Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
09-17-2002, 08:47 AM
#41
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Join Date: Aug 2000
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Yea MardiGrasMax and company would put the hurt to an M3. Now the people with nitrous can do it too. Nitrous is a universal mod, so an M3 could install it and then bye bye Maxima. My friend and I were talking about putting nitrous on his C5, but his opinion changed mine. When you have nitrous, yes you have a fast car, but only when the juice is flowing. For example, S20DEN(not picking on you) has run 12s with his nitrous, but his car isnt really a "12 Second car" all the time. When he isnt spraying his car is a 14 second car. People say I have a 13 or 12 second Nitrous car, but IMO it really isnt. When an N/A or boosted engine runs 12s, it runs 12s pretty much anytime. Dont take this the wrong way, I think nitrous is one of the best bangs for the buck.
09-17-2002, 08:53 AM
#42
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Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by JMAX95
Now that's what I'm talking about.
To fully appreciate automobiles, you must note the strong points and weaknesses:
M3 goodies:
- Crazy speed
- Crazy torque
- Handles like on rails
- Sleek styling
- Sport button (oh so fine)
- Stiff chasis
- TCS,Anti-lock, etc (all the computer stuff)
- Fun to drive (this is what you buy this car for)
M3 baddies:
- Gets SUV MPG
- $55K? please
- Maintenance costs $$$
- Don't miss that "Castrol" oil sucka
- Only 2 doors (Well it's a sports car)
- mfailure.com (not a good sign considering the ratio of peeps that actually drive M3's to problems posted.)
- Engine so powerful yet seems fragile.
I'm sure everyone here can note the good things and bad things about the Maxima. But I tell you one thing: I've had my car for 8 years now (95 SE) If I had a choice to go back in time and buy a car, I would buy the same car. No doubt that I love the Maxima engine. That is why the 3.5L version is in more than 50% of cars Nissan sells including the 350Z and Infiniti V6 cars.
Now that's what I'm talking about. To fully appreciate automobiles, you must note the strong points and weaknesses:
M3 goodies:
- Crazy speed
- Crazy torque
- Handles like on rails
- Sleek styling
- Sport button (oh so fine)
- Stiff chasis
- TCS,Anti-lock, etc (all the computer stuff)
- Fun to drive (this is what you buy this car for)
M3 baddies:
- Gets SUV MPG
- $55K? please
- Maintenance costs $$$
- Don't miss that "Castrol" oil sucka
- Only 2 doors (Well it's a sports car)
- mfailure.com (not a good sign considering the ratio of peeps that actually drive M3's to problems posted.)
- Engine so powerful yet seems fragile.
I'm sure everyone here can note the good things and bad things about the Maxima. But I tell you one thing: I've had my car for 8 years now (95 SE) If I had a choice to go back in time and buy a car, I would buy the same car. No doubt that I love the Maxima engine. That is why the 3.5L version is in more than 50% of cars Nissan sells including the 350Z and Infiniti V6 cars.
have to give you props on this post JMax95!! this is a good one. But little that I knew that the M3 engine was so fragile and that sticky price!! FCK that Ill get a 350Z or a 2k2 max or an M3 anyday. I know its a Beemer but we can t be hanging at the dealers garage all the time!!!
09-17-2002, 08:57 AM
#43
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,151
Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by JMAX95
Now that's what I'm talking about.
M3 baddies:
- Gets SUV MPG
- $55K? please
- Maintenance costs $$$
- Don't miss that "Castrol" oil sucka
- Only 2 doors (Well it's a sports car)
- mfailure.com (not a good sign considering the ratio of peeps that actually drive M3's to problems posted.)
- Engine so powerful yet seems fragile.
Now that's what I'm talking about. M3 baddies:
- Gets SUV MPG
- $55K? please
- Maintenance costs $$$
- Don't miss that "Castrol" oil sucka
- Only 2 doors (Well it's a sports car)
- mfailure.com (not a good sign considering the ratio of peeps that actually drive M3's to problems posted.)
- Engine so powerful yet seems fragile.
09-17-2002, 09:36 AM
#44
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Jan 2001
Posts: 271
Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
BMW offers scheduled maintence for 3 years/36000 miles, so you pay nothing. The engine problems from what I read are mainly from a November build date in 01'. I believe that the problem shows only in those builds.
BMW offers scheduled maintence for 3 years/36000 miles, so you pay nothing. The engine problems from what I read are mainly from a November build date in 01'. I believe that the problem shows only in those builds.
09-17-2002, 10:44 AM
#45
Originally posted by Don in Texas
Watch out for the M3, its a pretty quick car, and its built very well (but again, its 2x the $$$ a Maxima is, it should be 2x's as good)
Watch out for the M3, its a pretty quick car, and its built very well (but again, its 2x the $$$ a Maxima is, it should be 2x's as good)
09-17-2002, 10:50 AM
#46
Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by Frank Fontaine
Just trying would put a tremendous strain on the car, what would be the sense? It's like thinking I'm in good shape, as strong as John LeClair, so why don't I have a shootout one-on-one with Simon Gagne? he's a pro, I'm an amateur, I'd get kicked and strain myself trying. Even if you drove as fast as an M3, while his car is hugging the road the max would be beyond its limits, and that's not a good thing.
Of all the people who bash M3's, I wonder why that is. That's like when girls hate another girl for being beautiful and getting all the guys. Makes no sense.
Just trying would put a tremendous strain on the car, what would be the sense? It's like thinking I'm in good shape, as strong as John LeClair, so why don't I have a shootout one-on-one with Simon Gagne? he's a pro, I'm an amateur, I'd get kicked and strain myself trying. Even if you drove as fast as an M3, while his car is hugging the road the max would be beyond its limits, and that's not a good thing.
Of all the people who bash M3's, I wonder why that is. That's like when girls hate another girl for being beautiful and getting all the guys. Makes no sense.
