turbo or supercharger
08-28-2003, 01:59 PM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 100
turbo or supercharger
i wanted to get some feedback from maxima owners who have either a supercharger or a turbocharger for there car.
if you have one, please let me know what you think about it, and which one your sudgest.
thanks
if you have one, please let me know what you think about it, and which one your sudgest.
thanks
08-28-2003, 02:58 PM
#3
Definitely a turbo. Had the SC, sold it. Building a custom turbo right now.
There is no comparison. The SC is pretty good, i'm not bashing it in any way. But honestly it's nothing special. You only get full boost at redline, and so the car never feels that fast.
That and the kit isn't all that reliable. I had mine for 16 months. Went through 3 belts, both the idler and tensioner pulley melted and disintegrated, and had to custom shim the blower just for alignment. Definitely more work than Stillen lets on. Yes, you can get metal pulleys which will prevent the melting. But factor in the price of the kit, $3900, the pulleys, $200 and you're right up there in the price range for the turbo kits.
For daily driving, I'd say a turbo kit is more usable. it provides a much broader powerband than the SC, and there is a lot of low end power. The custom turbo we built for thebigsadler puts down 256 whp and 254 ft/lbs torque at 5 psi. The SC could never come close to those numbers at 5 psi, especially the torque number. And the car sees full boost at a little more than 3000 rpm instead of redline like the SC. Finally, 240 ft./lbs of torque are available by 3000 RPM, that's pretty much impossible to get with the SC. And that is what makes driving a turbo car so much fun.
Reliability is still up in the air, but there is less stuff to break. It's all piping. As long as the turbo is in good shape, not too much can go wrong if the kit is well designed.
There is no comparison. The SC is pretty good, i'm not bashing it in any way. But honestly it's nothing special. You only get full boost at redline, and so the car never feels that fast.
That and the kit isn't all that reliable. I had mine for 16 months. Went through 3 belts, both the idler and tensioner pulley melted and disintegrated, and had to custom shim the blower just for alignment. Definitely more work than Stillen lets on. Yes, you can get metal pulleys which will prevent the melting. But factor in the price of the kit, $3900, the pulleys, $200 and you're right up there in the price range for the turbo kits.
For daily driving, I'd say a turbo kit is more usable. it provides a much broader powerband than the SC, and there is a lot of low end power. The custom turbo we built for thebigsadler puts down 256 whp and 254 ft/lbs torque at 5 psi. The SC could never come close to those numbers at 5 psi, especially the torque number. And the car sees full boost at a little more than 3000 rpm instead of redline like the SC. Finally, 240 ft./lbs of torque are available by 3000 RPM, that's pretty much impossible to get with the SC. And that is what makes driving a turbo car so much fun.
Reliability is still up in the air, but there is less stuff to break. It's all piping. As long as the turbo is in good shape, not too much can go wrong if the kit is well designed.
08-28-2003, 03:04 PM
#5
The kit for his car was actually rather expensive because of certain parts he requested.
But for a production kit using the same turbo/slightly smaller IC, and so on that would put out the same numbers. Somewhere slightly under $4K. Don't hold me to that number yet since the kit isn't in production and there are some final details to be hammered out.
But for a production kit using the same turbo/slightly smaller IC, and so on that would put out the same numbers. Somewhere slightly under $4K. Don't hold me to that number yet since the kit isn't in production and there are some final details to be hammered out.
Originally posted by 97blackSE
how much would a kit such as Jason's go for?
how much would a kit such as Jason's go for?
08-28-2003, 04:30 PM
#6
All YOUR grammer belong to me
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,400
Originally posted by Shadow
Definitely a turbo. Had the SC, sold it. Building a custom turbo right now.
Definitely a turbo. Had the SC, sold it. Building a custom turbo right now.
There is no comparison. The SC is pretty good, i'm not bashing it in any way. But honestly it's nothing special. You only get full boost at redline, and so the car never feels that fast.
Centrifugel Superchargers aren't recommended for Automatic cars.I definatally wish the SC made more power down low, becuase whenever I shift, i'm at the very beginning of boost again, which puts me outta the meaty power. But, the SC can be fierce. I was cruising at 45mph in second gear today, when I punched the gas. The car took off like a rocket, and torquesteered to the point where I had to let off the gas or face a big wreck. The power and torque was INSTANT. It is definatally there, and it is VERY noticeable, you just gotta be in the right part of the powerband/right gear.
