Black Max

I've got a bad noise coming from the front wheels (hard to tell which side), that I have not been able to find the cause of.

Background: Did a clutch job a while back and everything went back together nicely. Car has been running great. A couple days ago I ran across the washers for the axle nuts and realized I did not put them back on when we did the clutch. So I jacked the car up and put the washers behind the axle nuts and bolted everything back up.

Within a day of me doing this, I started to get a strange rubbing/clunking noise from the front of the car that is speed-sensitive. Applying the brakes does not affect it. The noise will go away if I steer right, but get's worse if I steer left. it's definitely metal on metal, and the clunking will vary with load on the driveline (i.e. if I step on the gas, it will ease up, but if I go back to coasting it will begine clunking again.

I jacked the car up again and inspected and tightened all the bolts on the front struts, control arms, tie rods, lug nuts, and calipers. This did not help, and I have no idea how putting the axle washers on could have made a noise appear.

I know the car needs new front tires, and new shocks as well. The brakes are only 6 months old, and the axles are only about 1 month old (replaced at the same time as clutch).

I need some direction on where too look. Any ideas on what to check or anyone who's had a similar situation, all help is appreciated.

bravehart

I have the same exact problem but from BOTH wheels. Sounds like a wheel bearing. I let Courtesy Nissan take a look at it and they agreed. They wanted $400 per side to fix. I know how i'll be spending my weekend.
check this out

the_3d_man

iTrader: (1)

if you did not tighten the crap out of that axle nut when you put it back on it will back off while driving. (trust me... i know from experience). and if that nut backs off to the point that the axle is not all the way in the hub it does bad things. for me it totally destroyed my wheel bearing. I am still not sure why the axle nut came loose on mine, but it happened right after i had my clutch changed.

MDeezy

iTrader: (27)

If you think its the washer, take it off bolt everything back up and test drive.

Its an odd noise if everthing is seated properly. Make sure axle is in all the way. Jack up the car and spin the wheel (or if your an auto, put on jacks, start the car and put in "D") listen for the noise and see if you can pin point its location.

95CustomMaxima

iTrader: (5)

The noise is coming from your passenger side if it goes away when turning right and gets worse when turning left. When you turn right, you're taking the load off right (passenger side), the chances are a wheel bearing is at fault. The noise that you're describing though is not a typical wheel bearing failure noise. A wheel bearing usually will be a humming/whirring noise. Have you heard this noise prior to the clunking?

A clunking noise can be a bad inner joint on the cv shaft. Both a wheel bearing and inner joint will be "speed sensitive", as you increase speed the noise will increase. Are you feeling any vibrations in the steering wheel, pedals, anywhere?

If the wheel bearing has failed very bad the wheel will actually wobble and then can cause a clunking noise. My guess would be that the wheel bearing is done.

-Nick

maxkill...

I changed my clutch last week and when we first took the car out of the garage I didn't even get out of the driveway before we heard a metal on metal rubbing/scraping noise. I heard it from the drivers side and did notice that when I had the wheel turned left it got worse. After checking again to make sure nothing was loose we realized it was the shield around the rotor which must have been bent a bit and it was rubbing on the rotor. We just bent it back slightly with a screwdriver and the noise went away. I never got the car up to speed before fixing it, so I don't know how it would have sounded while driving.

Black Max

Sorry for not being able to come back to this, I was out for a few days.

The thing is, both axle nuts were still fine. Neither had moved without the washer, and I tightened the crap out of them when I put it back together.

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

Wheel bearings. You will need:

Wheel Bearing
2 Bearing Seals
Wheel Hub

I have recently replaced them on both sides of my car. When the bearing goes it takes the hub out with it. Junkyard is your friend for the hub ~$65 vs $130+ at the stealership. You could save money on the labor by pulling your spindles and just have a shop do the rest of the work since it requires a press.

Black Max

I thought about this too, but the axles/CV joints are brand new. I inspected all the boots last night and they all look great.

Also, when the car is in the air and I pull/push on the wheel, there is no lateral play. I took this to mean the bearing was probably good still.

Also, something I did not mention that occurred to me after posting - when we were putting the lower crossmember back in after doing the clutch, we could not get one of the rear-engine-mount-to-cross-member bolts back in, the large brass nut and bolts that hold the lower end of the engine mount to the crossmember. We just couldn't get the bolt to line back up where we needed it to, so after 30 minutes of trying we just left it with one of the bolts in. The mount is secure so I thought it would be fine, but could that be what's making the clunking noise - the mount moving on decceleration? It completely goes away when accelerating, maybe the torque of the acceleration is keeping the engine mount from moving?

