Is it financially risky to deal with Nissan dealers?
07-05-2010, 04:12 PM
#1
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Is it financially risky to deal with Nissan dealers?
A large number of posts here detail what appears to be extreme price gouging by service and parts departments- in diagnosis, parts, service, and labor.
Many manufacturers' dealers have reputations for high rates compared to smaller repair shops, but this pattern appears to be way deeper than that.
After a while it occured to me that maybe bleeding customers is the business model?
I am very reluctant to have the Maxima visit a dealer - as it seems I might be prey for the car service fraud monster.
Is this just my reaction to exaggerated rip offs, or does this feeling reflect a real risk?
Many manufacturers' dealers have reputations for high rates compared to smaller repair shops, but this pattern appears to be way deeper than that.
After a while it occured to me that maybe bleeding customers is the business model?
I am very reluctant to have the Maxima visit a dealer - as it seems I might be prey for the car service fraud monster.
Is this just my reaction to exaggerated rip offs, or does this feeling reflect a real risk?
Last edited by Intrepid1; 07-05-2010 at 04:15 PM.
07-05-2010, 05:01 PM
#3
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The whole SES light thing, way over average sensors needing replacement, motor mounts and idle air controls frying ECUs? a bad reputation for coils needing replacement . . .
Then reading about many people's cars at dealers needing several thousand dollars to get running again?
Several thousand dollars on most cars is a transmission or an engine, not computers and sensors going beserk.
Both the manufacturer and the dealers share in the profitable business driven by bad design . . .
Then reading about many people's cars at dealers needing several thousand dollars to get running again?
Several thousand dollars on most cars is a transmission or an engine, not computers and sensors going beserk.
Both the manufacturer and the dealers share in the profitable business driven by bad design . . .
07-05-2010, 05:34 PM
#4
yeah thats basically why. a member on here pointed me out to a guy who works as a mechanic from his home and is $50 a hour and you bring your own parts. he said that the guy is the only person he trusts with his Maxima. the small garage i usually go to quoted me $1200 for the timing belt and water pump and hes doing my timing belt, water pump, tensioner, thermostat, oil change and coolant change as well as all new seals for $500, $650 if theres lots of rusty bolts.
i get it back Wednesday, if all is good hes my new mechanic
i get it back Wednesday, if all is good hes my new mechanic
07-05-2010, 05:35 PM
#5
The whole SES light thing, way over average sensors needing replacement, motor mounts and idle air controls frying ECUs? a bad reputation for coils needing replacement . . .
Then reading about many people's cars at dealers needing several thousand dollars to get running again?
Several thousand dollars on most cars is a transmission or an engine, not computers and sensors going beserk.
Both the manufacturer and the dealers share in the profitable business driven by bad design . . .
Then reading about many people's cars at dealers needing several thousand dollars to get running again?
Several thousand dollars on most cars is a transmission or an engine, not computers and sensors going beserk.
Both the manufacturer and the dealers share in the profitable business driven by bad design . . .
Last edited by Shift_Nismo; 07-05-2010 at 05:41 PM.
07-05-2010, 05:56 PM
#6
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Not really. Everything you mentioned will not last forever, they will go out. If you wait to fix them (meaning neglect the car), then yes things will pile up, and it will end up taking thousands to fix. The frying of an ECU doesn't happen as soon as the IACV goes bad, its has to have been bad for a while. If I have time between the IACV first acting up and the ECU event, what a relief. Only when you leave it there, and dont fix it, will it fry the ecu. Coils, just like spark plugs, distributors, and spark plug wires will have to be replaced at some point.Agreed. Nothing on a car lasts forever, but if you take care of things as they happen, instead of waiting for the car to stop running, then the maintenance on Maximas is EXTREMELY low. Compare the maintenance costs to that of Audi, Mercedes, we've got it good. As far as reliability, compare it to most any GM, or Ford from 89-05, The Maxima will beat most of them if not all. A car is only as reliable as the owner, so if you wait for the car to stop running, and it ends up costing an arm & leg to fix, then its your fault, not the car's. As far as the coils needing replacement I only know of the 99 coils being a bad batch, maybe someone else can chime in if there are any other bad ones. Just got a very well maintained 2001 and the 1320 and the 0301 code, along with a miss in #1 cylinder prompted me to buy coils. You assume that all the threads you have read, are from everyone on the org, and they aren't, just some. **** happens. Nothing on a car is designed to last forever, its impossible to make it. Even Hondas and Toyotas have their problems. As far as parts, we get discounted OEM Nissan parts from Dave B, you should contact him if you need a part. And there is a reason why we call ALL dealerships, not just Nissan dealerships, "stealerships". Its not a Nissan thing, all stealerships are the same way. So unless your car is still under warranty, take your car to a private mechanic, they are usually lower. And don't wait for the car to say fuc it, to decide to fix it.