Thank you for saying this!
09-17-2002, 10:58 AM
#47
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Whats so fast about that?
Whats so fast about that?
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Its a nice car, but unless you have a head/cams package its not that fast.
Its a nice car, but unless you have a head/cams package its not that fast.
So Mid 4s, low 13s isn't fast?
For a car like this, a mere intake/exhaust can make it noticeably faster.
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Now on the other hand a Z06 is very fast.
Now on the other hand a Z06 is very fast.
09-17-2002, 12:27 PM
#48
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,151
Originally posted by CoolMax
What are you comparing it to? It's faster than our standard, the Maxima, right?
The Maxima is a nice car, but unless you have all the bolt-ons, SC/turbo/NOS it's not that fast.
So Mid 4s, low 13s isn't fast?
For a car like this, a mere intake/exhaust can make it noticeably faster.
Only shot at see5 because he doesn't own one.
What are you comparing it to? It's faster than our standard, the Maxima, right?
The Maxima is a nice car, but unless you have all the bolt-ons, SC/turbo/NOS it's not that fast.
So Mid 4s, low 13s isn't fast?
For a car like this, a mere intake/exhaust can make it noticeably faster.
Only shot at see5 because he doesn't own one.
The standard LS1 isnt anything that fast. My friend has a 01' 6 speed, which has the LS6 Block and intake along with a Halltech Intake and Borla Stingers. Its a quick car, but its nothing compared to a Z06. Unless you have head and cams on a LS1, it cant touch a Z06. Thats assuming no S/C, Nitrous, or turbos are used.
I was spoiled last week....Drove the C5 listed above, 02' Z06, and a 69' Mustang 428 Cobra jet which is heavily modded. Thats why a say a stock C5 isnt that quick
09-17-2002, 12:53 PM
#49
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Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,084
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Yea MardiGrasMax and company would put the hurt to an M3. Now the people with nitrous can do it too. Nitrous is a universal mod, so an M3 could install it and then bye bye Maxima. My friend and I were talking about putting nitrous on his C5, but his opinion changed mine. When you have nitrous, yes you have a fast car, but only when the juice is flowing. For example, S20DEN(not picking on you) has run 12s with his nitrous, but his car isnt really a "12 Second car" all the time. When he isnt spraying his car is a 14 second car. People say I have a 13 or 12 second Nitrous car, but IMO it really isnt. When an N/A or boosted engine runs 12s, it runs 12s pretty much anytime. Dont take this the wrong way, I think nitrous is one of the best bangs for the buck.
Yea MardiGrasMax and company would put the hurt to an M3. Now the people with nitrous can do it too. Nitrous is a universal mod, so an M3 could install it and then bye bye Maxima. My friend and I were talking about putting nitrous on his C5, but his opinion changed mine. When you have nitrous, yes you have a fast car, but only when the juice is flowing. For example, S20DEN(not picking on you) has run 12s with his nitrous, but his car isnt really a "12 Second car" all the time. When he isnt spraying his car is a 14 second car. People say I have a 13 or 12 second Nitrous car, but IMO it really isnt. When an N/A or boosted engine runs 12s, it runs 12s pretty much anytime. Dont take this the wrong way, I think nitrous is one of the best bangs for the buck.
I'm not bashing anything here. Just pointing out that every modification has it's shortcomings. Some may offer more power, but you have to get it refilled often. Some offer instant access to power, but you place more strain on the engine all the time. Some may be more pricier than others. We can always find a down side to everything if we look hard enough. I personally opted for nitrous for the bang for the buck category. There is certainly people on this board that have a whole lot more HP than me. Not a problem, that was not my initial intent anyway. I just wanted a sleeper car that I could drive normally every single day.
09-17-2002, 03:08 PM
#50
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Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 631
I can beat a new M3 with no problem, but I don't have a Maxima 
09-17-2002, 03:54 PM
#51
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Yea MardiGrasMax and company would put the hurt to an M3. Now the people with nitrous can do it too. Nitrous is a universal mod, so an M3 could install it and then bye bye Maxima. My friend and I were talking about putting nitrous on his C5, but his opinion changed mine. When you have nitrous, yes you have a fast car, but only when the juice is flowing. For example, S20DEN(not picking on you) has run 12s with his nitrous, but his car isnt really a "12 Second car" all the time. When he isnt spraying his car is a 14 second car. People say I have a 13 or 12 second Nitrous car, but IMO it really isnt. When an N/A or boosted engine runs 12s, it runs 12s pretty much anytime. Dont take this the wrong way, I think nitrous is one of the best bangs for the buck.
Yea MardiGrasMax and company would put the hurt to an M3. Now the people with nitrous can do it too. Nitrous is a universal mod, so an M3 could install it and then bye bye Maxima. My friend and I were talking about putting nitrous on his C5, but his opinion changed mine. When you have nitrous, yes you have a fast car, but only when the juice is flowing. For example, S20DEN(not picking on you) has run 12s with his nitrous, but his car isnt really a "12 Second car" all the time. When he isnt spraying his car is a 14 second car. People say I have a 13 or 12 second Nitrous car, but IMO it really isnt. When an N/A or boosted engine runs 12s, it runs 12s pretty much anytime. Dont take this the wrong way, I think nitrous is one of the best bangs for the buck.
09-17-2002, 03:57 PM
#52
yes but the likely hood of your SC belt threading or your Turbo Bearings blowing during a race is far slimmer than running out of Juice
Originally posted by JAIMECBR900
If a belt shreds on a s/c car, you don't have a 12 sec either. If a bearing goes out on a turbo, you don't have a 12 sec either. If you have a plug foul out on any of them you haven't got a 12 sec car either. I understand you're anology, but in the context of racing, nitrous is just like any other add-on performance part. While in good working condition, it is a performance part. If it is malfunctioning or in the case of nitrous bottle empty, you have a dead bolt-on. As soon as I get my bottle refilled, I have the performance back.
