Jambo...tell me where to send the check!! (REOPENED)
02-05-2001, 02:21 PM
#1
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At the risk of offending you, Jamie, I feel compelled to reopen this thread. I don't want to appear ungrateful for the service this forum provides, but there are a growing number of contributors who are concerned about the forum's worsening performance and your apparent unwillingness to address this issue in a professional and businesslike manner.
Once again, I'd ask that you tell us precisely what it would cost to bring the forum's performance up to a reasonable level. Forget about politics and personal attacks. Just give us your conditions for accepting contributions and let us decide for ourselves whether we're willing to meet your conditions.
Once again, I'd ask that you tell us precisely what it would cost to bring the forum's performance up to a reasonable level. Forget about politics and personal attacks. Just give us your conditions for accepting contributions and let us decide for ourselves whether we're willing to meet your conditions.
02-05-2001, 02:35 PM
#2
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,530
Well, to get a <B>managed<B> server with plenty of ram (512 MB - 1024), you're talking somewhere between ~$1245 to 1500/month. I would not go the unmanaged route, because it's way too risky to have no support for application and database software.
That's our closest next step. We're at the top of the current eschelon with the hosting company. They've been way too good, and I'm not willing to switch the site to another server company.
So, I'll be glad to sell "contributors" stickers for several hundred dollars so that people are getting something for the money they send and it works out on the books, or I could throw together some legaleze that would basically remove anyone "donating" to the cause from being able to stake claim to rights of the site. I'm not about to have 100 people start saying that they gave $1 so they have a right to say how it's run. That's way too messy.
How's that? I'd like to think that I was anything but unprofessional or unbusinesslike.
That's our closest next step. We're at the top of the current eschelon with the hosting company. They've been way too good, and I'm not willing to switch the site to another server company.
So, I'll be glad to sell "contributors" stickers for several hundred dollars so that people are getting something for the money they send and it works out on the books, or I could throw together some legaleze that would basically remove anyone "donating" to the cause from being able to stake claim to rights of the site. I'm not about to have 100 people start saying that they gave $1 so they have a right to say how it's run. That's way too messy.
How's that? I'd like to think that I was anything but unprofessional or unbusinesslike.
Originally posted by y2kse
At the risk of offending you, Jamie, I feel compelled to reopen this thread. I don't want to appear ungrateful for the service this forum provides, but there are a growing number of contributors who are concerned about the forum's worsening performance and your apparent unwillingness to address this issue in a professional and businesslike manner.
Once again, I'd ask that you tell us precisely what it would cost to bring the forum's performance up to a reasonable level. Forget about politics and personal attacks. Just give us your conditions for accepting contributions and let us decide for ourselves whether we're willing to meet your conditions.
At the risk of offending you, Jamie, I feel compelled to reopen this thread. I don't want to appear ungrateful for the service this forum provides, but there are a growing number of contributors who are concerned about the forum's worsening performance and your apparent unwillingness to address this issue in a professional and businesslike manner.
Once again, I'd ask that you tell us precisely what it would cost to bring the forum's performance up to a reasonable level. Forget about politics and personal attacks. Just give us your conditions for accepting contributions and let us decide for ourselves whether we're willing to meet your conditions.
02-05-2001, 03:24 PM
#3
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Originally posted by Jambo
Well, to get a <B>managed</B> server with plenty of ram (512 MB - 1024), you're talking somewhere between ~$1245 to 1500/month.
Well, to get a <B>managed</B> server with plenty of ram (512 MB - 1024), you're talking somewhere between ~$1245 to 1500/month.
You haven't broken out your costs. Obviously, some of them are tied up in server equipment, some in software, some in connectivity, and some in management fees. While I don't think it would be feasible for us to pay a monthly fee to cover recurring charges, we might be able to pool our resources and purchase an industrial-strength server and better quality software through a one-time transaction. You could continue to cover your recurring charges through advertising, product sales, etc.
Would that work? If not, why not?
PS: Once again I would encourage you to stay on topic and not get pulled aside by politics or personal attacks.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-05-2001 at 05:37 PM]
02-05-2001, 03:53 PM
#4
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,467
i was wondering.. if this site is a business do we have to get rid of the .org??? shouldn't a .com or something be used.. i don't know, just pokeing around.. 
02-05-2001, 04:57 PM
#5
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Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,530
Some thoughts....
ALL of them are in server costs. Our current costs for the server are ~$250/month. Then there's one time costs here and there for software (i.e. this forum software, the ad management software, etc.). Those I can usually absorb.
The problem with buying a one-time mac daddy server is the ongoing maintenance of it and the colocation. I really don't want to have to worry about installing the software, installing patches and updates, etc. I'd much rather leave that to someone else (i.e. the "managed" part) to do. Otherwise, we'd be going down from time to time just to get upgrades to software done, etc. Believe me -- I tried the Cobalt RAQ option as an unmanaged thing at one point and that just plain sucked.
