all three (6sp. SE, auto SE, auto SL and is confusing the transmissions of the latter two). Doesn't much matter to me because:
1) At best it is sloppy journalism for which there is no real excuse - he should get the facts right, that's his job. On this, I think we agree.
2) It doesn't detract one bit from the things he did observe and didn't like about the Maxima, namely (and I'm paraphrasing here):
a) lofty price;
b) hodgepodge styling / overdone grille (I'm with him on the grille);
c) Silly sky-view roof (I also found this pointless - at least it is optional);
d) impractical split-buckets in rear for the Elite package (I agree again, but it can also be avoided);
e) serious torque-steer (He's right here as well - though, like me, he may not have driven a car with the HLSD)
You may place greater reliance on Car and Driver, Road and Track, Motor Trend and others (as do I, generally), but have a flip through the letters to the editor section of these magazines - these guys get some not-insignificant facts wrong all the time and constantly have people writing / e-mailing in to point out their errors (in a manner that can range from a helpful heads-up to derisive gloating).
So when you make a comment like:
"I wouldn't put too much stock into that article... hmmm car and driver or money magazine. I wouldn't take stock tips from car and driver..."
I suggest that a categorical rejection of the content of the article on this basis is something less than a principled approach, though I certainly acknowledge that you are free to accept or dismiss what anyone says for whatever reason you choose.
Put another way, if this guy had raved and heaped praises on the Maxima as the best thing ever with four doors and four wheels, would you have been so conclusively dismissive of his comments even if he did screw up what type of auto tranny was in the SL versus the SE?
Regards,
Jaeger
04-24-2003, 01:40 PM
#43
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 77
Originally posted by 1SICKLEX
Most all new cars sell well when introduced to the market. It's a "NEW" car and people like new cars.
It's not really my statement. Every magazine I have read seems to say the same things. This new Maxima should be called the MAXIMA ARMADA. Then they should bring out the real Maxima.
Most all new cars sell well when introduced to the market. It's a "NEW" car and people like new cars.
It's not really my statement. Every magazine I have read seems to say the same things. This new Maxima should be called the MAXIMA ARMADA. Then they should bring out the real Maxima.
As far as feeling huge I don't notice it. My only complaint is turn radius. It handles much better than my 98 SE did and doesn't feel bigger when I drive it.
I think the car will sell just fine. Besides Nissan is making fewer of them anyway. Only time will tell whose prediciton will come true.
-Ed
04-24-2003, 02:29 PM
#44
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 77
Originally posted by Jaeger
Hey gmc74,
I don't know the reason why the guy got it wrong, I don't pretend to know, and in fact we may never know. Could be any of the reasons you suggested, or it could be that he drove all three (6sp. SE, auto SE, auto SL and is confusing the transmissions of the latter two). Doesn't much matter to me because:
2) It doesn't detract one bit from the things he did observe and didn't like about the Maxima, namely (and I'm paraphrasing here):
a) lofty price;
b) hodgepodge styling / overdone grille (I'm with him on the grille);
c) Silly sky-view roof (I also found this pointless - at least it is optional);
d) impractical split-buckets in rear for the Elite package (I agree again, but it can also be avoided);
e) serious torque-steer (He's right here as well - though, like me, he may not have driven a car with the HLSD)
You may place greater reliance on Car and Driver, Road and Track, Motor Trend and others (as do I, generally), but have a flip through the letters to the editor section of these magazines - these guys get some not-insignificant facts wrong all the time and constantly have people writing / e-mailing in to point out their errors (in a manner that can range from a helpful heads-up to derisive gloating).
Jaeger
Hey gmc74,
I don't know the reason why the guy got it wrong, I don't pretend to know, and in fact we may never know. Could be any of the reasons you suggested, or it could be that he drove all three (6sp. SE, auto SE, auto SL and is confusing the transmissions of the latter two). Doesn't much matter to me because:
2) It doesn't detract one bit from the things he did observe and didn't like about the Maxima, namely (and I'm paraphrasing here):
a) lofty price;
b) hodgepodge styling / overdone grille (I'm with him on the grille);
c) Silly sky-view roof (I also found this pointless - at least it is optional);
d) impractical split-buckets in rear for the Elite package (I agree again, but it can also be avoided);
e) serious torque-steer (He's right here as well - though, like me, he may not have driven a car with the HLSD)
You may place greater reliance on Car and Driver, Road and Track, Motor Trend and others (as do I, generally), but have a flip through the letters to the editor section of these magazines - these guys get some not-insignificant facts wrong all the time and constantly have people writing / e-mailing in to point out their errors (in a manner that can range from a helpful heads-up to derisive gloating).