Black Max

Is there a way to confirm that the noise is the wheel bearings, any other signs I can look for?

the_3d_man

iTrader: (1)

with the car sitting on the ground, push on the side of the car and see if the wheel moves any (like if there is ANY play that allows the wheel hub to rock back and forth).
then jack the car up and spin the wheel by and listen for any grinding or squeeling. also if it's really hard to spin by hand. also check for free play in the axle and (although I know it goes without saying) check out your brakes.

cardana24

iTrader: (81)

it sounds like you are having the same problem I am having with my 95 GXE. I have no movement in my wheels side to side when I tug and push them when the car is on the ground. I have also checked everything you have, I have even pulled my driverside axle out and put it back in, just to make sure it was all the way in. The passenger side bolts to that mounting plate so I did not pull that one out since it can not really go anywhere once the 3 bolts are tightened. Where did you get your axles? I am starting to think that is my problem. I got my driver side axle from napa, it was 'new' not a rebuilt axle. I have also put my car up on jackstands and engaged the car in first gear. While the car was off the ground and cruising at about 1k in first gear I was not getting any of the clunking noise, so I figure the weight of the car must be on it for this to happen. Also when driving my car I can feel the thumping in the dead pedal area when I am resting my left foot there. I have had wheel bearings go bad, and this is not the same noise, I have had the dust shield rubbing my rotor and that is not this noise. The only thing that has sounded similar was when I left my lugs loose on my second gen, so maybe check that. Also when I go over bumps slow it feels like something is loose, and I feel like this has to do with my thumping. Also, my car is currently in the shop having the oil pan gaskets replaced and I asked the shop to diagnose this problem as well, so hopefully I will have more info. towards the end of the day or tomorrow. So what kind of axles do you have?

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

Usually you do this with the wheels off the ground. Just grab it by the top and bottom and rock it back and forth. There should be zero play. When my first one went there was no play, but it still ended up being the bearing. I can tell you the noise it made was AWFUL! A horrid metal grinding on metal sound. The sound also went away during acceloration because the weight load was transfered to the back of the car. If yours has the same symptoms, then I would put my money on a bearing.

Black Max

When the car is on the ground and I push on the wheels or fender, there is zero side to side play or movement, very solid. I spun them briefly by hand when tightening the lug nuts back on and did not hear anything, I might check that again though. Thanks.

Also, I have triple-checked both axles and there is only very minimal movement, which I figure is just the slack in the CV joints.

Brakes are good too.

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

You wont hear any noise coming from the bearing if there is no weight on the front end. Even if the hub is badly damaged. Trust me.

Black Max

Dude, this sounds like my exact problem to a T - I can feel the thumping on decelleration and part throttle near my foot, which made me wonder whether it was the rear engine mount moving back there.

Please let me know what the shop says was wrong with your car, as it might point me in the right direction on this. Thanks.

I bought the axles new from O'Reilley's, they were a decent price - don't remember off the top of my head what it was though.

EDIT: Also, last night I went around the tranny bellhousing and re-tightened all the housing to block bolts, because I thought maybe the tranny itself was moving around and vibrating. Some had worked a little loose but most were still solid. I thought for sure I had found the problem but when I test drove it afterwards, the same problem was still there.

I am seriously at a loss about this.

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

You guys need to read what I have posted.

cardana24

iTrader: (81)

thanks for what you posted but personally I am much further into this that what was posted. I have done everything you recomended, and that was not the problem.

I just heard back from the shop and they think it is the driver side axle as well. They said my bearings are nice and tight. I am going to call napa now and see how they work their warranty stuff. If they will give me another axle before I bring the old one in, since this is my only car on the road right now.

Also I do not think it is your motor mounts...but I would still try to get that in. When I did my motor swap, I poly filled my mounts and all bolts are put back in but yet I have the same problem. I know my tranny mount is trashed but I do not think that would cause this.

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

Point taken, but I had a mechanic look at mine as well and he basically said but start with the wheel bearings. After that advice I bought all of the wheel bearing stuff and took it to Stephen Max's house. We searched and searched, but couldnt make the noise happen with the car off the ground. It wasnt until he removed the hub that everything was apparent. The hub almost slid out. It had about 1mm chewed off of it.