So, really, a managed server is the way to go, and you're not usually going to be able to just outright "buy" those and get them managed for you. That would mean that the support people would have to know all of the ins and outs of different types of servers that people just come and plop down in their server area. That's a support nightmare! Managed solutions are usually going to be offered by the hosting companies since they usually know the hardware that they're supporting very well.
The optimal solution here is a bigger machine with more RAM, a larger hard drive (the forum DB is getting big, even zipped!), and one that's managed. With that, you're not going to be able to avoid getting into the ~$1000/month realm.
See the pickle we're in?
The problem with buying a one-time mac daddy server is the ongoing maintenance of it and the colocation. I really don't want to have to worry about installing the software, installing patches and updates, etc. I'd much rather leave that to someone else (i.e. the "managed" part) to do. Otherwise, we'd be going down from time to time just to get upgrades to software done, etc. Believe me -- I tried the Cobalt RAQ option as an unmanaged thing at one point and that just plain sucked.
So, really, a managed server is the way to go, and you're not usually going to be able to just outright "buy" those and get them managed for you. That would mean that the support people would have to know all of the ins and outs of different types of servers that people just come and plop down in their server area. That's a support nightmare! Managed solutions are usually going to be offered by the hosting companies since they usually know the hardware that they're supporting very well.
The optimal solution here is a bigger machine with more RAM, a larger hard drive (the forum DB is getting big, even zipped!), and one that's managed. With that, you're not going to be able to avoid getting into the ~$1000/month realm.
See the pickle we're in?
Originally posted by y2kse
Thanks, Jamie. It seems that you <B>are</B> willing to discuss this intelligently. That's good. Let's take our discussion to the next step.
You haven't broken out your costs. Obviously, some of them are tied up in server equipment, some in software, some in connectivity, and some in management fees. While I don't think it would be feasible for us to pay a monthly fee to cover recurring charges, we might be able to pool our resources and purchase an industrial-strength server and better quality software through a one-time transaction. You could continue to cover your recurring charges through advertising, product sales, etc.
Would that work? If not, why not?
PS: Once again I would encourage you to stay on topic and not get pulled aside by politics or personal attacks.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-05-2001 at 05:37 PM] [/I]
Thanks, Jamie. It seems that you <B>are</B> willing to discuss this intelligently. That's good. Let's take our discussion to the next step.
You haven't broken out your costs. Obviously, some of them are tied up in server equipment, some in software, some in connectivity, and some in management fees. While I don't think it would be feasible for us to pay a monthly fee to cover recurring charges, we might be able to pool our resources and purchase an industrial-strength server and better quality software through a one-time transaction. You could continue to cover your recurring charges through advertising, product sales, etc.
Would that work? If not, why not?
PS: Once again I would encourage you to stay on topic and not get pulled aside by politics or personal attacks.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-05-2001 at 05:37 PM] [/I]
02-05-2001, 06:09 PM
#6
Disco Biscuit
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,791
While the errors are frustrating,
I understand the issue Jamie is having. In fact, some large comapanies choose to host their sites with outside companies. They can afford to do so since most companies sites in one way or another bring in enough money to the company to be able to handle the cost it takes to manage a site like that. Companies who choose to host thir own servers usually have dedicated staff on site paid to manage the server and be on call 24x7. Unfortunatly, this site is unable to support the cost of having either option at this point. And a site this large, that has a constantly changing database cannot be left alone. If you think there are problems now, try an unmanaged route. I personally don't understand why it is so difficult for someone to press refresh a few times until it connects. IT"S A SIMPLE PRICE TO PAY! If you're willing to pay hard earned cash , why not spend a little extra energy to click a mouse button. I also feel that It's not been Jamie's intention to be unwilling to respond, but being unable to. After all, what more can he say? At this point there is nothing else he can do!
02-05-2001, 06:13 PM
#7
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 955
Hey Jambo, weren't you saying a while ago that you thought the reason that we got so many errors had to do with the software you were using? What would it cost to use something else? Would you have to rewrite the scripting?
P.S. I would have no problem signing something saying I had no ownership of the site
P.S. I would have no problem signing something saying I had no ownership of the site
02-06-2001, 06:35 AM
#8
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OK, Jamie. Thanks for staying with me on this. I'm starting to get the picture. Let me explore a few more ideas with you.
First, what if anything can be done to our current server to improve its performance? You had mentioned adding more RAM. How much RAM does our server currently have and how much would it cost to max it out if it's not already maxed out?
Second, what if anything can be done to improve database performance? Would it make sense to purchase new database software and migrate our current database?
