Clutch engagement problem.
04-20-2008, 12:13 AM
#1
Clutch engagement problem.
Ever since my 5 speed swap I've noticed that the clutch does not engage smoothly or normal...its as if it always changes its engage point etc. I read this could be due to preload where the master cylinder connects to the pedal and I'm going to take care of that soon.
Tonight I had a little emergency moment where I floored it through first shifted hard into second still WOT and then took the car out of gear. I proceeded to clutch in and put it into 5th but the gears grinded. My foot was ALL the way down on the clutch pedal. I clutched out and pressed down again and it grinded again. I waited a second because this has happened before and on the third try it worked.
What causes this? Is it something temperature related? Its acting as if I didnt have the clutch pressed at all and just tried to put it into a gear.
The master cylinder was new when I did the swap but it was aftermarket off of ebay. I have SS clutch line to the slave cylinder which is kind of old itself. The clutch was brand new OEM 00-01 clutch.
I'm going to be rebuilding the transmission for the diff bearings which are long dead, within the next few weeks but I know this is something more related to the clutch.
I also hope my gears arent all messed up cause I've grinded pretty hard a couple times due to the clutch not engaging.
Thanks guys
edit: Im reading that this could be synchronizers. If thats the case....this sucks. I was planning on rebuilding the transmission but I didnt buy synchronizers and I know that adds a whole new task to the rebuild...any advice as far as that goes?
Tonight I had a little emergency moment where I floored it through first shifted hard into second still WOT and then took the car out of gear. I proceeded to clutch in and put it into 5th but the gears grinded. My foot was ALL the way down on the clutch pedal. I clutched out and pressed down again and it grinded again. I waited a second because this has happened before and on the third try it worked.
What causes this? Is it something temperature related? Its acting as if I didnt have the clutch pressed at all and just tried to put it into a gear.
The master cylinder was new when I did the swap but it was aftermarket off of ebay. I have SS clutch line to the slave cylinder which is kind of old itself. The clutch was brand new OEM 00-01 clutch.
I'm going to be rebuilding the transmission for the diff bearings which are long dead, within the next few weeks but I know this is something more related to the clutch.
I also hope my gears arent all messed up cause I've grinded pretty hard a couple times due to the clutch not engaging.
Thanks guys
edit: Im reading that this could be synchronizers. If thats the case....this sucks. I was planning on rebuilding the transmission but I didnt buy synchronizers and I know that adds a whole new task to the rebuild...any advice as far as that goes?
Last edited by chillin014; 04-20-2008 at 12:22 AM.
04-20-2008, 10:45 AM
#3
im gonna go check right now. Your probably right though, when I did the swap I had to use those washers between the firewall and the pedal and I might have put too many. The threaded rod from the master cylinder barely engages with the pedal.
There have been days where the clutch engages perfect though and pretty early on in the pedal "swing", consistent everytime as well. But those days are rare.
Its been a year since the swap and it only locks me out of gears like this whenever I drive the car very hard which results in horrible grinds because I'm shifting hard.
brb
they arent even, the clutch pedal is actually higher up than the brake pedal by maybe almost half an inch. would that have anything to do with not being able to shift into gear like that though??
There have been days where the clutch engages perfect though and pretty early on in the pedal "swing", consistent everytime as well. But those days are rare.
Its been a year since the swap and it only locks me out of gears like this whenever I drive the car very hard which results in horrible grinds because I'm shifting hard.
brb
they arent even, the clutch pedal is actually higher up than the brake pedal by maybe almost half an inch. would that have anything to do with not being able to shift into gear like that though??
Last edited by chillin014; 04-20-2008 at 10:47 AM.
04-20-2008, 10:10 PM
#4
my 2nds grinds when the car is all warmed up.
Does your 5th gear grind like you let your clutch out before you were fully engaged into gear? Cause my 2nd gear feels like that when it grinds.
But if it is cold I have no problem.
