pics of my system are up...
10-29-2002, 08:28 PM
#1
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pics of my system are up...
here are pics of my system:
http://students.ou.edu/P/Mitul.Patel-1/index.html
i know its a civic, but i will be getting that maxima soon, and all the audio stuff will be going in there.
opinions?
i did all the stuff myself, so yes, it looks very newbie-like, and i couldn't afford all the stuff i wanted ( like 2 amps ) so its a budget system.
next i plan on getting an EQ next, clarion eqs-560 5 band, its nothing special, just something that will allow me to get better control of the sub then the HU will, also, will an EQ up my pre amp voltage? i heard that pioneer decks have low pre amp voltage, is this true? what does this mean anyways?
http://students.ou.edu/P/Mitul.Patel-1/index.html
i know its a civic, but i will be getting that maxima soon, and all the audio stuff will be going in there.
opinions?
i did all the stuff myself, so yes, it looks very newbie-like, and i couldn't afford all the stuff i wanted ( like 2 amps ) so its a budget system.
next i plan on getting an EQ next, clarion eqs-560 5 band, its nothing special, just something that will allow me to get better control of the sub then the HU will, also, will an EQ up my pre amp voltage? i heard that pioneer decks have low pre amp voltage, is this true? what does this mean anyways?
10-29-2002, 08:56 PM
#2
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The 7400 should have 2.2 volt pre-outs. That's not bad. Not as good as 4-5 volt pre-outs. But still not bad. Any amp should be compatable with 2.2 volt outs. I don't know that the pre-amp can increase the out-put. Unless it has it's own power supply. The EQ may give you more options for your sub crossover point and level control.
10-29-2002, 08:59 PM
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Originally posted by jmax
The 7400 should have 2.2 volt pre-outs. That's not bad. Not as good as 4-5 volt pre-outs. But still not bad. Any amp should be compatable with 2.2 volt outs. I don't know that the pre-amp can increase the out-put. Unless it has it's own power supply. The EQ may give you more options for your sub crossover point and level control.
The 7400 should have 2.2 volt pre-outs. That's not bad. Not as good as 4-5 volt pre-outs. But still not bad. Any amp should be compatable with 2.2 volt outs. I don't know that the pre-amp can increase the out-put. Unless it has it's own power supply. The EQ may give you more options for your sub crossover point and level control.
10-29-2002, 11:51 PM
#4
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Originally posted by slick
hmm..kinda what i thought, but for $60, i guess that EQ isn't bad then, right?
hmm..kinda what i thought, but for $60, i guess that EQ isn't bad then, right?
But that's life. You gotta live it, or -
- well you know how that goes.
10-30-2002, 07:10 AM
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Originally posted by jmax
$60? Hell no, not bad at all. I think my first EQ back in the first half of the 90's was $180. That was a week and a half's wages or something like that. So for a days work after taxes you should be okay. Ain't this world great. Stuff that took a week or longer to save up for less than ten years ago can be had for less than a days work now. Makes the first quarter century seem kinda worthless when I think of it that way. The same will probably be able to be said of the stuff I buy now.
But that's life. You gotta live it, or - - well you know how that goes.
$60? Hell no, not bad at all. I think my first EQ back in the first half of the 90's was $180. That was a week and a half's wages or something like that. So for a days work after taxes you should be okay. Ain't this world great. Stuff that took a week or longer to save up for less than ten years ago can be had for less than a days work now. Makes the first quarter century seem kinda worthless when I think of it that way. The same will probably be able to be said of the stuff I buy now.
But that's life. You gotta live it, or -
- well you know how that goes.
anyways, i figured $60 would be good, even if its a 5 band.