That and the kit isn't all that reliable.
I had mine for 16 months. Went through 3 belts, both the idler and tensioner pulley melted and disintegrated, and had to custom shim the blower just for alignment.
Definitely more work than Stillen lets on. Yes, you can get metal pulleys which will prevent the melting. But factor in the price of the kit, $3900, the pulleys, $200 and you're right up there in the price range for the turbo kits.
For daily driving, I'd say a turbo kit is more usable. it provides a much broader powerband than the SC, and there is a lot of low end power. The custom turbo we built for thebigsadler puts down 256 whp and 254 ft/lbs torque at 5 psi. The SC could never come close to those numbers at 5 psi, especially the torque number. And the car sees full boost at a little more than 3000 rpm instead of redline like the SC. Finally, 240 ft./lbs of torque are available by 3000 RPM, that's pretty much impossible to get with the SC. And that is what makes driving a turbo car so much fun.
No boost spikes or overheating with superchargers. Oh, and instant throttle response with the supercharger, turbo's have to get the exhaust gases spooled up, so theres a little lag.
08-28-2003, 08:12 PM
#7
Sorry, this is Jeff (Shadow) posting under jason's name. Forgot to sign him off my computer.
Problem is that V1's are few and far between. So if he were looking to get the SC now, it would have to be the V2, and I stand by my comments on the V2's reliability. Blower is fine, but the miscellaneous stuff that Stillen did is not so good.
Also, with the right turbo, the throttle response is just as good. Big misconception about turbo lag, it isn't as apparent as most people think. Yes, the turbo does take time to spool, but literally it takes a fraction of a second before you see boost. That is if you picked the turbo properly. I guarantee you that a turbo car will be at full boost well before the SC even sees noticable boost. Jason's car sees full boost at a hair over 3000 rpms, my girlfriend's Integra with another custom turbo we did sees full boost at 2800 RPM. My maxima saw like 2 psi at 3000 rpm with the 3.33 pulley. you'll be above that obviously, but still you get my point.
And you're right, the SC is powerful if you're in the right part of the powerband. But why have to deal with all that if you can essentially be in the right part of the powerband practically all the time with a turbo. Back when I had the SC, if i floored it at 40 mph, my tires would break loose at 45-50 mph. That's a lot of power, but only at that point. Then the car would shift, boost would have to climb again and so on.
Explain this one to me. Why is it that Jay25's car with 321 whp can't beat Kirk's turbo car with like 230 whp. And kirk's car is an auto. And Jamie got beat hard by Eric (Ramius83's) PFI turbocharged car. And Eric is running less boost and less hp than Jamie. could it be the torque? Or that the hp curve is much much better with a turbo? If you get a chance, race Jason. If your car is faster than his, I'll take back everything I just said. Even at 5psi, he will beat you at your 10 psi.
BTW, turbos don't inherently overheat. Badly designed turbo kits overheat (ie ones where you remove the fans to run hot exhaust gases within 2" of the radiator). A well designed turbo setup will not overheat any more than a SC kit. And once again, a well designed turbo kit won't have boost spikes as long as the wastegate used is a good one.
Problem is that V1's are few and far between. So if he were looking to get the SC now, it would have to be the V2, and I stand by my comments on the V2's reliability. Blower is fine, but the miscellaneous stuff that Stillen did is not so good.
Also, with the right turbo, the throttle response is just as good. Big misconception about turbo lag, it isn't as apparent as most people think. Yes, the turbo does take time to spool, but literally it takes a fraction of a second before you see boost. That is if you picked the turbo properly. I guarantee you that a turbo car will be at full boost well before the SC even sees noticable boost. Jason's car sees full boost at a hair over 3000 rpms, my girlfriend's Integra with another custom turbo we did sees full boost at 2800 RPM. My maxima saw like 2 psi at 3000 rpm with the 3.33 pulley. you'll be above that obviously, but still you get my point.
And you're right, the SC is powerful if you're in the right part of the powerband. But why have to deal with all that if you can essentially be in the right part of the powerband practically all the time with a turbo. Back when I had the SC, if i floored it at 40 mph, my tires would break loose at 45-50 mph. That's a lot of power, but only at that point. Then the car would shift, boost would have to climb again and so on.