Maybe try pulling the axels out and look for small metal shavings or filings around the hub/bearing area? I dont remember if that was seen.

Black Max

I did Dubbya, but my symptoms don't match what you describe.

Black Max

Cardana, let me know what fix they come up with for your car. Thanks.

cardana24

iTrader: (81)

I just talked to NAPA and once I bring the axle back they will credit me for it. I have all next week off from work so I plan on doing it then. I hope to goodness it is the axle, I am tired of laying on my garage floor every weekend, going over everything a million times. If for some reason you replace your driver side axle before I do please post back as to if it helped/fixed the problem.

Dubbya I will look at the hub when I pull the axle out again. Thanks.

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

I feel your pain. Mine happened directly after a transmission swap so I was ready to bet money it was an axel or the transmission itself. Good luck man!

cardana24

iTrader: (81)

is there anything specifically I should be looking for in the hub for signs of wear or damage?

Black Max

Will do man. I need to get this taken care of ASAP.

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

The only real way to tell is to remove the hub from the bearing. Unfortunately that is half of removing the bearing for replacement. The hub is pressed in. I am just wondering if, on the back side of the spindle you might see some metal shavings from the hub grinding. I dont know if the seal will hold them in or if they will be noticeable. Take a close look around the bearing seals. Just something else to look for.

95CustomMaxima

iTrader: (5)

If you rock the wheel from top to bottom and there is play, that would be a wheel bearing (like Dubbya mentioned).

Are you positive the axles were new units or rebuilt?

You mentioned that cardana's symptoms matched yours. From what I gather from cardana's post is that his inner cv joint is bad. This will cause a clunking noise and you will feel it (pedals, floorboard, and such) and is only noticable under load (weight of the car), also the clunking will get worse as speed increases. Just because the boots look good doesnt mean the cv joint is good also.

If you have a warranty like cardana's like most axles do I would replace it.

-Nick

Black Max

Yes, I'm sure the axles were new units.

Thanks for the input, I will check the axle if it turns out that it's not the wheel bearing.

About how much is the average cost to have a shop replace a wheel bearing?

Another item of interest is that the clunking will only happen if I'm turning hte wheel to ther left, if I veer right the clunking will go away completely. Also, it has developed a whining/scraping noise that is speed-sensitive.

cardana24

iTrader: (81)

For mine it is not the axle. I replaced it a few days ago and I sitll have the exact same noise. I know that my ball joints are worn out but would they cause a noise like this? I have noticed too that the noise with my car does not start until you get to about 15-20 mph, and it is at its worst around 40mph. Its not the tires because I rotated those a few days ago. I have this whole week off from work so hopefully I can get somewhere on this.

ryant35

iTrader: (3)

I agree with that, I would tear it apart and check it out, of course after jacking it up and looking for anything obvious that may be rubbing. Then be sure to torque down that hub nut, use an impact gun if you can. There should also be a crown & a cotter pin. This is needed even if you use an impact gun

vincetti26

i get a similar sound myself

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

Anyone figure out the problem? Just curious..............

cardana24

iTrader: (81)

mine is going back to the shop on thursday, I have a leaking timing chain cover, so I am going to get them to look at it again. I changed the axle and that was not the problem, and I do not have a press so pulling the wheel bearing out it not an option for me to do at my house.

Black Max

UPDATE: I finally had a chance to tear down the pass. side supsension this afternoon. I was fully intent on removing the axle and returning it to O'Reilly's for a new one, thinking the noise had to be my cv joint.

As soon as I removed the axle from the hub, I saw metal shavings (long thing wirey pieces) around the inner wheel bearing. Dubbya was right, it's time for a new wheel bearing.

NOW, my question is ... Do I just need to have a new wheel bearing and seals pressed into the hub and put it back together, or will I need a new hub as well?

cardana24

iTrader: (81)

Depends on if the hub is damaged. A lot of times if the wheel bearing is not fixed in a timely manor then it will trash the hub as well. I usually let the shop that is doing the wheel bearing let me know if I need a hub as well.

Black Max

That's the plan, I"m going to drop it off today or tomorrow at a local shop and have them replace the wheel bearing. I guess we'll see if the hub is trashed once they get in there. Will try to come back and update this with the results.

Dubbya

iTrader: (16)

Get a hub from the Junkyard. They are about $45-60 for the entire spindle. The dealership charges $130 just for the hub.