I'm not bashing anything here. Just pointing out that every modification has it's shortcomings. Some may offer more power, but you have to get it refilled often. Some offer instant access to power, but you place more strain on the engine all the time. Some may be more pricier than others. We can always find a down side to everything if we look hard enough. I personally opted for nitrous for the bang for the buck category. There is certainly people on this board that have a whole lot more HP than me. Not a problem, that was not my initial intent anyway. I just wanted a sleeper car that I could drive normally every single day.
If a belt shreds on a s/c car, you don't have a 12 sec either. If a bearing goes out on a turbo, you don't have a 12 sec either. If you have a plug foul out on any of them you haven't got a 12 sec car either. I understand you're anology, but in the context of racing, nitrous is just like any other add-on performance part. While in good working condition, it is a performance part. If it is malfunctioning or in the case of nitrous bottle empty, you have a dead bolt-on. As soon as I get my bottle refilled, I have the performance back.
I'm not bashing anything here. Just pointing out that every modification has it's shortcomings. Some may offer more power, but you have to get it refilled often. Some offer instant access to power, but you place more strain on the engine all the time. Some may be more pricier than others. We can always find a down side to everything if we look hard enough. I personally opted for nitrous for the bang for the buck category. There is certainly people on this board that have a whole lot more HP than me. Not a problem, that was not my initial intent anyway. I just wanted a sleeper car that I could drive normally every single day.
09-17-2002, 04:17 PM
#53
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,151
Originally posted by SprintMax
yes but the likely hood of your SC belt threading or your Turbo Bearings blowing during a race is far slimmer than running out of Juice
yes but the likely hood of your SC belt threading or your Turbo Bearings blowing during a race is far slimmer than running out of Juice
09-17-2002, 04:18 PM
#54
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
That is true. S/C and Turbos are IMO more reliable and always there when you need them. Nitrous is a great mod, but its not there all the time. Its only on when you turn your bottle on and arm the system. When you are off the juice or like you said run out of juice your car is back to normal. You should know best, you have had both of them
That is true. S/C and Turbos are IMO more reliable and always there when you need them. Nitrous is a great mod, but its not there all the time. Its only on when you turn your bottle on and arm the system. When you are off the juice or like you said run out of juice your car is back to normal. You should know best, you have had both of them
i got sick of trying to race people and go.. damn..i am out of juice.. let me go spend another $37 so i can race for 10 seconds again
09-17-2002, 04:23 PM
#55
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,151
Originally posted by SprintMax
why you think i did that i got sick of trying to race people and go.. damn..i am out of juice.. let me go spend another $37 so i can race for 10 seconds again
why you think i did that
i got sick of trying to race people and go.. damn..i am out of juice.. let me go spend another $37 so i can race for 10 seconds again
09-17-2002, 04:38 PM
#56
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Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,883
Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by CoolMax
Sour grapes.
Thank you for saying this!
Sour grapes.
Thank you for saying this!
I just got some stuff in the mail for the new 745i/Li--I'm not sure what it is. I got a full brochure weeks ago. It has a card to return to BMW and wants to know why I would be interested in a luxury/performance sedan (it doesn't say BMW 745 specifically):
performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
When you get down to it, doesn't a BMW beat a Maxima hands-down in each of the 5 choices? Why should a M3 owner feel that any of those 5 elements are in jeopardy just because some crazy Max is driving beyond its limits??
09-17-2002, 04:42 PM
#57
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Posts: 2,151
Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by Frank Fontaine
Yeah, I mean I'm not saying a person has to like the owner, I'm just saying if a person likes cars, and we all do, why be negative about a masterpiece of a sports car?
I just got some stuff in the mail for the new 745i/Li--I'm not sure what it is. I got a full brochure weeks ago. It has a card to return to BMW and wants to know why I would be interested in a luxury/performance sedan (it doesn't say BMW 745 specifically):
performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
When you get down to it, doesn't a BMW beat a Maxima hands-down in each of the 5 choices? Why should a M3 owner feel that any of those 5 elements are in jeopardy just because some crazy Max is driving beyond its limits??
Yeah, I mean I'm not saying a person has to like the owner, I'm just saying if a person likes cars, and we all do, why be negative about a masterpiece of a sports car?
I just got some stuff in the mail for the new 745i/Li--I'm not sure what it is. I got a full brochure weeks ago. It has a card to return to BMW and wants to know why I would be interested in a luxury/performance sedan (it doesn't say BMW 745 specifically):
performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
When you get down to it, doesn't a BMW beat a Maxima hands-down in each of the 5 choices? Why should a M3 owner feel that any of those 5 elements are in jeopardy just because some crazy Max is driving beyond its limits??
BMW is going down the drain. They started with the design of the 745i and will continue with the new 5 series. Chris Bangle is ruining some pretty elegant designs and implementing useless technology(I-drive for example) IMO in the next few years Audi is going to be the name to beat.
09-17-2002, 04:46 PM
#58
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Wha? Where I live, BMWs are like flys man. They are everywhere. I don't think they are hurting. I agree the new 7 series design is just plain odd. If they do trickle down that design to the 5-3 series, it will probably ruin the looks. But we will see. Audi might do okay. I see lots of them also. But their owner VW is taking some $ chances by trying to upscale with their W8 Passat.
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
BMW is going down the drain. They started with the design of the 745i and will continue with the new 5 series. Chris Bangle is ruining some pretty elegant designs and implementing useless technology(I-drive for example) IMO in the next few years Audi is going to be the name to beat.
BMW is going down the drain. They started with the design of the 745i and will continue with the new 5 series. Chris Bangle is ruining some pretty elegant designs and implementing useless technology(I-drive for example) IMO in the next few years Audi is going to be the name to beat.