Explain this one to me. Why is it that Jay25's car with 321 whp can't beat Kirk's turbo car with like 230 whp. And kirk's car is an auto. And Jamie got beat hard by Eric (Ramius83's) PFI turbocharged car. And Eric is running less boost and less hp than Jamie. could it be the torque? Or that the hp curve is much much better with a turbo? If you get a chance, race Jason. If your car is faster than his, I'll take back everything I just said. Even at 5psi, he will beat you at your 10 psi.
BTW, turbos don't inherently overheat. Badly designed turbo kits overheat (ie ones where you remove the fans to run hot exhaust gases within 2" of the radiator). A well designed turbo setup will not overheat any more than a SC kit. And once again, a well designed turbo kit won't have boost spikes as long as the wastegate used is a good one.
Originally posted by Craig Mack
Well, keep in mind your also autotragic, and your car is probably heavy, especially with those anchors..I mean 19's. Centrifugel Superchargers aren't recommended for Automatic cars.
I definatally wish the SC made more power down low, becuase whenever I shift, i'm at the very beginning of boost again, which puts me outta the meaty power. But, the SC can be fierce. I was cruising at 45mph in second gear today, when I punched the gas. The car took off like a rocket, and torquesteered to the point where I had to let off the gas or face a big wreck. The power and torque was INSTANT. It is definatally there, and it is VERY noticeable, you just gotta be in the right part of the powerband/right gear.
My V1 blower has over 70,000 miles on it, almost half of which were run with a 3.125" pulley. The bearings and seals are working fine, no leaks or sign of wear/tear. If that's not reliable, I don't know what is.
Notorious for V2's, not the earlier V1's.
You can get the kit new for at least a few hundred dollars less than your above quoted price.
No boost spikes or overheating with superchargers. Oh, and instant throttle response with the supercharger, turbo's have to get the exhaust gases spooled up, so theres a little lag.
Well, keep in mind your also autotragic, and your car is probably heavy, especially with those anchors..I mean 19's.
Centrifugel Superchargers aren't recommended for Automatic cars.I definatally wish the SC made more power down low, becuase whenever I shift, i'm at the very beginning of boost again, which puts me outta the meaty power. But, the SC can be fierce. I was cruising at 45mph in second gear today, when I punched the gas. The car took off like a rocket, and torquesteered to the point where I had to let off the gas or face a big wreck. The power and torque was INSTANT. It is definatally there, and it is VERY noticeable, you just gotta be in the right part of the powerband/right gear.
My V1 blower has over 70,000 miles on it, almost half of which were run with a 3.125" pulley. The bearings and seals are working fine, no leaks or sign of wear/tear. If that's not reliable, I don't know what is.
Notorious for V2's, not the earlier V1's.
You can get the kit new for at least a few hundred dollars less than your above quoted price.
No boost spikes or overheating with superchargers. Oh, and instant throttle response with the supercharger, turbo's have to get the exhaust gases spooled up, so theres a little lag.
08-28-2003, 10:11 PM
#9
Originally posted by thebigsadler
Sorry, this is Jeff (Shadow) posting under jason's name. Forgot to sign him off my computer.
Explain this one to me. Why is it that Jay25's car with 321 whp can't beat Kirk's turbo car with like 230 whp. And kirk's car is an auto.
Sorry, this is Jeff (Shadow) posting under jason's name. Forgot to sign him off my computer.
Explain this one to me. Why is it that Jay25's car with 321 whp can't beat Kirk's turbo car with like 230 whp. And kirk's car is an auto.
Not to say your incorrect jeff.. but I think there is some unknown info that should be said.....
I am @ 7-8 PSI.. I have NOT DYNO'd @ 7-8 PSI.. I made the 230 WHP @ 6 PSI.
I am also running slightly leaner.. I am guessing I make about 250- 270 WHP.
Also, jay DID infact beat me several different times when we raced.
I would call jay's faster than mine.. one race I was in front of him doing 145+ MPH and he was PULLING on me
But I do agree with you on most of what you said
Just wanted to give you ALL the info ...
back to the debate
08-28-2003, 10:18 PM
#10
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 100
hey Image i'm in the same boat, the turbo's seem to offer more power, and if done properly, are just, if not more reliable.
but... it seems the risk is in the set up.
my problem is, if i buy a custom turbo kit, i can't get these guys to install it, i'm gonna have to get a local person to do it for me, and how do i know tehre not gonna screw it up.
so the supercharger seems like the safer bet, but i think i'm starting to like the turbo's better.
but... it seems the risk is in the set up.
my problem is, if i buy a custom turbo kit, i can't get these guys to install it, i'm gonna have to get a local person to do it for me, and how do i know tehre not gonna screw it up.
so the supercharger seems like the safer bet, but i think i'm starting to like the turbo's better.
