Ok, so about 2-months back an .org member by the name of Willy341 (Mark) gives me a call about doing some brakes on his '98 I30, and asks me what I recommend him to get for parts for something that's going to stop a little better than stock. I tell him that brembo cores drilled & slotted off of E-bay, w/ factory nissan pads and stainless steel lines is a pretty killer combination that doesn't really have the drawbacks of some other hi-per set-ups.

So a week or so later, Mark (Willy341) drops off his I30 along with all the parts that I recommend he get, (I later found out that he ended up buying the rotors in the group deal section, no biggie though) I do the brake job, analy clean the corrosion, prep everything, install goes great, like it should. I passed my A5 test years back when I went to school for this stuff. So Mark calls me on the way home: "Kevin, this thing is AMAZING, it stops better than any of the sports cars I've owned, I'm probably going to have you do the I35 brakes with the same thing except I'll probably hold off on the stainless lines"

Fast forward a few months, when I started in on the I35 brakes..........

Noticed the rotors were only drilled, not slotted. Blah, whatever.

Halfway through installing the rears, I happened to notice that one of them goes 'whoosh whoosh whoosh' when the wheel is spun. I wasn't to concerned though, since I knew that all corrosion had been removed from both the hub & wheel surfaces. I attributed it to the fact that I had only lightly tightened the lugs with an impact gun, I always do final tourqe of wheels with a tourqe wrench once it's on the ground.

So, I forgot about that, and continued on and installed all 4.

Drop car on ground, go to bed-in the brakes. I come to the first stop from 30-0 mph in 5-3 seconds, and as soon as I'm almost fully stopped the thing clunks like hell and throws me forward, I'm like "WTF!" So I immediatly turn around, at which point I can now hear the most horrid clunks, sounds like a damn wheel was about to fall off.

I pulled the drivers front wheel off, and start inspecting, and see nothing wrong, I'm confused as all hell now.

So I throw the car in Park and try to spin the wheel, it get's about 1/2 way around before, BAM, the caliper flexes outwards and I can't even turn the wheel by hand anymore!

I call mark, he tells me he ended up getting the rotors from the same place he got them from last time, importrp in the group deal section. "He didn't have brembo's in stock for the I35 though, but he assured me that the ones he was going to send out were just as good quality"

Don't worry, the part where I get mad is coming up soon
Well they weren't, they were JUNK, the rotors were so incredibly warped right from the box that I'm lucky the caliper or caliper brackets didn't suffer sever damage on the drivers front. There was metal bit's locked up in front of the pads. These rotors suck. They really screwed my schedule up, I had to lift the car back up, unbolt all the wheels, pull the caliper mounting brackets & parking brake cables, bring his stock rotors to the machine shop 20 minutes away, drive home 20 minutes, wait 2-hours for them to be turned, drive another 20 minutes, pick them up, drive back to the shop, clean them, reinstall & tourqe everything.

So obviously I had to charge Mark a little extra for this.

And NOW, instead of trying to give him a FULL refund including shipping, you're blaming it on the mechanic, giving him a hassle, and telling him he needs to "Ship the rotors back to me and if I find anything wrong with them I'll send out another set"

Well you messed up, because the mechanic happens to be on the .org

When you get those rotors back you're going to find something messed up alright, they have probably 1/4" of runout!!!!! And then what, you send him back some more? What good is that? We have no use for those china crap rotors, even if you send a set that doesn't have the most runout I've ever seen, they are obviously going to warp within 6 months.

I'm sorry but that is bad customer service, and it really erks me, Mark is one of my best customers, and a whicked nice guy, reading the following from him in a pm really pissed me off, I call that you "personally check the rotors before sending them out"

Anything less than a FULL refund is unnacceptable, and I will not delete this thread, or the links to it in my sig or your FS thread, until he recieves a full refund.

Thank you,
Sincerely,
Kevin Goodwin
774-766-7462

 

I see nothing unreasonable about that. customers complaining of defective products often pull stuff like that just to get another set of parts. I personally don't warranty any of my products until I've seen them firsthand. whether its your fault or the sellers (which these simply sound like defective rotors..), the burden of proof is on the buyer to show the parts are bad, not the seller to offer warranty on a problem he can't see.

Have Mark ship the bad rotors back to Automax and give him time to look at them and send another set back to Mark.