09-17-2002, 04:49 PM
#59
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Posts: 3,883
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
BMW is going down the drain. They started with the design of the 745i and will continue with the new 5 series. Chris Bangle is ruining some pretty elegant designs and implementing useless technology(I-drive for example) IMO in the next few years Audi is going to be the name to beat.
BMW is going down the drain. They started with the design of the 745i and will continue with the new 5 series. Chris Bangle is ruining some pretty elegant designs and implementing useless technology(I-drive for example) IMO in the next few years Audi is going to be the name to beat.
I probably would not even consider such a car until I enter my 60's, but I still like the way it looks. I think as far as history goes, BMW has always been avant garde with its styling. Maybe Honda Motors will pull a fast one and reverse that trend. They have to do something with all the $ they're getting over list price across several models.
09-17-2002, 04:50 PM
#60
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by Frank Fontaine
Yeah, I mean I'm not saying a person has to like the owner, I'm just saying if a person likes cars, and we all do, why be negative about a masterpiece of a sports car?
I just got some stuff in the mail for the new 745i/Li--I'm not sure what it is. I got a full brochure weeks ago. It has a card to return to BMW and wants to know why I would be interested in a luxury/performance sedan (it doesn't say BMW 745 specifically):
performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
When you get down to it, doesn't a BMW beat a Maxima hands-down in each of the 5 choices? Why should a M3 owner feel that any of those 5 elements are in jeopardy just because some crazy Max is driving beyond its limits??
Yeah, I mean I'm not saying a person has to like the owner, I'm just saying if a person likes cars, and we all do, why be negative about a masterpiece of a sports car?
I just got some stuff in the mail for the new 745i/Li--I'm not sure what it is. I got a full brochure weeks ago. It has a card to return to BMW and wants to know why I would be interested in a luxury/performance sedan (it doesn't say BMW 745 specifically):
performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
When you get down to it, doesn't a BMW beat a Maxima hands-down in each of the 5 choices? Why should a M3 owner feel that any of those 5 elements are in jeopardy just because some crazy Max is driving beyond its limits??
09-17-2002, 04:50 PM
#61
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,151
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by Jeff92se
Wha? Where I live, BMWs are like flys man. They are everywhere. I don't think they are hurting. I agree the new 7 series design is just plain odd. If they do trickle down that design to the 5-3 series, it will probably ruin the looks. But we will see. Audi might do okay. I see lots of them also. But their owner VW is taking some $ chances by trying to upscale with their W8 Passat.
Wha? Where I live, BMWs are like flys man. They are everywhere. I don't think they are hurting. I agree the new 7 series design is just plain odd. If they do trickle down that design to the 5-3 series, it will probably ruin the looks. But we will see. Audi might do okay. I see lots of them also. But their owner VW is taking some $ chances by trying to upscale with their W8 Passat.
09-17-2002, 04:53 PM
#62
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Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by Frank Fontaine
You may be right, but I hope not. I've come across the same opinion in the Roundel. But my friend just did the thing at Shea Stadium where they put the 745i against a Benz and Lexus, and wouldn't you know the BMW smoked 'em 6 ways to sundown. I think the Benz was only an 8 cyl E Class though, non AMG.
You may be right, but I hope not. I've come across the same opinion in the Roundel. But my friend just did the thing at Shea Stadium where they put the 745i against a Benz and Lexus, and wouldn't you know the BMW smoked 'em 6 ways to sundown. I think the Benz was only an 8 cyl E Class though, non AMG.
09-17-2002, 08:32 PM
#63
Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by Frank Fontaine
Yeah, I mean I'm not saying a person has to like the owner, I'm just saying if a person likes cars, and we all do, why be negative about a masterpiece of a sports car?
Yeah, I mean I'm not saying a person has to like the owner, I'm just saying if a person likes cars, and we all do, why be negative about a masterpiece of a sports car?
Sometimes I miss the old BBS.
Originally posted by Frank Fontaine
I just got some stuff in the mail for the new 745i/Li--I'm not sure what it is. I got a full brochure weeks ago. It has a card to return to BMW and wants to know why I would be interested in a luxury/performance sedan (it doesn't say BMW 745 specifically):
I just got some stuff in the mail for the new 745i/Li--I'm not sure what it is. I got a full brochure weeks ago. It has a card to return to BMW and wants to know why I would be interested in a luxury/performance sedan (it doesn't say BMW 745 specifically):
Originally posted by Frank Fontaine
performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
When you get down to it, doesn't a BMW beat a Maxima hands-down in each of the 5 choices? Why should a M3 owner feel that any of those 5 elements are in jeopardy just because some crazy Max is driving beyond its limits??
performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
When you get down to it, doesn't a BMW beat a Maxima hands-down in each of the 5 choices? Why should a M3 owner feel that any of those 5 elements are in jeopardy just because some crazy Max is driving beyond its limits??
The Maxima plays in a different arena, if you dare compare it to the M3, in which it "wins": value, practicality, reliability, int. room...feel free to add.
Well, I've drifted way OT and am bound to infuriate the Maxima community.
09-17-2002, 08:36 PM
#64
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Yes a Vette is much faster than a Maxima.
The standard LS1 isnt anything that fast.
I was spoiled last week....Drove the C5 listed above, 02' Z06, and a 69' Mustang 428 Cobra jet which is heavily modded. Thats why a say a stock C5 isnt that quick
Yes a Vette is much faster than a Maxima.
The standard LS1 isnt anything that fast.
I was spoiled last week....Drove the C5 listed above, 02' Z06, and a 69' Mustang 428 Cobra jet which is heavily modded. Thats why a say a stock C5 isnt that quick
But it ain't slow either.
09-17-2002, 08:48 PM
#65
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
BMW is going down the drain. They started with the design of the 745i and will continue with the new 5 series. Chris Bangle is ruining some pretty elegant designs and implementing useless technology(I-drive for example) IMO in the next few years Audi is going to be the name to beat.