08-28-2003, 10:22 PM
#11
Supporting Maxima.org Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Posts: 1,035
A lot of what I would term as "leading/extreme enthusiasts" have been switching from supercharger to turbo recently. I wonder why that is?
Oh, picking the turbo is probably one of the biggest headaches you'll ever have! Once you get the right one though ... it'll be awesome! So many to pick from .. T3,T4, BB, non-BB, GT non-BB, GT BB!
! Nice thing is you can change and sell your used one for some good money. Can't wait to get my GT-BB in 
(It's taken a little longer than I had anticipated) 
.. well at least my clutch is in town ... too bad I'm not!
Oh, picking the turbo is probably one of the biggest headaches you'll ever have! Once you get the right one though ... it'll be awesome! So many to pick from .. T3,T4, BB, non-BB, GT non-BB, GT BB!
! Nice thing is you can change and sell your used one for some good money. Can't wait to get my GT-BB in (It's taken a little longer than I had anticipated) .. well at least my clutch is in town ... too bad I'm not!
08-28-2003, 10:27 PM
#12
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 100
i have another question, with all this power that a turbo is producing, will you need to do any other modifications, to handle the power?
and btw, how have you guys all raced each other, do you live close or what?
and btw, how have you guys all raced each other, do you live close or what?
08-28-2003, 10:32 PM
#13
Originally posted by JJmax
i have another question, with all this power that a turbo is producing, will you need to do any other modifications, to handle the power?
and btw, how have you guys all raced each other, do you live close or what?
i have another question, with all this power that a turbo is producing, will you need to do any other modifications, to handle the power?
and btw, how have you guys all raced each other, do you live close or what?
and NIGEL.. I am looking into the garrett GT30...
I was thinking 35 but after more research I deemed I could not use all the power...
what you getting??
08-28-2003, 11:00 PM
#15
Look at a Maxima turbo closely. Then look at the Stillen SC closely. When you're done, you'll see which one is actually more complicated. A turbo is beautiful in it's simplicity.
BTW, try to get some customer support from Stillen for their SC if you have problems with it. not so fun.
And the turbos aren't just whipped up. We put over 100 hours just into the research before we built Jason's turbo. Heck, I spent 2 days just looking over compressor maps and doing research to choose the right turbo for him. This isn't just some backyard spur of the moment thing. Every aspect of the design was researched and debated. And I can say the same goes for PFI's kit, it is well engineered also.
BTW, try to get some customer support from Stillen for their SC if you have problems with it. not so fun.
And the turbos aren't just whipped up. We put over 100 hours just into the research before we built Jason's turbo. Heck, I spent 2 days just looking over compressor maps and doing research to choose the right turbo for him. This isn't just some backyard spur of the moment thing. Every aspect of the design was researched and debated. And I can say the same goes for PFI's kit, it is well engineered also.
Originally posted by image
Damnit. I dunno which one to get. The problem is a Turbo looks to damn complicated. SC is well tested, offers support.. Unlike the turbo's that people just whip up..
Damnit. I dunno which one to get. The problem is a Turbo looks to damn complicated. SC is well tested, offers support.. Unlike the turbo's that people just whip up..
08-29-2003, 07:46 AM
#16
Guest
Posts: n/a
I won't even touch this subject as it has been debated SO MUCH over the past.
But, for OUR MAXIMA'S case, a Turbo is by far a better choice. Even though for other cars this isn't the case, but for OUR MAXIMA, the turbo is best. And you can debate this all you want Craig Mack........
We are in the process of converting all SC cars and putting Stillen out of business......You may be next.......
But, for OUR MAXIMA'S case, a Turbo is by far a better choice. Even though for other cars this isn't the case, but for OUR MAXIMA, the turbo is best. And you can debate this all you want Craig Mack........
We are in the process of converting all SC cars and putting Stillen out of business......You may be next.......