10-30-2002, 01:11 PM
#6
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Originally posted by slick
hah, i know what you mean, i buy lots of worthless things, but with such low prices, i dont really care.
anyways, i figured $60 would be good, even if its a 5 band.
hah, i know what you mean, i buy lots of worthless things, but with such low prices, i dont really care.
anyways, i figured $60 would be good, even if its a 5 band.
eric
10-30-2002, 01:29 PM
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Originally posted by nismo240sx
my only suggestion is that if you use it as an eq, only cut frequencies, dont boost them, because it can cause clipping, and will sound bad and destroy stuff.
eric
my only suggestion is that if you use it as an eq, only cut frequencies, dont boost them, because it can cause clipping, and will sound bad and destroy stuff.
eric
if thats the case, that is what i'm gonna do, the one sub and components up front are plenty loud right now. the gain on the amp is down on sub to, cause it distorts at high gain.
got a question, i set the low pass for the sub on the amp to 100hz, will the EQ override that in any way?
i want the EQ because i notice that some songs that i play has bass, but i can't hear it unless i up the low pass frequency, an EQ will allow me to mess with that kind of stuff wont it?
11-01-2002, 07:43 AM
#9
Nice install Slick...
..but if you're looking for sugguestions, get some Split Loom Tubing. It's used for hiding wires and what not. Very cheap, but really cleans up the install!
Here's some
Here's some
11-01-2002, 12:50 PM
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Re: Nice install Slick...
Originally posted by spta97
..but if you're looking for sugguestions, get some Split Loom Tubing. It's used for hiding wires and what not. Very cheap, but really cleans up the install!
Here's some
..but if you're looking for sugguestions, get some Split Loom Tubing. It's used for hiding wires and what not. Very cheap, but really cleans up the install!
Here's some
this is my first install, so ANY suggestions are welcome. if you honestly think that i goofed up, maybe one of the components of the system dont belong or whatever, or if i need to add something, just tell me, i dont mind the critizism.
11-01-2002, 05:57 PM
#11
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Originally posted by nismo240sx
my only suggestion is that if you use it as an eq, only cut frequencies, dont boost them, because it can cause clipping, and will sound bad and destroy stuff.
eric
my only suggestion is that if you use it as an eq, only cut frequencies, dont boost them, because it can cause clipping, and will sound bad and destroy stuff.
eric
11-01-2002, 06:49 PM
#12
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Originally posted by jmax
Push everything to the max. Then set amp gains. Now cut everything back to the mid-point and start tuning from there.
Push everything to the max. Then set amp gains. Now cut everything back to the mid-point and start tuning from there.
11-01-2002, 07:22 PM
#13
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Originally posted by slick
oh, ok, i get what you are saying now. thanks, i hope i get this thing installed this weekend, if so, i'll let you guys know whats up with it, but maybe i shouldn't expect too much from a $60 EQ.
oh, ok, i get what you are saying now. thanks, i hope i get this thing installed this weekend, if so, i'll let you guys know whats up with it, but maybe i shouldn't expect too much from a $60 EQ.
11-02-2002, 01:33 PM
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i appreciate all the advice and input so far guys. i am at work right now, so i still didn't get the EQ installed.
i have a question though, my pioneer unit gives out 2 volts on the pre amp outs, the EQ gives out 7 volts, what do these numbers actually mean?
meaning, what difference will i see from the 2 volts to the 7 volts?
i have a question though, my pioneer unit gives out 2 volts on the pre amp outs, the EQ gives out 7 volts, what do these numbers actually mean?
meaning, what difference will i see from the 2 volts to the 7 volts?
11-02-2002, 03:11 PM
#15
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Originally posted by slick
i appreciate all the advice and input so far guys. i am at work right now, so i still didn't get the EQ installed.
i have a question though, my pioneer unit gives out 2 volts on the pre amp outs, the EQ gives out 7 volts, what do these numbers actually mean?
meaning, what difference will i see from the 2 volts to the 7 volts?
i appreciate all the advice and input so far guys. i am at work right now, so i still didn't get the EQ installed.
i have a question though, my pioneer unit gives out 2 volts on the pre amp outs, the EQ gives out 7 volts, what do these numbers actually mean?
meaning, what difference will i see from the 2 volts to the 7 volts?
11-02-2002, 05:06 PM
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Originally posted by jmax
Unless the EQ has a power supply and steps up the voltage you won't see an increase in the pre-amp voltage. In either case I wouldn't worry about it. Just set the amp gain accordingly.