Unfortunately Mark is stuck in a bad spot as he has to pay someone to do the work and he's winding up paying for more than he should. politely see what AutoMax will do about that, but his only real liability is to the part itself and not the services required to install the part.

 

Kevin
I personally don't know you, and the way you post this is more of personal attack rather than an complaint about a situation. We have company policies and procedures that we have to follow for defective parts, we can't give customer a full refund just because HIS MECHANIC say the rotors are JUNK before we inspected, does that make sense? If the product is defective we will send ***** a new set, isn't that what it said in the p.m?
Wanna read more regarding our return/refund/warranty policy?
http://www.racetechperformance.com/terms.asp
I have been serving the maxima community for the last 6 years! i have ZERO complaints about my customer service, in fact i have one of the highest sellers rating on .org. What you are doing right now is to protect your customer in a horrible way. I sold over thousands of SETS of rotors to the maxima community and ZERO had compliant about the quality of our goods or our services, in fact most of our product we sell has a life time warranty.

Posting such Meaningless post doesn't get you anywhere.......

btw ***** only contacted me once
Our contact # are listed everywhere, he never called

and I personally inspect all the rotors myself before it goes out, you call bs? I will pay for your plane ticket to fly down to our new ware house and have you to check the way we operate our businesses.

Also defective parts are not a rare thing, out of couple hundreds or even thousands will have that 1% of defective rate. Even though we still have to inspect the defective parts before we issue refunds or send out new parts....

Don't you think is a little to early to post something like this before our final decision to either refund or not refund him? While the buyer only make contact with the seller ONCE?

 

I do not think that you can call the stuff that Kevin has posted "meaningless". He is a mechanic with a tight schedule who does not have time for stuff like this to happen. I have seen Mark's cars at his garage on multiple occasions and I have had Kevin work on my car countless times with no problems.

I do not think that Kevin did come off as attacking you, rather more, he is just upset with the "blaming the mechanic" deal. It cannot be the mechanic's fault if the product was faulty from the beginning. I can see his frustration because you claim to "inspect every rotor before sending them out". Maybe this one was mis inspected or just looked good....it is a hassle that he shouldn't need to deal with.

Kevin is a good mechanic, who does good work. I cannot see him lying in any way about this subject, he is the most honest mechanic I have ever met. I hope you can resolve this in a professional manner...I just wanted to voice my opinion.

 

Mistakes and defects happen; anyone should know this, especially a mechanic!

He is willing to fix the problem with a new set of rotors, get off your high horse and accept the fact that crap happens and yes, people sometimes get inconvenienced...

In my business we buy the best products and pay more for them, but guess what, we still have defects. You can't produce thousands-->millions of parts/products and have them all be perfect.

BTW, I have a set of rotors from AuToMaX 95 and I have had them for years with zero problems.

 

importrp??? thats a different seller, so I am a bit confused, cause if its supposed to be them then you may want to fix that.

Like its been said before no judgement on you at all. Its probably just a defect, sometimes its worth more to just let certain comments roll off your back and not let it get to you because not everything needs a comeback and not everything needs a response. I understand you want to defend your territory but honestly everyone here knows that your good mechanic, just as everyone knows Automax_95 is a good seller (I have experienced that first hand).

You went a bit to far when you posted in a Group Deal forum what you did. Do remember that maxima.org works because of sponsors who pay their dues. So lets not hinder there business because we do need sponsors.

 

What I meant when I said meaningless was, first of all he's not the buyer (Mark only contacted me once and only once)! Second, if he felt that the rotors were warp, shouldn't, from a MECHANIC's point of view just tell Mark, "hey, the rotor is warp contact automax_95 and have him resolve this." Rather than installing the rotor, turning it, and installing it on and off while wasting, what 2 hours? And then charge Mark extra money KNOWING THAT THE ROTOR WAS DEFECTIVE?!

And you also said Mark didn't personally attack me? Why don't you look at the topic of this thread, "JUNK ROTORS FROM AUTOMAX_95" bashing me and the parts i sell. I haven't even seen the rotors yet. I had dealt with rotors for the last 7 years, and I have my ASE certification. It doesnt mean anything to you does it? So what if he worked on your car and did a GREAT JOB and how Great of a person he is and such, what does that have to do with me, the seller. Especially I am currently handling the RMA process for *MARK*?

How have I not handle this in a professional matter can you please explain?