Maybe it's me, being used to newer cars. Recently I decided to forgo the new car/payment scene and buy quality used. I did expect to put some money into the Max, but its sort of freaky to have it a week and the SES light comes on and the engine starts missing.
I am mainly surprised that this car did it so fast, as the previous owner was almost fanatical about maintence and generally taking care of the car.
I really like the Maxima, and plan to take care of it as well (really better) that new cars I've owned.
So far changed the trans fluid, disconnected the mounts (they were starting to sing after shutdown), and ordered coils. I plan to install a new IACV as soon as it hiccups (maybe sooner), and carefully inspect the mounts and bushings and such.
07-05-2010, 06:01 PM
#7
Yeah that true, I used to work in a Toyota dealership and we have a detail department that charges $450 dollars to do a Gold package detail...
And after sitting there and watching them work one evening I found out that I could do that "Gold" package myself if I had $65 bucks with $25 of that being a orbital buffer. And the rest going into Meguiares products and renting a carpet cleaner. And it took one guy about 3 hours to complete. So even if he were paid $100 dollars an hour, it still wouldn't come out to the $450 they were charging.
Bleh! Over charging and over glorifying, that is how they make money... Now this is Toyota, I am sure Honda, and Nissan, and any other manufacturer aren't far away in the over charge scale.
And after sitting there and watching them work one evening I found out that I could do that "Gold" package myself if I had $65 bucks with $25 of that being a orbital buffer. And the rest going into Meguiares products and renting a carpet cleaner. And it took one guy about 3 hours to complete. So even if he were paid $100 dollars an hour, it still wouldn't come out to the $450 they were charging.
Bleh! Over charging and over glorifying, that is how they make money... Now this is Toyota, I am sure Honda, and Nissan, and any other manufacturer aren't far away in the over charge scale.
07-05-2010, 07:27 PM
#8
You make very good points, and I generally agree with all of them.
Maybe it's me, being used to newer cars. Recently I decided to forgo the new car/payment scene and buy quality used. I did expect to put some money into the Max, but its sort of freaky to have it a week and the SES light comes on and the engine starts missing.
I am mainly surprised that this car did it so fast, as the previous owner was almost fanatical about maintence and generally taking care of the car.
I really like the Maxima, and plan to take care of it as well (really better) that new cars I've owned.
So far changed the trans fluid, disconnected the mounts (they were starting to sing after shutdown), and ordered coils. I plan to install a new IACV as soon as it hiccups (maybe sooner), and carefully inspect the mounts and bushings and such.
Maybe it's me, being used to newer cars. Recently I decided to forgo the new car/payment scene and buy quality used. I did expect to put some money into the Max, but its sort of freaky to have it a week and the SES light comes on and the engine starts missing.
I am mainly surprised that this car did it so fast, as the previous owner was almost fanatical about maintence and generally taking care of the car.
I really like the Maxima, and plan to take care of it as well (really better) that new cars I've owned.
So far changed the trans fluid, disconnected the mounts (they were starting to sing after shutdown), and ordered coils. I plan to install a new IACV as soon as it hiccups (maybe sooner), and carefully inspect the mounts and bushings and such.
