Cumalot

iTrader: (8)

Serioiusly, I highly doubt I will get a turbo kit. However, I will keep the car and not return it back to stock anymore. Maybe get a bodykit though.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Hmmmmnnn...that has me thinking about a CVT for any belt driven compressor.

I wonder how complicated that would be. Basically, instead of having a FIXED pulley diameter, it would change from a small pulley to spin the charger faster when RPM's are low and then move to the desired diameter for x-psi limit.

IF that was possible, I'd bet the torque curve would look very much like a TC torque curve you desire.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

Yes, that is right. Also, another contributor to turbo lag is an intercooler. The air volume in an intercooler needs to be compressed before the boost pressure reaches the intake manifold, so you want to be careful how you size your IC. You want it big enough to do the job of handling the airflow and removing heat, but not so big that you have to compress a needlessly large volume of air in the intake tract.

This is only something I've seen talked about. I don't know if anybody is actually developing something like this. But it would be pretty cool to have a variable speed drive with a clutch mechanism that engaged when you punched it and maintained the blower at a fixed high rpm while the engine revved up to redline. You would have the torque curve of a turbo (possibly better at top end), but you would also have a certain amount of lag time as the blower spooled up, just like a turbo.

Or maybe eventually they'll develop a 40 kW alternator capable of powering an electric motor driven blower. Sort of like the ebay toy electric superchargers, only sized to actually produce significant boost and cfm.

I'm not sure if these ideas are any better than using exhaust gas energy, though, except maybe for the heat factor.

JAY25

iTrader: (38)

I was only joking

thebigsadler

iTrader: (4)

mm.. short drive for me to a meet, that would be a first. and i get a new fartcan soon!!

Bags

iTrader: (3)

Due to the fact I am an Auto I can only test that 100% in 1st gear.

I can sort of test it in 2nd gear.

In 1st @ 3000 RPM I am about 2-3 PSI.. That is a close guess... I can't look at the boost gauge and drive 100%..lol

I am using a grainger air compressor valve for my MBC. Total cost $14

I have 5 PSI set on the wastegate.

Now I can brake boost. I am getting a little better at that and let me tell you that makes a WORLD of difference


And everyone mentions lag, those that have ridden in my car understand from a dead stop once I hit 2700 RPM there is NO more lag in any gear.

When I want boost I work my auto and get it. I downshift manually and hammer it.

Brake boosting puts me @ 0 boost, but as soon as I let off the brake and floor it the boost shoots to 7/8 PSI

I wish we would have taped it I would like to see it from the outside looking in.

According to my friend in th GS 400 behind he said after the 3rd honk we were OUT

I may be dynoing this week as well, this has made me want to find out the REAL WHP I am putting down

sorry for the book, but there is lag in EVERY turbo, just not much in mine.

I am sure I will pay for that in peak HP, but I have that planned as well

nismo2020

iTrader: (1)

no , gonna install it soon though.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

That's exactly what we need.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

MB has a clutch that engages/disengages the SC, however it's more for fuel consumption reasons. It disengages for normal driving to not spin the SC, but if you step on it, it engages the clutch very similar to the A/C compressor clutch. Supposedly, there is a limit point at which the belt will snap if you engage the clutch, so you can't activate the SC above a certain RPM.

That will be a possibility once the 42V electrical systems start coming out in about 2yrs.. Garrett has pioneered an electrically ASSISTED turbocharger that virtually eliminates lag. Basically, you run a LARGE turbo that would normally lag at low exhaust gas velocity, but use an electric motor to PRE-spool it. Kind of like the track Supras use nitrous I guess.

However, imagine once the aftermarket gets ahold of this. You'll be able to push a button, spool the turbo to a desired boost, and then floor the car and allow the exhaust to take over. You'll see people stuffing EVEN BIGGER turbos in their cars after that.

turbo97SE

iTrader: (3)

Bah! Get a two step, retard timing about 20 degrees and you have full boost at idle!

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

...ala WRC style.

Dave B

Bags-
Sounds like your turbo is running a bit better if you're pretty much neck and neck with a mid-high 13 second SC Max.


Everyone else-
I personally think going automatic with the turbo is the only real way to go because you don't loose boost on shifts, you can launch under boost, and then there's the huge torque advantage. I'd think the ultimate 1/4 mile Maxima would be a 8-9 psi turbo auto with a beefed up tranny, VB mod, slightly higher stall converter, and a set of the 3.80 gears out of the 5 speed. The torque (torque converter stall, gearing, turbo) from this setup would be immense and the topend power would be there. Most turbo guys know that autos are the best for drag racing. Look at most of the quickest WRXs, Supras, and 300ZXTTs and they're all autos.