Jaeger
Secondly, even point A is arguable. It's lofty price depends upon what you compare it to. I have a Lexus ES300 in addition to the Maxima and the Maxima has luxury features not even found on my Lexus. My Lexus stickers for almost $6,000 more than a comparably equipped Maxima. Overpriced by this standard? Certainly not. So you see, it depends upon your point of view.
As to point E, I haven't driven it to the point of experiencing this yet since I've only got about 400 miles on it. I'll know better later on, but I'm not generally in the practice of flooring it around turns. I have no doubt that this issue is real when the car is driven in this manner, but I bet most Maxima drivers won't do that and will have no idea what this issue is all about.
04-24-2003, 02:57 PM
#45
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 40
The review is awfully *****y.... hard to take seriously.
I'd be interested in a G35 if it had headroom, rear seat legroom, and a telescopic wheel. But it doesn't....
I do think the G35 is a better car overall and should be priced MORE than the Maxima, but the market will decide the prices. G35 sells close to MSRP, Maxima probably will not.
S stands for "suggested". I think the new Maxima is a great $27,000 car which happens to be listed at $32,000 (with popular options).
I'd be interested in a G35 if it had headroom, rear seat legroom, and a telescopic wheel. But it doesn't....
I do think the G35 is a better car overall and should be priced MORE than the Maxima, but the market will decide the prices. G35 sells close to MSRP, Maxima probably will not.
S stands for "suggested". I think the new Maxima is a great $27,000 car which happens to be listed at $32,000 (with popular options).
04-24-2003, 03:45 PM
#46
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Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 125
Maxima04,
I'm not sure what it is you don't understand about my "point" - perhaps you did not read the entire post and the post by gmc74 to which it was responsive. Nonetheless, I'll try to clarify.
First of all, points a) through e) were merely my summary, in point form, of the negative aspects of the review (let's pause for a moment and recall that there were quite a few positive comments as well). The commentary in brackets is my take on the author's criticisms, some of which I agree with to a greater or lesser extent.
My point was that these criticisms, whether one agrees with them or not, are not rendered worthless simply because the author doesn't write for a car magazine and got a significant factual detail wrong. Again, you'd probably have to read my post in the context of previous posts to understand that.
I think we are more or less in agreement when you say:
"Points b, c & d are certainly, without a doubt, subjective. I didn't like the split back seats, but I have met people that love them. Each to his own. Even if this guy were an automotive expert (which he obviously isn't) his subjectivity is no better than yours or mine. I have found that people have responded OVERWHELMINGLY favorably to the styling of the 04 Maxima "
Just as you are entitled to your subjective view, and I am entitled to mine, the author of the review is entitled to his. I've never read any car review that didn't have some element of subjectivity, and frankly, wouldn't want to - statistics are boring.
Where we part company is when you say:
"As to point E, I haven't driven it to the point of experiencing this (torque steer) yet since I've only got about 400 miles on it. I'll know better later on, but I'm not generally in the practice of flooring it around turns. I have no doubt that this issue is real when the car is driven in this manner, but I bet most Maxima drivers won't do that and will have no idea what this issue is all about."
First of all, I don't presume to speak for most Maxima drivers, only for myself. Second, this is supposed to be a sport sedan, and the way it puts power to the ground is hardly a trifling point in this context. That assessment does find support in the fact that nearly every major car magazine that has reviewed the 04 Max has criticized it for this problem. You may be right when you say that most Maxima drivers "will have no idea what this issue is all about" but given that many Maxima drivers are performance-oriented (and hence, shy away from Accords and Camrys) I think you might well be wrong.
I'm glad that you like your car and that others like it as well - if you can't enjoy a new car (particularly one as nice as the Maxima) it's time to check for a pulse. No car is perfect, however, and some people are going to have differeing opinions about what they like and don't like about it. That's what makes forums like this interesting. If everyone thought the same thing and said the same thing, it would make for a pretty boring read.
Cheers,
Jaeger
I'm not sure what it is you don't understand about my "point" - perhaps you did not read the entire post and the post by gmc74 to which it was responsive. Nonetheless, I'll try to clarify.
First of all, points a) through e) were merely my summary, in point form, of the negative aspects of the review (let's pause for a moment and recall that there were quite a few positive comments as well). The commentary in brackets is my take on the author's criticisms, some of which I agree with to a greater or lesser extent.
My point was that these criticisms, whether one agrees with them or not, are not rendered worthless simply because the author doesn't write for a car magazine and got a significant factual detail wrong. Again, you'd probably have to read my post in the context of previous posts to understand that.