Third, would performance be improved if there were fewer threads to manage? If so, would it be possible to close and archive threads after a certain period of time . . . say, 30 days or so from their creation date? (Closing and archiving threads shouldn't be an issue. People could reopen closed/archived threads the same way I reopened this one.) And would it help to store closed/archived threads near-line rather than on-line?
First, what if anything can be done to our current server to improve its performance? You had mentioned adding more RAM. How much RAM does our server currently have and how much would it cost to max it out if it's not already maxed out?
Second, what if anything can be done to improve database performance? Would it make sense to purchase new database software and migrate our current database?
Third, would performance be improved if there were fewer threads to manage? If so, would it be possible to close and archive threads after a certain period of time . . . say, 30 days or so from their creation date? (Closing and archiving threads shouldn't be an issue. People could reopen closed/archived threads the same way I reopened this one.) And would it help to store closed/archived threads near-line rather than on-line?
02-06-2001, 09:32 AM
#9
well i'll throw this out into the playing field.
all the sigs and graphics are great. but we're here for information and have discussions. why have sigs? i'm sure it's taking up some memory and etc having pics on here...i'll admit that i'm guilty of that too. but why place restrictions...why not take out the whole picture deal entirely and run it text based? i mean i guess you can leave the smiles and etc but take out the big stuff. would that put a smaller strain on the resources? it might be boring but hey if it keeps the BBS running faster then why not give it a shot?
all the sigs and graphics are great. but we're here for information and have discussions. why have sigs? i'm sure it's taking up some memory and etc having pics on here...i'll admit that i'm guilty of that too. but why place restrictions...why not take out the whole picture deal entirely and run it text based? i mean i guess you can leave the smiles and etc but take out the big stuff. would that put a smaller strain on the resources? it might be boring but hey if it keeps the BBS running faster then why not give it a shot?
02-06-2001, 09:41 AM
#10
Disco Biscuit
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,791
Actually the sig pics have no affect on the performance.
The only issues they create is with users with dial up connections. Other than that, the sigs cause no other problems.
02-06-2001, 12:36 PM
#11
Re: Actually the sig pics have no affect on the performance.
ohhh ok...oops. ok carry on. 
Originally posted by Whitemax
The only issues they create is with users with dial up connections. Other than that, the sigs cause no other problems.
The only issues they create is with users with dial up connections. Other than that, the sigs cause no other problems.
02-06-2001, 01:36 PM
#12
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,530
Well, RAM is our biggie. However, we can't just go adding RAM to the server, because 1) we don't own it and 2) there are other hosts on it besides us. Kinda like adding a turbocharger to a Ryder truck that you rent one weekend or something -- you just can't do it.
We're currently sharing 256 MB of RAM with 7 other hosts. Too little for our database, as far as I'm concerned. It needs more RAM than that.
I don't think the database software itself is bad -- it just needs a lot of RAM to handle a bunch of concurrent connections.
Well, yes, I would think (unless our indexes are way outta whack) that having fewer threads would help, and I've been trying to think of some good way to do something like archiving threads to another db or something. Still thinking on that one.
All of that being said, I've asked for our hosting company to set up one of their new virtual servers for us, and over the next several weeks, I'll be testing it to see if changing and tweaking some of the database parameters will help (since we'll now be able to "tweak").
Hope this helps.
We're currently sharing 256 MB of RAM with 7 other hosts. Too little for our database, as far as I'm concerned. It needs more RAM than that.
I don't think the database software itself is bad -- it just needs a lot of RAM to handle a bunch of concurrent connections.
Well, yes, I would think (unless our indexes are way outta whack) that having fewer threads would help, and I've been trying to think of some good way to do something like archiving threads to another db or something. Still thinking on that one.
All of that being said, I've asked for our hosting company to set up one of their new virtual servers for us, and over the next several weeks, I'll be testing it to see if changing and tweaking some of the database parameters will help (since we'll now be able to "tweak").
Hope this helps.
Originally posted by y2kse
OK, Jamie. Thanks for staying with me on this. I'm starting to get the picture. Let me explore a few more ideas with you.
First, what if anything can be done to our current server to improve its performance? You had mentioned adding more RAM. How much RAM does our server currently have and how much would it cost to max it out if it's not already maxed out?
Second, what if anything can be done to improve database performance? Would it make sense to purchase new database software and migrate our current database?
Third, would performance be improved if there were fewer threads to manage? If so, would it be possible to close and archive threads after a certain period of time . . . say, 30 days or so from their creation date? (Closing and archiving threads shouldn't be an issue. People could reopen closed/archived threads the same way I reopened this one.) And would it help to store closed/archived threads near-line rather than on-line?
