Hyper Ground System UPDATE GAINS!!!!!
08-04-2002, 08:48 AM
#81
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,530
I really dont think it gets hotter then 222 degrees (or 150 actually) if you're not right on the exhaust manifolds. I have a remote thermometer under the hood and on the hottest of days, with the AC on sitting idle in traffic the temp has gone to 150 degrees.
I also came across one of my old threads here http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?threadid=81524 except in this one, I only added an additional ground between the battery and the body of the car and my stereo seems to have gotten louder. I think the ground system may work. My friend with a WRX did his homemade. I'll try to snap a pic the next time I see him.
I also came across one of my old threads here http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?threadid=81524 except in this one, I only added an additional ground between the battery and the body of the car and my stereo seems to have gotten louder. I think the ground system may work. My friend with a WRX did his homemade. I'll try to snap a pic the next time I see him.
08-04-2002, 03:00 PM
#83
Originally posted by Anachronism
Anyone know where I can get a good quality battery terminal for a decent price? I think I may buy some battery cables from Wal Mart and try this.
Anyone know where I can get a good quality battery terminal for a decent price? I think I may buy some battery cables from Wal Mart and try this.
08-04-2002, 03:27 PM
#84
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Aug 2001
Posts: 2,267
Re: Glad everything is working out
Count me in for the group deal.
Originally posted by Kevin Wong
I'll be talking with the head of distributions of Sun Auto on Thursday. He mentioned a group buy discount, but I think he's hoping for a large number like 30 or so. I'll see what we can do. As for the sales pitch, these wires are perfectly universal to just about any car, they improve so much for such little money, and they are very easy to install.
I'll be talking with the head of distributions of Sun Auto on Thursday. He mentioned a group buy discount, but I think he's hoping for a large number like 30 or so. I'll see what we can do. As for the sales pitch, these wires are perfectly universal to just about any car, they improve so much for such little money, and they are very easy to install.
08-04-2002, 11:08 PM
#86
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Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,493
08-06-2002, 04:33 AM
#89
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Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 722
Originally posted by eric93SE
Dude useing better wire will increase the voltage, not the other way around. I think you are a little confused with Ohms Law.
Again your not on the ball, when you say intensity I assume you mean current (amperage). So by reducing the resistance in the wire it will allow more current to flow, so there would be less of a voltage drop due to the resistive heating in the wire. More wire equals more charge carriers.
Wow
I cannot believe that there arent any other org members that wanted to correct him.
Dude useing better wire will increase the voltage, not the other way around. I think you are a little confused with Ohms Law.
Again your not on the ball, when you say intensity I assume you mean current (amperage). So by reducing the resistance in the wire it will allow more current to flow, so there would be less of a voltage drop due to the resistive heating in the wire. More wire equals more charge carriers.
Wow
I cannot believe that there arent any other org members that wanted to correct him.
08-28-2002, 04:25 PM
#90
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 928
I originally spoke to Diaji These wires claim to have 10X less the impedence than factory on the back of the box. I think I was mistaken before. If the impedence is reduced, either voltage would decrease
Think of impedance as resistance to current flow. E = I x R or
Voltage = Current x Resistance. If Voltage remains constant and Resistance decreases (By adding 5 6 gauge wires in parallel) then current increase. Therefore all electrically operated controls will
operate quicker, ie... solenoids, valves, fuel injectors etc.. thereby making engine controls more responsive. A while back I reported how installing a new battery and thoroughly cleaning the termials improved performance and milage. This confirms to me why I saw the improvement. Just did the math, if you drive 10k miles at 25 mpg and gas cost $1.50 gallon you'll save $48 year with 2 mpg increase. This mod pays for itself and the improved hp and torque are free! This further increases my belief that cleaning all ground connections on the engine will only help. They are only paralleling the major grounds. Your thoughts.
Think of impedance as resistance to current flow. E = I x R or
Voltage = Current x Resistance. If Voltage remains constant and Resistance decreases (By adding 5 6 gauge wires in parallel) then current increase. Therefore all electrically operated controls will
operate quicker, ie... solenoids, valves, fuel injectors etc.. thereby making engine controls more responsive. A while back I reported how installing a new battery and thoroughly cleaning the termials improved performance and milage. This confirms to me why I saw the improvement. Just did the math, if you drive 10k miles at 25 mpg and gas cost $1.50 gallon you'll save $48 year with 2 mpg increase. This mod pays for itself and the improved hp and torque are free! This further increases my belief that cleaning all ground connections on the engine will only help. They are only paralleling the major grounds. Your thoughts.
