So I've been mulling over this idea for the past couple of months.

I found a "valve" that the domestic guys use that's similiar to a wastegate to control boost levels. Unfortunately I lost the link.

But basically, I've had a v1 kit on my 3.5 swapped 4th gen for some time, and was thinking of various ways to help with the boost, without going turbo. The link below is an example of the wastegate install on a vortech kit.

http://www.musclemustangfastfords.co...all/index.html

I figure if I put on a 2.62 pulley and add a wastegate set to say...10lbs? The boost would kick in much sooner, and I'd stay at my peak boost much longer. I was wondering if anyone had any experience or could lend some expertise.

The only downside to this it seems would be overspinning the blower, but I figured it was still an idea to toss around. Thanks in advance fellas.

 

WOW, freaky, I swear your post was the exact same thought I had just a week ago when I was thinking about what pulley size to run. My plan is slightly different though, instead of a wastegate I planned to install 2-3 z31 emergency bypass valves on my charge pipe shimmed up to vent @ 9psi. The only drawback I saw as well was overspinning the blower, but it's just as if the smaller pulley was on anyways.

I don't see why this wouldn't work, and why it wouldn't be a killer move.

 

Like I said, I've been blown for a few years now and am just looking for ways to help out a bit.

My power is more than enough up top, but I feel this will add a crap load of area under the curve.

I'm still in the process of doing calculations for the 2.62 since i'd probably be revving out to the 7500 range. I figured I'd be hitting 10psi between 4500-5500, and sticking it to redline. They have the upgraded bearings/seals for the vortechs, I think I would need to upgrade those.

I have some extra charge pipes laying around as well as a wastegate...so we'll see what happens.

Keep the info coming fellas, thanks,

 

So the basic idea is, you get the smallest pulley you can find that provides you with the highest boost possible, then you get a wastgate to leak that boost at w/e pressure you want. say the spring provides you with like 14psi, u have it leak boost at like 9psi. pretty interesting. What do s/c guys do about overspinning a s/c? what can happen by overspinning? blowing hot air or damaging the s/c internals?

Something I was going to do with my turbo was add water injection PRE-turbo, alot of people do this and basically when u have a turbo thats running out of its efficiency range, u spray a very very small shot of water or water/meth, and this functions as if you had a larger turbo. Because reduces the excess heat being caused by not being efficient, so u end up with alot more power and cooler air, etc... Perhaps this could be a possible solution for when a s/c is being overspun? the only thing people don like about is it that it "might" damage the impeller, but that depends on how much ur spray, u dont wann have big drops of water going into a blade spinning thousands of rpm.

 

didnt know S/C boost could be controlled. but the mind is a powerful thing, the things we think of and come up with

 

Streetz,


Basically the supercharger overspinning means the bearings are out of their "efficiency range", meaning the bearings and seals wear quicker, which can lead to damaged blower internals or leaky seals.

They sell "thrust" bearings for the V series vortech blowers, basically they are bearings that are much more durable and suitable to run at much higher impellar speeds, I've seen them go on ebay for around $250ish.

I know a stock v2/v1 will start over spinning with a 2.87" pulley at about 6500rpms.

Again, the whole point of this would be hitting peak boost much earlier, and being in that range for much longer.

 

You could just do like me and put the small pulley on and not bleed any boost off.


http://www.928m.com/parts/boostlimitervalve.php

I installed the older version of one of these when I put on the small pulley, and it will bleed off boost but I didn't experiment much with it. I quickly realized that I didn't like to bleed off boost so I leave the valve closed and use all the boost I can.

The new version looks very nice, but its also pricy.

 

how many miles have you gone with the no slip pulley?

Any signs of overspinning? bad seals? Do you push the car often?

 

My blower is noisy, but it always has been since I have had it. Calculators for impeller speed are never ideal because belts will always slip. I forget how long I have had the 2.70" anti-slip pulley. They all slip, but this one slips less that the 3.125" standard pulley that I had before.

 

This is good stuff. I like how you guys think. I would just be careful of the hotter boost temps from the smaller pulley.

Another thing you might consider is using an air/air or a water/air aftercooler. This allows you to use a smaller pulley (boost comes on quicker) but still clips your peak since the aftercooler costs you about 2PSI. And of course the obvious advantage of lowering your intake temps.

Again, nice thinking.

 

Thanks, I'm still toying with what I'm going to do. FMIC and Wastegate, or PWR AC...not sure yet.

I'll definitly give it a shot, and see what happens. My main concern is overspinning the blower...

 

i'm gonna S/C my 98 max, but is it mandatory to use a MAF from a turbocharged nissan car or can i use the MAF from the DE-K motor?

 

Nice threadjack attempt.

 

wtf???

 

You should just sell your blower and headers to buy a turbo and charge pipe....Shyt you're almost half way there with the wastegate and fmic. Or if funds allow, I would just upgrade to a t-trim if you're worried about over spinning the blower and spray some meth. Just my opinion....

 

SEARCH feature is very helpful you know

 

How much did that anti-slip pulley run you?


Yea Steve upgrade to that T trim..It's true like he said your half way there(turbo). Did you see that thread Bishnu posted ...Tesh is doing some piping for a 4th gen going turbo looks good...that's all you'll really need him for as I'm sure the rest of the install you can tackle...I can come over and help/learn too

Talk to Bishnu about the meth kit...I haven't read much about it but from the looks of it it will definitely help with temps.

