accordingtou

iTrader: (41)

Nice job on the exhaust ports
Do you have acess to a flow bench?
I know the real gains will be seen on a dyno but I was wondering how much better they will flow compared to stock.

speed racer

iTrader: (10)

That's real shinny. You did a good job. Did you just use a die grinder? What other tools you used?

doublea

iTrader: (7)

Thanks man, I dont have access to a flow bench but the company who will do my valve jobs have one so I can ask them to test the flow of the VQ heads and get the spec ( this is an area that I know nothing about ). The surface is so much smoother than the stocker and it's very easy to see that just the difference in the material friction will play a important role in the increase of flow.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

The first head required too many hours because I've experimented different technique with different tools, but essentially the die grinder and the dremmel are you best friend.

The second head is going to be much faster to do since I know exactly how to do it, the finale buffing was done with the Black Emery compound and buffer wheel (1/4 and 1/8 inche ) using both the dremmel and the die grinder.

In order to get this high polish on the exhaust port, it took me about 2 hours per ports just for the final polish so over all it's an exhaustive jobs that cant be done in a week-end.

MOHFpro90

iTrader: (11)

Just out of curiosity, and this is probably a stupid question, but has anyone ever thought about removing that shelf in between the valves on the heads?

Nice work AA

doublea

iTrader: (7)

Let me guess that removing the separator could create more pressure on the shortest runner so I dont think it would do any good, because I think it would unbalance the air input but I might be plain wrong.

I'm so anxious to put the engine back and finish the project, it's almost 2 years since I've been contemplating my car without being able to drive it...

doublea

iTrader: (7)

For the polishing stuff look here: www.caswellplating.com it's a great ressource.

A+

doublea

iTrader: (7)

Just received the manganese/bronze valve guide, here is some pics:

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

Actually it works the other way around, in very miniscule amounts though, so don't waste your time superpolishing the intakes like that, the only reason and benefit of doing the exhaust's super smooth and shiny like that is to reduce carbon build-up which will in the long term decrease flow, same deal with the combustion chamber except carbon build-up there can be a little more detrimental, especially to you (Re: boost & detonation).

Nonetheless, awesome work man, definitly see you got rid of all the (allthough miinor on a VQ) casting flaws, you should definitly see a nice bump if you anally clean up and port match that entire thing. It sucks you couldn't just slap those heads on someone else's cars to do a before/after with the larger valves, but please do get them flowtested, what is the area going to increase on them again? Also, do you know if those guides are service guides or not, anyway to post up the exact OD?

Thanks and good luck with the build, this is getting interesting.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

The super fine polishing is only done on the exhaust side. The intake side has to remain a little rough like 80 grid but it's a good idea to smooth it out with a cross buff, it remove all the material that may otherwise detach and fly in the engine. I'm going to ask the shop how much that would get me to have both heads flow tested, I'll let you know shortly.

I'm not sure what you mean when you say " what is the area going to increase on them again? Also, do you know if those guides are service guides or not ? "


I'll give you the exact OD later tonight since I dont have my vernier caliper with me now.

Thanks for the good words, I still have some good works ahead of me but at least one of the 2 heads is finished. I hope to have the second one done within the next week and ship asap to JT Precision and hopefully I'll get those heads back in 3-4 weeks. In the meantime we are going to start the cleaning of the block and take care of all the polishing that need to be done on many engine parts, I'm also bringing a box full of parts, brackets, bolts & nuts to the chrome shop tomorrow.

MOHFpro90

iTrader: (11)

Eww chrome....haha

Lookin good man, I know you will keep us updated.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

The C.H.E valve guide have 10.03 mm OD, I've measure few of them and they all have the same exact size.

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

Werd, they are stock size than, nissan doesn't sell stock size guides which sucks, only the service guides which are 10.17mm, installing them get's expensive, and on top of that IIRC retail is like $25-30 per guide!!! Allthough there are other readily available 10.06mm guides available, I like being able to use parts whose quality I don't question.

As for area, I'll look through the thread again, I'm geussing somewhere you mentioned the diameter of the larger valves, I can figure it out from there, I wanted to calculate out the total area increase and also figure it out as a percentage increase as well.