OK, Jamie. Thanks for staying with me on this. I'm starting to get the picture. Let me explore a few more ideas with you.
First, what if anything can be done to our current server to improve its performance? You had mentioned adding more RAM. How much RAM does our server currently have and how much would it cost to max it out if it's not already maxed out?
Second, what if anything can be done to improve database performance? Would it make sense to purchase new database software and migrate our current database?
Third, would performance be improved if there were fewer threads to manage? If so, would it be possible to close and archive threads after a certain period of time . . . say, 30 days or so from their creation date? (Closing and archiving threads shouldn't be an issue. People could reopen closed/archived threads the same way I reopened this one.) And would it help to store closed/archived threads near-line rather than on-line?
02-06-2001, 02:37 PM
#13
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Some thoughts....
Free space, free support, free high powered server, I don't see a pickle. I see the problem in you Jamie.
(peelboy bought a server for this club basically), and you deny to use it for free! I won't pay as long as people are allowing you to use one for free.
(peelboy bought a server for this club basically), and you deny to use it for free! I won't pay as long as people are allowing you to use one for free.
Originally posted by Jambo
ALL of them are in server costs. Our current costs for the server are ~$250/month. Then there's one time costs here and there for software (i.e. this forum software, the ad management software, etc.). Those I can usually absorb.
The problem with buying a one-time mac daddy server is the ongoing maintenance of it and the colocation. I really don't want to have to worry about installing the software, installing patches and updates, etc. I'd much rather leave that to someone else (i.e. the "managed" part) to do. Otherwise, we'd be going down from time to time just to get upgrades to software done, etc. Believe me -- I tried the Cobalt RAQ option as an unmanaged thing at one point and that just plain sucked.
So, really, a managed server is the way to go, and you're not usually going to be able to just outright "buy" those and get them managed for you. That would mean that the support people would have to know all of the ins and outs of different types of servers that people just come and plop down in their server area. That's a support nightmare! Managed solutions are usually going to be offered by the hosting companies since they usually know the hardware that they're supporting very well.
The optimal solution here is a bigger machine with more RAM, a larger hard drive (the forum DB is getting big, even zipped!), and one that's managed. With that, you're not going to be able to avoid getting into the ~$1000/month realm.
See the pickle we're in?
[/I]
ALL of them are in server costs. Our current costs for the server are ~$250/month. Then there's one time costs here and there for software (i.e. this forum software, the ad management software, etc.). Those I can usually absorb.
The problem with buying a one-time mac daddy server is the ongoing maintenance of it and the colocation. I really don't want to have to worry about installing the software, installing patches and updates, etc. I'd much rather leave that to someone else (i.e. the "managed" part) to do. Otherwise, we'd be going down from time to time just to get upgrades to software done, etc. Believe me -- I tried the Cobalt RAQ option as an unmanaged thing at one point and that just plain sucked.
So, really, a managed server is the way to go, and you're not usually going to be able to just outright "buy" those and get them managed for you. That would mean that the support people would have to know all of the ins and outs of different types of servers that people just come and plop down in their server area. That's a support nightmare! Managed solutions are usually going to be offered by the hosting companies since they usually know the hardware that they're supporting very well.
The optimal solution here is a bigger machine with more RAM, a larger hard drive (the forum DB is getting big, even zipped!), and one that's managed. With that, you're not going to be able to avoid getting into the ~$1000/month realm.
See the pickle we're in?
Originally posted by y2kse
Thanks, Jamie. It seems that you <B>are</B> willing to discuss this intelligently. That's good. Let's take our discussion to the next step.
You haven't broken out your costs. Obviously, some of them are tied up in server equipment, some in software, some in connectivity, and some in management fees. While I don't think it would be feasible for us to pay a monthly fee to cover recurring charges, we might be able to pool our resources and purchase an industrial-strength server and better quality software through a one-time transaction. You could continue to cover your recurring charges through advertising, product sales, etc.
Would that work? If not, why not?
PS: Once again I would encourage you to stay on topic and not get pulled aside by politics or personal attacks.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-05-2001 at 05:37 PM]
Thanks, Jamie. It seems that you <B>are</B> willing to discuss this intelligently. That's good. Let's take our discussion to the next step.
You haven't broken out your costs. Obviously, some of them are tied up in server equipment, some in software, some in connectivity, and some in management fees. While I don't think it would be feasible for us to pay a monthly fee to cover recurring charges, we might be able to pool our resources and purchase an industrial-strength server and better quality software through a one-time transaction. You could continue to cover your recurring charges through advertising, product sales, etc.
Would that work? If not, why not?