Also I'm sending my blower to get rebuilt with hi-thrust bearing let me know if your interested I can ask for a better rate if we send in more than one.

 

i approve this idea, ill be in to post about it later. Excellent idea Steve!

 

i don't see the point of having this. you don't put on a smaller pulley to lower the boost. you put it on for more power.

 

First find what your max RPM is for your blower if you don't know already

http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...=SUPERCHARGERS

Next use this little tool below to figure out what pulley you need to turn your blower at it's max RPM. All you need to know is the size of your crank pulley and what RPM you will be shifting at, use different pulley sizes to come up with the combo that gets you closest to max RPM without going dangerously over it.

http://www.vortechsuperchargers.com/...d%20Calculator

You won't have a fear of overspinning the blower and can adjust your waste gate to what ever PSI you want (but I agree about getting an air to air intercooler, treadstone has some very nice ones for cheap.) As for the guy above me who says he doesn't get it. The main advantage to this obviously you will build boost much quicker if your pulley setup is for 12 psi and you bleed it off so that you're only running 8 psi (power comes on quicker so you're making more power through the RPM range than if you were just pullied for 8psi) and your waiste gate has become a boost controller so no more pesky pulley swaps when you change your setup.


The biggest problem with my car is that it's a draw through MAF so I'd have to somehow recirculate the expelled wastegate air back into the system. But after a high reving bottom end I should be at peak RPM for the T-trim so it's all good. Hope one of you do this, it's a great mod.

 

*sigh*....thanks for the update champ.



Reeper,

I'd be installing the WG between the blower and the maf, so I wouldnt need to recirculate the air.

I already know that I will begin to overspin the blower. A v1 starts to overspin at 6500 with a 2.87 pulley.

IF I go through with this I'll be on a 2.7 antislip pulley revving out to about 7500.

 

What RPM is that turning the blower at? (I don't have the specs on the crank pulley for a max.)

Vortech like all manufactures are undoubtedly conservative on their max RPM speeds so I'd guess the blowers still work a little beyond what they claim.

Do they make front mount kits for Maxima's? I decided to moch up my own for the mustang to save money. Like I said treadstone basically uses spearco cores so their stuff is top notch. Check them out if they don't sell kits already.

 

Yea a front mount may be in my future.

I'll do some calculations on impellar speed tonight, but its definitly going to overspin the blower unless i get thrust bearings installed.

Thanks for the info, I'll look into treadstone cores.

 

nice idea steve. Your gonna be a legend if this goes thru lol.. I gotta tell JeEve about this

 

I dont see the point of your post.
Who's lowering the boost? He wants to use the smaller pulley to build boost sooner, and then hold his prefered boost level all the way up. I dont see anything wrong with that. I wouldnt mind doing the same thing, staying at my current boost level yet having it come on much sooner. Not a bad idea.

 

Nice tailights. Ya for those people who don't want a lot of boost this mod is going to help them the most. For those who want to bleed off just a couple of psi probably not so much.

Somebody get a YSi and pulley it to the moon then use this mod IIRC it should bolt up to the same bracket as the S-trim ha ha.

 

Maybe......

 

LOL, he isnt ANYWHERE near a turbo setup just because he would have spent $120 on an ebay intercooler and a $150 universal intercooler piping kit, doesnt make him halfway there, lol.

Hell yeah this is great for guys who have boost-limited engines as well. ie a 3.5 swapped 4th gen with internals that wouldnt support high boost. This is perfect.

I'm so surprised this hasnt been done already, or more serious thought hasnt been put into it.

 

Looks like I stepped into the supercharger world at the right time.

Now correct me if I'm wrong, but could this setup yield just as much area under the curve as a turbo? Assuming that the boost came on at the same time it could even be more efficient than a turbo because it wouldn't be as hot. With an a/w inter or a/a inter you should be able to make more power and area with the same boost.

 

Im also wondering if this would put an end to the 3.5 vs 3.0SC war.

 

I'm curious as to how the MAF would handle all this business.

Obviously the WG would have to go before the MAF, but would air velocity and turbulence play a part?

I think the BEST thing to do, Steve, since you have an EU, is convert to a MAP-based system, then you can run all the wastegates and boost levels you want.

 

Turbo's are usually going to be superior because they don't take as much power to create boost.

Of course if you have a large turbo and were just using a small amount of psi I could see how area under the curve might be better with this mod. However I'd be very surprised, even shocked, if a properly sized turbo wasn't still far superior in all aspects.

 

You're right in that the MAP-Based system would be better, but the MAF will handle it just as it would a 14+ psi pulley. MAF isnt a big issue then, it wont be with this. Even less so, because some boost would get vented before it even hit the maf. Z32 Maf is fine IMO.

Agreed. TC is a different ball game.

 

Any updates? Steve, have you figured out exactly how you would set this up? Would you just wastegate it and use a Boost controller or spring?

 

lmfao, what does thread jacking even mean?, some of you guys take this thing waaaay tooo serious, i'm just asking a question that at the time i needed an aswer to. SMFH

 

Its when you bring up a topic in a thread that is irrelavent to the current topic.
New topics deserve new threads.