Blaming the mechanic deal? So blaming on the seller not refunding the buyer in full before the seller even see the defective parts is suppose to be okay?

I didn't blame him. Do you know how many message i get regarding the rotor making noise when they are installed. Why is the zinc plating on the surface of the rotor flack off, and how come this and that. I ask mark to check with his mechanic on the installation base on my pass experience. In many case alot of buyers just didn't do the proper break in procedure to have such a small problem.

I didn't said his lying, I am saying he came out too aggresive to personal attack me, while on the other hand mark only contacted me once, and I responded him in a timely matter regarding the situations.

Many who dealt with me in the pass know I work with the customers, many had came back to me more than numerous time, they are all happy with my customer service, thus i have gotten alot of feed backs on .org.

Look bottom line is, I don't know who kevin is, I really don't care who he is, his not my customer, I honestly don't care if his from .org my next door neighboor or what not, I take care of all my customers problem period. If they work with me, I work with them.

P.S I honestly don't care about the existence of this thread, we have policies to follow (you can bash on our defective parts all you want, it does not make a difference). What ever your(kevin) INPUT is, it doesn't change how I will deal with mark, you are only making the situation worse. I am here for 1 reason that is to support maxima.org, offer the cheapest price possible and excellent service and I stand by it.

I AM DONE WITH MY INPUT IF MARK HAS A PROBLEM ASK HIM TO CALL ME 909-348-7277

 

Automax_95:

I did not mean to come off as bashing you, I was only standing by Kevin as a good and trustworthy mechanic. I can understand you defending yourself and although the title may be harsh, but there is no reason to put me into the picture here.

By "handling this in a professional matter" I simply meant, that I hoped things would work out without any further dispute.

Seriously tho, it is not a big deal, stuff like this happens all the time. Return, inspect, and ship out the new ones and get on with it. I have been around retail and when someone has a problem, I was taught that the customer is always right.

Sorry to stir up any more controversy. I should stop posting in this thread now.

 

0123456789

 

And everybody that have and had been supporting me, I am very appreciated! at the end customers like you are the one who make us work even harder!

We will have a customer apprecaition sales during christmas for past customers only!

Best Regards
Jason

NOW I AM DONE!

 

what you said is 100% true and I agree with you, but the problem here is that, mark contacted me only once after kevin install the rotors. If he had contact me again or what not I would of takecare of him in more depth. We are busy moving to another location this past week, I getabout 10-15 p.ms a day, recently I had just reply couple sentence and I am done with. If mark was unhappy with the situation he should of contacted me ( thats my whole point) I will still take care of him no matter what, there is no need for kevin getting in the picture and post all that meaningless things, since I was still gonne take care mark if the parts were defective. I HAVE TO INSPECT THE PARTS BEFORE REFUND/EXCHANGE IS GIVEN ( you know what i mean)

okay I am done no more

 

enough said. mods close thread.

 

On behalf of Automax_95, as a close friend, partner, etc... I have some reasonable and common sense comments to make.

1st off, I have full front / rear set XD/Slotted rotors, PBR Ultimate pads, HID, clutch line and brake-line installed and purchased straight from Automax_95 for over 3 years, I have ZERO PROBLEM TO I T!!! I wont personally use or sell product that may put ME OR MY CUSTOMER IN DANGER, PERIOD !!!

.
This is funny if you're a professional mechanic like you said you are, and you knew better then anybody else that the rotors are defected once you saw it right out of the box, then let me ask you this, why did you waste 3 hours of your precious time installing, testing, uninstalling and then be MAD at the situation ?
Why not just tell your customer "Mark" that the rotors are defected, I do not want to take any responsibility in damaging your car because I know for sure it will and have Mark contact the seller and have them replaced ?
Its very simple, if a person buy a box of chocolate went home and open it up and then found the chocolate went bad which has mole on it, will he/she eat it ?

This is true, crap happens all at once whether you like it or not, rotors are tear and wear products, same thing for the drill bits that drill rotors. As a example, if the factory decide not to change out the dull drill bits, I guarantee every rotor wont be drilled to its optimum working condition. Nothing in the world last forever, they gotta retire some day sooner or later. I work w/ Automax_95 in real life as partners, we have strict guidelines in our business which means inspect our product before they were ship out, test our HID KITS before they were ship out, respond customer demands/question/comments in a timely manner, Process RMA if product were within warranty period and much much more, and human error do occur. Automax_95 might have miss-looked the rotors on that day, after all we are all humans, no one is perfect. We Pack our lighting product and brake product with the best protective way we could think of, if the product were not defective to begin with, then the UPS guy decided to throw the package around which result in product damage, then I have no power to stop him once he leave our warehouse.

