INJECTORS: VQ30DE vs. VQ30DE-K vs. VQ35DE?
10-09-2003, 07:53 PM
#81
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,275
e-manage
Yea Ive talked to a few people about the eManage and they say its crap. It is a glorified SAFC2, but some of these people have had problems trying to get it to work with the maxima ecu's.
Dixit[/QUOTE]
I'll let you guys know in the next week or two whether or not e-manage is worth it because I have the COMPLETE E-manage setup w/the Profec E-01 boost controller so I dont need a laptop. Its abbout 60% installed but It should be done by the weekend and I'll try to dyno then. All those optional harnesses are where we are at this point. DONT COUNT IT OUT YET! Because no one IMO has given it a legit chance yet and you cant count how it works on other cars. Sounds like you guys have been drinkin a lil too much hatorade!!! I made the investment when my S-AFC got fried and I'm going to defend it until it proves me wrong first hand. The sources I've spoken to say its awesome.... so we'll see.
I'm disappointed to hear about the cartech not being able to adjust base fuel pressure though. Here it is I thought I had one of the best FPR on the market in the cartech. Maybe it will react better in conjuction w/bigger injectors we'll have to see. It may react differently on the 5th Gen.
Deac
Dixit[/QUOTE]
I'll let you guys know in the next week or two whether or not e-manage is worth it because I have the COMPLETE E-manage setup w/the Profec E-01 boost controller so I dont need a laptop. Its abbout 60% installed but It should be done by the weekend and I'll try to dyno then. All those optional harnesses are where we are at this point. DONT COUNT IT OUT YET! Because no one IMO has given it a legit chance yet and you cant count how it works on other cars. Sounds like you guys have been drinkin a lil too much hatorade!!! I made the investment when my S-AFC got fried and I'm going to defend it until it proves me wrong first hand. The sources I've spoken to say its awesome.... so we'll see.
I'm disappointed to hear about the cartech not being able to adjust base fuel pressure though. Here it is I thought I had one of the best FPR on the market in the cartech. Maybe it will react better in conjuction w/bigger injectors we'll have to see. It may react differently on the 5th Gen.
Deac
10-09-2003, 08:00 PM
#82
Deac, the best FMU is technically the SFMU since it can do both, problem is that it is still disk driven. But Vortech does that that bleeder valve to bleed off the boost so in a sense it comes a cartech style again.
Dixit
Dixit
10-10-2003, 01:31 AM
#83
Originally Posted by BigDogJonx
Thomas, what are the 5 Earl fittings for? Also does anyone have shots of how this is installed on the rail? Im having trouble picturing it?
Dixit
Dixit
btw, eManage/profec e01 works great for me. does a lot more than the safc2. you can log everything that the eManage reads - boost, rpm, throttle position, duty cycle, air flow, etc at 10 samples/sec for as much memory as you have on your laptop. also, it gives you a 16x16 map that lets you set your own rpm points for air flow, duty cycle, and ignition timing. furthermore, for air flow, you can reference to a map sensor if you are past the capacity of your stock MAF sensor, or you can opt to use a MAF from another car and the eManage will adjust accordingly. and the annoying stalling problem that an open atmosphere BOV gives you when the MAF is on the non pressurized side - eManage takes care of that.
10-10-2003, 04:08 AM
#84
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,275
Originally Posted by sx7r
one is a plug to plug the extra inlet port, 2 are 9/16 to -6 AN that screw into the inlet and outlet port, and 2 are -6 AN to barbed to connect stock fuel lines to the FPR. I'll take a pic for you tomorrow.
btw, eManage/profec e01 works great for me. does a lot more than the safc2. you can log everything that the eManage reads - boost, rpm, throttle position, duty cycle, air flow, etc at 10 samples/sec for as much memory as you have on your laptop. also, it gives you a 16x16 map that lets you set your own rpm points for air flow, duty cycle, and ignition timing. furthermore, for air flow, you can reference to a map sensor if you are past the capacity of your stock MAF sensor, or you can opt to use a MAF from another car and the eManage will adjust accordingly. and the annoying stalling problem that an open atmosphere BOV gives you when the MAF is on the non pressurized side - eManage takes care of that.
btw, eManage/profec e01 works great for me. does a lot more than the safc2. you can log everything that the eManage reads - boost, rpm, throttle position, duty cycle, air flow, etc at 10 samples/sec for as much memory as you have on your laptop. also, it gives you a 16x16 map that lets you set your own rpm points for air flow, duty cycle, and ignition timing. furthermore, for air flow, you can reference to a map sensor if you are past the capacity of your stock MAF sensor, or you can opt to use a MAF from another car and the eManage will adjust accordingly. and the annoying stalling problem that an open atmosphere BOV gives you when the MAF is on the non pressurized side - eManage takes care of that.