Unless the EQ has a power supply and steps up the voltage you won't see an increase in the pre-amp voltage. In either case I wouldn't worry about it. Just set the amp gain accordingly.
its a clarion eqs-560 5 band. sounds like it doesn't, it was just $60 and very simple little thing, but still, how would i know. the documentation is very short and vague, so i doubt that would tell me anything, but i will check it.
11-02-2002, 05:47 PM
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Originally posted by slick
ok, this will be my extreme newbie question of the day, but how do i know if the EQ has a power supply of its own?
its a clarion eqs-560 5 band. sounds like it doesn't, it was just $60 and very simple little thing, but still, how would i know. the documentation is very short and vague, so i doubt that would tell me anything, but i will check it.
ok, this will be my extreme newbie question of the day, but how do i know if the EQ has a power supply of its own?
its a clarion eqs-560 5 band. sounds like it doesn't, it was just $60 and very simple little thing, but still, how would i know. the documentation is very short and vague, so i doubt that would tell me anything, but i will check it.
11-03-2002, 10:35 AM
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Originally posted by jmax
Unless the EQ has a power supply and steps up the voltage you won't see an increase in the pre-amp voltage. In either case I wouldn't worry about it. Just set the amp gain accordingly.
Unless the EQ has a power supply and steps up the voltage you won't see an increase in the pre-amp voltage. In either case I wouldn't worry about it. Just set the amp gain accordingly.
be careful when setting the sytem gains..clipping is very easy and not always audible..first turn all amp gains down to minimun, then put in a cd that will have the broadest musical content on it. turn the radios volume up to about 80% of full volume (80% because with a cd that is recorded this well is as loud as you should go, to get more output from a radio station u can turn it up a lil past 80% and still get no distortion) its a lil confusing, but at 80% of full volume u shouldn't hear any distortion at all with the amp gains turned down, start turning the amp gains up until u hear distortion, then turn them down just below distortion point, and u have just set ur gains. remember that it isnt volume that causes distortion, it is a clipped audio signal that is. think of it like this: ur audio signal is a SIN voltage wave that goes from negative to positive values very rapidly every second, as the volume is increased the SIN wave increases in amplitude( waves get higher), there is a threshold that limits how high the waves can get. on a piece of paper draw a wave, then draw a straight line on top of the wave and the bottom of the wave so that it isnt touching the wave. this is then an audio signal that isnt clipping. now draw the waves so that they go through t he lines you drew, they get "clipped" at the top and bottom because they get cut off by the lines(threshold). this signal is seen by the amps and speakers as a SQUARE wave rather than a SIN wave . a square wav will kill a speakers voice coil. this is why u can kill a speaker at a really low volume. in fact its easy to blow a speaker with a clipped signal at a low volumen than to blow a speaker at a high volume with an unclipped signal even if its powered beyond RMS value. another thing is to buy an amp that is rated at a higher RMS than ur speakers. this is because at the maximum RMS wattage output the amp is rated for the amp begins to strain for power increasing THD distortion, so it is a better idea to get a more powerfull amp that will comfortably handle power without distorting since u can just keep the gains down. its more expensive, but it is the ideal thing to do to get the cleanest signal. think of it as a car. a corvette and a buick can both travel at 100mph right? which one does it more efficiently with more power to spare? get what im sayin?
