Yea right, RWD maxima...but what IF?
01-21-2006 | 09:17 AM
#41
Originally Posted by d00df00d
The custom driveshaft is absolutely the least of your worries.
You can't just tack on any old rear suspension. The rear section of the frame is designed around the beam suspension, which depends on the lateral link in the center to guide it up and down without it shifting around. If you go with a solid rear axle and try to cusomize that lateral link, you lose a ton of ground clearance and wind up having the differential, axle, and half of the driveshaft being unsprung weight -- in other words, ALL the help your weight distribution just got is unsprung, which will KILL the car's dynamics. The only other option would be to mount the diff to the frame and set up an independent rear suspension, which means you now can't rely on the lateral link to guide suspension travel. So either you reuse the stock shock mounting points and have the most primitive suspension you've ever seen in your life (bye bye handling and stability), or you design upper and lower control arms and find some way to cram them along with the springs and shocks into spaces designed to hold nothing more than the springs and shocks.
Then you're only half done. That tunnel down the center of the car is big enough for a driveshaft or an exhaust, but not both, and there isn't another convenient place to run an exhaust. You'd HAVE to run side exhausts, and good luck trying to cram catalytic converters and a noise-legal muffler in there.
Plus you'd have to destroy the firewall and completely rebuild it to accommodate a RWD engine and transmission.
You can't just tack on any old rear suspension. The rear section of the frame is designed around the beam suspension, which depends on the lateral link in the center to guide it up and down without it shifting around. If you go with a solid rear axle and try to cusomize that lateral link, you lose a ton of ground clearance and wind up having the differential, axle, and half of the driveshaft being unsprung weight -- in other words, ALL the help your weight distribution just got is unsprung, which will KILL the car's dynamics. The only other option would be to mount the diff to the frame and set up an independent rear suspension, which means you now can't rely on the lateral link to guide suspension travel. So either you reuse the stock shock mounting points and have the most primitive suspension you've ever seen in your life (bye bye handling and stability), or you design upper and lower control arms and find some way to cram them along with the springs and shocks into spaces designed to hold nothing more than the springs and shocks.
Then you're only half done. That tunnel down the center of the car is big enough for a driveshaft or an exhaust, but not both, and there isn't another convenient place to run an exhaust. You'd HAVE to run side exhausts, and good luck trying to cram catalytic converters and a noise-legal muffler in there.
Plus you'd have to destroy the firewall and completely rebuild it to accommodate a RWD engine and transmission.
I did see a rwd integra before.
01-21-2006 | 10:58 PM
#43
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Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by d00df00d
The custom driveshaft is absolutely the least of your worries.
You can't just tack on any old rear suspension. The rear section of the frame is designed around the beam suspension, which depends on the lateral link in the center to guide it up and down without it shifting around. If you go with a solid rear axle and try to cusomize that lateral link, you lose a ton of ground clearance and wind up having the differential, axle, and half of the driveshaft being unsprung weight -- in other words, ALL the help your weight distribution just got is unsprung, which will KILL the car's dynamics. The only other option would be to mount the diff to the frame and set up an independent rear suspension, which means you now can't rely on the lateral link to guide suspension travel. So either you reuse the stock shock mounting points and have the most primitive suspension you've ever seen in your life (bye bye handling and stability), or you design upper and lower control arms and find some way to cram them along with the springs and shocks into spaces designed to hold nothing more than the springs and shocks.
Then you're only half done. That tunnel down the center of the car is big enough for a driveshaft or an exhaust, but not both, and there isn't another convenient place to run an exhaust. You'd HAVE to run side exhausts, and good luck trying to cram catalytic converters and a noise-legal muffler in there.
Plus you'd have to destroy the firewall and completely rebuild it to accommodate a RWD engine and transmission.
You can't just tack on any old rear suspension. The rear section of the frame is designed around the beam suspension, which depends on the lateral link in the center to guide it up and down without it shifting around. If you go with a solid rear axle and try to cusomize that lateral link, you lose a ton of ground clearance and wind up having the differential, axle, and half of the driveshaft being unsprung weight -- in other words, ALL the help your weight distribution just got is unsprung, which will KILL the car's dynamics. The only other option would be to mount the diff to the frame and set up an independent rear suspension, which means you now can't rely on the lateral link to guide suspension travel. So either you reuse the stock shock mounting points and have the most primitive suspension you've ever seen in your life (bye bye handling and stability), or you design upper and lower control arms and find some way to cram them along with the springs and shocks into spaces designed to hold nothing more than the springs and shocks.