08-29-2003, 07:49 AM
#17
Yes, that is our secret agenda. To convert all SC owners to turbo owners...
First Kevin, Dixit, then Matt, and so on. Soon, our transformation will be complete and all the fast cars will be turbo.
First Kevin, Dixit, then Matt, and so on. Soon, our transformation will be complete and all the fast cars will be turbo.
Originally posted by Ramius83
We are in the process of converting all SC cars and putting Stillen out of business......You may be next.......
We are in the process of converting all SC cars and putting Stillen out of business......You may be next.......
08-29-2003, 08:00 AM
#18
Originally posted by Shadow
Look at a Maxima turbo closely. Then look at the Stillen SC closely. When you're done, you'll see which one is actually more complicated. A turbo is beautiful in it's simplicity.
Look at a Maxima turbo closely. Then look at the Stillen SC closely. When you're done, you'll see which one is actually more complicated. A turbo is beautiful in it's simplicity.
From the prespective of a SC owner:
There is no doubt that turbo kits will make more power. If you want killer power they are the way to go. I think that the supercharger kit is a great "into" to the world of boost. Superchargers are very simple. No boost controlers, boost spikes, etc. Much lower chance of blowing something up. Worst case, you loose a belt. $25 for a belt or $500+ for a motor.
I really don't think which is more reliable should come into the debate. There are people on both sides that are 100% trouble free, and people on both sides that have had major problems. If you're going to boost car that wasn't designed for it, you must be prepared for the worst.
There are +'s and -'s to each.
08-29-2003, 08:48 AM
#19
I am very happy with my turbo setup, and after basically building the entire thing myself (with justin and jeff) in a garage I can tell you that it really is not that complicated. Once you have a firm understanding of how things go together and how things work you should have nothing to worry about.
I am not going to lie, I had NO clue how turbo's worked or how the piping would run or what does this and why this does that when I first started. But with some help from a bunch of people I can safely say that I have a firm knowledge of all of this stuff and I hope to pass that on to others in the future. I am not a fan of the stillen SC and have never been. I personally just don't like the idea of something that messes with all my belts and will completely shut my car down if it isn't running properly. If my turbo (knock on wood) has issues, my car will run like crap, but will run.. that is the beauty of the turbo.
I think a huge debate in this is also 5spd and automatic users. It seems that the automatic guys have a lot more to worry about when it comes to boost spike and other issues. I will attest to the fact that I know my car will run a 10psi supercharger, for a fact. I've raced a new m3, an 01 cobra and a 00 vette and none of them even stayed with me, when does a supercharger beat up on those cars?
After the first drive of the turbo I knew I was set on this. I drive my car everyday and have yet to have any overheating problems, if anything my radiator is actually cooler than it was before.
Jason
I am not going to lie, I had NO clue how turbo's worked or how the piping would run or what does this and why this does that when I first started. But with some help from a bunch of people I can safely say that I have a firm knowledge of all of this stuff and I hope to pass that on to others in the future. I am not a fan of the stillen SC and have never been. I personally just don't like the idea of something that messes with all my belts and will completely shut my car down if it isn't running properly. If my turbo (knock on wood) has issues, my car will run like crap, but will run.. that is the beauty of the turbo.
I think a huge debate in this is also 5spd and automatic users. It seems that the automatic guys have a lot more to worry about when it comes to boost spike and other issues. I will attest to the fact that I know my car will run a 10psi supercharger, for a fact. I've raced a new m3, an 01 cobra and a 00 vette and none of them even stayed with me, when does a supercharger beat up on those cars?
After the first drive of the turbo I knew I was set on this. I drive my car everyday and have yet to have any overheating problems, if anything my radiator is actually cooler than it was before.
Jason
08-29-2003, 10:30 AM
#21
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Aug 2003
Posts: 100
hey jason, what do you mean by powerband?
secondly, i just got my dad's car a few months ago, which i had been driving for about a year and a half, since i started driving, and it is a 1997 maxima gxe auto, and soon i'm going to trade it in for a 1999 se 5 spd. so i don't have a lot of experience with 5 spd cars, so how long should i wait till i put in a turbo ( if that's what i'm giong to do) so i don't screw up my engine, by being new at driving standard.
and lastly to the guy who said that you gotta fool around, and get new parts for the exhaust for a turbo, you gonna wanna fool around and get new parts with the exhaust, regardless of whether or not your getting a turbo.
secondly, i just got my dad's car a few months ago, which i had been driving for about a year and a half, since i started driving, and it is a 1997 maxima gxe auto, and soon i'm going to trade it in for a 1999 se 5 spd. so i don't have a lot of experience with 5 spd cars, so how long should i wait till i put in a turbo ( if that's what i'm giong to do) so i don't screw up my engine, by being new at driving standard.
and lastly to the guy who said that you gotta fool around, and get new parts for the exhaust for a turbo, you gonna wanna fool around and get new parts with the exhaust, regardless of whether or not your getting a turbo.