I think we are more or less in agreement when you say:
"Points b, c & d are certainly, without a doubt, subjective. I didn't like the split back seats, but I have met people that love them. Each to his own. Even if this guy were an automotive expert (which he obviously isn't) his subjectivity is no better than yours or mine. I have found that people have responded OVERWHELMINGLY favorably to the styling of the 04 Maxima "
Just as you are entitled to your subjective view, and I am entitled to mine, the author of the review is entitled to his. I've never read any car review that didn't have some element of subjectivity, and frankly, wouldn't want to - statistics are boring.
Where we part company is when you say:
"As to point E, I haven't driven it to the point of experiencing this (torque steer) yet since I've only got about 400 miles on it. I'll know better later on, but I'm not generally in the practice of flooring it around turns. I have no doubt that this issue is real when the car is driven in this manner, but I bet most Maxima drivers won't do that and will have no idea what this issue is all about."
First of all, I don't presume to speak for most Maxima drivers, only for myself. Second, this is supposed to be a sport sedan, and the way it puts power to the ground is hardly a trifling point in this context. That assessment does find support in the fact that nearly every major car magazine that has reviewed the 04 Max has criticized it for this problem. You may be right when you say that most Maxima drivers "will have no idea what this issue is all about" but given that many Maxima drivers are performance-oriented (and hence, shy away from Accords and Camrys) I think you might well be wrong.
I'm glad that you like your car and that others like it as well - if you can't enjoy a new car (particularly one as nice as the Maxima) it's time to check for a pulse. No car is perfect, however, and some people are going to have differeing opinions about what they like and don't like about it. That's what makes forums like this interesting. If everyone thought the same thing and said the same thing, it would make for a pretty boring read.
Cheers,
Jaeger
04-24-2003, 03:51 PM
#47
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 535
I think the car will sell just fine. Besides Nissan is making fewer of them anyway. Only time will tell whose prediciton will come true.
I find ANY SUV sells fine, cars are having a much harder time (times have changed).
04-24-2003, 05:47 PM
#48
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,282
Hey Jaeger,
I agree that a lot of it is very subjective, I just have a hard time taking seriously someone that does shoddy work.
Here is an analogy. You have a neighbor that puts an addition onto his house. The work is terrible, the walls aren't straight, looks bad. Sure, structurely it won't fall down, but it is bad worksmanship. Would you ask the guy that did the work for advice? Would you even listen if he offerred it up? I know I wouldn't.
When you get into things that are subjective, some are more so than others. Like his idea of lofty price. I think we have demonstrated on here that it isn't much more money, but it is more car than the others in its class (which are the Accord and Camry). It does cost more, but it offers more as well.
As far as the looks go, again everyone has their opinion. I totally agree on the maxipad skylight
(well, a quick correction on your it is standard, you have the option to pay $$$ for the other sunroof)
I guess what it all comes down to is, how can you judge someone on their subjective choices. Well, you really can't right? So that leaves the technical part of his review for us to judge him on, and I think we all agree that he was less than correct on that one.
I am still waiting for his reply to my email.
Grant
I agree that a lot of it is very subjective, I just have a hard time taking seriously someone that does shoddy work.
Here is an analogy. You have a neighbor that puts an addition onto his house. The work is terrible, the walls aren't straight, looks bad. Sure, structurely it won't fall down, but it is bad worksmanship. Would you ask the guy that did the work for advice? Would you even listen if he offerred it up? I know I wouldn't.
When you get into things that are subjective, some are more so than others. Like his idea of lofty price. I think we have demonstrated on here that it isn't much more money, but it is more car than the others in its class (which are the Accord and Camry). It does cost more, but it offers more as well.
As far as the looks go, again everyone has their opinion. I totally agree on the maxipad skylight
(well, a quick correction on your it is standard, you have the option to pay $$$ for the other sunroof)I guess what it all comes down to is, how can you judge someone on their subjective choices. Well, you really can't right? So that leaves the technical part of his review for us to judge him on, and I think we all agree that he was less than correct on that one.
I am still waiting for his reply to my email.
Grant
04-24-2003, 05:54 PM
#49
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Originally posted by 1SICKLEX
What are sales projections? I know the previous Max was a 100-150k selling car correct?
I find ANY SUV sells fine, cars are having a much harder time (times have changed).
What are sales projections? I know the previous Max was a 100-150k selling car correct?
I find ANY SUV sells fine, cars are having a much harder time (times have changed).