Then you're only half done. That tunnel down the center of the car is big enough for a driveshaft or an exhaust, but not both, and there isn't another convenient place to run an exhaust. You'd HAVE to run side exhausts, and good luck trying to cram catalytic converters and a noise-legal muffler in there.
Plus you'd have to destroy the firewall and completely rebuild it to accommodate a RWD engine and transmission.
This is going to be a full out race car, so probably no/minimal interior, partial cage, probably 80-90% custom firewall, and all unnessicary wiring/features will be removed. Oh and the budget is $2006. This outta be fun! Now only if the weather would get warmer (consistantly anyway) Id get started!
~Alex
01-22-2006 | 11:15 AM
#47
Originally Posted by Alex_V
I plan on doing exactly that to my 3rd gen parts car. Plus you forgot the PS rack and front crossmember to mount the engine on, oh and the tranny crossmember. and making sure the shifter is lined up right. Thats about it other then wiring.
This is going to be a full out race car, so probably no/minimal interior, partial cage, probably 80-90% custom firewall, and all unnessicary wiring/features will be removed. Oh and the budget is $2006. This outta be fun! Now only if the weather would get warmer (consistantly anyway) Id get started!
~Alex
This is going to be a full out race car, so probably no/minimal interior, partial cage, probably 80-90% custom firewall, and all unnessicary wiring/features will be removed. Oh and the budget is $2006. This outta be fun! Now only if the weather would get warmer (consistantly anyway) Id get started!
~Alex
I really don't understand what you guys plan to do with the front spindles. Without the axle to hold the bearing on, the hub will slide out of the spindle. It almost happened to me when I was towing my Maxima. I had the motor and tranny out and I was towing on a tow rope. After only two miles one of the wheel bearings was ready to come loose. From now on I trailer the chassis around.
01-23-2006 | 08:38 AM
#48
No matter cost, time, or work...
NCSU_MAX and I will do a RWD 4G max with a 3.5.... Once John and I get the shop up and running it will become the company project car....
In due time.............
NCSU_MAX and I will do a RWD 4G max with a 3.5.... Once John and I get the shop up and running it will become the company project car....
In due time.............
01-23-2006 | 09:07 AM
#49
Originally Posted by blackmaxx96
No matter cost, time, or work...
NCSU_MAX and I will do a RWD 4G max with a 3.5.... Once John and I get the shop up and running it will become the company project car....
In due time.............
NCSU_MAX and I will do a RWD 4G max with a 3.5.... Once John and I get the shop up and running it will become the company project car....
In due time.............
Good luck
01-23-2006 | 09:55 AM
#50
Funny how nobody answers my question. That is probably the most difficult part of the project to overcome. The front suspension would have to be totally ripped out, redone and all the mount points would be different. It'd be nice to use a simple McPhearson strut type suspension. The only car I can think of that might have struts are the j30. If you use a double A-arm suspension its gonna be a helluvalot harder. The 240 uses a strut type suspension but the wheel base is definitely not as wide as it would need to be for the Maxima. Meaning the crossmember would also have to be reworked. Pretty much, it requires some very serious engineering. That is certainly not required.
If you really love the VQ then find a suitable platform that is already RWD. If you love the Maxima but hate FWD then you should come to the realization, as I did, that its not possible to overcome without some very serious know-how. If you guys are asking these simple questions then there is no way you know how to engineer the pickup points for a totally one off suspension; I don't either and I don't claim to. I'd love to get to that point at some time but right now I accept that I only have the skills, knowledge and tooling required to modify the OE chassis.
Finally, when all is said and done, the things that you loved about the Maxima(or at least the things I loved), the leather, sunroof, 5 seats, nice stereo, good modern looks for a 10 year old car, auto climate control, will all be worthless because those things probably won't be there any more.
