4th gen 5 speed sucks
11-19-2007, 08:12 PM
#41
but 5 speeds are such junk!! i hope you dont pay more than 50 bucks for it. 
I know what you mean, I used to be auto but swapped and have never looked back. I often drive home very late as well and I think the 5 speed helps me stay awake honestly...when it was auto I remember drifting off very frequently. Plus driving a 5 speed helps you be MUCH more aware of the road and your speed if you ask me. it sounds opposite, but like everyone says "I have an auto , i can eat, drink, flip channels on the radio all while driving"...exactly my point...your going to multitask because you can. kinda like sleeping and driving at the same time
anyway I know that was kinda besides the point but this thread has gone down the drain anyway. Be happy your auto's have 4 gears..i have an el camino with only 3....
I know what you mean, I used to be auto but swapped and have never looked back. I often drive home very late as well and I think the 5 speed helps me stay awake honestly...when it was auto I remember drifting off very frequently. Plus driving a 5 speed helps you be MUCH more aware of the road and your speed if you ask me. it sounds opposite, but like everyone says "I have an auto , i can eat, drink, flip channels on the radio all while driving"...exactly my point...your going to multitask because you can. kinda like sleeping and driving at the same time
anyway I know that was kinda besides the point but this thread has gone down the drain anyway. Be happy your auto's have 4 gears..i have an el camino with only 3....
11-20-2007, 07:55 AM
#42
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 136
My 5 spd. with a Fidanza blows by anyone on the freeway when I want to and I don't have to downshift, but revving up and dropping in to 3rd at 65 and running in to fourth at 95 is so fun.... Something about immediate passing power in 5th puts a smile on my face too.
Anyone else notice a lot faster acceleration at speed with a lighter flywheel?
167,000 original manual, 24mpg average over a year, foot to floor at least once a day
Anyone else notice a lot faster acceleration at speed with a lighter flywheel?
167,000 original manual, 24mpg average over a year, foot to floor at least once a day
11-20-2007, 10:19 AM
#43
My 5 spd. with a Fidanza blows by anyone on the freeway when I want to and I don't have to downshift, but revving up and dropping in to 3rd at 65 and running in to fourth at 95 is so fun.... Something about immediate passing power in 5th puts a smile on my face too.
Anyone else notice a lot faster acceleration at speed with a lighter flywheel?
167,000 original manual, 24mpg average over a year, foot to floor at least once a day
Anyone else notice a lot faster acceleration at speed with a lighter flywheel?
167,000 original manual, 24mpg average over a year, foot to floor at least once a day
11-20-2007, 01:20 PM
#46
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2007
Posts: 136
Most manufacturers make the stock flywheel very heavy. This makes the engine very smooth and enables it to retain energy at part throttle cruise and up long grades for better fuel economy. To overcome the kinetic energy stored in the flywheel (accelerating/ decelerating) you have to put more energy in to it than it has "stored". Basic physics.
Flywheels act as a kinetic energy reservoir (has no effect on engine power output). A heavy flywheel can compensate briefly for an underpowered engine when it's suddenly placed under load, like when you're letting the clutch out, however it also restricts the engines ability to accelerate. The rotating mass you remove from the flywheel diminishes the amount of energy that must be put into the flywheel before any work can be done on moving the car itself. This is the same theory behind using lighter weight wheels to give you quicker acceleration. However, since the flywheel is placed before the transmission and rotating at much higher rpm's than your wheels, lightening it has a much greater effect as energy in an object climbs exponentially with speed.
Having a lighter flywheel results in more immediate acceleration/ deceleration at any rpm (less energy/ time spent to increase rotational speed) but is exponentially more effective as rpm's climb, there are no negative side effects until you go too light. A lighter flywheel does create more bucking/ surging at lower speeds and makes clutch engagement seem less predictable. Ever wonder why high performance road cars and all race cars have lightened flywheels?
Morpheus you are correct to the extent that it has less effect at lower rpms and as wind resistance increases (higher speeds). That is why I asked if other people feel the same more immediate acceleration at speed. There's no doubt it makes a difference in the mid/ upper rpms. Like anything else it's all subjective. We can all agree that our 3000 lb. 5 speeds are fun and rarely get shown up on the road.