08-29-2003, 10:46 AM
#22
If you are getting a 99 5spd, you wont have to wait long at all.. just do a compression test and make sure the car has no oil leaks and is running well.
Powerband means that a supercharger at 260whp will make 260whp at 6500rpms. A turbocharger will make full power at like 3500-4000 rpms. If you think about that logically, which car would be faster? Hence why I can take any car under 400hp that is not turbo charged itself (m3, supercharged mustangs, vettes and etc).
Powerband means that a supercharger at 260whp will make 260whp at 6500rpms. A turbocharger will make full power at like 3500-4000 rpms. If you think about that logically, which car would be faster? Hence why I can take any car under 400hp that is not turbo charged itself (m3, supercharged mustangs, vettes and etc).
08-29-2003, 10:46 AM
#23
This is Jeff, my brother and I were the ones who helped build the turbo for jason.
By powerband, he means the range that the car makes power. For example, on a supercharged car, the powerband is very narrow. Below 4000 rpm, the blower isn't doing much so the car isn't much faster than a naturally aspirated car. So the car is only making real power from 4000 to redline or so. On a turbo car, the powerband starts much lower. You're in boost by under 3000 rpm. So if a turbo car races a SC car, and both were making identical power numbers, the turbo car would win. Simply because it is making power at a lower point. The turbo is making power at 3000 rpm, so it would pull from the SC car which wouldn't make real power until 4000 rpm. This is what usually happens when a turbo max races a SC max.
The wider the RPM range your car can make power, the faster it is. That's why a car with nitrous will run similar times to a much higher hp SC car. The SC is only making power at a small point in the RPM range while the nitrous car is making power throughout a large part of the RPM range.
By powerband, he means the range that the car makes power. For example, on a supercharged car, the powerband is very narrow. Below 4000 rpm, the blower isn't doing much so the car isn't much faster than a naturally aspirated car. So the car is only making real power from 4000 to redline or so. On a turbo car, the powerband starts much lower. You're in boost by under 3000 rpm. So if a turbo car races a SC car, and both were making identical power numbers, the turbo car would win. Simply because it is making power at a lower point. The turbo is making power at 3000 rpm, so it would pull from the SC car which wouldn't make real power until 4000 rpm. This is what usually happens when a turbo max races a SC max.
The wider the RPM range your car can make power, the faster it is. That's why a car with nitrous will run similar times to a much higher hp SC car. The SC is only making power at a small point in the RPM range while the nitrous car is making power throughout a large part of the RPM range.
Originally posted by JJmax
hey jason, what do you mean by powerband?
secondly, i just got my dad's car a few months ago, which i had been driving for about a year and a half, since i started driving, and it is a 1997 maxima gxe auto, and soon i'm going to trade it in for a 1999 se 5 spd. so i don't have a lot of experience with 5 spd cars, so how long should i wait till i put in a turbo ( if that's what i'm giong to do) so i don't screw up my engine, by being new at driving standard.
and lastly to the guy who said that you gotta fool around, and get new parts for the exhaust for a turbo, you gonna wanna fool around and get new parts with the exhaust, regardless of whether or not your getting a turbo.
hey jason, what do you mean by powerband?
secondly, i just got my dad's car a few months ago, which i had been driving for about a year and a half, since i started driving, and it is a 1997 maxima gxe auto, and soon i'm going to trade it in for a 1999 se 5 spd. so i don't have a lot of experience with 5 spd cars, so how long should i wait till i put in a turbo ( if that's what i'm giong to do) so i don't screw up my engine, by being new at driving standard.
and lastly to the guy who said that you gotta fool around, and get new parts for the exhaust for a turbo, you gonna wanna fool around and get new parts with the exhaust, regardless of whether or not your getting a turbo.
