Yet another Header Question
02-26-2007, 02:37 PM
#1
Yet another Header Question
I've been asking around on different threads the last month about this but its lead to dead ends, so Im just going to ask straight out.
It seems OBX has a new design for their headers.
These being the old ones --> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OBX-9...spagenameZWDVW
Notice the t-connection of the rear header onto the downpipe. This isnt a Y-pipe, its a "T-pipe". These are the ones that were imfamous for their fitment issues that one would have to modify the rear engine mount for them to fit. And in Tylley's case, modified it to the point that it was too weak to handle the output of one of his many turbo motors and he broke the mount. Not only that but that T connection is guaranteed to hamper and disturb the flow of exhaust gasses.
Now, notice these OBX headers --> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OBX-E...spagenameZWDVW
These seem to have slightly smoother bends, but the more important difference is that the "T" is gone. The rear header actually has a "Y" juncture to the downpipe. Being that these have primaries that are very similar in length to those of HS and Cattman (refer to the new Sticky... http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?t=512293), and now that they have a "Y"-pipe, the only thing thats keeping them back is that they are not equal length, but for $200 less than HS, and over $500 less than Cattman, who's to complain?
What I've been trying to find out is, has anyone installed one of these new OBX headers with the "Y"-Pipe. And if so, did you have any fitment issues?
Thanks in advance,
Eddy
It seems OBX has a new design for their headers.
These being the old ones --> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OBX-9...spagenameZWDVW
Notice the t-connection of the rear header onto the downpipe. This isnt a Y-pipe, its a "T-pipe". These are the ones that were imfamous for their fitment issues that one would have to modify the rear engine mount for them to fit. And in Tylley's case, modified it to the point that it was too weak to handle the output of one of his many turbo motors and he broke the mount. Not only that but that T connection is guaranteed to hamper and disturb the flow of exhaust gasses.
Now, notice these OBX headers --> http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/OBX-E...spagenameZWDVW
These seem to have slightly smoother bends, but the more important difference is that the "T" is gone. The rear header actually has a "Y" juncture to the downpipe. Being that these have primaries that are very similar in length to those of HS and Cattman (refer to the new Sticky... http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?t=512293), and now that they have a "Y"-pipe, the only thing thats keeping them back is that they are not equal length, but for $200 less than HS, and over $500 less than Cattman, who's to complain?
What I've been trying to find out is, has anyone installed one of these new OBX headers with the "Y"-Pipe. And if so, did you have any fitment issues?
Thanks in advance,
Eddy
02-26-2007, 03:07 PM
#2
Well i hope this new Design will produce as much power as the cattman and Hotshots, but i dont know anybody that can prove it here.. This goes back from the generic header threads, whos gonna be the Guinea pig?
02-26-2007, 05:20 PM
#3
Still not equal length.
By definition, I don't think the Hottshots or Cattmans are true equal length, but they're much closer than either of those pictured items.
For the price though. You never know. I'll admit, they're good for the price, but not sure about the power gains.
By definition, I don't think the Hottshots or Cattmans are true equal length, but they're much closer than either of those pictured items.
For the price though. You never know. I'll admit, they're good for the price, but not sure about the power gains.
02-26-2007, 05:33 PM
#4
Originally Posted by NmexMAX
Still not equal length.
By definition, I don't think the Hottshots or Cattmans are true equal length, but they're much closer than either of those pictured items.
For the price though. You never know. I'll admit, they're good for the price, but not sure about the power gains.
By definition, I don't think the Hottshots or Cattmans are true equal length, but they're much closer than either of those pictured items.
For the price though. You never know. I'll admit, they're good for the price, but not sure about the power gains.
. But yea this is exactly why Im looking into these headers. They might not be equal length, but for the price difference, if they make say 3whp less than the HS or Cattman, blah to that! Advance the timing 1* and you just made up the power difference, lol (just exaggerating, but you guys get my drift).
nismo-max, i think I may just have to be this guinea pig. Im sure these OBXs will make more power than a stock shorty header+ y-pipe, just for the fact of the long primaries. Real questions are,
Will I need to modify anything to make them fit like the previous design?
and
Exactly how much power will they make over stock headers?