Last edited by Shift_Nismo; 07-05-2010 at 07:36 PM.
07-05-2010, 07:33 PM
#9
Yeah that true, I used to work in a Toyota dealership and we have a detail department that charges $450 dollars to do a Gold package detail...
And after sitting there and watching them work one evening I found out that I could do that "Gold" package myself if I had $65 bucks with $25 of that being a orbital buffer. And the rest going into Meguiares products and renting a carpet cleaner. And it took one guy about 3 hours to complete. So even if he were paid $100 dollars an hour, it still wouldn't come out to the $450 they were charging.
Bleh! Over charging and over glorifying, that is how they make money... Now this is Toyota, I am sure Honda, and Nissan, and any other manufacturer aren't far away in the over charge scale.
And after sitting there and watching them work one evening I found out that I could do that "Gold" package myself if I had $65 bucks with $25 of that being a orbital buffer. And the rest going into Meguiares products and renting a carpet cleaner. And it took one guy about 3 hours to complete. So even if he were paid $100 dollars an hour, it still wouldn't come out to the $450 they were charging.
Bleh! Over charging and over glorifying, that is how they make money... Now this is Toyota, I am sure Honda, and Nissan, and any other manufacturer aren't far away in the over charge scale.
07-06-2010, 03:29 AM
#10
Haha when I was wandering around and saw the price of it, I almost cried a little.
Good God, for that price you could... buy a nice set of used rims (With no tires), maybe a fancy intake, or a nice exhaust system, or a SUPER sound system, maybe not enough to go turbo-ed or supercharged but close
Good God, for that price you could... buy a nice set of used rims (With no tires), maybe a fancy intake, or a nice exhaust system, or a SUPER sound system, maybe not enough to go turbo-ed or supercharged but close
07-06-2010, 06:21 AM
#11
I seriously doubt dealership parts deparments have a lot of wiggle room in the price they charge for parts.
You should direct your wrath to Nissan corporate, not the individual franchise.
You should direct your wrath to Nissan corporate, not the individual franchise.
07-06-2010, 10:48 AM
#14
i however have a VG30E n00b
07-06-2010, 11:06 AM
#15
personally finished with them. went for a "free" oil change (reimbursement for when i called them out for charging me to change a new belt) well...
i already went to them for 3 brackets that were causing a rattle upon acceleration. happens again. this time i find it. a flippin super old rusted bracket they place on my Y-pipe that is waaaay different than the others.
i already went to them for 3 brackets that were causing a rattle upon acceleration. happens again. this time i find it. a flippin super old rusted bracket they place on my Y-pipe that is waaaay different than the others.
07-10-2010, 01:56 PM
#19
07-11-2010, 06:54 PM
#23
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Northern NJ
Posts: 81
I feel that it is financially risky to ever take your car to a dealer to get it fixed. The only way I get my car worked on is by buying the part myself and getting my mechanic, who owns his own medium sized shop of ~4 guys, to install it. I can always get the part cheaper than basically any mechanic would charge, nevermind what a dealer would charge. The only way I see it reasonable to not buy the part yourself is if you get it from someone for nearly the same price they paid for it if they ordered in bulk and thus got a discounted price.
07-13-2010, 03:28 AM
#24
I feel that it is financially risky to ever take your car to a dealer to get it fixed. The only way I get my car worked on is by buying the part myself and getting my mechanic, who owns his own medium sized shop of ~4 guys, to install it. I can always get the part cheaper than basically any mechanic would charge, nevermind what a dealer would charge. The only way I see it reasonable to not buy the part yourself is if you get it from someone for nearly the same price they paid for it if they ordered in bulk and thus got a discounted price.
07-13-2010, 09:49 AM
#26
nearly all mechanics do as well, some people working out of their home may not but im sure dealers do
07-13-2010, 04:14 PM
#28
07-13-2010, 04:57 PM
#30
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Location: PA
Posts: 85
IMHO the dealer business model is very flawed.