08-29-2003, 12:09 PM
#24
If you're looking at dyno numbers, the biggest difference between a turbocharged and supercharged (centrifugal) Max is the area under the hp and torque curve. Since the turbo makes peaks boost faster (meaning it will probably flow more air into the engine), a TC'ed car will pull away from the SC'ed quicker.
Take a look at the dyno graph between the two different setups I had:
- SC with 2.87" pulley pushing out 11 psi
- TC with T4 ceramic ball-bearing turbo pushing out 10 psi
You want another comparison?
I am not putting down Matt or his accomplishments... this is only an example. Only respect for Matt
MardiGrasMax makes 379.78 whp and 320.43 torque at 15 psi on his SC (no nitrous). I make 317.3 whp and 314.4 torque at 10 psi.
Let's plot the hp and torque numbers
You see how close the numbers are all the way up to 5500? Close race huh? But Matt will kick my butt after 5500. 
*edit: fixed a number*
Take a look at the dyno graph between the two different setups I had:
- SC with 2.87" pulley pushing out 11 psi
- TC with T4 ceramic ball-bearing turbo pushing out 10 psi
You want another comparison?
I am not putting down Matt or his accomplishments... this is only an example. Only respect for Matt
MardiGrasMax makes 379.78 whp and 320.43 torque at 15 psi on his SC (no nitrous). I make 317.3 whp and 314.4 torque at 10 psi.
Let's plot the hp and torque numbers
Code:
Approximate hp and torque RPM Matt Me 2500 95/190 85/180 3000 120/210 120/200 3500 160/235 145/220 4000 200/260 195/210 4500 245/285 240/305 5000 295/305 290/310 5500 325/310 305/295 6000 370/320 317/225 6500 N/A 315/250
*edit: fixed a number*
08-29-2003, 12:24 PM
#25
so what your saying is
---------------------------------------------->http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?threadid=241656
---------------------------------------------->http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?threadid=241656
08-29-2003, 12:40 PM
#26
Originally posted by bags533
so what your saying is
---------------------------------------------->http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?threadid=241656
so what your saying is
---------------------------------------------->http://forums.maxima.org/showthread.php?threadid=241656
It reconfirms what we're trying to say from the start about SC and TC.
I see you got walked after 5500.
Same thing would happen if Matt and I went at it.
08-29-2003, 12:43 PM
#27
Supporting Maxima.org Member
iTrader: (3)
Join Date: Mar 2002
Location: Fort Collins, Colorado
Posts: 1,035
Welcome back Kev!
Is it me, or are you leaving power on the table here? looks like you're running a little rich in some parts of the powerband. Nice numbers all the same! Was this done on a good motor?
Is it me, or are you leaving power on the table here? looks like you're running a little rich in some parts of the powerband. Nice numbers all the same! Was this done on a good motor?
Originally posted by Y2KevSE
If you're looking at dyno numbers, the biggest difference between a turbocharged and supercharged (centrifugal) Max is the area under the hp and torque curve. Since the turbo makes peaks boost faster (meaning it will probably flow more air into the engine), a TC'ed car will pull away from the SC'ed quicker.
Take a look at the dyno graph between the two different setups I had:
- SC with 2.87" pulley pushing out 11 psi
- TC with T4 ceramic ball-bearing turbo pushing out 10 psi
You want another comparison?
I am not putting down Matt or his accomplishments... this is only an example. Only respect for Matt
MardiGrasMax makes 379.78 whp and 320.43 torque at 15 psi on his SC (no nitrous). I make 317.3 whp and 314.4 torque at 10 psi.
Let's plot the hp and torque numbers
You see how close the numbers are all the way up to 5500? Close race huh? But Matt will kick my butt after 5500.
*edit: fixed a number*
If you're looking at dyno numbers, the biggest difference between a turbocharged and supercharged (centrifugal) Max is the area under the hp and torque curve. Since the turbo makes peaks boost faster (meaning it will probably flow more air into the engine), a TC'ed car will pull away from the SC'ed quicker.
Take a look at the dyno graph between the two different setups I had:
- SC with 2.87" pulley pushing out 11 psi
- TC with T4 ceramic ball-bearing turbo pushing out 10 psi
You want another comparison?