02-26-2007, 05:40 PM
#5
It's more a difference of where the power will be delivered. And of course, add 1* there, and then add the same to the CM/HS equipped car... Profit?
As far as how much more
. You said it, engineer your way to optimize your personal set-up.
Anyway, they have to be better than stockers.
As far as how much more
. You said it, engineer your way to optimize your personal set-up.Anyway, they have to be better than stockers.
02-26-2007, 06:05 PM
#6
Whenever you use longer primaries your setup is focused more on the top end aspect. It is more free flowing than the shorty headers as explained by vipervadim. The new design was able to fix most of its problems and I'm sure they fixed the problem with the rear motor mount. You can't go wrong for the price.
I also think the maximum HP loss would not be more than 3 hp like you said.
I also think the maximum HP loss would not be more than 3 hp like you said.
02-26-2007, 07:17 PM
#7
Originally Posted by speed racer
Whenever you use longer primaries your setup is focused more on the top end aspect. It is more free flowing than the shorty headers as explained by vipervadim. The new design was able to fix most of its problems and I'm sure they fixed the problem with the rear motor mount. You can't go wrong for the price.
I also think the maximum HP loss would not be more than 3 hp like you said.
I also think the maximum HP loss would not be more than 3 hp like you said.
02-26-2007, 07:26 PM
#8
Originally Posted by speed racer
Whenever you use longer primaries your setup is focused more on the top end aspect. It is more free flowing than the shorty headers as explained by vipervadim. The new design was able to fix most of its problems and I'm sure they fixed the problem with the rear motor mount. You can't go wrong for the price.
I also think the maximum HP loss would not be more than 3 hp like you said.
I also think the maximum HP loss would not be more than 3 hp like you said.
02-26-2007, 08:12 PM
#9
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Dec 2004
Location: Atlanta, GA
Posts: 1,183
Originally Posted by 95BLKMAX
nismo-max, i think I may just have to be this guinea pig. Im sure these OBXs will make more power than a stock shorty header+ y-pipe, just for the fact of the long primaries. Real questions are,
I think TONS of Maxima owners would jump on them like a fat kid on cupcakes if the headers provided gains like cattman. We will have to see if that outlet is killer or not.
... don't forget the precious sound clips either
... on preferably stock cat-back.One question ... these headers are two piece meaning that the rear part is permenately attached. Wouldn't this cause major hell in the event that exhaust work is needed on a car with this on ... or maybe even the removal of the exhaust for a tranny drop?
02-26-2007, 08:42 PM
#10
Originally Posted by scrhale
Strike a deal with OBX. If you get a good dyno with them then *sniff sniff* ... what's that smell ... ohhhhh discounted group deal
I think TONS of Maxima owners would jump on them like a fat kid on cupcakes if the headers provided gains like cattman. We will have to see if that outlet is killer or not.
... don't forget the precious sound clips either ... on preferably stock cat-back.
One question ... these headers are two piece meaning that the rear part is permenately attached. Wouldn't this cause major hell in the event that exhaust work is needed on a car with this on ... or maybe even the removal of the exhaust for a tranny drop?
I think TONS of Maxima owners would jump on them like a fat kid on cupcakes if the headers provided gains like cattman. We will have to see if that outlet is killer or not.
... don't forget the precious sound clips either
... on preferably stock cat-back.One question ... these headers are two piece meaning that the rear part is permenately attached. Wouldn't this cause major hell in the event that exhaust work is needed on a car with this on ... or maybe even the removal of the exhaust for a tranny drop?
Well I desided to get these headers prior to catback, so yea you'll have a soundclip on stock catback, with 3.5 though. Honestly you dont need to remove your exhaust to drop/ install a tranny, it just makes it slightly easier cus of the better angle. But from my experience, you spend more time removing and installing x-member and exhaust to get that angle than the added time it takes to remove/ install the tranny with the engine at normal angle, lol.
The only time I see these headers being a PITA for me is if I need to remove my oil pan for some reason. So beside new custom spec'd intake cam adpaters and ARP rod bolts, that should be my last time having to remove my oil pan in hopefully a very long time, lol.