If you really love the VQ then find a suitable platform that is already RWD. If you love the Maxima but hate FWD then you should come to the realization, as I did, that its not possible to overcome without some very serious know-how. If you guys are asking these simple questions then there is no way you know how to engineer the pickup points for a totally one off suspension; I don't either and I don't claim to. I'd love to get to that point at some time but right now I accept that I only have the skills, knowledge and tooling required to modify the OE chassis.
Finally, when all is said and done, the things that you loved about the Maxima(or at least the things I loved), the leather, sunroof, 5 seats, nice stereo, good modern looks for a 10 year old car, auto climate control, will all be worthless because those things probably won't be there any more.
01-23-2006 | 10:48 AM
#51
less than a year ago someone posted a pic of late 90's -early 00's Grand Prix (sand color) at a drag strip - it was a rwd conversion with a V-8 (dont remember if it was a small block or a big block). i think the conversion involved a tube chassis. someone needs to find that post with the pic.
Originally Posted by MDeezy
In short. Just plain not worth it. The money spent to do this honnestly could by a decent RWD car and tune it.
I did see a rwd integra before.
I did see a rwd integra before.
01-23-2006 | 11:30 AM
#53
IMO there are two somewhat reasonable choices:
1) Buy a RWD car and swap a VQ in it. This is what I would do, because as much as I love the Maxima platform, despite its disfunctions, I am more loyal to the VQ engine than anything else. I just wish there were more options on light cheap RWD (Nissan preferably) cars out there. I would also need time and money to do it.
2) get a custom or imported AWD transmission that will fit the VQ and run a driveshaft back through the exhaust path. That would be MUCH easier to deal with than having to start from scratch in the front and try and mount the VQ longitudinally. If you can do it then more praise to you. You would have to deal with the fuel tank and rear suspension and expand the exhaust routing which you have to do all of this anyway, but the front end could almost go unchanged. The weight balance would not be great, but if you want that then go with option #1 and get it relatively easily. Longitudinally FR in a Maxima is no where near practical in a Maxima or most FWD cars. If you try to fit the engine in the rear that might work, but once again there are better, light, and easier cars to do that in.
1) Buy a RWD car and swap a VQ in it. This is what I would do, because as much as I love the Maxima platform, despite its disfunctions, I am more loyal to the VQ engine than anything else. I just wish there were more options on light cheap RWD (Nissan preferably) cars out there. I would also need time and money to do it.
2) get a custom or imported AWD transmission that will fit the VQ and run a driveshaft back through the exhaust path. That would be MUCH easier to deal with than having to start from scratch in the front and try and mount the VQ longitudinally. If you can do it then more praise to you. You would have to deal with the fuel tank and rear suspension and expand the exhaust routing which you have to do all of this anyway, but the front end could almost go unchanged. The weight balance would not be great, but if you want that then go with option #1 and get it relatively easily. Longitudinally FR in a Maxima is no where near practical in a Maxima or most FWD cars. If you try to fit the engine in the rear that might work, but once again there are better, light, and easier cars to do that in.
01-23-2006 | 11:33 AM
#54
I agree. The murano's VQ35 is transverse mounted and it is AWD. Plus, you can get the weight of a 4th gen down to 2700 or so pretty easily. I doubt the conversion would add more than 150-200 lbs to the car. 2850-2900 in the end that would still be a good 200-300 less than an STI.
If someone was to undertake a conversion project, AWD would be the way to go IMO.
If someone was to undertake a conversion project, AWD would be the way to go IMO.
01-23-2006 | 11:39 AM
#55
The Murano is CVT which would be difficult to manipulate without full ECU conversion to say the Least, but it is a step in the right direction. A Bluebird SSS ATTESA or GTi-R transmission would be better and you would just have to convert the bellhousing.
An effective rear suspension would make or break the project though, which would take considerable time, money, and custom parts.
An effective rear suspension would make or break the project though, which would take considerable time, money, and custom parts.