04-24-2003, 05:55 PM
#50
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Originally posted by perrymaxima
Writers do make mistakes I bet this guy drove a manual SE and an Auto SE because as stated the SL doesn't have a manumatic transmission so he made a mistake when he stated he drove a SE and SL.
As far as the class of car the 6th gen Maxima is in well... It's in what ever class you want it to be in. The car has a broad range of features so equip it as much as you like and love it for what it is...just a car!
I do have grips about some of the features the Maxima is lacking as someone else stated I would not pay 30K+ for a car that didn't include roadside asistance, 4 year warranty and luxury customer service... What that means to me is if I want a 2004 Maxima I would offer the dealer 27-29K and if he doesn't want my business either wait a couple months or go someplace that can suite me.
There is a chance though that Infiniti will offer a midsize luxury car alia Teana that will probably be in the same price range as a loaded Maxima so if I want Luxury I will get a Infiniti.
No need to flame each other we all have our opinions and if you don't like my opinion so what you can't delete it! We all have at least 1 thing in common... attraction to the Maxima image.
Writers do make mistakes I bet this guy drove a manual SE and an Auto SE because as stated the SL doesn't have a manumatic transmission so he made a mistake when he stated he drove a SE and SL.
As far as the class of car the 6th gen Maxima is in well... It's in what ever class you want it to be in. The car has a broad range of features so equip it as much as you like and love it for what it is...just a car!
I do have grips about some of the features the Maxima is lacking as someone else stated I would not pay 30K+ for a car that didn't include roadside asistance, 4 year warranty and luxury customer service... What that means to me is if I want a 2004 Maxima I would offer the dealer 27-29K and if he doesn't want my business either wait a couple months or go someplace that can suite me.
There is a chance though that Infiniti will offer a midsize luxury car alia Teana that will probably be in the same price range as a loaded Maxima so if I want Luxury I will get a Infiniti.
No need to flame each other we all have our opinions and if you don't like my opinion so what you can't delete it! We all have at least 1 thing in common... attraction to the Maxima image.
04-24-2003, 07:41 PM
#51
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 77
Originally posted by 1SICKLEX
What are sales projections? I know the previous Max was a 100-150k selling car correct?
I find ANY SUV sells fine, cars are having a much harder time (times have changed).
What are sales projections? I know the previous Max was a 100-150k selling car correct?
I find ANY SUV sells fine, cars are having a much harder time (times have changed).
-Ed
04-24-2003, 08:59 PM
#52
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,282
Originally posted by e_marston
They have cut production to about 80K Maxima's a year in anticipation of more sales to the Altima because of the Max's higher sticker price. Can't remember which article it was from but this is what I recall reading more than once.
-Ed
They have cut production to about 80K Maxima's a year in anticipation of more sales to the Altima because of the Max's higher sticker price. Can't remember which article it was from but this is what I recall reading more than once.
-Ed
Grant
04-25-2003, 06:39 AM
#53
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Join Date: Sep 2001
Posts: 265
Originally posted by gmc74
I have to assume it will be higher for the 2004 model since it will be out for about 4-6 months longer than a normal model year
Grant
I have to assume it will be higher for the 2004 model since it will be out for about 4-6 months longer than a normal model year
Grant
04-25-2003, 08:31 AM
#54
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Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 535
They have cut production to about 80K Maxima's a year in anticipation of more sales to the Altima because of the Max's higher sticker price. Can't remember which article it was from but this is what I recall reading more than once.
04-25-2003, 08:58 AM
#55
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 81
from an article i found regarding sales estimates...
By Ken Chester, Jr.
Motor News Media Corporation
Production of the 2004 Nissan Maxima began on January 21 and should be arriving at Nissan dealers within a few weeks. The automaker estimates calendar year sales of 70,000 units. Nissan officials said more can be coaxed from the assembly line as demand dictates.
By Ken Chester, Jr.
Motor News Media Corporation
Production of the 2004 Nissan Maxima began on January 21 and should be arriving at Nissan dealers within a few weeks. The automaker estimates calendar year sales of 70,000 units. Nissan officials said more can be coaxed from the assembly line as demand dictates.
04-25-2003, 10:11 AM
#56
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Posts: 4
Re: Re: Perspective
Originally posted by Maxima04
Boy, aint that the truth! I tried it the other day (in N.Y.) while the morning temp was about 40. It was REALLY nice and heated up very quickly, so I can imagine how nice this will be in the dead of winter.
BTW, I brought mine in for service to align the hood better and found the car became much quieter on the road afterwards. Apparently the misalignment of the hood was causing some air turbulence that created noise at speeds above 65. You wouldn't think this would affect the overall noise level, but it sure did. That was about the only complaint I had about the car (noise at speeds above 65). I remember someone posting that his 04 Max was about as quiet as his Lexus LS400. I can now believe that.