BMW is going down the drain. They started with the design of the 745i and will continue with the new 5 series. Chris Bangle is ruining some pretty elegant designs and implementing useless technology(I-drive for example) IMO in the next few years Audi is going to be the name to beat.
Originally posted by Jeff92se
Wha? Where I live, BMWs are like flys man. They are everywhere. I don't think they are hurting. I agree the new 7 series design is just plain odd. If they do trickle down that design to the 5-3 series, it will probably ruin the looks. But we will see. Audi might do okay. I see lots of them also. But their owner VW is taking some $ chances by trying to upscale with their W8 Passat.
Wha? Where I live, BMWs are like flys man. They are everywhere. I don't think they are hurting. I agree the new 7 series design is just plain odd. If they do trickle down that design to the 5-3 series, it will probably ruin the looks. But we will see. Audi might do okay. I see lots of them also. But their owner VW is taking some $ chances by trying to upscale with their W8 Passat.
Think of the 5 characteristics Frank listed: performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
Performance: going up.
Styling, which is subjective: going down. I rmember something that I read in a mag regarding the looks of the 7-series: "Please don't let it have babies!"
Prestige: uh, I guess it remains the same? If anything I think a category like this is influenced by the company's success in the racing circuits, and I'd guess that BMW is doing just fine.
Technology: I-drive, as painful as it is, is a breakthrough - going up.
Luxury: going up with luxury, I'd imagine.
I'm a bigger Audi fan, than I am for BMW. Check out my sig, the link is for my family's mechanic for the last 15yrs: Mike Galati, who tears up GT(?) in an S4.
But I think Audi's image is diluted because of its association with VW. But I wonder what $$$ cars like the Phaeton, Touerag (sp?), W8 Passat will do for that.
09-17-2002, 09:01 PM
#66
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,151
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by CoolMax
Going down the drain maybe an overstatement.
Think of the 5 characteristics Frank listed: performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
Performance: going up.
Styling, which is subjective: going down.
Prestige: uh, I guess it remains the same? If anything I think a category like this is influenced by the company's success in the racing circuits, and I'd guess that BMW is doing just fine.
Technology: I-drive, as painful as it is, is a breakthrough - going up.
Luxury: going up with luxury, I'd imagine.
I'm a bigger Audi fan, than I am for BMW. Check out my sig, the link is for my family's mechanic for the last 15yrs: Mike Galati, who tears up GT(?) in an S4.
But I think Audi's image is diluted because of its association with VW. But I wonder what $$$ cars like the Phaeton, Touerag (sp?), W12 Passat will do for that.
Going down the drain maybe an overstatement.
Think of the 5 characteristics Frank listed: performance, styling, prestige, technology, luxury.
Performance: going up.
Styling, which is subjective: going down.
Prestige: uh, I guess it remains the same? If anything I think a category like this is influenced by the company's success in the racing circuits, and I'd guess that BMW is doing just fine.
Technology: I-drive, as painful as it is, is a breakthrough - going up.
Luxury: going up with luxury, I'd imagine.
I'm a bigger Audi fan, than I am for BMW. Check out my sig, the link is for my family's mechanic for the last 15yrs: Mike Galati, who tears up GT(?) in an S4.
But I think Audi's image is diluted because of its association with VW. But I wonder what $$$ cars like the Phaeton, Touerag (sp?), W12 Passat will do for that.
Prestige: All about equal. Audi is doing real well in racing too
Styling: BMW is putting out some pretty ugly cars and more to come.
Technology: I-drive isnt a technological breakthrough. GM had a system in place like this in the early 90s and it was a flop just like I-drive. The person who invented it and the engineers who implemented it should be shot.
Luxury: The interior of the 745i isnt anything special. Audi has the nicest interiors in the segment.
09-17-2002, 09:02 PM
#67
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Well from the pictures I have seen of the new 5 series, which is due out next year its going to look very much like the 7 series. It will also have I-drive. BMW tends to trickle down styling and equipment thru the model ranges. BMW does sell a lot of cars, but I believe that the new 745 isnt selling well. Audi is coming out with the new A8 which is supposed to be a great handling car and it looks awesome. They are also bringing out the RS6, which has 450 hp to take on the M5 and E55.
Well from the pictures I have seen of the new 5 series, which is due out next year its going to look very much like the 7 series. It will also have I-drive. BMW tends to trickle down styling and equipment thru the model ranges. BMW does sell a lot of cars, but I believe that the new 745 isnt selling well. Audi is coming out with the new A8 which is supposed to be a great handling car and it looks awesome. They are also bringing out the RS6, which has 450 hp to take on the M5 and E55.
I'm not a fan of the new A8. The old model had some classy lines, IMHO, but its time has come. It has the big butt similarity (to the A6, of which I'm not fan of, lookswise.) that Audi has been praised and/or criticized for.
The RS6 is nutz! But will it keep Audi on par with the rurmored V10 M5 and inevitable SC'd E55?
09-17-2002, 09:20 PM
#68
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Performance: For BMW has always been top notch, but the competition is getting pretty heated. AMG is catching up to BMW M and making really fast cars. Audi also is coming out with some fast cars thru S and Quattro. The RS6 is a good example
Performance: For BMW has always been top notch, but the competition is getting pretty heated. AMG is catching up to BMW M and making really fast cars. Audi also is coming out with some fast cars thru S and Quattro. The RS6 is a good example
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Prestige: All about equal. Audi is doing real well in racing too.
Prestige: All about equal. Audi is doing real well in racing too.
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Styling: BMW is putting out some pretty ugly cars and more to come.
Styling: BMW is putting out some pretty ugly cars and more to come.
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Technology: I-drive isnt a technological breakthrough. GM had a system in place like this in the early 90s and it was a flop just like I-drive. The person who invented it and the engineers who implemented it should be shot.