EDIT, it appears like oversize valves are not happening at this point. Damn it, I was really looking forward to that.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

ok I see your point, but you know it's not that difficult to install, first you want to leave the valve guide in the freezer for 24 hrs along with the valve driver ( you can get it from Goodson for 20$ ) you also need a zip gun. You'll have to start by putting the heads in the oven at 300 degree F for about an hour, then it will take less then 10 minutes to remove the stock valve guide, it probably take the same time to put the new one back, but because I'm having a valve job done it's the machine shop that will install the new one but if I have to it's not difficult at all you just need the right tools.

I'll check the stock valve size again later today, I'll let you know shortly. As far as using larger valve I can only guess that it will add gain.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

The stock exhaust valve size is 1.234 5 mm and the intake is 1.422 5 mm.

The shop who will perform the valve job will be re-using my stock valve, since they are very high quality. I dont know wich size they will end up to be, ( ya smaller than before the grind ) but not necessary, apparently they can add material to existing valve and re-grind/ re-shape after to fit the new bored valve seats, wich would be bigger obviously. When I asked the technician, he said there was room for improvement on my VQ30DEK heads and he could bore a little bit more, I then asked him if I would have to replace the valve itself and he said no, because they are high quality. This discussion was in relation with the valve seat diameter, so it must involve adding material on existing valve otherwise it would not make sense to bore a bigger valve seats and thinking that the stocker will still fit in there.

MOHFpro90

iTrader: (11)

Maybe there is some sort of gasket or ring they can put around it? beats me....Im just thinking out loud.

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

I don't see how, they definitly aren't welding material onto the valve that's for sure.

Tatanko

iTrader: (34)

Wouldn't that be like insanely difficult to balance and everything?

doublea

iTrader: (7)

One thing I forgot to mention is they can add a copper valve seats that will fit the valve size, but I wouldn't do that for a daily driver car since the copper seats are much less resistant to wear but much better for heat dissipation. There must be a certain tolerance, like they can bore the valve seat to an extend and just re-grind the valve so it's still fit perfectly. I'm going to call the tech today just to get more infos about that.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

This afternoon I called JPrecision Racing Heads and one of the tech told me they can increase the valve seat contact size by 1/1000 of an inche, as for the valve he said they have enough clearance for a re-grind since they never been re-grind. As for the flow bench test, he said it would cost something like 500 to a 1000$ and because this engine will be S/C'd he said it doesn't worth it, he said if I would be a racer where every 1/10 of second count then yes it could worth it but not in my situation. They will also clean both head using ultrasound for like 50-75$.

I'm currently working on the second head and will bust my a$$ to finish asap. On another note I found a local shop that does great powder coating they have over 1100 colors available, I'm going to bring them the VQ engine block along withe the upper oil pan, lower oil pan, timing gear cover and back face. When both heads will be fully done they'll be also powder coated. Tomorrow morning if the snow storm doesn't hit us too hard I'll be bringing both valve cover and a bunch of bracket to the chrome shop and that should be about it for now.

98SEBlackMax

iTrader: (9)

Interesting project.

If you ever get the heads flow tested I have some stock VQ30 flow bench data along with VQ35 pathy and VQ35 Maxima heads. Granted it would be two different machines done at two different times, it still would be of interest to compare the data.

On the whole valve oversizing thing. I too have seen some good gains by oversizing 1 mm valves. The same shop where I had the heads flow tested, a friend of mine had his SVT Focus heads reworked with oversizied valves among other things. Compared to the stock they flow ALOT better. They even outflowed the competition heads that Ford sold for the SVT Focus engine as well.

I decided not to even look into oversized valves on my build up. I ended up getting a full set of VK45 Ti valves for almost nothing. So those are going in my engine whenever I get around to building it up.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

I spend so much time to work on those heads, I followed the advice and tips of a few professionals & a shop that does NASCAR engine and stuff. So ya the flow bench test & data would be great for the 1000$ it cost but on instead with the same money I can afford the valve jobs so it's a win/win situation. I took my time taking measurement and be very careful at where I removed the material, all in all I think my work has been pretty consistant and each port are very very close to each other in the term or size, shape & finishes. The machine shop tech was very strait forward on the phone the first time I spoke with them, he honestly told me that many not so handy people who try to do this end up destroying their heads, so at first I was a little nervous to show them my works, it ended up that I was congratulated for the jobs I did. It was some how a relief since no one want to spend like 80 hours on something and later being tell that your work is crap and your basically a moron that has no futur. At the end the valve jobs is really not that costly taking into account all cost of this build.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