08-29-2002, 04:03 AM
#91
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 722
Sure - better grounding works. The claim of lower impedance has two effects - one, which everyone can see is less DC resistance, a good thing for all the systems. The other, hidden gain is less inductance. The spark, for example, is a very high frequency pulse. Even a low resistance conductor can have a high impedance at high frequency, giving the effect of reduced peak current over a longer time. In simple terms, inductance in a conductor is pretty much an issue of surface area (called skin effect). So in an automotive system, large diameter wire or braid strapping would be the ticket. Shielding on a ground wire? Not germaine, but maybe a large diameter conductor?
Would I pay $100+ for a kit? NO WAY!!! Practically, I would use 4ga welding cable with crimped and soldered lugs, stainless internally toothed stainless star washers and anti-ox coating. So what if the insulation melts - it's another connection!
I have done this - it works. It also is what I do for a living - 4000A, 95kv, 400nanosecond pulsed power supplies - impedance is everything!
Would I pay $100+ for a kit? NO WAY!!! Practically, I would use 4ga welding cable with crimped and soldered lugs, stainless internally toothed stainless star washers and anti-ox coating. So what if the insulation melts - it's another connection!
I have done this - it works. It also is what I do for a living - 4000A, 95kv, 400nanosecond pulsed power supplies - impedance is everything!
08-29-2002, 04:43 AM
#92
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Apr 2002
Posts: 928
Originally posted by wdave
Sure - better grounding works. The claim of lower impedance has two effects - one, which everyone can see is less DC resistance, a good thing for all the systems. The other, hidden gain is less inductance. The spark, for example, is a very high frequency pulse. Even a low resistance conductor can have a high impedance at high frequency, giving the effect of reduced peak current over a longer time. In simple terms, inductance in a conductor is pretty much an issue of surface area (called skin effect). So in an automotive system, large diameter wire or braid strapping would be the ticket. Shielding on a ground wire? Not germaine, but maybe a large diameter conductor?
Would I pay $100+ for a kit? NO WAY!!! Practically, I would use 4ga welding cable with crimped and soldered lugs, stainless internally toothed stainless star washers and anti-ox coating. So what if the insulation melts - it's another connection!
I have done this - it works. It also is what I do for a living - 4000A, 95kv, 400nanosecond pulsed power supplies - impedance is everything!
Sure - better grounding works. The claim of lower impedance has two effects - one, which everyone can see is less DC resistance, a good thing for all the systems. The other, hidden gain is less inductance. The spark, for example, is a very high frequency pulse. Even a low resistance conductor can have a high impedance at high frequency, giving the effect of reduced peak current over a longer time. In simple terms, inductance in a conductor is pretty much an issue of surface area (called skin effect). So in an automotive system, large diameter wire or braid strapping would be the ticket. Shielding on a ground wire? Not germaine, but maybe a large diameter conductor?
Would I pay $100+ for a kit? NO WAY!!! Practically, I would use 4ga welding cable with crimped and soldered lugs, stainless internally toothed stainless star washers and anti-ox coating. So what if the insulation melts - it's another connection!
I have done this - it works. It also is what I do for a living - 4000A, 95kv, 400nanosecond pulsed power supplies - impedance is everything!
08-29-2002, 08:03 AM
#95
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 722
Originally posted by Danielsan
I have got about 25 ft of 2 gauge StreetWires audio power cable...
Would this be worth a shot? Or just overkill?
The bigger the gauge the better for the car right?
I have got about 25 ft of 2 gauge StreetWires audio power cable...
Would this be worth a shot? Or just overkill?
The bigger the gauge the better for the car right?
08-29-2002, 09:11 AM
#96
Originally posted by Danielsan
The bigger the gauge the better for the car right?
The bigger the gauge the better for the car right?
So you're two gauge will definately be good, but if you have a better use for it then save it. Just go buy some 4-8 gauge wire and do the grounding with that.
08-29-2002, 11:18 AM
#97
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 2,038
Can you post ALL of the 6 dyno charts? (I can host them if you need)
I see 1 and 4 got posted - were those the best runs each?
Also, did they do anything different on the runs with hyper ground - like blow a fan on the intake? (I'm not doubting you - just suspicious of them)
The premise of this thread is very interesting. I think I need to go fix that ground wire from the cat to the chassis now!
I see 1 and 4 got posted - were those the best runs each?
Also, did they do anything different on the runs with hyper ground - like blow a fan on the intake? (I'm not doubting you - just suspicious of them)
The premise of this thread is very interesting. I think I need to go fix that ground wire from the cat to the chassis now!