Technology: I-drive isnt a technological breakthrough. GM had a system in place like this in the early 90s and it was a flop just like I-drive. The person who invented it and the engineers who implemented it should be shot.
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
Luxury: The interior of the 745i isnt anything special. Audi has the nicest interiors in the segment.
Luxury: The interior of the 745i isnt anything special. Audi has the nicest interiors in the segment.
I'm not a fan BMW ergnomics, but was impressed with the 745's interior and luxury. Of course I was kept my eyes off the center of the dash. Audi has a classic German interior - too many small buttons - but I love it. It new A4 has the best dash layout, IMHO. I really don't know how one judges luxury: comfort, ergonomics, quality of material (Nappa, Alcantara, woods), etc.
09-17-2002, 10:48 PM
#69
Originally posted by MAX2000JP
I was in the BriGuyMax's car a few times when his PSI was too low. We held off a LT1 6 speed long enough, but we bit off more than we could chew with a WS6. The initial kick of nitrous is awesome I must say.
I was in the BriGuyMax's car a few times when his PSI was too low. We held off a LT1 6 speed long enough, but we bit off more than we could chew with a WS6. The initial kick of nitrous is awesome I must say.
I never ran a WS6....with you in the car or without....and I defnintely didn't lose to one if I didn't run one.
09-18-2002, 03:32 AM
#71
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 3,883
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Can anyone here hang with a 2K2 M3?
Originally posted by CoolMax
Yes, to all 5. However, some people believe that paying for prestige and image is stupidly vain. But how vain is it to say how much more superior the your Max is to the Accord and Camry?
Yes, to all 5. However, some people believe that paying for prestige and image is stupidly vain. But how vain is it to say how much more superior the your Max is to the Accord and Camry?
It's really so simple, it's harder to get a 400k house than a 200k house, but when you go to sell it, you haven't lost anything. You just had to have more front money to get the former. Is it vain to choose the more expensive home? The shocking truth is it may cost less in depreciation to drive a BMW 3-Series than a Nissan Maxima because of how steep the loss is on the latter. Suddenly prestige isn't so expensive after-all. But like my other example, you have to have more front money to get the BMW. And when you don't, sometimes it's sour grapes! It's all about the delta (change), not the starting and ending points.
09-18-2002, 06:27 AM
#72
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,151
Originally posted by BriGuyMax
ummm...no.
I never ran a WS6....with you in the car or without....and I defnintely didn't lose to one if I didn't run one.
ummm...no.
I never ran a WS6....with you in the car or without....and I defnintely didn't lose to one if I didn't run one.
09-18-2002, 08:23 AM
#73
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,084
Originally posted by SprintMax
yes but the likely hood of your SC belt threading or your Turbo Bearings blowing during a race is far slimmer than running out of Juice
yes but the likely hood of your SC belt threading or your Turbo Bearings blowing during a race is far slimmer than running out of Juice
So I guess the moto is...keep the bottle full and you'll be happy. Keep up with maintainance on the s/c or turbo and you'll be happy too. Everybody's a winner.
09-18-2002, 09:19 AM
#74
Originally posted by JAIMECBR900
Maybe, but when it does....you're just as n/a as me w/o the juice. If you burn a bearing or tear up a s/c, it is substantially more expensive than a $30 tank fill up. You also have it all the time, which is a double edged sword since it puts more stress on the engine and tranny on an every day ride. When you first install either of those you are at relatively low power levels and most if not all opt to step it up on the boost. Don't get me wrong, I personally like boosted cars, I also think that most boosted cars will eventually need to step up to stronger internals to keep up with the demands of the driver. Actually all forced inductions cars, nitrous included, will eventually need some kind of strengthening at some point when the power levels rise.
So I guess the moto is...keep the bottle full and you'll be happy. Keep up with maintainance on the s/c or turbo and you'll be happy too. Everybody's a winner.
Maybe, but when it does....you're just as n/a as me w/o the juice. If you burn a bearing or tear up a s/c, it is substantially more expensive than a $30 tank fill up. You also have it all the time, which is a double edged sword since it puts more stress on the engine and tranny on an every day ride. When you first install either of those you are at relatively low power levels and most if not all opt to step it up on the boost. Don't get me wrong, I personally like boosted cars, I also think that most boosted cars will eventually need to step up to stronger internals to keep up with the demands of the driver. Actually all forced inductions cars, nitrous included, will eventually need some kind of strengthening at some point when the power levels rise.
So I guess the moto is...keep the bottle full and you'll be happy. Keep up with maintainance on the s/c or turbo and you'll be happy too. Everybody's a winner.
I guess you don't race as often as Matt(MardigrasMax), Thomas(sx7r), BriGuyMax(Brian), Rob(Tilleys99se),Adam(MY 4DSC), Matt(WA Matt) and My Self do.. because i always start off with a full bottle and by the time i get home i have nothing.. for a 10 second race.. and thats basically why we ALL coverted to boost.. you can add Synki to that list too even though his boost is not with a maxima.. and the amount of money i would spend on maintaining a turbo or SC compared to the amount of fill up's of Nitrous i do with the amount of times i race someone.. or give joy rides wouldn't even compare.. Nitrous is initially cheap.. but that **** adds up.. and it adds up quick..
its like going to a maxima meet with 2 full bottles ($70) and give a couple joy rides for people to feel the nitrous.. that $70 right there.. were as thats $0 on Turbo/SC .. i don't know if you will ever get sick of refilling your bottle.. but i did.. and obviously others did too..
you can try to feed me that crap about you are as NA as I am.. no. .if a turbo or SC brakes i am N/A = Not Applicable.. the car doesn't work.. and as i said before.. the amount of cases with boost Failure compared to people running out of Nitrous doesnt' even compare.. people run out of nitrous every day during races.. i am not knocking Nitrous .. obviously thats why is still have the dual setup.. but obviously its not going to be the strenght of my game because i am not going to keep refillign the bottle over and over..