Yes another e-manage supporter. Do you have all the options installed to? The harnesses n stuff? I may need some advice from you. If you have any advice on what I should watch out for or how best to tune it, PLEASE PM me. Thanx...
Deac
10-10-2003, 09:41 AM
#85
![[maxi-overdose]'s Avatar](https://maxima.org/forums/customavatars/avatar1856_1.gif){kind=avatar}
Originally Posted by BigDogJonx
Maxi - this is where alot of people are confused, even kevin was at one point till Mardis pointed it out to him. The cartech does NOT adjust base pressure. The top screw basically is an adjustment of when you want the cartech to take over the FP. Thats the one advantage it has, gives you a bit of fine tuning ability. Like normal FMU work when boost comes in, well this one works the same, except you can dial down on the cartech at what PSI when the boost comes in you want it to take control of the FP.
Dixit
even my dyno shop told me the Billet FMU is adjustable for base fuel pressure.
http://atpturbo.bigstep.com/item.htm...0&PRID=1390327
btw, Cartech is Billet, right?
10-10-2003, 09:57 AM
#86
It may have all those features, but I've read Greddy tuner from Japan was flown over for the 350z TT install and couldn't get the ignition timing to work, have you? How about replacing the MAF with MAP?
Also, you're still limited to the amount of fuel the STOCK ECU can trim out under closed loop for the bigger injectors. The eManage only changes open-loop maps, same as S-AFC, and it's by tricking the MAF voltage to the ECU. I know the Greddy 350z is supposedly running 440cc injectors, but I doubt it's still daily driven. Running at WOT on the track is one thing. Driving stop and go with short trips to work/store and running way too rich is another.
Also, you're still limited to the amount of fuel the STOCK ECU can trim out under closed loop for the bigger injectors. The eManage only changes open-loop maps, same as S-AFC, and it's by tricking the MAF voltage to the ECU. I know the Greddy 350z is supposedly running 440cc injectors, but I doubt it's still daily driven. Running at WOT on the track is one thing. Driving stop and go with short trips to work/store and running way too rich is another.
Originally Posted by sx7r
btw, eManage/profec e01 works great for me. does a lot more than the safc2. you can log everything that the eManage reads - boost, rpm, throttle position, duty cycle, air flow, etc at 10 samples/sec for as much memory as you have on your laptop. also, it gives you a 16x16 map that lets you set your own rpm points for air flow, duty cycle, and ignition timing. furthermore, for air flow, you can reference to a map sensor if you are past the capacity of your stock MAF sensor, or you can opt to use a MAF from another car and the eManage will adjust accordingly. and the annoying stalling problem that an open atmosphere BOV gives you when the MAF is on the non pressurized side - eManage takes care of that.
10-10-2003, 12:18 PM
#87
Originally Posted by [maxi-overdose]
so the top screw is used to make the cartech kicks in and take over the fuel at certain amount of boost?
even my dyno shop told me the Billet FMU is adjustable for base fuel pressure.
http://atpturbo.bigstep.com/item.htm...0&PRID=1390327
btw, Cartech is Billet, right?
even my dyno shop told me the Billet FMU is adjustable for base fuel pressure.
http://atpturbo.bigstep.com/item.htm...0&PRID=1390327
btw, Cartech is Billet, right?
http://www.bellengineering.net/fmu2020instruc.html That is the link to Bell's site (maker of Cartech FMU) and the instruction guide to the FMU.
The rising rate regulators fit into the fuel system after the stock regulator, and in series with it. They become the last item before the fuel returns to the tank. Do not remove the stock regulator, as it still controls the fuel flow under most manifold vacuum conditions.
Also here is what they say about the top screw so you better understand what I was trying to say earlier.
