Curt

iTrader: (27)

Don’t know if this discovery is unique to my situation, but this may be the cause behind the problems so many have experienced with belts on the Stillen V2 SC. This afternoon, while test fitting a new V2 onto an “out-of-car” engine (i.e., I could clearly see what I was doing and didn’t have to work by Braille), I was running into an interference fit problem where the SC mounting plate mates with the tension pulley bracket. Bottom line, the relief machined into the backside of the SC mounting plate to accommodate the upper-right corner of the tension pulley bracket wasn’t clearanceing. As a result, the lower tab on the plate was held off from seating fully against the pulley bracket (i.e., pushed out away from the engine block) by about a quarter of an inch . A little shade-tree engineering to remove some additional material solved the problem and there’s now a perfect fit. I checked with a straightedge and all of the pulleys align with each other perfectly.
Some guys have talked about having to shim things, but I don’t see anything in the Stillen instructions mentioning having to shim, and I doubt that any reasonably talented engineer would have designed this kit to require such seat-of-the-pants shimming. I’m guessing that such shimming was an effort to fix a problem without first identifying what was causing the problem and correcting that. If you’ve been experiencing such belt alignment problems, take a close look at where the lowest end of the V2 SC mounting plate sandwiches the upper mount point of the tensioner pulley bracket against the engine block. Two angles to view are (1) over the top of the alternator (it’s just inboard from the SC idler pulley), and (2) looking down from above the front engine cover motor mount down past the tensioner adjuster.

ptatohed

iTrader: (12)

Thanks Curt. I don't know what exactly is the alignment issue we hear so much about. I presonally haven't had any problems between my '96 and my '99. My belt did jump a rib once but I think that was just belt tension. Your discovery sounds like a reasonable explanation. Thanks for sharing. On The Wizard's car, we dropped a plumb bob and everything lined up great. I haven't tried that on my car yet.

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

You may be right, Curt.

I came across the same problem when I recently replaced a broken tensioner pulley bracket on a V2 kit that I installed about a year ago. I had to do some grinding to get the tensioner bracket to slip in behind the SC bracket enough for the bolt holes to line up. The alternative to grinding the tensioner bracket would have been forcing the SC bracket away from the engine in order to open up enough space to insert the tensioner bracket. I didn't have to shim, though, and this particular kit hasn't ever thrown or shredded any belts.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Just so I can visualize better, where did you grind in this pic(Credit:JAY25):

ptatohed

iTrader: (12)

The only reason I think this is not the reason is that I think people would know if they needed to shave that part of the SC plate. Think about it. The SC goes on first. So he's already on the engine (and assumed flush). Then the belt adjuster assembly goes on. The top right of the adjuster pulley needs to slip in under the lower leg of the SC. If it didn't fit, it would be obvious. The only way I see this being a potential problem is if someone still had their SC bolts loose and they were waiting for everything to be aligned before they cranked them down - but they shouldn't. All SC bolts should be tightened by the end of step #20. The belt aduster assembly gets installed in step #23.

slimer

iTrader: (13)

i usually dont torque everything down until all screws are fed. that way everything should thread fine.

ptatohed

iTrader: (12)

Agreed. But only for the SC itself. I think once all the SC plate bolts are in 90% you can torque them all down to 100%. To me the belt adjuster is a seperate entity. By the time I finish step 20, it is usually 3am and time for bed. Also, I want to get the SC plate bolts fully tightened as soon as I can before the Threadlocker Blue dries. I can see the argument for leaving ALL bolts (SC and belt adjuster) not fully tightened until both the SC and adjuster are in - but I don't think it is nessary. Besides once the adjuster pulley is in, you are making it hard on yourself to get to some of the lower SC bolts.

BlackCat

iTrader: (6)

I've learned from the many tear-downs and reinstalls which bolts are the most crucial. I usually put in bolt #2 or #5 first and only half way in, so that the plate is supported in position. Then I put in bolt #14 next as that one is the most finickiest bolt of all. Once that one is in I then torque down the first bolt(s) and then I follow that with the bolt for the idler pulley and then put in all of the other bolts. Reason I do this is because I learned that once I tried to get bolt #14 in after torquing down all of the other bolts it would not thread in straight. I've used blue locktite on all bolts except for bolt#14. Why not bolt #14? Because it is in there pretty snug after torquing by hand and I have never seen it work its way loose after 5 years of use.

slimer

iTrader: (13)

we all have our own little tricks. i have a belt/pulley swap under 3 hours now if i have an extra person that has done it before. if not, its closer to 4.

Curt

iTrader: (27)

The mounting plate in the picture in post #4 is different than mine. Instead of that reinforcing rib running down the backside of the plate towards holes #14 & 15, that whole leg of the plate is thicker and has a relief macinned on the back side of hole #14 to provide clearance for the Tensioner bracket. It's this relief that was inadequate.
If someone will tell me how to incorporate photos into the thread, I'll post a couple of pictures that'll make it all clear. Apparently there are different versions of the V2 plate!

BlackCat

iTrader: (6)

You'll have to post your pics in place like cardomain.com or equivalent first of all.
Then when you have them loaded you simply open the pics up, right click on the pic and copy or cut the properties line. When you come back to this thread, paste the properties line in your message and place [IMG] in front of the line and [/IMG] at the end of the line.

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

Here are the pics of Curts' V2 bracket:

Curt

iTrader: (27)

The 1st foto (above) shows work in progress to remove material and provide sufficient clearance behind hole #14 (having access to a machine shop would have been nice!);
The 2nd foto shows the tensioner bracket held in position by a pair of needle-nose Vise Grips. You can see why the bracket needed the additional clearance;
The 3rd foto is with the mounting plate on the engine as viewed from the alternator side;
And the 4th foto, also with everything mounted, is looking down from above the timing cover engine mount.
Bottom-line, there was no way the tensioner bracket was going to be able to be positioned properly and the mounting plate sandwiching it against the engine without some material first being removed (either from the mounting plate, as I did, or from the tensioner bracket itself).

BlackCat

iTrader: (6)

Since my blower is currently off I stuck a mirror next to the area in the above pics and took this pic:

The #14 bolt is not in as I put the bracket on temporarily until I get a replacement oil return hose. I just put in all of the other bolts so that I can drive the car.
You can see that the tensioner bracket doesn't interfere with my mounting bracket and so I think Curt's problem may be unique to his car only.

ptatohed

iTrader: (12)

Maybe I'm viewing it wrong but it appears that in your photo number two (held with pliars) that you are exagerating it by swinging your adjuster pulley into the area you just cut away. In photos three and four, it does not seem to be in the area you cut away (or at least not all the way).

Stephen Max

iTrader: (59)

I had to remove material in exactly the same place as Curt after getting a new tensioner bracket from Stillen.

BlackCat

iTrader: (6)

Hmmm...I wonder how many others had to do the same?

Curt

iTrader: (27)

Ptatohed-
I cut away only slightly more than necessary - about the thickness of the blade as shown in the first foto. I didn't want to come up short and have to do more. But that foto with the pliers exagerates only a very little: the tensioner did not end up against the shoulder of the cut after installed. The 4th foto shows about 1/16" of clearance.
It may not be a problem for everyone, but certainly seems to merit guys becoming aware of it as a possible problem area that they ought to check if everything doesn't line up easily.
Curt