Nitrous will blow a head gasket quicker than an SC or turbo will.. dont' fool yourself, and it will wear the engine much quicker than SC or turbo.. Rob, Brian and myself have had engine problems with Nitrous.. problems i never heard of with the SC or Turbo.. and thats why i never wasted my money getting a DP setup.. why? why use all that money for somethign you use temporarily..
09-18-2002, 10:33 AM
#75
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,084
Originally posted by SprintMax
I guess you don't race as often as Matt(MardigrasMax), Thomas(sx7r), BriGuyMax(Brian), Rob(Tilleys99se),Adam(MY 4DSC), Matt(WA Matt) and My Self do.. because i always start off with a full bottle and by the time i get home i have nothing.. for a 10 second race.. and thats basically why we ALL coverted to boost.. you can add Synki to that list too even though his boost is not with a maxima.. and the amount of money i would spend on maintaining a turbo or SC compared to the amount of fill up's of Nitrous i do with the amount of times i race someone.. or give joy rides wouldn't even compare.. Nitrous is initially cheap.. but that **** adds up.. and it adds up quick..
its like going to a maxima meet with 2 full bottles ($70) and give a couple joy rides for people to feel the nitrous.. that $70 right there.. were as thats $0 on Turbo/SC .. i don't know if you will ever get sick of refilling your bottle.. but i did.. and obviously others did too..
you can try to feed me that crap about you are as NA as I am.. no. .if a turbo or SC brakes i am N/A = Not Applicable.. the car doesn't work.. and as i said before.. the amount of cases with boost Failure compared to people running out of Nitrous doesnt' even compare.. people run out of nitrous every day during races.. i am not knocking Nitrous .. obviously thats why is still have the dual setup.. but obviously its not going to be the strenght of my game because i am not going to keep refillign the bottle over and over..
Nitrous will blow a head gasket quicker than an SC or turbo will.. dont' fool yourself, and it will wear the engine much quicker than SC or turbo.. Rob, Brian and myself have had engine problems with Nitrous.. problems i never heard of with the SC or Turbo.. and thats why i never wasted my money getting a DP setup.. why? why use all that money for somethign you use temporarily..
I guess you don't race as often as Matt(MardigrasMax), Thomas(sx7r), BriGuyMax(Brian), Rob(Tilleys99se),Adam(MY 4DSC), Matt(WA Matt) and My Self do.. because i always start off with a full bottle and by the time i get home i have nothing.. for a 10 second race.. and thats basically why we ALL coverted to boost.. you can add Synki to that list too even though his boost is not with a maxima.. and the amount of money i would spend on maintaining a turbo or SC compared to the amount of fill up's of Nitrous i do with the amount of times i race someone.. or give joy rides wouldn't even compare.. Nitrous is initially cheap.. but that **** adds up.. and it adds up quick..
its like going to a maxima meet with 2 full bottles ($70) and give a couple joy rides for people to feel the nitrous.. that $70 right there.. were as thats $0 on Turbo/SC .. i don't know if you will ever get sick of refilling your bottle.. but i did.. and obviously others did too..
you can try to feed me that crap about you are as NA as I am.. no. .if a turbo or SC brakes i am N/A = Not Applicable.. the car doesn't work.. and as i said before.. the amount of cases with boost Failure compared to people running out of Nitrous doesnt' even compare.. people run out of nitrous every day during races.. i am not knocking Nitrous .. obviously thats why is still have the dual setup.. but obviously its not going to be the strenght of my game because i am not going to keep refillign the bottle over and over..
Nitrous will blow a head gasket quicker than an SC or turbo will.. dont' fool yourself, and it will wear the engine much quicker than SC or turbo.. Rob, Brian and myself have had engine problems with Nitrous.. problems i never heard of with the SC or Turbo.. and thats why i never wasted my money getting a DP setup.. why? why use all that money for somethign you use temporarily..
This whole thread started asking about keeping up with some car. Someone said I could. I thanked them for that. Why are you trying to instigate an argument? You have a fast car from what I hear, and I never tried to say otherwise. Just chill out and recognize that not all opinions are meant to be taken as derrogatory. We could argue all day about s/c vs. nitrous, but that's not the subject of this thread. If you want to do that, start a thread and we can discuss the differences there.
09-18-2002, 11:19 AM
#76
Originally posted by JAIMECBR900
I wasn't trying to start a ****ing contest on this, but I guess you do. Anyway, I race as often as possible. I never said that at the end of race the bottle was still useful, but since I only race at the track and not on the street...I don't care. I come home and go down the street and get it filled, and I'm ready for the next time. Nitrous, as you know, can be your friend or foe. The only thing separating the two is tuning, period. You didn't want to invest the money on DP, but went out and paid 3 times as much for a s/c. You say tomato, and I say tomatoe...at $30 a bottle (if you're completely empty) it would take 100+ bottles to equal your INITIAL investment. That's not taking into consideration if you added the usual add-ons and labor. So you see, as I said in the beginning, the best bang for the buck is Nitrous, period. I never said it was better than boost, I just stated the obvious because someone said that nitrous was not worth it.
I wasn't trying to start a ****ing contest on this, but I guess you do. Anyway, I race as often as possible. I never said that at the end of race the bottle was still useful, but since I only race at the track and not on the street...I don't care. I come home and go down the street and get it filled, and I'm ready for the next time. Nitrous, as you know, can be your friend or foe. The only thing separating the two is tuning, period. You didn't want to invest the money on DP, but went out and paid 3 times as much for a s/c. You say tomato, and I say tomatoe...at $30 a bottle (if you're completely empty) it would take 100+ bottles to equal your INITIAL investment. That's not taking into consideration if you added the usual add-ons and labor. So you see, as I said in the beginning, the best bang for the buck is Nitrous, period. I never said it was better than boost, I just stated the obvious because someone said that nitrous was not worth it.