Boy, aint that the truth! I tried it the other day (in N.Y.) while the morning temp was about 40. It was REALLY nice and heated up very quickly, so I can imagine how nice this will be in the dead of winter.
BTW, I brought mine in for service to align the hood better and found the car became much quieter on the road afterwards. Apparently the misalignment of the hood was causing some air turbulence that created noise at speeds above 65. You wouldn't think this would affect the overall noise level, but it sure did. That was about the only complaint I had about the car (noise at speeds above 65). I remember someone posting that his 04 Max was about as quiet as his Lexus LS400. I can now believe that.
I will take it back to the dealer next week to have all the issues addressed.
The car is very quiet, does not lean much during cornering, & handles road imperfections nicely. Be extremely careful on the highway as 80 mph feels like 50mph.
Overall, this car is a huge step up in this class. I don't think the other makers at the below luxury level can match this product at the moment. The new rear suspension along with sound dampening upgrades gives this car both a Lexus-like feel with sports sedan behavior. My 2000 Maxima was nice but this car is a middleclass man's beast. Assuming I can have all my issues addressed, I LOVE THIS CARR!!!!
04-25-2003, 11:15 AM
#57
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Join Date: Apr 2003
Posts: 1,282
Re: Re: Re: Perspective
Originally posted by Eleuthera
The car is very quiet, does not lean much during cornering, & handles road imperfections nicely. Be extremely careful on the highway as 80 mph feels like 50mph.
The car is very quiet, does not lean much during cornering, & handles road imperfections nicely. Be extremely careful on the highway as 80 mph feels like 50mph.
It doesn't help that I used to drive an Excursion, and you always had to have the pedal down near the floor... I guess this may also be why the maxima doesn't feel/look all that big to me.
Grant
04-26-2003, 07:09 AM
#58
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 77
Originally posted by 1SICKLEX
Thanks. I know they sell 400k+ Camrys and Accords a year. I think they sold about 220k Altimas the first year, I'm not sure. SO that is 300k total. I suppose the Maximas higher price offsets the difference in volume, though I HAVE seen loaded Camrys at 31k (ridiculous).
Thanks. I know they sell 400k+ Camrys and Accords a year. I think they sold about 220k Altimas the first year, I'm not sure. SO that is 300k total. I suppose the Maximas higher price offsets the difference in volume, though I HAVE seen loaded Camrys at 31k (ridiculous).
06-14-2003, 03:22 PM
#60
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Join Date: Jun 2003
Posts: 233
Originally posted by 1SICKLEX
I think they had an Article on the new Acura TSX and they pretty much said the same thing about it. I tend to agree. After driving the car, this is no Maxima. Road and Track said similar things as well:
Great family car
Average Sports Sedan
Below AVerage 4-door Sports Car.
The Maxima is like an Accord/Camry with more power now. No more sweet handling for a FWD car. The Max I tested was 33k and they are NUTS at this price. It's only strong agument is more space. Otherwise
Acura TL-S
BMW 330
Lexus IS 300
Audi A4
Infiniti G35
Volvo S70
Caddy CTS
All get my vote first.
I think they had an Article on the new Acura TSX and they pretty much said the same thing about it. I tend to agree. After driving the car, this is no Maxima. Road and Track said similar things as well:
Great family car
Average Sports Sedan
Below AVerage 4-door Sports Car.
The Maxima is like an Accord/Camry with more power now. No more sweet handling for a FWD car. The Max I tested was 33k and they are NUTS at this price. It's only strong agument is more space. Otherwise
Acura TL-S
BMW 330
Lexus IS 300
Audi A4
Infiniti G35
Volvo S70
Caddy CTS
All get my vote first.
Jaeger:
a) lofty price? Nah, not in my opinion... you get a roomy car with great styling, one of the best V6 engines in the world, and many features thare arent even available in any car in its class
b) styling? Subjective... the '04 IMO, looks slick! And the many people that stop to compliment the car agree.
c) better to have the Sky View than nothing at all... it's a no-charge standard feature...
d) Elite Package is an option, and a very practical luxury for those who would get it.... people without families, or people with grown kids...
e) VDC/Traction Control, or HLSD = issue solved... and get rid of those crappy Goodyear Eagle RS-A tires! ICK!
The only car review I am worried about is my own... I could are less what someone says about a particular car I want/like. If I still want/like it after a test drive, it's mine (assuming I am in the market)... after all, I am the one that will be living with it.
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