Sebastian I'll give you a call about my clutch, just like how I mentioned it in my thread.
Does your 5th gear grind like you let your clutch out before you were fully engaged into gear? Cause my 2nd gear feels like that when it grinds.
But if it is cold I have no problem.
Sebastian I'll give you a call about my clutch, just like how I mentioned it in my thread.
04-21-2008, 12:42 AM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lowell/Boston, MA
Posts: 1,613
yah u need to adjust your clutch pedals freeplay. Don't adjust the height if it is the same as the brake pedal... Stock specs say to have it like 5/8 higher then the brake but just don't do it... It sucks... lol... O and when adjusting ur freeplay, only do a few turns... because the pedal will change as u drive to adjust to those settings. Refer to my topic titled "Never adjust Freeplay and pedal height at the same time"
04-21-2008, 05:56 AM
#6
once the car is in gear theres is no grinding. it only does this thing when i'm driving it kinda hard or trying to make a quick shift...acts like I'm not pressing in the clutch enough or at all.
coremanx- Freeplay? I dont think there is any freeplay. I swapped in the 5 speed so I had to make a spacer on the firewall to mount the pedal at the proper height. I think I might have put too many washers however so thats why it barely engages with the threaded rod. If I were to thread that rod more it would be putting even more preload on the pedal wouldnt it?
wheres your thread?
i still dont feel like pedal position is enough of an excuse for how it acts though
coremanx- Freeplay? I dont think there is any freeplay. I swapped in the 5 speed so I had to make a spacer on the firewall to mount the pedal at the proper height. I think I might have put too many washers however so thats why it barely engages with the threaded rod. If I were to thread that rod more it would be putting even more preload on the pedal wouldnt it?
wheres your thread?
i still dont feel like pedal position is enough of an excuse for how it acts though
04-21-2008, 04:42 PM
#7
yah u need to adjust your clutch pedals freeplay. Don't adjust the height if it is the same as the brake pedal... Stock specs say to have it like 5/8 higher then the brake but just don't do it... It sucks... lol... O and when adjusting ur freeplay, only do a few turns... because the pedal will change as u drive to adjust to those settings. Refer to my topic titled "Never adjust Freeplay and pedal height at the same time"
04-21-2008, 05:26 PM
#8
04-21-2008, 11:56 PM
#9
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lowell/Boston, MA
Posts: 1,613
No, there is 2 adjustments you can make... The height which is the next to a sensor, I think it is the cruse control killswitch, I can't remember, and it adjusts pedal height. And behind the pedal there is a bar that goes into the Master cylinder and you can adjust the "freeplay" of the pedal which is basically an inch or about 3/4"th of an inch before the pedal gets resistance after you press it. You are not supposed to get instant resistance when u push the clutch. There needs to be a gap of space. IF you get instant resistance that is why ur clutch is slipping, because it is not fully engaging. It happened to me twice.
04-22-2008, 10:45 AM
#12
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lowell/Boston, MA
Posts: 1,613
alright well think what u want... someone that has expericence in this or someone that don't... right now u don't have many options so I would take what you can get for help... If it is not this probelm then you or someone ****ed up on putting in ur clutch, and yes clutch can be put in backwards.
Last edited by S1cTech; 04-22-2008 at 11:25 AM.
04-22-2008, 11:06 AM
#13
thats no way to act. I am going to go look at my pedal and see if there is a "height" adjustment
according to the FSM, you can adjust the height with the pedal stopper bolt/cruise control switch. and the free play with the master cylinder push rod.
Im going to go see if mine is in spec.
I originally thought my spacer was too large on the firewall but when I went to look at it the pedal sits right on top of the black firewall cover so its not like I could really push it back any further if I took a washer/spacer out.
according to the FSM, you can adjust the height with the pedal stopper bolt/cruise control switch. and the free play with the master cylinder push rod.
Im going to go see if mine is in spec.