01-23-2006 | 01:38 PM
#58
Originally Posted by liqidvenom
i dont see why if you can build a rwd max y not use a serious n/a motor
I'm thinking something along the lines of an LS-6/7
01-23-2006 | 01:49 PM
#59
Originally Posted by liqidvenom
i dont see why if you can build a rwd max y not use a serious n/a motor
01-23-2006 | 02:27 PM
#60
This is what I'm thinking of doing in the future. I can get this car from help from a guy I know who ships freight too and from The Bahamas.
Swap all sheet metal hood doors Front and Rear bumpers headlights and rear headlight's trunk and custom fit the 3.5 inside. A maxima AWD or RWD I like AWD better now that's something. But the only thing that would give it away of course is it's right hand drive. I honestly think this car is the best to try with because I looked at the cefiro's and the only chassis that came with RWD were the A31 the dimensions on that car is way off from say a 88-93 maybe the 3rdgen guys could try this.
The only thing I see wrong with the bluebird is that getting the exterior to look like a 4thgen would be a challenge in it's own. It seems that the bluebird is more like the Infiniti G20 size but a little longer taller and wider. The hard part of this would have to be cosmetics which should be allot easier than making your own RWD chassis. You know what forget about swaping the VQ35DE the SR20DET or maybe RB26DETT would be way eaisier and bad azz.
1998 Nissan Bluebird 2.0SSS Attesa S 4WD
Length:179.7" vs. 4thgen: 187.7"
Width: 66.7" vs. 4thgen: 69.7"
Hieght: 55.9" vs. 4thgen: 55.7"
WheelBase: 102.3" vs. 4thgen 106.3"
Swap all sheet metal hood doors Front and Rear bumpers headlights and rear headlight's trunk and custom fit the 3.5 inside. A maxima AWD or RWD I like AWD better now that's something. But the only thing that would give it away of course is it's right hand drive. I honestly think this car is the best to try with because I looked at the cefiro's and the only chassis that came with RWD were the A31 the dimensions on that car is way off from say a 88-93 maybe the 3rdgen guys could try this.
The only thing I see wrong with the bluebird is that getting the exterior to look like a 4thgen would be a challenge in it's own. It seems that the bluebird is more like the Infiniti G20 size but a little longer taller and wider. The hard part of this would have to be cosmetics which should be allot easier than making your own RWD chassis. You know what forget about swaping the VQ35DE the SR20DET or maybe RB26DETT would be way eaisier and bad azz.
1998 Nissan Bluebird 2.0SSS Attesa S 4WD
Length:179.7" vs. 4thgen: 187.7"
Width: 66.7" vs. 4thgen: 69.7"
Hieght: 55.9" vs. 4thgen: 55.7"
WheelBase: 102.3" vs. 4thgen 106.3"
01-23-2006 | 03:32 PM
#62
Wait does anyone know if the chassis layout for the 96 USD Alti's have the driveshaft housing underneath as the JDM version? Just like the Ford focus they have it already underneath where you can make it AWD or RWD very easy. I would deff consider buying a focus and doing this...
01-29-2006 | 08:11 PM
#63
That's what my friend Nick and I are planning out right now.
He's got a 98 240 body with no drivetrain in his garage and been trying to decide what power plant to put in it, and I finally convinced him this week :-D
Tentative plans are a "built" VQ30 with somewhere around 10 lbs of boost and enough suspension work to take an exige to town....
[QUOTE=SPiG]IMO there are two somewhat reasonable choices:
1) Buy a RWD car and swap a VQ in it. This is what I would do, because as much as I love the Maxima platform, despite its disfunctions, I am more loyal to the VQ engine than anything else. I just wish there were more options on light cheap RWD (Nissan preferably) cars out there. I would also need time and money to do it.
He's got a 98 240 body with no drivetrain in his garage and been trying to decide what power plant to put in it, and I finally convinced him this week :-D
Tentative plans are a "built" VQ30 with somewhere around 10 lbs of boost and enough suspension work to take an exige to town....
[QUOTE=SPiG]IMO there are two somewhat reasonable choices:
1) Buy a RWD car and swap a VQ in it. This is what I would do, because as much as I love the Maxima platform, despite its disfunctions, I am more loyal to the VQ engine than anything else. I just wish there were more options on light cheap RWD (Nissan preferably) cars out there. I would also need time and money to do it.
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