Flywheels act as a kinetic energy reservoir (has no effect on engine power output). A heavy flywheel can compensate briefly for an underpowered engine when it's suddenly placed under load, like when you're letting the clutch out, however it also restricts the engines ability to accelerate. The rotating mass you remove from the flywheel diminishes the amount of energy that must be put into the flywheel before any work can be done on moving the car itself. This is the same theory behind using lighter weight wheels to give you quicker acceleration. However, since the flywheel is placed before the transmission and rotating at much higher rpm's than your wheels, lightening it has a much greater effect as energy in an object climbs exponentially with speed.
Having a lighter flywheel results in more immediate acceleration/ deceleration at any rpm (less energy/ time spent to increase rotational speed) but is exponentially more effective as rpm's climb, there are no negative side effects until you go too light. A lighter flywheel does create more bucking/ surging at lower speeds and makes clutch engagement seem less predictable. Ever wonder why high performance road cars and all race cars have lightened flywheels?
Morpheus you are correct to the extent that it has less effect at lower rpms and as wind resistance increases (higher speeds). That is why I asked if other people feel the same more immediate acceleration at speed. There's no doubt it makes a difference in the mid/ upper rpms. Like anything else it's all subjective. We can all agree that our 3000 lb. 5 speeds are fun and rarely get shown up on the road.
03-12-2009, 12:06 AM
#49
Senior Member
Join Date: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,108
Old bump 
But please someone make me feel better
I just brought a 5speed after having an auto and wanting a manual for long and then by accident I see this thread
Are the 5speeds that weak? I have standard clutch (probably original) and I'm only down shifting at reasonable revs (&matching).. how weak are they?
Is it bad on the tranny to rev through 1st to 5000? or power through 2nd etc, is it only weak when shifting and not in gear? I have no intention of burnouts etc.. oh ands its non-lsd
Is it harder on the trans or the clutch when doing a 4th to 2nd downshift?
Pics of my new car
_
But please someone make me feel better
I just brought a 5speed after having an auto and wanting a manual for long and then by accident I see this thread
Are the 5speeds that weak? I have standard clutch (probably original) and I'm only down shifting at reasonable revs (&matching).. how weak are they?
Is it bad on the tranny to rev through 1st to 5000? or power through 2nd etc, is it only weak when shifting and not in gear? I have no intention of burnouts etc.. oh ands its non-lsd
Is it harder on the trans or the clutch when doing a 4th to 2nd downshift?
Pics of my new car
_
Last edited by killerVQ30DE; 03-12-2009 at 01:21 AM.
03-12-2009, 12:29 AM
#50
The trannys are fine... OP just thought he owned a Z06, not a Maxima.
My only gripe about the 4th gen 5 speed is what has been mentioned, how short 5th gear is. It should be a cruising gear, or at least a little better than the auto. It gets old turning 3,200+ RPMs on the freeway on long trips, and obviously gas mileage suffers a bit. Someone mentioned the passing power in 5th, which is nice, but honestly how difficult is it to shift to 4th for those rare occasions?
Overall though, the stock clutch and tranny will last for a very long time if you treat them right, and from what I've read on this forum will put up with a bit of moderate abuse as well. My 96 is at about 125k and is on the original clutch, still feels great and it has been used to teach at least 8-10 beginners how do drive stick on...
You're fine man. Overall I think most guys on this forum will agree it's a better tranny than the auto.
My only gripe about the 4th gen 5 speed is what has been mentioned, how short 5th gear is. It should be a cruising gear, or at least a little better than the auto. It gets old turning 3,200+ RPMs on the freeway on long trips, and obviously gas mileage suffers a bit. Someone mentioned the passing power in 5th, which is nice, but honestly how difficult is it to shift to 4th for those rare occasions?
Overall though, the stock clutch and tranny will last for a very long time if you treat them right, and from what I've read on this forum will put up with a bit of moderate abuse as well. My 96 is at about 125k and is on the original clutch, still feels great and it has been used to teach at least 8-10 beginners how do drive stick on...
You're fine man. Overall I think most guys on this forum will agree it's a better tranny than the auto.
03-12-2009, 06:48 AM
#53
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 1,422
it all depends on how you drive, i drive my car normal.
if you drive it hard, then of course it wont last.
if you drive it hard, then of course it wont last.
03-12-2009, 07:31 AM
#54
The trannys are fine... OP just thought he owned a Z06, not a Maxima.