On a side note, friday I received the phenolic material that I order to make some customs spacers for the LIM & intake side of the heads, I've started yesterday to make the first one so I cant wait to see how it's going to end-up. For you info it cost me 125$ for a 12 x 24 inche piece, not exactly cheap but that stuff can stand like 700 degre F.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

Hey guys, here is the latest news on the build-up. I spend some time making a phenolic spacer which was well cut and fit but it's not going work, the material I bought is 1/8 of an inch and is too thick to put between the heads and the LIM, I cant align the head with the spacer on so it seem that only the UIM can benefit from the phenolic spacer because of it flat surface. I'm a little disappointed but it's not a big deal. I'll just use the standard gasket that I will match to the port, I already trim the old gasket and it's a fairly straight forward thing to do and will work good.

Yesterday I finished the disassemble of the engine, so the block, both timing cover and both oil pan are ready for the powder coating, wich should be done in the next 2 weeks or so. Both valve cover will be send to the chrome shop in the next few weeks as well.

Here a few questions I have: The block is in very good condition but should i have the chamber polished to remove any left over crap ?

I imagine that I will have to replace the main bearing & crank bearing, should I buy those from Nissan or is there a better option ?

What is the best option for the rods ? I believe Peuter and Eagle make rods for the VQ30DEK, does any one has experienced one or the other, so any advice as to wich one is a better choice. Is there any option for the crank shaft ? For the rest everything is going well, the Toga valve seal and oil pump are on it's way. If everything goes as plan I should be re-assembling the engine by end of april or early may.

Oh I almost forgot about the valve, the shop is going to bore the valve seat by 1 mm and re-grind the stock valve. The weak link for now is still the Autotragic, many are suggesting to swap to a 6 speed, that alone would bring a lot more work for an already overloaded single guy, who's working his a$$ off to finish the build before being too old to drive this car again. Lol

One thing I'm seriously thinking is to have the auto rebuild with a higher stall converter, I was also thinking to use something like this: http://twistmachine.com/shopping/ind...2de8d283a3fe63

Is it legal to replace the steering wheel with an after market steering wheel that has no air bag ? I think the answer is no but I though of asking.

One other possible solution is to use a Rogue steering wheel ( the one that come with paddle shifter ) My wife just bought a Rogue and the steering wheel seem smaller, it has a very nice grip on it and fore most has the paddle shifter so I'm wondering if that could work ?

That's about it for now.


AA

doublea

iTrader: (7)

You where absolutely right, there is no way they can welds material onto the valve. I though I had heard something about that but that must have been the green stuff that I use for my inhalotherapy session. Lol

MOHFpro90

iTrader: (11)

Youre going to chrome the valve covers?


It depends on where you live for the steering wheel, I think its legal here in FL.

skuccio's max

iTrader: (1)

Whoa whoa whoa what parts are you going with here exactly?

Is this a VQ30 or VQ35? I'm guessing 30, but then maybe 35 cause you're doing port matching?

I'm curious.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

Yes I'm going to have the valve cover chromed, I though of polishing but that doesn't last and it is a PITA to do.

I believe it's not legal if the air bag is removed, but I need to search more.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

I'm working on a VQ30DEK.

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

Yeah seriously man I've done alot of port work myself and was very impressed also, actually your exhaust ports were my desktop background for awhile, an award that is given to only the most distinguished of nissan performance pics. I now officially change my statement from awhile back, I like where this is going, and it's cool to see somebody doing all of the little things and muscle car V8 type of stuff as well, can't wait to see some more pics.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

Hey KRRZ350, thanks I always appreciated a few words of encouragement. This is the best fuel to keep up the energy on the hard work. As you know this take a lot of time and dedication and I wanted to make as good jobs as I can and not look like an idiot. I hope to finish the second head this months, once this part will be done then things should go at a much faster pace, as it will involve more assembling then craftman works.

I will post more pics as soon as the works will advance.

Do you think the LIM should have a high polished surface to flow more air or should it be left with a rough surface ?

Thanks for your input & good words.