02-26-2007, 08:48 PM
#11
Funny - I ordered a set of these new OBX headers last week. Gonna have some work done on them to blend into my 3 inch Warpspeed plumbing, but I like the long-tube collectors, so I'm keeping those parts.
And about this comment from Scrhale:
"One question ... these headers are two piece meaning that the rear part is permenately attached. Wouldn't this cause major hell in the event that exhaust work is needed on a car with this on ... or maybe even the removal of the exhaust for a tranny drop?"
We are going to try to insert a flange in the rear collector plumbing, like the front, and attach both front and rear to the Warpspeed plumbing. Until the shop has parts in hand, that's where the plan is now....
And about this comment from Scrhale:
"One question ... these headers are two piece meaning that the rear part is permenately attached. Wouldn't this cause major hell in the event that exhaust work is needed on a car with this on ... or maybe even the removal of the exhaust for a tranny drop?"
We are going to try to insert a flange in the rear collector plumbing, like the front, and attach both front and rear to the Warpspeed plumbing. Until the shop has parts in hand, that's where the plan is now....
02-26-2007, 08:58 PM
#13
Originally Posted by scrhale
Sig changed
I can't wait to hear the sound clips.
Grey ... what kind of work are you getting done to them?
I can't wait to hear the sound clips.
Grey ... what kind of work are you getting done to them?
Warpspeed:
OBX:
Anyway, it looked like a good idea at the time - it's been a long time since I made headers from scratch.....
.
.
.
02-26-2007, 09:27 PM
#14
Oh snap, i think you are on to what I had in mind Harold! I wonder if once you're done with this (assuming it can be done, which looks simple enough from the pictures) if Dallas could make an exact copy of this "WSP OBX-to-X" adapter but leading into a 2.5" pipe.
I guess when the time comes we shall see.
OT- Hey also, I've been dalaying the install of "the device". I went to dyno on thrusday and the track on friday (both results are up their respective forum). But hopefully I will get around to it soon, midterms are this week.
I guess when the time comes we shall see.
OT- Hey also, I've been dalaying the install of "the device". I went to dyno on thrusday and the track on friday (both results are up their respective forum). But hopefully I will get around to it soon, midterms are this week.
02-27-2007, 07:14 AM
#15
Originally Posted by 95BLKMAX
Oh snap, i think you are on to what I had in mind Harold! I wonder if once you're done with this (assuming it can be done, which looks simple enough from the pictures) if Dallas could make an exact copy of this "WSP OBX-to-X" adapter but leading into a 2.5" pipe.
I guess when the time comes we shall see.
OT- Hey also, I've been dalaying the install of "the device". I went to dyno on thrusday and the track on friday (both results are up their respective forum). But hopefully I will get around to it soon, midterms are this week.
I guess when the time comes we shall see.
OT- Hey also, I've been dalaying the install of "the device". I went to dyno on thrusday and the track on friday (both results are up their respective forum). But hopefully I will get around to it soon, midterms are this week.
Good luck on getting Dallas to build anything else for the 4th gen Maximas - I think he has moved on to bigger and better. Our market is just too small, and everyone wants it cheap.
I think I'll do a good photo history of whatever happens - my Warpspeed collection still comes in handy, and I'll have something to share with others.
Yup, school comes first - I need you young guys working in good jobs, to pay my Social Security!
02-27-2007, 09:36 AM
#16
Hey gut check this thread out. Vadim did a side by side of the different headers for our cars. It's also a sticky here on the org.
http://forums.nycmaximas.org/showthread.php?t=20592
http://forums.nycmaximas.org/showthread.php?t=20592
03-07-2007, 03:43 AM
#19
Originally Posted by NisMo-Max
hey for those who purchased these yet, have u installed them?
03-21-2007, 02:28 PM
#23
I did take my Max and the OBX headers to the "muffler shop". Two race cars in the parking spaces up front, and a couple of 10-lb NOS bottles on the floor next to the service desk. I'm home! 
The owner put the car up on the rack to see the lay of the land, and measured out the headers. He came up with a good plan - leave everything stock on the OBX assenbly, up to the part where the two downpipes come together into one collector and become the main pipe with a flex section bolting to the cat. The "main pipe" is way too small. He liked the quality of the collectors and the flanges. He was less impressed about where OBX forgot to finish the EGR welds on the rear header.