The first adjustment is of fuel pressure is at the atmospheric pressure point, and can best be done at idle. To simulate passing through the zero point, the vacuum line must be removed from the our FPR. The FPR then sees atmospheric pressure as a signal, same as zero on the boost gauge. Control of the fuel pressure at the zero point is by the Allen screw in the center of the FPR. Clockwise on the screw will raise the pressure. Once adjusted, plug the vacuum line back onto the FPR and observe the fuel pressure drop to the stock figure. A suggested pressure for starters is 48 to 50 psi.
Dixit
10-10-2003, 12:23 PM
#88
wow you are having a good time with it, thats good to see... 
what is your setup if I might ask?? I can't find a decent tuner in MD who even is setup to play around with it.
what is your setup if I might ask?? I can't find a decent tuner in MD who even is setup to play around with it.
Originally Posted by sx7r
btw, eManage/profec e01 works great for me. does a lot more than the safc2. you can log everything that the eManage reads - boost, rpm, throttle position, duty cycle, air flow, etc at 10 samples/sec for as much memory as you have on your laptop. also, it gives you a 16x16 map that lets you set your own rpm points for air flow, duty cycle, and ignition timing. furthermore, for air flow, you can reference to a map sensor if you are past the capacity of your stock MAF sensor, or you can opt to use a MAF from another car and the eManage will adjust accordingly. and the annoying stalling problem that an open atmosphere BOV gives you when the MAF is on the non pressurized side - eManage takes care of that.
10-10-2003, 01:27 PM
#89
I see your point. 
thx for the info.....you the man!
thx for the info.....you the man!
Originally Posted by BigDogJonx
They are flat out wrong unfortunately.
http://www.bellengineering.net/fmu2020instruc.html That is the link to Bell's site (maker of Cartech FMU) and the instruction guide to the FMU.
As it states there clearly that you cannot remove the stock regulator.
Also here is what they say about the top screw so you better understand what I was trying to say earlier.
So as said earlier, the ONLY fmu that truly does both FMU and Base pressure is the Vortech SFMU.
Dixit
http://www.bellengineering.net/fmu2020instruc.html That is the link to Bell's site (maker of Cartech FMU) and the instruction guide to the FMU.
As it states there clearly that you cannot remove the stock regulator.
Also here is what they say about the top screw so you better understand what I was trying to say earlier.
So as said earlier, the ONLY fmu that truly does both FMU and Base pressure is the Vortech SFMU.
Dixit
10-10-2003, 11:10 PM
#90
Well bought the new IMPORT RACER mag flipped it open and what do I see, but Power Enterprise 350Z injectors. So, I went to the websites:
JAPAN website - 380cc or 510cc are ~$165/each:
http://www.power-enterprise.co.jp/ex...p/inj_pump.htm
Parts Lineup:
http://www.power-enterprise.co.jp/exp/catalog.htm
US Distributor:
http://www.rbmotoring.com/sales.html
So, the RC Engineering injectors are going to be around HALF the price, but is it worth the sh!ty fuel atomization? Supposedly, the PE injectors are better.
JAPAN website - 380cc or 510cc are ~$165/each:
http://www.power-enterprise.co.jp/ex...p/inj_pump.htm
Parts Lineup:
http://www.power-enterprise.co.jp/exp/catalog.htm
US Distributor:
http://www.rbmotoring.com/sales.html
So, the RC Engineering injectors are going to be around HALF the price, but is it worth the sh!ty fuel atomization? Supposedly, the PE injectors are better.
Originally Posted by IceY2K1
I'll put more stock into it vs. color.
Anyways, I found Power Enterprise is a JDM company that makes higher flowing 350Z/-K injectors, but info is kind of scarce.
I know they at least make:
Nissan VQ35 (350Z)
2003+ Z33 350Z/G35 380cc or 510cc - $950/set
380cc, 510cc
Links:
http://godspeed.hack.net/PE.html
http://cars.ign.com/articles/428/428427p1.html
Anyways, I found Power Enterprise is a JDM company that makes higher flowing 350Z/-K injectors, but info is kind of scarce.
I know they at least make:
Nissan VQ35 (350Z)
2003+ Z33 350Z/G35 380cc or 510cc - $950/set
380cc, 510cc
Links:
http://godspeed.hack.net/PE.html
http://cars.ign.com/articles/428/428427p1.html
10-13-2003, 10:34 AM
#96
Apparently not.