I don't see the point of this hatred personal attack, by calling other people's product JUNK while they have good reputation over the past 7-years on maxima.org What would you feel if people starting to call your service CRAP when in deed you're a knowledgeable and responsible mechanic right ?

MY LIFE IS FULL OF S*&T, I CHOOSE TO DEAL WITH IT, BECAUSE RUNNING IS NOT AN OPTION.

 

thanks buddy but i think every one get the point now. lets get the thread lock or something....

 

Are you kidding me? Did you not get what I was saying?

I wasted 25 minutes uninstalling your rotors, I wasted 2+ hours dealing with getting his stock rotors machined so that I could get the car out the door and back on the road!

That is completely understandable, and almost a given. But the fact remains you told Mark when he called you that you would only issue him a replacement set of rotors, that does no good at this point, this is what I have a problem with.

The second time he called you, you stated that if the rotors were indeed bad, you would issue him a refund, minus shipping & a 15% restocking fee! The shipping is understandable, but a 15% restocking fee is not, especially since he had to pay me for three hours time & machine shop labor so that I could get his car done.

Side note: The reason I had to get involved, is because my technical information about how the whole job got screwed up and that it wasn't the mechanics fault isn't something Mark could relay to you. Firsthand account of the hassle caused by these rotors > secondhand account.

The fact remains, you were quick to re-assure Mark that these rotors were just as good of quality.

Cool, I've bought stainless clutch lines off of you twice, and sent countless others your way.

 

ISP check anyone? Your english is just as bad, leaves me with suspicions.

Also, by "out of the box" I meant "brand new" Not that I saw them right away. You can't SEE runout, it must be measured with a dial indicator, even as bad as these were.

I bang out all four sides on a complete brake job, and final tourqing of the wheels is done on the ground, so they didn't get noticed until the road test. Also, I never thought $18 autozone rotor's > these.

 

First of all, It's IP address not ISP

A person's English has nothing to do with their business practices, This is direct evidence that this thread was meant as a personal attack.



But that's not the point of this issue



In all honesty, you, being Mark's mechanic, have nothing to do with how he goes about purchasing/returning/exchanging rotors from Jason, you should have Mark take care of the problem instead of going out of your way to post negative feedback all over the .org. If anything, it should have been Mark that posted the threads.

Like other people said, defects happen. It's understandable.

It does not take 2+ hours to resurface OEM rotors. My shop only takes about 15 minutes each with their machine.

But that's not the point of this thread.




If anything, let Mark handle the problem, you should drop it.





I can vouch for Maxima.org that Automax is an excellent vendor.
I bought many things from Jason already, all of my transactions were smooth.

 

A business' public communications do need to reflect a level of professionalism.

Personally, I don't believe this thread was warranted it seems that the OP took something personal and created much ado about nothing. It looks like a simple case of a defective product.

However, the hard to read and emotional (albeit understandable) replies do more harm than the content of the original thread. I certainly understand your need to reply but you must do so in a measured fashion in order to get the maximum benefit out of the exchange. Keep it professional (in tone and in presentation) and not personal.

I hope this situation is resolved to the satisfaction of both parties.

 

I think it's reasonable for the business to inspect the rotors and if they are bad they replace them, end of story....

We are done here....

 

Any experienced mechanic wouldn't have noticed the warp and then continued on with the install. I would have checked the runout IMMEDIATELY after noticing the rotor running funny. If you did your job properly, you would have never put the rotors on, never had to uninstall them, never had to get them worked on and Mark wouldn't had to pay anything extra (other than the minimal time to take the parts off again mid-install)

So if the parts are defective, Automax should replace them. BUT for these types of parts, almost NO ONE will replace sight unseen. I've been in the puchasing business for well over 10 years and this is a 100% legitmate policy.

Automax or even Mark for this matter shouldn't be responsible for something you should have noticed. Always inspect the parts BEFORE you put them in. A 1/4" runout would be noticable just by putting the rotors on a flat surface.