09-25-2002, 07:30 PM
#98
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Oct 2000
Posts: 1,493
09-26-2002, 09:43 AM
#99
Member
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 95
The fix doesn't last forever!
1st, why doesn't everyone take 12v measurements using several of the grounds available while the car is running. Take measurements at the coil, fuel pump, alternator, battery, starter, ecu, stereo....whatever. Use different grounds for each positive test source. You will see variances. Then, fix the cause of the variances.
And if there were minimal variances in voltage, put the stereo/headlights/brakelights on and do the same. It will be there.
Running additional 'ground or power wires' to various components will decrease the resistance and increase the voltage. This is extremely noticeable on corroded connections. Notice that I didn't use the word impedance. This is a fully DC system and there isn't much reactance to worry about. The only thing to worry about is voltage at all components and voltage changes because of the varying loads.
On cars with low coil & fuel pump voltages, rewiring caused power increases(consistent fuel pressure/sensor readings), eliminated misfires(stronger voltage from/to coil), improved MPG, eliminated hesitation etc. Some vehicles required regrounded sensors(map/afm) for a fix. Even the 02 sensor doesn't rely on the exhaust as a ground anymore, hence no more single wired o2 sensors.
If road salt is used during the winter or if you live near the ocean(can smell the salty breeze), you WILL benefit from cleaning all the connections or by running additional wires. Eventually, your new spiffy $120 wire upgrade WILL degrade and collect corrosion at the connection points and you will be back to the power levels before the upgrade. So, electrical maintenance is as important as fluid/filter maintenance even with the stock wiring system. Clean all the connections, use conductive/dielectric grease, and upgrade accordingly for each mod(stereo/lights/whatever).
I also don't see any benefit in running 100lbs of copper cable bridging every electrical connection. That would be obsessive compulsive.
I have experienced numerous voltage issues with various cars. Most were caused by connection oxidation or cable degradation. A simple fix was either cable replacement, connection cleaning, or running a jumper(call it what you want--all these companies are selling jumpers--love to see the patents on these).
What I want to see is a dyno comparison of a stock vehicle with before/afters runs after cleaning the stock factory harness connections. And, then compare the cleaned factory harness to the spiffy aftermarket jumper cable.
And if there were minimal variances in voltage, put the stereo/headlights/brakelights on and do the same. It will be there.
Running additional 'ground or power wires' to various components will decrease the resistance and increase the voltage. This is extremely noticeable on corroded connections. Notice that I didn't use the word impedance. This is a fully DC system and there isn't much reactance to worry about. The only thing to worry about is voltage at all components and voltage changes because of the varying loads.
On cars with low coil & fuel pump voltages, rewiring caused power increases(consistent fuel pressure/sensor readings), eliminated misfires(stronger voltage from/to coil), improved MPG, eliminated hesitation etc. Some vehicles required regrounded sensors(map/afm) for a fix. Even the 02 sensor doesn't rely on the exhaust as a ground anymore, hence no more single wired o2 sensors.
If road salt is used during the winter or if you live near the ocean(can smell the salty breeze), you WILL benefit from cleaning all the connections or by running additional wires. Eventually, your new spiffy $120 wire upgrade WILL degrade and collect corrosion at the connection points and you will be back to the power levels before the upgrade. So, electrical maintenance is as important as fluid/filter maintenance even with the stock wiring system. Clean all the connections, use conductive/dielectric grease, and upgrade accordingly for each mod(stereo/lights/whatever).
I also don't see any benefit in running 100lbs of copper cable bridging every electrical connection. That would be obsessive compulsive.
I have experienced numerous voltage issues with various cars. Most were caused by connection oxidation or cable degradation. A simple fix was either cable replacement, connection cleaning, or running a jumper(call it what you want--all these companies are selling jumpers--love to see the patents on these).
What I want to see is a dyno comparison of a stock vehicle with before/afters runs after cleaning the stock factory harness connections. And, then compare the cleaned factory harness to the spiffy aftermarket jumper cable.
09-26-2002, 10:14 AM
#100
Re: The fix doesn't last forever!
Originally posted by deadrx7conv
What I want to see is a dyno comparison of a stock vehicle with before/afters runs after cleaning the stock factory harness connections. And, then compare the cleaned factory harness to the spiffy aftermarket jumper cable.
What I want to see is a dyno comparison of a stock vehicle with before/afters runs after cleaning the stock factory harness connections. And, then compare the cleaned factory harness to the spiffy aftermarket jumper cable.
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