He said he thought the best approach would be to remove the main pipe up to where the two downpipes come together, build a new main pipe starting with a new 2-pipe collector merging into a new 3" pipe and 3" Turbo flex section (new technology flex) and mating to the 3" hi-flow cat in the car. That's the good part - that would cost about $200 - if the headers are on the car. If not, he wants to charge the Nissan manual's flatrate hours to change out the two exhaust manifolds. That's about $600.
To install the OBX completely and build the new collector and flex will be $837.00. That's probably not going to happen. I'll shop around and see if another shop can pull the manifolds - I know that's not easy with the engine in the car.
Maybe I can remove those manifolds myself - but there isn't much room, especially in the back, and those nuts have been on the manifold studs for 90,000 miles.
.
The owner put the car up on the rack to see the lay of the land, and measured out the headers. He came up with a good plan - leave everything stock on the OBX assenbly, up to the part where the two downpipes come together into one collector and become the main pipe with a flex section bolting to the cat. The "main pipe" is way too small. He liked the quality of the collectors and the flanges. He was less impressed about where OBX forgot to finish the EGR welds on the rear header.
He said he thought the best approach would be to remove the main pipe up to where the two downpipes come together, build a new main pipe starting with a new 2-pipe collector merging into a new 3" pipe and 3" Turbo flex section (new technology flex) and mating to the 3" hi-flow cat in the car. That's the good part - that would cost about $200 - if the headers are on the car. If not, he wants to charge the Nissan manual's flatrate hours to change out the two exhaust manifolds. That's about $600.
To install the OBX completely and build the new collector and flex will be $837.00. That's probably not going to happen. I'll shop around and see if another shop can pull the manifolds - I know that's not easy with the engine in the car.
Maybe I can remove those manifolds myself - but there isn't much room, especially in the back, and those nuts have been on the manifold studs for 90,000 miles.
.
03-21-2007, 04:37 PM
#24
Originally Posted by grey99max
I did take my Max and the OBX headers to the "muffler shop". Two race cars in the parking spaces up front, and a couple of 10-lb NOS bottles on the floor next to the service desk. I'm home!
The owner put the car up on the rack to see the lay of the land, and measured out the headers. He came up with a good plan - leave everything stock on the OBX assenbly, up to the part where the two downpipes come together into one collector and become the main pipe with a flex section bolting to the cat. The "main pipe" is way too small. He liked the quality of the collectors and the flanges. He was less impressed about where OBX forgot to finish the EGR welds on the rear header.
He said he thought the best approach would be to remove the main pipe up to where the two downpipes come together, build a new main pipe starting with a new 2-pipe collector merging into a new 3" pipe and 3" Turbo flex section (new technology flex) and mating to the 3" hi-flow cat in the car. That's the good part - that would cost about $200 - if the headers are on the car. If not, he wants to charge the Nissan manual's flatrate hours to change out the two exhaust manifolds. That's about $600.
To install the OBX completely and build the new collector and flex will be $837.00. That's probably not going to happen. I'll shop around and see if another shop can pull the manifolds - I know that's not easy with the engine in the car.
Maybe I can remove those manifolds myself - but there isn't much room, especially in the back, and those nuts have been on the manifold studs for 90,000 miles.
.
The owner put the car up on the rack to see the lay of the land, and measured out the headers. He came up with a good plan - leave everything stock on the OBX assenbly, up to the part where the two downpipes come together into one collector and become the main pipe with a flex section bolting to the cat. The "main pipe" is way too small. He liked the quality of the collectors and the flanges. He was less impressed about where OBX forgot to finish the EGR welds on the rear header.
He said he thought the best approach would be to remove the main pipe up to where the two downpipes come together, build a new main pipe starting with a new 2-pipe collector merging into a new 3" pipe and 3" Turbo flex section (new technology flex) and mating to the 3" hi-flow cat in the car. That's the good part - that would cost about $200 - if the headers are on the car. If not, he wants to charge the Nissan manual's flatrate hours to change out the two exhaust manifolds. That's about $600.
To install the OBX completely and build the new collector and flex will be $837.00. That's probably not going to happen. I'll shop around and see if another shop can pull the manifolds - I know that's not easy with the engine in the car.