PS: Once again I would encourage you to stay on topic and not get pulled aside by politics or personal attacks.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-05-2001 at 05:37 PM]
02-06-2001, 02:41 PM
#14
Guest
Posts: n/a
****EDITED BECAUSE THIS POST IS GARBAGE AND UNPRODUCTIVE....****
[Edited by bill99gxe on 02-06-2001 at 05:10 PM]
[Edited by bill99gxe on 02-06-2001 at 05:10 PM]
02-06-2001, 02:43 PM
#15
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 182
Re: Re: Actually the sig pics have no affect on the performance.
Jambo.
I went through these same problems on my forum. I tried every combination of commands with MySQL and even removing old threads. None of it worked. It seemed to me like a bunch of the MySQL connections were hanging and then waiting to time out which would cause MySQL to spawn more instances of it's self until eventually the whole thing would die.. Then I would have to kill the database, fix the tables and restart it all..
I even tried installing a patch to the kernal for a threading problem that was a known issue in MySQL, but that did not help either.
I switched to several different servers. Including a Virtual server just like yours (except slightly more powerfull), and eventually got my dedicated server which has 512mb of ram and 600mhz processor. I still used up a lot of my resources on the server, but I didn't come close to using them ALL... And I still had the problem
Good luck getting it fixed. It will not be an easy process. Upgrading the server might only fix the problem for a month or two and then it will all start over :\
I went through these same problems on my forum. I tried every combination of commands with MySQL and even removing old threads. None of it worked. It seemed to me like a bunch of the MySQL connections were hanging and then waiting to time out which would cause MySQL to spawn more instances of it's self until eventually the whole thing would die.. Then I would have to kill the database, fix the tables and restart it all..
I even tried installing a patch to the kernal for a threading problem that was a known issue in MySQL, but that did not help either.
I switched to several different servers. Including a Virtual server just like yours (except slightly more powerfull), and eventually got my dedicated server which has 512mb of ram and 600mhz processor. I still used up a lot of my resources on the server, but I didn't come close to using them ALL... And I still had the problem
Good luck getting it fixed. It will not be an easy process. Upgrading the server might only fix the problem for a month or two and then it will all start over :\
Originally posted by DanNY
ohhh ok...oops. ok carry on.
ohhh ok...oops. ok carry on.
Originally posted by Whitemax
The only issues they create is with users with dial up connections. Other than that, the sigs cause no other problems.
The only issues they create is with users with dial up connections. Other than that, the sigs cause no other problems.
02-06-2001, 02:49 PM
#16
The missing moderator
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,019
Re: Re: Some thoughts....
Russ,
Learn to speak with some tact. I'll pay for yuo language lessons. Until then, please... think twice before clicking. Because what you are typing is very offensive. To me, "I see the problem in you" Russ.
-Shing
Learn to speak with some tact. I'll pay for yuo language lessons. Until then, please... think twice before clicking. Because what you are typing is very offensive. To me, "I see the problem in you" Russ.
-Shing
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
Free space, free support, free high powered server, I don't see a pickle. I see the problem in you Jamie.
(peelboy bought a server for this club basically), and you deny to use it for free! I won't pay as long as people are allowing you to use one for free.
[/I]
Free space, free support, free high powered server, I don't see a pickle. I see the problem in you Jamie.
(peelboy bought a server for this club basically), and you deny to use it for free! I won't pay as long as people are allowing you to use one for free.
Originally posted by Jambo
ALL of them are in server costs. Our current costs for the server are ~$250/month. Then there's one time costs here and there for software (i.e. this forum software, the ad management software, etc.). Those I can usually absorb.
The problem with buying a one-time mac daddy server is the ongoing maintenance of it and the colocation. I really don't want to have to worry about installing the software, installing patches and updates, etc. I'd much rather leave that to someone else (i.e. the "managed" part) to do. Otherwise, we'd be going down from time to time just to get upgrades to software done, etc. Believe me -- I tried the Cobalt RAQ option as an unmanaged thing at one point and that just plain sucked.
So, really, a managed server is the way to go, and you're not usually going to be able to just outright "buy" those and get them managed for you. That would mean that the support people would have to know all of the ins and outs of different types of servers that people just come and plop down in their server area. That's a support nightmare! Managed solutions are usually going to be offered by the hosting companies since they usually know the hardware that they're supporting very well.
The optimal solution here is a bigger machine with more RAM, a larger hard drive (the forum DB is getting big, even zipped!), and one that's managed. With that, you're not going to be able to avoid getting into the ~$1000/month realm.
See the pickle we're in?
ALL of them are in server costs. Our current costs for the server are ~$250/month. Then there's one time costs here and there for software (i.e. this forum software, the ad management software, etc.). Those I can usually absorb.