A)You're just saying Ford injectors are cheap, which means nothing to us.
OR
B)You're saying the '03 Cobra injectors is a drop in for the 350z.
Explain?
A)You're just saying Ford injectors are cheap, which means nothing to us.
OR
B)You're saying the '03 Cobra injectors is a drop in for the 350z.
Explain?
Originally Posted by SR20DEN
sould be quite obvious
Frys' around the corner only charges $1.99/lb for hamburger. 
10-13-2003, 11:50 AM
#101
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 1,275
Originally Posted by SR20DEN
A
and suit yourself
and suit yourself
Whats w/the puzzles and multiple choice? We need to move forward w/some construction information or suggestions so we can get some injectors done man... lest stay focused here!
Deac
10-13-2003, 11:56 AM
#102
Originally Posted by Deac
Whats w/the puzzles and multiple choice? We need to move forward w/some construction information or suggestions so we can get some injectors done man... lest stay focused here!
Deac
Deac
10-13-2003, 11:58 AM
#103
No, you gave an ambiguous and invalid "alternative" that is just misleading.
Originally Posted by SR20DEN
I proposed a much less expensive alternative and was given multiple choices for answers.
10-13-2003, 12:01 PM
#104
Originally Posted by IceY2K1
No, you gave a ambiguous and invalid "alternative" that is just misleading people.
The first post was directed at Dixit not you. I really don't care if you accept the idea or not.
10-13-2003, 12:02 PM
#105
What is there to accept?
You give an alternative, yet don't say how it can be useful or what you mean?
You give an alternative, yet don't say how it can be useful or what you mean?
Originally Posted by SR20DEN
The first post was directed at Dixit not you. I really don't care if you accept the idea or not.
10-13-2003, 12:08 PM
#106
Originally Posted by IceY2K1
What is there to accept?
You give an alternative, yet don't say how it can be useful or what you mean?
You give an alternative, yet don't say how it can be useful or what you mean?
10-13-2003, 12:15 PM
#107
Explanation is required to understand that although the Ford guys have a cheap alternative, we don't and it does us ABSOLUTELY no good.
So why would you state that again? I must be missing the point of WHY you're telling Dixit that '03 Cobra guys have 39# injectors. Clearly Dixit ASSUMED you were telling him they would work on the 350z, which you don't know.
So why would you state that again? I must be missing the point of WHY you're telling Dixit that '03 Cobra guys have 39# injectors. Clearly Dixit ASSUMED you were telling him they would work on the 350z, which you don't know.
Originally Posted by SR20DEN
Why does it require so much explanation? Bigger injectors for much less money.
10-13-2003, 12:37 PM
#110
Originally Posted by Stephen Max
Sorry, I'm dumb this morning. Are you saying to get Cobra injectors, or to get a Cobra if you want inexpensive injectors?Plus since the VQ35s use a 3.5 bar fuel pressure the end result makes them probably closer to 440cc.
10-13-2003, 12:58 PM
#111
Ignoring the VQ30 vs. VQ35 injector/fuel rail(???) differences, can you explain this more?
What needs to be modified? Machine the injector bores on the manifold to fit the Cobra injectors profile? Shim the fuel rail height?
Using pigtails for the injector harness is pretty much a given on any option, so that's no biggie.
What needs to be modified? Machine the injector bores on the manifold to fit the Cobra injectors profile? Shim the fuel rail height?
Using pigtails for the injector harness is pretty much a given on any option, so that's no biggie.
Originally Posted by SR20DEN
...They pretty much will drop in...
10-19-2003, 10:37 AM
#114
How will you get the computer to support the different injectors? Stand-Alone fuel management? How about a second fuel rail with cobra injectors? Then you could program the standalone with that? Hehe, I don't know.
10-19-2003, 11:23 AM
#115
Originally Posted by spanishrice
How will you get the computer to support the different injectors? Stand-Alone fuel management? How about a second fuel rail with cobra injectors? Then you could program the standalone with that? Hehe, I don't know.
some 4th gen peeps use JEW ECU and make it stand-alone.
some uses 370cc injectors from 300zxTT with stock ECU, but they use an adjustable FPR to lower base fuel pressure so they wont flood their engine in idle. They only have to use a 4:1 FMU during boost...so their fuel pressure is always safe like 60ish, peak. unlike mine....>100psi at redline.