11-03-2002, 02:19 PM
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Originally posted by friendhasmax
be careful when setting the sytem gains..clipping is very easy and not always audible..first turn all amp gains down to minimun, then put in a cd that will have the broadest musical content on it. turn the radios volume up to about 80% of full volume (80% because with a cd that is recorded this well is as loud as you should go, to get more output from a radio station u can turn it up a lil past 80% and still get no distortion) its a lil confusing, but at 80% of full volume u shouldn't hear any distortion at all with the amp gains turned down, start turning the amp gains up until u hear distortion, then turn them down just below distortion point, and u have just set ur gains. remember that it isnt volume that causes distortion, it is a clipped audio signal that is. think of it like this: ur audio signal is a SIN voltage wave that goes from negative to positive values very rapidly every second, as the volume is increased the SIN wave increases in amplitude( waves get higher), there is a threshold that limits how high the waves can get. on a piece of paper draw a wave, then draw a straight line on top of the wave and the bottom of the wave so that it isnt touching the wave. this is then an audio signal that isnt clipping. now draw the waves so that they go through t he lines you drew, they get "clipped" at the top and bottom because they get cut off by the lines(threshold). this signal is seen by the amps and speakers as a SQUARE wave rather than a SIN wave . a square wav will kill a speakers voice coil. this is why u can kill a speaker at a really low volume. in fact its easy to blow a speaker with a clipped signal at a low volumen than to blow a speaker at a high volume with an unclipped signal even if its powered beyond RMS value. another thing is to buy an amp that is rated at a higher RMS than ur speakers. this is because at the maximum RMS wattage output the amp is rated for the amp begins to strain for power increasing THD distortion, so it is a better idea to get a more powerfull amp that will comfortably handle power without distorting since u can just keep the gains down. its more expensive, but it is the ideal thing to do to get the cleanest signal. think of it as a car. a corvette and a buick can both travel at 100mph right? which one does it more efficiently with more power to spare? get what im sayin?
be careful when setting the sytem gains..clipping is very easy and not always audible..first turn all amp gains down to minimun, then put in a cd that will have the broadest musical content on it. turn the radios volume up to about 80% of full volume (80% because with a cd that is recorded this well is as loud as you should go, to get more output from a radio station u can turn it up a lil past 80% and still get no distortion) its a lil confusing, but at 80% of full volume u shouldn't hear any distortion at all with the amp gains turned down, start turning the amp gains up until u hear distortion, then turn them down just below distortion point, and u have just set ur gains. remember that it isnt volume that causes distortion, it is a clipped audio signal that is. think of it like this: ur audio signal is a SIN voltage wave that goes from negative to positive values very rapidly every second, as the volume is increased the SIN wave increases in amplitude( waves get higher), there is a threshold that limits how high the waves can get. on a piece of paper draw a wave, then draw a straight line on top of the wave and the bottom of the wave so that it isnt touching the wave. this is then an audio signal that isnt clipping. now draw the waves so that they go through t he lines you drew, they get "clipped" at the top and bottom because they get cut off by the lines(threshold). this signal is seen by the amps and speakers as a SQUARE wave rather than a SIN wave . a square wav will kill a speakers voice coil. this is why u can kill a speaker at a really low volume. in fact its easy to blow a speaker with a clipped signal at a low volumen than to blow a speaker at a high volume with an unclipped signal even if its powered beyond RMS value. another thing is to buy an amp that is rated at a higher RMS than ur speakers. this is because at the maximum RMS wattage output the amp is rated for the amp begins to strain for power increasing THD distortion, so it is a better idea to get a more powerfull amp that will comfortably handle power without distorting since u can just keep the gains down. its more expensive, but it is the ideal thing to do to get the cleanest signal. think of it as a car. a corvette and a buick can both travel at 100mph right? which one does it more efficiently with more power to spare? get what im sayin?
even though its cold outside, gonna go and install the EQ, otherwise i will never have time to do it. i dont have any place to put it, so i'm gonna temporary install it in the glove box, then i will do some custom work on the dash and get it in there, sound ok?
11-04-2002, 12:20 AM
#21
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I feel that people too often set the gains with the volume too low. Why set the gains with the volume at 80%? That's wasting 20% of your volume range. My headunit is still clean at 100% with a test tone at full gain. So I set my gains with the volume to the max. That way I don't have to worry about the amps clipping when I am out cruising on the highway with all the windows down and sunroof open. I know that I won't hear distortion as quickly in that situation so I set the gains to accomadate for the worst possble human treatment of the volume ****. If you set the amps to clip at 80% volume you are giveing yourself or others who operate the vehicle a 1 in 5 chance of burning up your speakers. Not the kind of odds I like when dealing with several thousand dollars of audio equipment.