AA

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

Rough surfaces flow more air, but it's so miniscule anyways.

I'm pretty sure that the de-k upper/lower is a much better fit, but I've found that the 02VI's have a pretty poor mismatch here, as well as a very loose fit. Meaning that you can take the upper and position it 1/8" or more every direction and it won't center itself even after all 5 bolts are tourqed down. To solve this I wrap teflon tape around the 2 studs until the diamater is big enough that the upper is a tight fit onto the studs, then I do my gasket matching. As for the de-k though, it's a litle more tricky to fix any step between the two mating surfaces because it uses an o-ring instead. If you have a flex attachment or long enough bit you can fit it in from the bottom of the lower, but this is much easier said than done. At the least, even just for my own curiosity since I don't have any de-k manifolds lying around, you should assemble the upper to the lower on the bench and see what it looks like.......

doublea

iTrader: (7)

I'll post some pics of the heads with UIM & LIM later tonight. As for the ports matching
I was able to port match the heads with the UIM and LIM, almost to a perfection so to speak. I've been working part time on this but for months and I'm not cutting corners.

All I can say now is that the I/E ports on my VQ30DEK heads are pretty much the same size if not bigger than the VQ35. I've increased the size of all ports to the maximum possible ( I've may have push it a little... ) also the valve seat are going to be increase by 1 mm, wich apparently are good for some nice gain.

Cheers

AA

nismology

iTrader: (8)

Too bad we won't have a chance to see the gains/losses from just the headwork. Unless I'm reading wrong, sounds like you just hogged the ports open.



So you're going with oversized valves?

doublea

iTrader: (7)

I'm probably going to have the car dyno'd before I put the S/C on but I see what you mean. I will dyno'd the car once everything is done and complete because I'm interested about the final result not necessary the gain for each mods I'm doing. I really open up the port to the absolute maximum, and every parts is port match to each other, that's also including the gaskets.

The machine shop can increase the valve seat by 1 mm without having to replace the valve itself. The valve can be re-grind to match the 1 mm increase of the seats since they never been re-grind before. Basically I going with oversized valve seats but I keep the stocker valve.

MOHFpro90

iTrader: (11)

Good choice on keeping the stock valves, IMO. Just hope the grind is solid and not too thin around the edges.


So have you decided on the pistons yet? I assume since you will be going boosted, your going low compression?

doublea

iTrader: (7)

The machine shop technician has mentioned that he can re-grind to match the 1 mm bore without affecting the integrity of the valve, when I showed him one of the valve he said those are very good quality, they doesn't need to be replace unless your building an engine that will rev like 9-10000 rpm + ( I heard it may be close to 8K rpm but I'd rather wait & see before speculating)

Yes it will be S/C with a V2 T trim. I'm going low compression as I have a set of Arias Forge piston with a c/r of 9.5:1 I might loose some power compare to the higher c/r of the stocker. I mean down the road the V2 T Trim along with the 2.62 pulley should give me enough power but foremost I'll have a more durable engine.

DrunkieTheBear

iTrader: (17)

This is dissappointing to hear that it would not benefit us, I was planning to do the same exact thing

doublea

iTrader: (7)

Did you mean for the flow bench test ? It's not totally out of the equation, it's just that this build is costing me so much money that if I can put the 1000$ on the engine it self then it's better for me but I understand the benefit of the flow bench test for the entire community so
I will seriously consider it, but I'll try to see if they can cut me a deal for like 500$ if they say yes then it will be a done deal. I'll let you guys know soon.

DrunkieTheBear

iTrader: (17)

you are going to receive alot of PMs from me in the coming months (june) I am buying my DEK engine soon and I'm tearing it down and basically doing all top end work, nothing much on the bottom, except rod bolts and such. But the head work is what I will need help with and I'll probably want to know the shop where your getting the valve work done cause I may use the same people.

Also when you ported out your heads did you try and keep the bottom port in the port the same and just open everything else up or did you just go all out and bore everything out as much as you could?
(example of what I mean:
)

One last question did you end getting those arp rod bolts? if not what are you using?

EDIT::

What are you doing for the IM? I'm removing my VIAS, but I'm thinking of developing what I call a 30SSIM and have been in talks with aaron93 about just gutting the hell out of the IM so its just basically all completely open.