Maybe I can remove those manifolds myself - but there isn't much room, especially in the back, and those nuts have been on the manifold studs for 90,000 miles.
.
03-21-2007, 07:22 PM
#25
Originally Posted by GoalieKeg
With the right tools, it's not too difficult. Drop the crossmember and the motor mounts, and that should give you some good room to work with. Also, you might need to pull your IM to have better access to your EGR port.
If I took the 3" y-pipe off completely, which is very obvious on this car (woops - I didn't eyeball the O2 sensors), then the EGR has to be disconnected - unbolted with a long wrench, cut, pulled out by the roots 'cause it ain't going back in, then both manifolds need to be unbolted. Is there a problem getting them down and out ??
Since I've never done this and don't know anyone who has (around here), I'm looking for an ed-ducation on header installation.
.
03-21-2007, 08:15 PM
#26
Goalikeg meant to say to remove the rear mount and its braket to the block, along with the x-member. Its for the removal of the rear manifold. The motor mounts braket will get into the way of the nuts on Cyl5 and maybe cyl3 ports.
For the front all you really need to do it remove the fan shroud to give you some extra room. That one is cake.
Orrrr, you could come to the SW of Miami-Dade County and we can do it fro ya
j/k lol
For the front all you really need to do it remove the fan shroud to give you some extra room. That one is cake.
Orrrr, you could come to the SW of Miami-Dade County and we can do it fro ya
j/k lol
03-22-2007, 06:31 AM
#28
Originally Posted by 95BLKMAX
Goalikeg meant to say to remove the rear mount and its braket to the block, along with the x-member. Its for the removal of the rear manifold. The motor mounts braket will get into the way of the nuts on Cyl5 and maybe cyl3 ports.
For the front all you really need to do it remove the fan shroud to give you some extra room. That one is cake.
Orrrr, you could come to the SW of Miami-Dade County and we can do it fro ya j/k lol
For the front all you really need to do it remove the fan shroud to give you some extra room. That one is cake.
Orrrr, you could come to the SW of Miami-Dade County and we can do it fro ya
j/k lol
It sounds doable with the tools I've got, but my garage space is so tight I can't get under the car from either side - just the front or back, depending on which way I park. I'll think this over a bit longer - no rush - the spring rains have begun.
If I showed up in the SW of Miami-Dade County, I'm sure your crew would help, but then you would bust my azz in some races as payment, right?
P.S. - a side note - I noticed that the boltholes on the OBX flanges are much larger on the two outside ports compared to the center port. This is true of both the front and rear headers. The front one mated right up to the donor engine I was playing with. The header could then rock from side-to-side a little. I wonder if OBX did this to make installation easier?
.
03-22-2007, 10:28 AM
#29
Originally Posted by 95BLKMAX
Goalikeg meant to say to remove the rear mount and its braket to the block, along with the x-member. Its for the removal of the rear manifold. The motor mounts braket will get into the way of the nuts on Cyl5 and maybe cyl3 ports.
For the front all you really need to do it remove the fan shroud to give you some extra room. That one is cake.
Orrrr, you could come to the SW of Miami-Dade County and we can do it fro ya j/k lol
For the front all you really need to do it remove the fan shroud to give you some extra room. That one is cake.
Orrrr, you could come to the SW of Miami-Dade County and we can do it fro ya
j/k lolEddy I prefer to have everything out of the way, and I also find it easier to install the crossmember back on the car by taking both motor mounts off still attached to the crossmember. That is just my preference, but it can be done like you do too. I just like having less bolts to deal with.
Originally Posted by nismology
Removing the IM isn't necessary to remove the rear exhaust manifold.
BTW, get your car to my damn garage so I can detail it, for the love of god!
03-22-2007, 11:00 AM
#31
Originally Posted by GoalieKeg
Eddy I prefer to have everything out of the way, and I also find it easier to install the crossmember back on the car by taking both motor mounts off still attached to the crossmember. That is just my preference, but it can be done like you do too. I just like having less bolts to deal with.
It's a hell of a lot easier to get to the EGR port. Shaddap.
It's a hell of a lot easier to get to the EGR port. Shaddap.
.
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