Find some CD's that are recorded at diffeerent levels. Some CD's will sound quieter than others. Try cranking a "quiet" CD all the way and just listen for the harshness or distortion that is not audible at lower volume. Now try doing this with a "loud" CD. It's a lot harder because of the difference in the noise floor, or the recording level. You should not have any "system" noise with either CD test. Also try listening to CD's with really large transients. Pink Floyd is great for this, but only if you know the music. They will go from a soft wisper to a scream instantly. Both aspects should be accurate.
Find some CD's that are recorded at diffeerent levels. Some CD's will sound quieter than others. Try cranking a "quiet" CD all the way and just listen for the harshness or distortion that is not audible at lower volume. Now try doing this with a "loud" CD. It's a lot harder because of the difference in the noise floor, or the recording level. You should not have any "system" noise with either CD test. Also try listening to CD's with really large transients. Pink Floyd is great for this, but only if you know the music. They will go from a soft wisper to a scream instantly. Both aspects should be accurate.
11-04-2002, 12:50 AM
#23
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In the 70's Jimi Hendrix's engineers would pull the volume ***** off the amps and renumber them so that they would look like they were turned all the way up at 7 or 8. He figured it out and kept blowing equipment. Luckilly we don't live in the 70's anymore. We can listen to Hendrix at 10 and hear it clean.
11-04-2002, 06:13 AM
#24
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Originally posted by jmax
I feel that people too often set the gains with the volume too low. Why set the gains with the volume at 80%? That's wasting 20% of your volume range. My headunit is still clean at 100% with a test tone at full gain. So I set my gains with the volume to the max. That way I don't have to worry about the amps clipping when I am out cruising on the highway with all the windows down and sunroof open. I know that I won't hear distortion as quickly in that situation so I set the gains to accomadate for the worst possble human treatment of the volume ****. If you set the amps to clip at 80% volume you are giveing yourself or others who operate the vehicle a 1 in 5 chance of burning up your speakers. Not the kind of odds I like when dealing with several thousand dollars of audio equipment.
Find some CD's that are recorded at diffeerent levels. Some CD's will sound quieter than others. Try cranking a "quiet" CD all the way and just listen for the harshness or distortion that is not audible at lower volume. Now try doing this with a "loud" CD. It's a lot harder because of the difference in the noise floor, or the recording level. You should not have any "system" noise with either CD test. Also try listening to CD's with really large transients. Pink Floyd is great for this, but only if you know the music. They will go from a soft wisper to a scream instantly. Both aspects should be accurate.
I feel that people too often set the gains with the volume too low. Why set the gains with the volume at 80%? That's wasting 20% of your volume range. My headunit is still clean at 100% with a test tone at full gain. So I set my gains with the volume to the max. That way I don't have to worry about the amps clipping when I am out cruising on the highway with all the windows down and sunroof open. I know that I won't hear distortion as quickly in that situation so I set the gains to accomadate for the worst possble human treatment of the volume ****. If you set the amps to clip at 80% volume you are giveing yourself or others who operate the vehicle a 1 in 5 chance of burning up your speakers. Not the kind of odds I like when dealing with several thousand dollars of audio equipment.
Find some CD's that are recorded at diffeerent levels. Some CD's will sound quieter than others. Try cranking a "quiet" CD all the way and just listen for the harshness or distortion that is not audible at lower volume. Now try doing this with a "loud" CD. It's a lot harder because of the difference in the noise floor, or the recording level. You should not have any "system" noise with either CD test. Also try listening to CD's with really large transients. Pink Floyd is great for this, but only if you know the music. They will go from a soft wisper to a scream instantly. Both aspects should be accurate.