They want numbers. They mostly pressure their people to put points on the board. They want a certian amount by months end.
Contrast that to a small (relatively) independant shop. The good ones (there is some bad in everything) build their business on goodwill and trust. They deliver more than expected, and gain many customers by referrals from happy customers. The numbers take care of themselves on a win - win model.
They want numbers. They mostly pressure their people to put points on the board. They want a certian amount by months end.
Contrast that to a small (relatively) independant shop. The good ones (there is some bad in everything) build their business on goodwill and trust. They deliver more than expected, and gain many customers by referrals from happy customers. The numbers take care of themselves on a win - win model.
07-13-2010, 05:02 PM
#31
07-13-2010, 07:06 PM
#32
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Join Date: Jun 2010
Location: Northern NJ
Posts: 81
http://lmgtfy.com/?q=gouging
(sorry, I've always wanted to use that site, not trying to be a jerk!)
And nah, I don't go OEM usually, I go OEM-spec, for example, this "OEM Quality" knock sensor at a monstrous price cut from a dealer's rate http://compare.ebay.com/like/140404926876?ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&rvr_id=&c rlp=1_263602_263632&UA=WVF%3F&GUID=ceb05df81290a0e204e48ab4ffcdec81&itemid=14040 4926876&ff4=263602_263632
or if you really want OEM... same item here, cheap. http://www.tnautoparts.net/servlet/t...-SENSOR/Detail
(sorry, I've always wanted to use that site, not trying to be a jerk!)
And nah, I don't go OEM usually, I go OEM-spec, for example, this "OEM Quality" knock sensor at a monstrous price cut from a dealer's rate http://compare.ebay.com/like/140404926876?ltyp=AllFixedPriceItemTypes&rvr_id=&c rlp=1_263602_263632&UA=WVF%3F&GUID=ceb05df81290a0e204e48ab4ffcdec81&itemid=14040 4926876&ff4=263602_263632
or if you really want OEM... same item here, cheap. http://www.tnautoparts.net/servlet/t...-SENSOR/Detail
07-14-2010, 04:14 AM
#33
07-14-2010, 06:34 AM
#34
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Join Date: Sep 2009
Location: Worcester, MA
Posts: 4,011
you guys are absolutely right, the dealers ALWAYS price gouge. They charge 100/hr for labor which is ridiculously high.
For that reason, whenever i go to the dealer, i always negotiate the price for maintenance work. they wanted to charge me 850 for replacing a few seals and o2 sensor. I got them down to 600.
Dealer or mechanic, you can always negotiate the price, especially if u feel the price is too high. Why wd u not
Courtesynissan.com ftw Btw
For that reason, whenever i go to the dealer, i always negotiate the price for maintenance work. they wanted to charge me 850 for replacing a few seals and o2 sensor. I got them down to 600.
Dealer or mechanic, you can always negotiate the price, especially if u feel the price is too high. Why wd u not
Courtesynissan.com ftw Btw
07-15-2010, 08:21 AM
#36
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Location: Worcester, MA
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07-16-2010, 09:20 AM
#39
08-01-2010, 04:25 PM
#40
Why are you getting so intense about defending dealerships, SteveB?
Dave B. has established himself as a human, complete with soul and empathy!, who gives great quotes on OEM parts for Maxima.org members. I have yet to read about someone getting a quote from Dave and a quote from their local dealer and picking their local dealer. Maybe you can link me to those threads..?
In any case, Courtesy Nissan is not repairing our cars, only sending us the parts needed to get the work done elsewhere. I'm sure they charge just as much for repairs as all the other dealers.
Dave B. has established himself as a human, complete with soul and empathy!, who gives great quotes on OEM parts for Maxima.org members. I have yet to read about someone getting a quote from Dave and a quote from their local dealer and picking their local dealer. Maybe you can link me to those threads..?
In any case, Courtesy Nissan is not repairing our cars, only sending us the parts needed to get the work done elsewhere. I'm sure they charge just as much for repairs as all the other dealers.