turbo97SE

iTrader: (3)

It's in the instructions! Step 1. Tie Lan cable to boost pipe, it improves boost response

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

* LAN cable sold separately and is needed for people pushing over 20 psi.

hlh0501

iTrader: (1)

Nigel, in regards to maf placement:
Thats all I have to say... ask how many of my customers have anny idle/stalling issues which will lead to future problems (improper cooldown before turning off after hard runs)? 0. How many broken maf's? 0.


In regards to oil tapping. I think we can agree upper oil pan is the ideal place, yes, I am even trying to make this a standard deal now, but it is not cheap as we all know! That picture you have, I am curious do you have a clear lower oil pan or how do you know exactly where the oil level is in your car when it is running? I have been told my a 9year nissan tech that oil level is only near top of the oil pan, and we tap the top of the oil pan...

have you measured what angle your oil exits the turbo , because I quote Page 44 of "MAXIMUM BOOST" by Corky Bell, about the most highly recognized boosting book... on oil return from a turbo
"....a near-vertical downward alignment of the oil drain hole. Veritcal is the ideal alignment, but where necessary, the deviation may be as great as 30 degrees."
"keep in mind that no oil pressure exists after the bearing, and low-pressure flow requires much greater flow area for equal flow rates....Ideally, the drain hose should swoop smoothly downward and arc gently over into the oil pan with no kinks, sharp bends, or rises."
and it sure looks like your oil return from the pictures you have released of the kit, is closer to horizontal than being within 30degrees of vertical.. is your car still running to the valve cover these days, if not, what was your reason for changing?

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

I didn't think you would post that!

BTW, at least we didn't have to use my belt.

So are we tossing the Fields for an S-AFC?

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

6psi Ok...maybe 8psi.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Works fine...verified with CLEAR tubing.

I'd guesstimate 15-degrees.

joaquink

So I could finish the drive home instead of making Alex push while I sipped a cold one.

The piping popped off. The IC pulls on the entire structure running to the throttle body because it's not supported on the passenger side. On the passenger side you cut an "n" shaped hole (open at the bottom) in the unibody and on the driver's side you cut an "o" shaped hole. As a result, there is no support on the passenger side. I'm going to have to fabricate something to help hold it up.

passenger's side driver's side

KevinG managed to wiggle the piping through without cutting out the bottom of the hole. I tried a few times but it didn't look to me like I could do that without removing the radiator and assorted goodies. Even then, it would have been tight so I elected to skip it. Looking back, I wish I would have done exactly that.

turbo97SE

iTrader: (3)

That's pretty WEAK considering all the links I have given. No one mentioned idling issues, none from me that's for sure. Broken MAFs? well, it's early days.

My valve cover is still draining my oil just fine. I personally don't like it cos it doesn't look quite as clean, (asthetics) and of course we all agree upper oil pan of course. I have also read Maximum Boost, I have the book. Actually, Brent (owner of PFI) is personal friends with Corky Bell, One of Brent's first turbo hondas was a joint effort with Corky. In fact, somewhere in the book is a picture of that very engine ... anyway that's besides the point. The book is one of the best books out there no contradiction there, but there are others! The one I quoted also is a leading book. Both books are a little dated, but have good fundamentals.

With regard to your quote, take a look at page 99, there appears to be an air flow meter at the turbo inlet. Take a look at page 224 and you will see that one of the kits he has chosen to show as an install kit has an airbox with guess what ... an airlfow meter before the turbo! Hmmmm! Indeed it IS a wonderful book!

My day is just getting better and better!

Please people let's look past the pricing for just a little while and see how much thought and effort has gone into this kit as well as proven performance ... people just keep looking at what is included in the price, sure price is important - just remember you get what you pay for ... some people may beg to differ

Bags

iTrader: (3)

More of my 2 cents



On the MAF issue, I have taken my car to several shops in the atlanta area, Balanced Performance ( they do lots of 240's and 300's and the only skyline in atlanta ) was the only shop to mention moving it to before the turbo to me.

I have hal's kit, stalling , NOPE no issues. Oil backing up into the turbo yep, I did have that. BUT it was not just the tapping into the lower oil pan.

It was also a sagging return line and using a smaller than an 8AN hose.

I wish people would have mentioned HEAT to me. I did not realize how much heat is made by a turbo. I guess I was foolish to think that this was plug and play. Due to the fact I was not prepared for the little issues ( boost leaks , exhaust leaks, heat damage, oil leaks, smoking turbo , etc ) This caused me lots of headaches, but I have learned alot in a month.

At this point in modding even the SC is not plug and play. But you learn and move forward.