sorry to burst ur bubble, but most HU's send a clipped signal at full volume, this is y u should set gains at 80% volume...my kenwood is clean at 100% so i set gains at 100% volume. only if it is undistorted at 100% should u set gains like that. and how is that wasting anything? just because u set gains at 80% means that normally for full output on a cd that was recorded well u dont need to go past 80% u are leaving urself room for more output from a cd that was recorded lower...thats all
11-04-2002, 08:19 AM
#25
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Originally posted by friendhasmax
sorry to burst ur bubble, but most HU's send a clipped signal at full volume, this is y u should set gains at 80% volume...my kenwood is clean at 100% so i set gains at 100% volume. only if it is undistorted at 100% should u set gains like that. and how is that wasting anything? just because u set gains at 80% means that normally for full output on a cd that was recorded well u dont need to go past 80% u are leaving urself room for more output from a cd that was recorded lower...thats all
sorry to burst ur bubble, but most HU's send a clipped signal at full volume, this is y u should set gains at 80% volume...my kenwood is clean at 100% so i set gains at 100% volume. only if it is undistorted at 100% should u set gains like that. and how is that wasting anything? just because u set gains at 80% means that normally for full output on a cd that was recorded well u dont need to go past 80% u are leaving urself room for more output from a cd that was recorded lower...thats all
Wasteing, let's see if I can explain this. If your headunit volume range is from 0 to 50 and you set the amp to clip at 40, that's 80%. Now you have 40 steps between no volume and max volume. If I set my gains to clip above 50 I have 50 usable steps on the volume ****. 10 more steps to choose from when listening to the stereo. Or 25% greater attenuation range.
And if my car is sick and has to go to the garage, my speakers are safe from "meachanic abuse". They can sit in the garage with my system turned all the way up with wahtever music they like all day and night. If they do that with yours all your speakers will sound like thwick, thwack, fuzzzz. Remember,worst case scenario.
11-04-2002, 08:51 AM
#26
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Originally posted by jmax
Good enough for most obviously is not good enough for me. If you set it for max volume at 80% of the volume **** that leaves a 20% margin of error. Or 20% probability of blowing your speakers with a clipped signal from the headunit going to the amp. Then that signal being clipped by the amp. If a HU that clips at 80% on the **** is good enough for you, then use that HU.
Wasteing, let's see if I can explain this. If your headunit volume range is from 0 to 50 and you set the amp to clip at 40, that's 80%. Now you have 40 steps between no volume and max volume. If I set my gains to clip above 50 I have 50 usable steps on the volume ****. 10 more steps to choose from when listening to the stereo. Or 25% greater attenuation range.
And if my car is sick and has to go to the garage, my speakers are safe from "meachanic abuse". They can sit in the garage with my system turned all the way up with wahtever music they like all day and night. If they do that with yours all your speakers will sound like thwick, thwack, fuzzzz. Remember,worst case scenario.
Good enough for most obviously is not good enough for me. If you set it for max volume at 80% of the volume **** that leaves a 20% margin of error. Or 20% probability of blowing your speakers with a clipped signal from the headunit going to the amp. Then that signal being clipped by the amp. If a HU that clips at 80% on the **** is good enough for you, then use that HU.
Wasteing, let's see if I can explain this. If your headunit volume range is from 0 to 50 and you set the amp to clip at 40, that's 80%. Now you have 40 steps between no volume and max volume. If I set my gains to clip above 50 I have 50 usable steps on the volume ****. 10 more steps to choose from when listening to the stereo. Or 25% greater attenuation range.
And if my car is sick and has to go to the garage, my speakers are safe from "meachanic abuse". They can sit in the garage with my system turned all the way up with wahtever music they like all day and night. If they do that with yours all your speakers will sound like thwick, thwack, fuzzzz. Remember,worst case scenario.
who said that at 80% it was clipping? i sure didnt. u think that what ur saying is logical, but it really isnt. but do what u want man
11-04-2002, 09:44 AM
#27
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Originally posted by friendhasmax
who said that at 80% it was clipping? i sure didnt. u think that what ur saying is logical, but it really isnt. but do what u want man
who said that at 80% it was clipping? i sure didnt. u think that what ur saying is logical, but it really isnt. but do what u want man
It's pretty tough to set gains by ear anyway. An O-scope should be used if you are planning to compete. But my ears have always worked fine for setting gains in my daily driver.
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