The problem with buying a one-time mac daddy server is the ongoing maintenance of it and the colocation. I really don't want to have to worry about installing the software, installing patches and updates, etc. I'd much rather leave that to someone else (i.e. the "managed" part) to do. Otherwise, we'd be going down from time to time just to get upgrades to software done, etc. Believe me -- I tried the Cobalt RAQ option as an unmanaged thing at one point and that just plain sucked.
So, really, a managed server is the way to go, and you're not usually going to be able to just outright "buy" those and get them managed for you. That would mean that the support people would have to know all of the ins and outs of different types of servers that people just come and plop down in their server area. That's a support nightmare! Managed solutions are usually going to be offered by the hosting companies since they usually know the hardware that they're supporting very well.
The optimal solution here is a bigger machine with more RAM, a larger hard drive (the forum DB is getting big, even zipped!), and one that's managed. With that, you're not going to be able to avoid getting into the ~$1000/month realm.
See the pickle we're in?
Originally posted by y2kse
Thanks, Jamie. It seems that you <B>are</B> willing to discuss this intelligently. That's good. Let's take our discussion to the next step.
You haven't broken out your costs. Obviously, some of them are tied up in server equipment, some in software, some in connectivity, and some in management fees. While I don't think it would be feasible for us to pay a monthly fee to cover recurring charges, we might be able to pool our resources and purchase an industrial-strength server and better quality software through a one-time transaction. You could continue to cover your recurring charges through advertising, product sales, etc.
Would that work? If not, why not?
PS: Once again I would encourage you to stay on topic and not get pulled aside by politics or personal attacks.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-05-2001 at 05:37 PM]
Thanks, Jamie. It seems that you <B>are</B> willing to discuss this intelligently. That's good. Let's take our discussion to the next step.
You haven't broken out your costs. Obviously, some of them are tied up in server equipment, some in software, some in connectivity, and some in management fees. While I don't think it would be feasible for us to pay a monthly fee to cover recurring charges, we might be able to pool our resources and purchase an industrial-strength server and better quality software through a one-time transaction. You could continue to cover your recurring charges through advertising, product sales, etc.
Would that work? If not, why not?
PS: Once again I would encourage you to stay on topic and not get pulled aside by politics or personal attacks.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-05-2001 at 05:37 PM]
02-06-2001, 02:55 PM
#17
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Re: Re: Some thoughts....
*****BLAH, BLAH, BLAH. MORE USELESS BABBLE. SO IT'S BYE-BYE POST COMMENTS.******
Please go somewhere else if you want to bash Jamie. Find your own Maxima club and compete the respectful way.
[Edited by bill99gxe on 02-06-2001 at 05:17 PM]
Please go somewhere else if you want to bash Jamie. Find your own Maxima club and compete the respectful way.
[Edited by bill99gxe on 02-06-2001 at 05:17 PM]
02-06-2001, 04:40 PM
#18
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Location: City of the Fallen Angel, CA
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Gentlemen! Gentlemen!
It certainly is difficult to have an intelligent conversation around here. I appeal to you all to <B>STAY ON THE TOPIC!</B>
Questions Jeremy. If I'm interpreting your post correctly, it appears that the primary problem is with the database software and not with the server. Is there better software available? If so, would it be possible to purchase new software and migrate our current database? If data migration is not possible, could we freeze this database and open a new one?
Questions Jeremy. If I'm interpreting your post correctly, it appears that the primary problem is with the database software and not with the server. Is there better software available? If so, would it be possible to purchase new software and migrate our current database? If data migration is not possible, could we freeze this database and open a new one?
02-06-2001, 05:36 PM
#19
The missing moderator
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,019
Re: Gentlemen! Gentlemen!
Originally posted by y2kse
It certainly is difficult to have an intelligent conversation around here. I appeal to you all to <B>STAY ON THE TOPIC!</B>
Questions Jeremy. If I'm interpreting your post correctly, it appears that the primary problem is with the database software and not with the server. Is there better software available? If so, would it be possible to purchase new software and migrate our current database? If data migration is not possible, could we freeze this database and open a new one?
It certainly is difficult to have an intelligent conversation around here. I appeal to you all to <B>STAY ON THE TOPIC!</B>
Questions Jeremy. If I'm interpreting your post correctly, it appears that the primary problem is with the database software and not with the server. Is there better software available? If so, would it be possible to purchase new software and migrate our current database? If data migration is not possible, could we freeze this database and open a new one?
-Shing
02-06-2001, 06:24 PM
#20
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Re: Re: Gentlemen! Gentlemen!
Originally posted by Shingles
As unfortunate as it is, it would be a futile attempt to try and hold an adult conversation regardin this issue here.
-Shing
As unfortunate as it is, it would be a futile attempt to try and hold an adult conversation regardin this issue here.
-Shing
So back to the topic at hand. What's it going to take to fix the problem?