Folks like mardi,turbomax,kev,i30krab,loren,etc have been working for YEARS on boost and all the problems and success. And they have SHARED in the downfalls as well as the good times

I guess what I am trying to say is, all the "differences" between these 2 kits seem really SMALL to me. BUT, all the info in this thread is HUGE.

You have 2 people qouting books for god's sake. If each one of them would take some time and share what they know, EVERYONE would learn something. If they would share what has worked and what has not, then someone else may not make the same mistake. Or even improve on the idea, but "WE" seem to like to keep things to ourselves. ( Me included ) I guess "WE" just want to be the 1st/only or whatever.

Oh well my rant. Keep it coming I am learning more... and I am taking notes and maybe I can come up with some idea that will be worth while on sharing... or maybe I will share my pitfalls, like melting a wiring harness that was too close to the turbo.

But that is my 4 cents.. to much typing for just 2 cents

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

4.25 quarts is quite a bit... a lot more that what the lower oil pan will hold. Yes, all the oil is swooshing around in the engine... but not that much. You'll have to drop the lower oil pan and see where the low/high marks are on the dip stick. And if I recall correctly, the marks are higher than the top of the lower oil pan.

hlh0501

iTrader: (1)

I have run MAF's on both sides, have you? I and customers prefer to have a car that will run properly without stalling after boost, etc w/out having to buy even more equipment. SAFC is necessary anyways you say? I have run one before also w/ larger injectors, but currently am not - but tell me why my dyno is verry close to 12.5 a/f without one or any other devices..

And proven performance? Is that altitude corrected or uncorrected proven? With your kit how much hp exactly can one expect to see, because I was under the impression (from experience) that the stock fuel pump is not going to push enough for more than a few pounds of boost (maybe up to 7-8ish if you really stretch it?) which is why you would notice I include a Walbro with my kit now. And stock exhaust, I assume that does not restrict your kit at all?

Your "proven performance" I have yet to see a dyno or a quote of what your exact kit without mods, addons, etc puts down with the stock muffler and piping considering that isn't included either. Granted I have seen your dyno's (altitude corrected 429whp, but then I also saw you post in the same post "Just for the record, I went back and checked the dyno numbers uncorrected, they are actually 364.7 HP"), but are you telling me I am going to get your same numbers when I purchase your 3790$ kit?

KEV: you are looking at a dipstick with the engine off, are you not? oil level will be much higher at that point. unless your dipstick will read even with engine running (mine and others i know of just smear up and down the stick) i'd say that is not a good way to check considering the turbo is not running when the car is off..

4signs

iTrader: (2)

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

interesting thread....very interesting.

turbo97SE

iTrader: (3)

Have I run MAF on both sides ... no .. do I intend to? ... no. Do I need to? Also no. Your quotes and misquotes just get you deeper and deeper and you never go back to answer my points. You just try to bring up something different. Agreed, the stock pump won't hold much more than psi unless you get injectors or AFC, there are different ways to deliver fuel, the choice is up to you. Corrected/uncorrected numbers, doesn't matter what you take cos it is more than any other kit has posted. As far as exhaust is concerned, some already have aftermarket exhausts some don't, granted they are 2.5" exhaust vs your 3", but your 2.5" restricts it anyway as does our crush part under the transmission for clearance. We can make it so that the crush is not there if you are willing to give up some clearance. If you are telling me you can fit a 3" pipe under the car and not lose clearance, I would have to say that you are being economical with the truth.

Baggs, as far as heat is concerned, I have had no problems with heat at all nothing has melted. I don't know what melted for you but I suspect the wiring close to the engine block on the driver's side, am I right there?

As far as quoting books, well maybe we know nothing about turbos and that is why we keep quoting books. But if you're going to quote, please make sure it supports your case!

well it's been fun .. later ...

... MUCH later ...!

hlh0501

iTrader: (1)

Haha, i don't? speaking of, you never got around to saying what your highest-end kit dynoed, the 3790$ one - just the kit, because how can you say it is more than "any other kit has posted" if you yourself do not have any dynos of the kit? I can post 400+ dynoes, but that is not what my customers are buying... same story with you.

(in regards to the dyno: call bs, i dont care. I am not here to discuss that because I have "no posted dynoes, no claimed numbers" other than a 13.2 which was ages ago and about my worst run! that i shouldn't even have posted.. I am not making any dyno claims just as i won't claim 12's on street tires.. but if you know me or my car.. then you know It is not worth the hassle on the internet.)

I think I am about finished with this thread, it has been fun - and I think the information is clear enough.

JeffesonM

iTrader: (5)

thank you guys... for a thread that is both informative, and entertaining.