10-19-2003, 12:38 PM
#116
I'm STILL trying to find a 350z injector, Cheston pussed out.
Once we have BOTH a 350z and -K injector, off to RC Engineering they go.
I've also sent RC Eng. an email asking if they've flowed a 350z injector, so hopefully they'll give back a response.
IF ANYONE can find a 350z or -K injector let me know. Otherwise, someone is going to have to end up ordering a RC/PE high flow injector and see if it fits.
Once we have BOTH a 350z and -K injector, off to RC Engineering they go.
I've also sent RC Eng. an email asking if they've flowed a 350z injector, so hopefully they'll give back a response.
IF ANYONE can find a 350z or -K injector let me know. Otherwise, someone is going to have to end up ordering a RC/PE high flow injector and see if it fits.
Originally Posted by Deac
any updates? Lets not get frustrated. We need to get this done!
10-20-2003, 11:16 AM
#118
You'll still need the FMU and with a 4:1 disc you'll see:
1/2(static pressure)+(FMU disc*boost)
=1/2(43.5)+(4*10) = 61.75psi fuel pressure.
=1/2(43.5)+(4*15) = 81.75psi fuel pressure.
=1/2(43.5)+(4*20) = 101.75psi fuel pressure.
Using 370cc@3bar injectors, calculating the new flow at different fuel pressures:
sqrt(new fp/old fp)*old cc
=sqrt(61.75/43.5)*370cc = ~440cc
=sqrt(81.75/43.5)*370cc = ~507cc
=sqrt(101.75/43.5)*370cc = ~565cc
Using a ”safe” BSFC=.60 and Duty Cycle=80%:
440cc(10psi) = ~335hp
507cc(15psi) = ~386hp
565cc(20psi) = ~430hp
I wouldn't go above 15psi with the 4:1 FMU disc due to excessive fuel rail pressure, however people here are running 100+psi fuel pressure for limited periods of time.
1/2(static pressure)+(FMU disc*boost)
=1/2(43.5)+(4*10) = 61.75psi fuel pressure.
=1/2(43.5)+(4*15) = 81.75psi fuel pressure.
=1/2(43.5)+(4*20) = 101.75psi fuel pressure.
Using 370cc@3bar injectors, calculating the new flow at different fuel pressures:
sqrt(new fp/old fp)*old cc
=sqrt(61.75/43.5)*370cc = ~440cc
=sqrt(81.75/43.5)*370cc = ~507cc
=sqrt(101.75/43.5)*370cc = ~565cc
Using a ”safe” BSFC=.60 and Duty Cycle=80%:
440cc(10psi) = ~335hp
507cc(15psi) = ~386hp
565cc(20psi) = ~430hp
I wouldn't go above 15psi with the 4:1 FMU disc due to excessive fuel rail pressure, however people here are running 100+psi fuel pressure for limited periods of time.
Originally Posted by spanishrice
How many pounds of boost could you run with the 370cc injectors and the stock ecu?
10-21-2003, 11:17 AM
#119
*UPDATE*
RC Engineering just got back to me and CONFIRMED the 350z injector part number is FBJC100, which is the SAME as the '00-'01 injector.
They stated the 350z injector flowed 295cc/min, but didn't specify if that's at 3bar or 3.5bar.
I'm pretty sure it's 3bar, so ORDER AWAY!!!!!!
RC Engineering just got back to me and CONFIRMED the 350z injector part number is FBJC100, which is the SAME as the '00-'01 injector.
They stated the 350z injector flowed 295cc/min, but didn't specify if that's at 3bar or 3.5bar.
I'm pretty sure it's 3bar, so ORDER AWAY!!!!!!
10-21-2003, 11:23 AM
#120
Actually, they stated the 350z injector part number is 3660 2824 FBJC100.
All I can see on the -K injector is FBJC100 000 0x29.
I don't *THINK* that's a concern, but I'd still like to get a -K injector sent into RC Engineering to confirm the flow rate.
All I can see on the -K injector is FBJC100 000 0x29.
I don't *THINK* that's a concern, but I'd still like to get a -K injector sent into RC Engineering to confirm the flow rate.