[Edited by y2kse on 02-06-2001 at 08:30 PM]
02-06-2001, 06:33 PM
#21
The missing moderator
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,019
Re: Re: Re: Gentlemen! Gentlemen!
I understand your intend, as it is a good and noble one. I don't disagree with you about trying to find a solution to this issue. The problem is you make the assumption that everyone here are "adults". That is probably not going to hold. You've been around long enough to realize that.
It's certainly up to you if you wish to continue this conversation. All I am suggeting to you is, if you truely are after a quick(er) solution to this issue, posting it here is not the best route to go.
I'll say this much... if this thread gets out of line, again, it will get tossed like the other... by myself or bill.
-Shing
It's certainly up to you if you wish to continue this conversation. All I am suggeting to you is, if you truely are after a quick(er) solution to this issue, posting it here is not the best route to go.
I'll say this much... if this thread gets out of line, again, it will get tossed like the other... by myself or bill.
-Shing
Originally posted by y2kse
I disagree, Shing. Adults can always choose to ignore the tantrums of children. Right now my only concern in this thread is to get to the bottom of the problem we're experiencing and, hopefully, find a cure. Those who wish to mount personal attacks rather than join the conversation hold themselves up for the fools they are. They serve no-one . . . not even themselves.
[Edited by y2kse on 02-06-2001 at 08:26 PM]
Originally posted by Shingles
As unfortunate as it is, it would be a futile attempt to try and hold an adult conversation regardin this issue here.
-Shing
As unfortunate as it is, it would be a futile attempt to try and hold an adult conversation regardin this issue here.
-Shing
[Edited by y2kse on 02-06-2001 at 08:26 PM]
02-06-2001, 06:36 PM
#22
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,530
Re: Gentlemen! Gentlemen!
I'll be the first to say that MySQL isn't the *best* option out there, however it is installed on our server, fairly easy to get around in and administer and works with a variety of packages, one of which being our forum software.
The forum software currently doesn't support other databases, however, I think in the future it will as the software grows.
So, <B>with the current forum software</b> we're bound to MySQL.
The forum software currently doesn't support other databases, however, I think in the future it will as the software grows.
So, <B>with the current forum software</b> we're bound to MySQL.
Originally posted by y2kse
It certainly is difficult to have an intelligent conversation around here. I appeal to you all to <B>STAY ON THE TOPIC!</B>
Questions Jeremy. If I'm interpreting your post correctly, it appears that the primary problem is with the database software and not with the server. Is there better software available? If so, would it be possible to purchase new software and migrate our current database? If data migration is not possible, could we freeze this database and open a new one?
It certainly is difficult to have an intelligent conversation around here. I appeal to you all to <B>STAY ON THE TOPIC!</B>
Questions Jeremy. If I'm interpreting your post correctly, it appears that the primary problem is with the database software and not with the server. Is there better software available? If so, would it be possible to purchase new software and migrate our current database? If data migration is not possible, could we freeze this database and open a new one?
02-06-2001, 06:54 PM
#23
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 402
excuse me for not knowing, i've not been here that long...
Jamie- do you work at a web hosting company?
I do, and i know we do servers for a certain amount. tomorrow when i talk to my boss, i will ask what the cost for a dedicated server is.
Are you having any bandwith associated problems? if so, what type of direct connection to the web are you on (DS3, T1,T3, OC3?) and you said you shared with 7 other clients.
i believe i could get you a connection on a T1 shared with only one other server (just a realaudio radio server) and 30 office staff during the day, empty at night. there are people on call 24/7 here.
perhaps better. i have been to our local central office, and there are 4 OC3 lines coming in, serving our bank of servers. i'll see what would be allowed.
if you want to discuss this more, email me at glwgb@aol.com
my aim accounts are GLWGB
The Future Udt
[Edited by The Sleeper on 02-06-2001 at 09:28 PM]
Jamie- do you work at a web hosting company?
I do, and i know we do servers for a certain amount. tomorrow when i talk to my boss, i will ask what the cost for a dedicated server is.
Are you having any bandwith associated problems? if so, what type of direct connection to the web are you on (DS3, T1,T3, OC3?) and you said you shared with 7 other clients.
i believe i could get you a connection on a T1 shared with only one other server (just a realaudio radio server) and 30 office staff during the day, empty at night. there are people on call 24/7 here.
perhaps better. i have been to our local central office, and there are 4 OC3 lines coming in, serving our bank of servers. i'll see what would be allowed.
if you want to discuss this more, email me at glwgb@aol.com
my aim accounts are GLWGB
The Future Udt
[Edited by The Sleeper on 02-06-2001 at 09:28 PM]
02-06-2001, 07:19 PM
#24
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Thread Starter
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Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: City of the Fallen Angel, CA
Posts: 4,728
Originally posted by The Sleeper
excuse me for not knowing, i've not been here that long...