Cumalittle

i am actually suprise w/ the amount of replies that were given...up until this thread...i feel alot of info was kept in secrecy...now some light is shed into potential problems w/ potential kits for potential customers...

RS Motorsports

iTrader: (3)

hey nigel i sent you an email about the bbq your pm box is full, hope you can make it.
Ryan

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

Of course you measure oil with the engine off, but do you remember how far down the dipstick goes? I'm sure you do if you dropped an oil pan before. Let's just say it doesn't go as far down as you think/assume.

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

Also, you won't see a smear... more like splatter all over the stick because the oil is moving. This is why you are suppose to wait a while after stopping the engine to measure oil level.

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

"smear up and down the stick" meaning there is oil where turbo oil is trying to return to, which is why we do not want oil going back so low.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

You're having a conversation with YOURSELF!

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

A&W Cream Soda with lunch... Pepsi Twist with breakfast.

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

out of all this I have one question, other than HLH's claimed 13.2...why have there been no track numbers?? dyno pulls are nice, but whats up with the track?? just wondering if there is a reason for the lack of timeslips

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Track+FWD+turbo=Broken Stuff

joaquink

Some people make modifications for their own enjoyment or the challenge of doing it rather than to brag about it or whatever by running down a 1/4 mile. I certainly don't, "live my life 1/4 mile at a time". In fact, I'm about to lay the smackdown on a friend if he asks about it again. Some people are scared to take the car to the track. Some just want street kills. Some aren't very good drivers. The same car might trip at 12.4 vs. 13.5 just by changing the driver. And so on and so forth.

If you want a timeslip for a turbo-charged Maxima, buy/build a turbo setup, take it to the track and report back to us.

Move along...

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

For me it is very inconvenient. I either have to sit in SF Bay Area rush hour traffic, take a day off work, or drive really far to the next closest track in rush hour traffic.

This one time we almost made it (took vacation day) but Matthel's car started overheating. His car probably wouldn't have started to overheat if Daniel (mingo) met up with us on time.

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

Hit Alex for me too please.

Thank you!

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

It's not me. He's got a 12-sec. Eclipse friend.

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

He's talking about this:
http://boostedmaximas.com/y2kevse/images/turbo3/08.jpg

joaquink

Show Off!

And what's with this free stuff for people that already benefit from the pains, crap instructions, higher prices, long waits, missing parts, returns, replacements and so on that the earlier people had to endure? HKS SSQBOV included now, Tial WG included now, and another freebie on top of that (boost gauge, turbo timer per Nigel's post).

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

"move along"....and who the **** are you?? and whats with the attitude....its a simple question!

and BTW, they'll be plenty of slips once the turbo 3rd gen me and buddy are working is finished so thanks I suggest that you please move along....know who you are talking to before you step yourself out there and insult someone, thanks. " "

joaquink

And Alex, Kevin and I gave you answers. Alex even provided a mathematical proof. And was that, "who the fukk are you??" or, "who the he!! are you" or something else? I may have slightly different answers for you depending on how emphatically you want to know. Basically I am just a puny, scrawny, uneducated and unemployed weakling of a 4th gen owner with no boost or mods done to my car. Heck, I don't even know how to take the tires off myself.

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

wtf.. how is everyone getting free gauges? no one told me of this

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Now that's the BIGGEST I've read in awhile!

Joaquin = punny, scrawny phhhhhhhhhalese. Hahahaha.

Unemployed? Hmmmn.

4th gen.
18x8 OZ wheels/Nitto
Kyb AGX/H&R
Wilwood BBK
Nigel T3/T4 turbo kit w/FMIC Tial WG/HKS BOV
Apexi EGT, Boost
Blitz DSBC
Fields AFC
Quaife differential
SPEC clutch
Fidanza Flywheel
Poly motor mounts

Oh wait....and a broken cup holder. I guess I need to lose my job.

Sprint

iTrader: (10)

holy ****

my cup holder is broken too

DA-MAX

iTrader: (10)

I'll ignore the sarcasm....but yes their answers were fine, but there was no need for your extra comments in your post....thats all I'm saying, when someone asks a valid question in the proper thread theres no need to get an attitude, simple as that! if you have other issues in your life no need to vent your anger over the internet at others.

Y2KevSE

iTrader: (13)

Should done it my way.







I wish we were getting a free gauge.

joaquink

Yeah, pretty much all the people are doing it.

I'll vent something else then



I agree but it was too late. Or perhaps the instructions should have provided the option. Or perhaps a support bracket (or two) should be supplied to hold the piping in place. The little metal bars PFI sent sure are cute but they sit below the IC anyway and would only serve to keep it from dropping to the ground rather than to hold it in position. This should be addressed - regardless of how the MAF and oil-tap arguments get resolved.