My only gripe about the 4th gen 5 speed is what has been mentioned, how short 5th gear is. It should be a cruising gear, or at least a little better than the auto. It gets old turning 3,200+ RPMs on the freeway on long trips, and obviously gas mileage suffers a bit. Someone mentioned the passing power in 5th, which is nice, but honestly how difficult is it to shift to 4th for those rare occasions?
My only gripe about the 4th gen 5 speed is what has been mentioned, how short 5th gear is. It should be a cruising gear, or at least a little better than the auto. It gets old turning 3,200+ RPMs on the freeway on long trips, and obviously gas mileage suffers a bit. Someone mentioned the passing power in 5th, which is nice, but honestly how difficult is it to shift to 4th for those rare occasions?
03-12-2009, 08:24 AM
#55
Yes. I said it. This transmission just doesn't have any of the qualities a good manual transmission has.
People buy a manual over an auto for performance, longer service life, economy. The 4th gen auto in 4th gear revs the engine lower then a 5 speed. A 5 speed has lower gas mileage over an auto because of it, not to mention that by running the engine at a higher RPM decreases engine life over an auto so it sucks on the highway. The 5 speed is a weak transmission. It blows. I seen a couple people here with blown transmissions. I don't care if they are driven hard. That's why it's a manual. And they also leak oil. They don't usually last long before a rebuild neither.
This 5 speed just doesn't perform like a manual transmission, isn't economic like a manual transmission and it's not dependable. I had an auto 97 Max with 200k miles before this 99 and the transmssion was still going strong. This manual wont last as long.
I'll give it props because there is a VLSD version so you can at least get massive FWD wheel spin from BOTH wheels instead of just one - I think I'm in trouble on that last one
People buy a manual over an auto for performance, longer service life, economy. The 4th gen auto in 4th gear revs the engine lower then a 5 speed. A 5 speed has lower gas mileage over an auto because of it, not to mention that by running the engine at a higher RPM decreases engine life over an auto so it sucks on the highway. The 5 speed is a weak transmission. It blows. I seen a couple people here with blown transmissions. I don't care if they are driven hard. That's why it's a manual. And they also leak oil. They don't usually last long before a rebuild neither.
This 5 speed just doesn't perform like a manual transmission, isn't economic like a manual transmission and it's not dependable. I had an auto 97 Max with 200k miles before this 99 and the transmssion was still going strong. This manual wont last as long.
I'll give it props because there is a VLSD version so you can at least get massive FWD wheel spin from BOTH wheels instead of just one - I think I'm in trouble on that last one
Not sure if you're just having problems with yours from either you not driving it right or previous owners not driving it right but the fact that I've got 305k miles should speak for itself that the high rpms havent killed the motor as you said, the 467 out of a 16 gal tank out of a 300k+ mile car is not considered poor economy. As for performance? the damn car is a grocery getter that has pulled on numerous cars that were supposed to be "fast". Dont know dude guess you got a bad one. I've done about 20k miles of driving since I got this Max in June 2008 and the trans is going strong still.
Either you've got higher manual trans standards from high end cars or your cars got problems, dont get me wrong this is my first manual so I just may be speaking out of my you know who
Good luck with that tranny
EDIT: woopsie just noticed I posted in an old *** thread
03-12-2009, 08:27 AM
#56
Not sure if you're just having problems with yours from either you not driving it right or previous owners not driving it right but the fact that I've got 305k miles should speak for itself that the high rpms havent killed the motor as you said, the 467 out of a 16 gal tank out of a 300k+ mile car is not considered poor economy. As for performance? the damn car is a grocery getter that has pulled on numerous cars that were supposed to be "fast". Dont know dude guess you got a bad one. I've done about 20k miles of driving since I got this Max in June 2008 and the trans is going strong still.
03-12-2009, 08:27 AM
#57
102k with my stock clutch....swaped it for a exedy just cause....and as for trannys, i blew my 95 tranny, because it was crap already, and i abused the crap out of it...took it to the track, droped the clutch at 5k, so i think it held up pretty well...right now i put in a 99 tranny and its holding up pretty well...i dont abuse it, but just been at the track, and its fun
03-12-2009, 08:47 AM
#58
I had the bearings and seals changed in my 95 SE three years ago, and its still going strong. I have no issues with that tranny....granted though that I dont beat on it every time I drive it.
I do find that I get better gas mileage with it in comparison to my 99 auto.
I do find that I get better gas mileage with it in comparison to my 99 auto.
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