Originally posted by JAIMECBR900
This whole thread started asking about keeping up with some car. Someone said I could. I thanked them for that. Why are you trying to instigate an argument? You have a fast car from what I hear, and I never tried to say otherwise. Just chill out and recognize that not all opinions are meant to be taken as derrogatory. We could argue all day about s/c vs. nitrous, but that's not the subject of this thread. If you want to do that, start a thread and we can discuss the differences there.
This whole thread started asking about keeping up with some car. Someone said I could. I thanked them for that. Why are you trying to instigate an argument? You have a fast car from what I hear, and I never tried to say otherwise. Just chill out and recognize that not all opinions are meant to be taken as derrogatory. We could argue all day about s/c vs. nitrous, but that's not the subject of this thread. If you want to do that, start a thread and we can discuss the differences there.
09-18-2002, 11:55 AM
#77
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 101
Originally posted by emax95
Given the opportunity to race a new M3 I would I know I would loose but it would not be that that bad. They trap only 3-4 MPH higher then me. Of course I would get killed off the line
Given the opportunity to race a new M3 I would
I know I would loose but it would not be that that bad. They trap only 3-4 MPH higher then me. Of course I would get killed off the line
09-18-2002, 12:05 PM
#78
Originally posted by Str8ridin
pshhh, hang with an M3? Some of you guys, yes.
New Audi Rs6? ALL maxima's will be hanging...on it's bumper and wake. Even the wagon version.
pshhh, hang with an M3? Some of you guys, yes.
New Audi Rs6? ALL maxima's will be hanging...on it's bumper and wake. Even the wagon version.
09-18-2002, 12:29 PM
#79
Senior Member
Join Date: Dec 2001
Posts: 2,084
Any car that has it's modded is going to be at the mercy of many outside factors. Your turbo is finicky about the weather, it runs better at certain temps, and requires substantially more additional modifications than does a nitrous setup. I'm not going to split hairs here, but how many gauges, heaters, and other stuff does it take to get to $1000? Personally, I have 3 gauges, heater, opener, and blanket and I didn't pay anywhere near $1000 for them. Anyway, you obviously are the exception because usually the nitrous guys I talk to do not go thru 2 bottles a week. Geez, are you just out flipping the juice all the time? No wonder you had engine problems. Since you didn't ever have a DP setup, how did you get from $375 to $2000 so quick?
Either way, the quickest time for any car is just that...a quickest time. If your car runs a 12 sec today, there is no guarantee that it will run it tommorow. Nitrous, s/c, or turbo there is a huge number of factors that go into consistency. I totally disagree with both you and the young man who stated that a 12 sec nitrous car is not a 12 sec car. I agree that there is a big advantage to having the power on tap w/o having to think about how much is left in the tank. I give you that, no problem. You should also agree with my very first point...it is the best bang for the buck and it's just as much a power adder as is your turbo or s/c.
Either way, the quickest time for any car is just that...a quickest time. If your car runs a 12 sec today, there is no guarantee that it will run it tommorow. Nitrous, s/c, or turbo there is a huge number of factors that go into consistency. I totally disagree with both you and the young man who stated that a 12 sec nitrous car is not a 12 sec car. I agree that there is a big advantage to having the power on tap w/o having to think about how much is left in the tank. I give you that, no problem. You should also agree with my very first point...it is the best bang for the buck and it's just as much a power adder as is your turbo or s/c.
09-18-2002, 12:38 PM
#80
Originally posted by JAIMECBR900
Any car that has it's modded is going to be at the mercy of many outside factors. Your turbo is finicky about the weather, it runs better at certain temps, and requires substantially more additional modifications than does a nitrous setup. I'm not going to split hairs here, but how many gauges, heaters, and other stuff does it take to get to $1000? Personally, I have 3 gauges, heater, opener, and blanket and I didn't pay anywhere near $1000 for them. Anyway, you obviously are the exception because usually the nitrous guys I talk to do not go thru 2 bottles a week. Geez, are you just out flipping the juice all the time? No wonder you had engine problems. Since you didn't ever have a DP setup, how did you get from $375 to $2000 so quick?
Any car that has it's modded is going to be at the mercy of many outside factors. Your turbo is finicky about the weather, it runs better at certain temps, and requires substantially more additional modifications than does a nitrous setup. I'm not going to split hairs here, but how many gauges, heaters, and other stuff does it take to get to $1000? Personally, I have 3 gauges, heater, opener, and blanket and I didn't pay anywhere near $1000 for them. Anyway, you obviously are the exception because usually the nitrous guys I talk to do not go thru 2 bottles a week. Geez, are you just out flipping the juice all the time? No wonder you had engine problems. Since you didn't ever have a DP setup, how did you get from $375 to $2000 so quick?
Originally posted by JAIMECBR900
Either way, the quickest time for any car is just that...a quickest time. If your car runs a 12 sec today, there is no guarantee that it will run it tommorow. Nitrous, s/c, or turbo there is a huge number of factors that go into consistency. I totally disagree with both you and the young man who stated that a 12 sec nitrous car is not a 12 sec car. I agree that there is a big advantage to having the power on tap w/o having to think about how much is left in the tank. I give you that, no problem. You should also agree with my very first point...it is the best bang for the buck and it's just as much a power adder as is your turbo or s/c.
Either way, the quickest time for any car is just that...a quickest time. If your car runs a 12 sec today, there is no guarantee that it will run it tommorow. Nitrous, s/c, or turbo there is a huge number of factors that go into consistency. I totally disagree with both you and the young man who stated that a 12 sec nitrous car is not a 12 sec car. I agree that there is a big advantage to having the power on tap w/o having to think about how much is left in the tank. I give you that, no problem. You should also agree with my very first point...it is the best bang for the buck and it's just as much a power adder as is your turbo or s/c.