I am not putting down Matt or his accomplishments... this is only an example. Only respect for Matt
MardiGrasMax makes 379.78 whp and 320.43 torque at 15 psi on his SC (no nitrous). I make 317.3 whp and 314.4 torque at 10 psi.
Let's plot the hp and torque numbers
Code:
Approximate hp and torque RPM Matt Me 2500 95/190 85/180 3000 120/210 120/200 3500 160/235 145/220 4000 200/260 195/210 4500 245/285 240/305 5000 295/305 290/310 5500 325/310 305/295 6000 370/320 317/225 6500 N/A 315/250
*edit: fixed a number*
08-29-2003, 12:47 PM
#28
Originally posted by turbo97SE
Welcome back Kev!
Is it me, or are you leaving power on the table here? looks like you're running a little rich in some parts of the powerband. Nice numbers all the same! Was this done on a good motor?
Welcome back Kev!
Is it me, or are you leaving power on the table here? looks like you're running a little rich in some parts of the powerband. Nice numbers all the same! Was this done on a good motor?
Yeah, it was running rich. We didn't get a chance to tune because whp decreased by 70 after each run. On the 4th or 5th run, the car sputtered and I drove home on 4 cylinders.
With the 3" cat-back in, I'm hoping to see at least 20 whp more up top.
Still driving on the blown motor (#6's compression is not good)... but don't tell that to the C5 I raced 2 weeks ago.
08-29-2003, 12:50 PM
#29
Originally posted by Y2KevSE
It reconfirms what we're trying to say from the start about SC and TC.
I see you got walked after 5500. Same thing would happen if Matt and I went at it.
It reconfirms what we're trying to say from the start about SC and TC.
I see you got walked after 5500.
Same thing would happen if Matt and I went at it.
your correct PSI for PSI I think the SC and turbo will make VERY close HP numbers.
And man I am whoring today knowing that this will be it until monday or so...
well it may be different in a month or so with matt
I need $2000 for the coming mods... I thought I would be better after the turbo .. I am worse... now it's crossing fingers and prayer hoping the engine and tranny last
08-29-2003, 01:20 PM
#30
Originally posted by bags533
your correct PSI for PSI I think the SC and turbo will make VERY close HP numbers.
And man I am whoring today knowing that this will be it until monday or so...
well it may be different in a month or so with matt
I need $2000 for the coming mods... I thought I would be better after the turbo .. I am worse... now it's crossing fingers and prayer hoping the engine and tranny last
your correct PSI for PSI I think the SC and turbo will make VERY close HP numbers.
And man I am whoring today knowing that this will be it until monday or so...
well it may be different in a month or so with matt
I need $2000 for the coming mods... I thought I would be better after the turbo .. I am worse... now it's crossing fingers and prayer hoping the engine and tranny last
Drive like granny and your car will last...
09-01-2003, 11:41 PM
#31
Originally Posted by Y2KevSE
What's up Nigel. I see you have connection from the other side of the world.
Yeah, it was running rich. We didn't get a chance to tune because whp decreased by 70 after each run. On the 4th or 5th run, the car sputtered and I drove home on 4 cylinders.
With the 3" cat-back in, I'm hoping to see at least 20 whp more up top.
Still driving on the blown motor (#6's compression is not good)... but don't tell that to the C5 I raced 2 weeks ago.
Yeah, it was running rich. We didn't get a chance to tune because whp decreased by 70 after each run. On the 4th or 5th run, the car sputtered and I drove home on 4 cylinders.
With the 3" cat-back in, I'm hoping to see at least 20 whp more up top.
Still driving on the blown motor (#6's compression is not good)... but don't tell that to the C5 I raced 2 weeks ago.
09-05-2003, 08:01 PM
#32
I have always wanted a turbo and now I may actually be able to get one soon, I was wondering which kits do you guys recommend. I've looked at the two kits that offer on turbomaxima.com but I would like some advice for you guys.
09-05-2003, 09:08 PM
#33
All YOUR grammer belong to me
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,400
Originally Posted by jcy98maxse
I have always wanted a turbo and now I may actually be able to get one soon, I was wondering which kits do you guys recommend. I've looked at the two kits that offer on turbomaxima.com but I would like some advice for you guys.
Who's with me
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
litch
4th Generation Maxima (1995-1999)
123
01-04-2024 07:01 PM
KabirUTA13
5th Generation Classifieds (2000-2003)
19
10-17-2015 02:15 AM