I originally thought my spacer was too large on the firewall but when I went to look at it the pedal sits right on top of the black firewall cover so its not like I could really push it back any further if I took a washer/spacer out.
Last edited by chillin014; 04-22-2008 at 11:26 AM.
04-22-2008, 11:26 AM
#14
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lowell/Boston, MA
Posts: 1,613
I am not trying to come off as a ****, but I just don't like when I help someone and they either disagree or don't use process of elimination. I had a similar experience with my clutch and this is how i fixed it... that is all I am saying.
04-22-2008, 11:39 AM
#15
nobody is disregarding your help but this isnt exactly a stock set up.
ANYWAY. According to the fsm my pedals initial resting point is actually sitting lower than it should be despite the fact that its much higher up than the brake pedal. The freeplay before it actually engages the master cylinder pushrod is about half an inch. I doubt messing with this freeplay area is going to have an effect on my problem seeing as how these little adjustments only change where the pedal rests and maybe the over all length of the swing but not necessarily anything to do with actually engaging the clutch.
I am going to change out my master cylinder to an OEM unit asap.
ANYWAY. According to the fsm my pedals initial resting point is actually sitting lower than it should be despite the fact that its much higher up than the brake pedal. The freeplay before it actually engages the master cylinder pushrod is about half an inch. I doubt messing with this freeplay area is going to have an effect on my problem seeing as how these little adjustments only change where the pedal rests and maybe the over all length of the swing but not necessarily anything to do with actually engaging the clutch.
I am going to change out my master cylinder to an OEM unit asap.
04-22-2008, 12:04 PM
#16
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lowell/Boston, MA
Posts: 1,613
I was surprised myself when my clutch was slipping when I adjusted the freeplay wrong... I couldn't even go 30mph at all... The clutch was slipping because it would not engage do not having any free play...
04-22-2008, 12:47 PM
#17
well my clutch isnt slipping. in fact the pedal is pretty much set all the way out on the master cylinder pushrod. I can see where if it was adjusted inwards you simply wouldnt be able to press the pedal far enough to push the master cylinder push rod in as far as it needs to go.
my problem is that the clutch pedal will be pressed in all the way and itll act as if the clutch pedal isnt being pressed at all.
my problem is that the clutch pedal will be pressed in all the way and itll act as if the clutch pedal isnt being pressed at all.
04-22-2008, 09:02 PM
#18
well Chillin14, f550maranello2, and I are all 5spd swapped, compared to your stock set up. So the situation for us is a little different. Just because we disagree with you doesn't mean we aren't listening to you.
your clutch was slipping cause you had pressure on your shift fork, pushing your pressure plate and having the clutch disk not engage fully. You could of easily rebleed your clutch line to fix that problem.
your clutch was slipping cause you had pressure on your shift fork, pushing your pressure plate and having the clutch disk not engage fully. You could of easily rebleed your clutch line to fix that problem.
04-23-2008, 05:53 AM
#19
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Join Date: Jun 2007
Location: Lowell/Boston, MA
Posts: 1,613
yah, i need to bleed thr system that is for sure, but I wonder why the freeplay adjusting fixed it... for now anyway... but as far as bleeding the pedal is rather spongy so as soon as I get to it, I need to bleed it.
04-23-2008, 10:06 AM
#21
04-23-2008, 11:16 AM
#22
well honestly..I have to rebuild the transmission regardless...so i'm probably going to post up a thread once I've stirred up that mess and have some pictures. I will probably replace the synchros depending on what they look like...and while i'm in there i'll probably replace the master cylinder as well so there might not be any way to tell what exactly was causing hte problem.
I also want to add that I am running very low on fluid seeing as how the car leaks it constantly and I never bothered to refill it once I found out it needed a rebuild.
I also want to add that I am running very low on fluid seeing as how the car leaks it constantly and I never bothered to refill it once I found out it needed a rebuild.
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