Jay's SC probably makes more peak power and gives the car slightly better topend pull (100mph+), but Bag's turbo auto most likely makes more power under the curve and the torque is relatively flat which makes a car feel slower than it really is. An excellent example is the LT1 F-Body vs the LS1 F-Body. You'd swear the LT1 is much stronger than the LS1 just by feel because the LT1 pins you in seat and on every shift. The LS1 just feels smooth and powerful and doesn't have near the "slam" on every gear. Race these two cars side by side and watch the LS1 walk away from 60mph+. The LT1 has a fairly flat torque curve with power dropping at around 5100rpms, the LS1 on the otherhand has a torque curve (which is higher than the LT1a) as flat as Florida and keeps pulling to nearly 6000rpms. That's a huge difference and the LS1 walks.


Dave

RastaManMax

iTrader: (5)

Roots type blowers give a lot of torque compared to centrifugal, true, but there is no substitute for turbo... A lot of people don't know this, but the efficiency of the roots blower decreases with increased boost pressure... What this means is that the sky isn't the limit like it is with a turbo, you cannot run insane amounts of boost in a roots type blower... That all being said, i still want a roots because of streetability and torque...

JAY25

iTrader: (38)

If roots blowers are the bomb why arent the new cobras going around owning everyone? why arent the GTP owning us with their roots blowers

Craig I hate to bring it to you man but the Turbo will out do our V1s and 2's. How ever what I love about the Vortech kits is that they are reliable as long as everything fits properly(f8cking stand off bolts etc.)no over heating issues and the list goes on. How ever after thorough tests conducted by myself, Baggs and Ramius even with all that heat under the hood, Turbo still ruled the supercharger and the turbo max had a broken Variable Intake. Preventive measures can be taken to take care of the motor i...e....flush your radiator fluid every summer, change your oil, tune the air fuel ratio, wrap the pipes w/fiberglass wrap, ceramic coat the turbo pipes, get a oil cooler and so on.....same **** you do when you get supercharged, common sense stuff etc..

Bags

iTrader: (3)

so jay.. it's NOT good when your radiator overflow.......................................... ............



overflows??????????????????????????

Dave B

They do own us. PERIOD. Go to www.ClubGP.com and check out the 1/4 mile section. They're not like us where we have one guy in the 11s, a couple in the 12s, and a handful in the 13s. They've got one guy in the 10s, 7 in the 11s, 45+ in the 12s, and God knows how many in the 13s because it's just so damn easy. Add a $900 intercooler setup, cam ($400), rockers ($400), ECU ($250), 2.8" pulley ($80), headers ($900), and some other I/E tweaks ($400) and you're looking at upper 12s. Buy the regeared and beefed up 4T65E tranny for $3500 and you're looking at 12.6-12.7s. This is also in a non-stripped 3400lbs car. The SC 3800 is todays Buick GN/T-Type.

Roots blower might be ineffiecent, but they makes loads of streetable power which is what most of us want. I could care less about turbo dyno and highway queens. I want a car that gets from 0-120mph in the least amount of time while putting down all the power. I'll be the first in line the day someone developes a Roots blower for the 4th gen. I'll take 300fwtq@2000rpms and 260fwhp@6000rpms over 350fwhp@6000rpms and 250fwtq@4500rpms. I like muscle.

As for the SC Cobras. Kenne Bell SC, exhaust, smaller pulley, ECU tweak = ~520rwhp with nearly 500rwtq and upper 10 second performance in a 3600lb car with amazing reliability. Sounds like a deal to me


Dave

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

well the GTP's have a much easier time getting those times since they come with sc's stock.

if the maxima came stock with turbo or sc i'm sure there would be a lot of maximas with those times too.

JAY25

iTrader: (38)

you know that 95Max I just bought, it god a jay25 tune up, big 300TT fuel filter, a complete radiator flush , and new sparkplugs and got dropped w/sprints and tockicos. I am loving the **** out of that automagic.

JAY25

iTrader: (38)

I accidentaly threw the mustang cobras in there by mistake and did not even realized it, I was thinking thurderbird but typed in cobra that was a typ-0 since those are the ones with roots type blowers, not the new cobras, busy tired day tired day yesterday, sorry about that.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

No, you were right in the first place. I went to the Ford dealer yesterday to get a part for my POS Exploder, and they had a brand new Cobra with the hood up. An Eaton roots blower was sitting on the engine.

Dave B

Well you were right in that they do come with Roots blowers now. The reason they're so powerful is because they're intercooled (like the Lightning) which helps them push a lot more power. As for the Roots SC Thunderbird, I wouldn't worry about that one. 13s is about the best most guys do with those and a small pulley. It's too heavy and a POS.

Have you guys seen the video of the Kenne Bell SC Cobra doing a 2mph-160mph run? It's pretty freaking insane. He mashes it in 1st and short shifts the 1-2 at 5000rpms. In 8 seconds he goes from a slight roll (2mph) to 100mph. In 25 seconds total, he's doing 160mph.



Dave

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

have a link to the video?

Dave B

Tell me this wouldn't be fun

http://www.nothingelseleft.com/cobra...%20KBcobra.wmv


Dave

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

that's awesome!!

nismo2020

iTrader: (1)

that was bad as hell

mtcookson

iTrader: (2)

only 3587 miles on the odo... lol