Jamie- do you work at a web hosting company?
I do, . . .
excuse me for not knowing, i've not been here that long...
Jamie- do you work at a web hosting company?
I do, . . .
I'll keep my fingers crossed.
02-06-2001, 07:29 PM
#25
Guest
Posts: n/a
Re: Re: Re: Re: Some thoughts....
You have NO RIGHT TO REMOVE WHAT I type. It's like you changing a letter I wrote. This board has got to suck if people start EDITING peoples posts. Man kids.
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
*****BLAH, BLAH, BLAH. MORE USELESS BABBLE. SO IT'S BYE-BYE POST COMMENTS.******
Please go somewhere else if you want to bash Jamie. Find your own Maxima club and compete the respectful way.
[Edited by bill99gxe on 02-06-2001 at 05:17 PM]
*****BLAH, BLAH, BLAH. MORE USELESS BABBLE. SO IT'S BYE-BYE POST COMMENTS.******
Please go somewhere else if you want to bash Jamie. Find your own Maxima club and compete the respectful way.
[Edited by bill99gxe on 02-06-2001 at 05:17 PM]
02-06-2001, 07:33 PM
#26
Senior Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 402
dude - russ, chill, okay? this is not the united states of america. there is no free speech. if you ran the server, you could say anything you wanted, but since it's Jambo's operation, he is god, and you deal with his world.
everyone just have a beer and go to bed....
everyone just have a beer and go to bed....
02-06-2001, 07:50 PM
#27
Guest
Posts: n/a
No I am not gonna chill when people are acting childish...this is stupid. All I can say one day Maxima.org will learn and have its day.
Originally posted by The Sleeper
dude - russ, chill, okay? this is not the united states of america. there is no free speech. if you ran the server, you could say anything you wanted, but since it's Jambo's operation, he is god, and you deal with his world.
everyone just have a beer and go to bed....
dude - russ, chill, okay? this is not the united states of america. there is no free speech. if you ran the server, you could say anything you wanted, but since it's Jambo's operation, he is god, and you deal with his world.
everyone just have a beer and go to bed....
02-06-2001, 08:03 PM
#28
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 3,989
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Some thoughts....
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
You have NO RIGHT TO REMOVE WHAT I type. It's like you changing a letter I wrote. This board has got to suck if people start EDITING peoples posts. Man kids.
You have NO RIGHT TO REMOVE WHAT I type. It's like you changing a letter I wrote. This board has got to suck if people start EDITING peoples posts. Man kids.
go to the main index and look at the column under moderator. shing is moderating the general forum(where you are posting), which means if he chooses to he can toss your post, he even can take away your right to post altogether, and there isn't a thing you can do about that. and yes it's his right, granted by jambo, who *owns* this place.
so... clear enough for you now?
btw, just curious, what is that "man kids" about???
02-06-2001, 08:16 PM
#29
The missing moderator
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,019
Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: Some thoughts....
Russ,
Personal attacks will not be tolerated on this forum. To attack someone personally is the childish act. Please just calm down a little. Yeah, people are pissing you off, so what? Ever thought that it's possible that you are pissing other's off as well?
This could have been a very good thread, however, I have no choice but to lock it now because you decided to come in and make personal attacks.
-Shing
Personal attacks will not be tolerated on this forum. To attack someone personally is the childish act. Please just calm down a little. Yeah, people are pissing you off, so what? Ever thought that it's possible that you are pissing other's off as well?
This could have been a very good thread, however, I have no choice but to lock it now because you decided to come in and make personal attacks.
-Shing
Originally posted by WoodEar
dood, get with the program.
go to the main index and look at the column under moderator. shing is moderating the general forum(where you are posting), which means if he chooses to he can toss your post, he even can take away your right to post altogether, and there isn't a thing you can do about that. and yes it's his right, granted by jambo, who *owns* this place.
so... clear enough for you now?
btw, just curious, what is that "man kids" about???
Originally posted by Russ2kSE
You have NO RIGHT TO REMOVE WHAT I type. It's like you changing a letter I wrote. This board has got to suck if people start EDITING peoples posts. Man kids.
You have NO RIGHT TO REMOVE WHAT I type. It's like you changing a letter I wrote. This board has got to suck if people start EDITING peoples posts. Man kids.
go to the main index and look at the column under moderator. shing is moderating the general forum(where you are posting), which means if he chooses to he can toss your post, he even can take away your right to post altogether, and there isn't a thing you can do about that. and yes it's his right, granted by jambo, who *owns* this place.
so... clear enough for you now?
btw, just curious, what is that "man kids" about???
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