Smokin' X-press

Finally got the subframe connectors Stage 1 and 2 installed on Friday. My suspension mods prior to this included Eibach, Tokico Blue, FSB and RSB. Anyone with a similar set up would concur that the ride was really bumpy esp going over pot holes, bumps or ruts in the road etc. Well all that crappy feeling is gone after the install of the SFCs. The ride quality is totally different...the car feels a lot more calm and composed when going over bad roads. It feels that the suspension is way well balanced and configured to the car's chassis. I made it a point to drive on bad roads after this to see how it felt and all that shaking and creaking that used to come on driving on bad roads is gone. For the $375 I spent on the parts and install, I think this is probably my best suspension/handling mod ever. The install took about 2.5 hrs. This was done by a shop that has never installed SFC's before, so it could be less if u go to some one who has experience. The install was perfect and I don't have any problems with door closing etc.

I also got to test the SFCs out at the track (Gingerman) yesterday. The car's handling is totally different. I'm not sure if I should say better than before as it took me some time to get a handle on the car. The car tends to oversteer (I mean the back end coming loose) a lot and very easily. This never happened to me even after the install of the RSB but now the car is really susceptible. I would probably think it could be because i'm able to take turns a lot faster than before as the car feels a lot more composed and handling seems a lot better taking fast turns and when i got used to the oversteer, I was able to use that to my advantage in taking turns.

Also, i believe the steering response seems to be a little better and overall I think it's the best bang for the buck.

2k2nyc

I just installed my stage 1 on Saturday also. I'm very pleased with it. I especially like how different the suspension feels now (Tokico & H&Rs). The car feels much more stable when going over bumps, and the rear doesn't skip when I go over bumps while turing at high speeds. Can't wait to get stage II.

VMaximus02

iTrader: (1)

You can asked the installer to fabricate a metal rod/bar to brace at the front of the SFC (kinda like FSB), just like the stage 3 except without the rear brace, to counter-balance out the rear end. Perhaps, this will make your car handling more neutral?

2k2nyc

Vmaximus02, what was the fittment issue you had with the stage II? Does that apply only to 02-03s or is it the same for all 5th gens?

VMaximus02

iTrader: (1)

I have 02' and the stage 2 kit that was shipped to me was misaligned. The 2 rear rods were too short and the front were too long. The installer tried to swap the rods and positioned them different ways but couldn't properly aligned them up. The center plate was the main component with the stage 2 installation since it dictated the clearance. Initially, I thought they had sent me the 4th gen kit my mistake but Dallas told me that they were correct in dimension when I gave him measurement??? After a month or so waiting for some responses from them, i got tired and had the installer to fabricate those rods and made some adjustment to the welding point to fit the stage 2. FYI, The installer who had done my SFC's installation was a very experience welder. He's specialized in muscle car and had done numerous SFC's installations and a few 4th gen SFC's too.

As to answer your question, I am not sure. Since the 5th gen Maxima (A33 chassis) should be the same from 00'-03'...perhaps Warpspeed had made changes to the stage 2 or yet they were just in denial that they had mistakenly send me the wrong kit? It was really frustrating when you'd paid for a performance parts and they don't fit right!

2k2nyc

I don't want to run into that problem b/c my welder (custom piping shop) charges an arm and a leg for modification.

Smokin-X - did you have any problem with the stage II?

Dave B

I couldn't agree more that SFCs are one the best mods out there. They make the Maxima feel like a more substanial car. When you hit bumps it's just a thump, not a resonating crash.

As for the oversteer, dump the RSB. You don't need a RSB because the beam already has a .7" sway bar going thru the middle of it. You're already lowered and you've got SFCs therefore much of your sway has already been reduced. The RSB is just causing bind and not letting the beam do it's job. Dump the rsb, gain better handling, gain more suspension travel, reduce suspension bind, and get better ride quality.


Dave

VMaximus02

iTrader: (1)

I've thought of doing that too, taking off the rsb. Not trying to question your claim in regards to better ride and handling quality with the rsb off but can you tell me why you have this conclusion? I thought that the rsb serves two purposes: 1) to reduce the sway of the rear end when corner, 2) stiffen the chassis to increase rigidity. Please give some more detail inputs to your suggestion.

maximum_rpm_nyc

I'm waiting SFCs as well.
Currently my 2K has JICs + STILLEN RSB + FSTB.
my 2K3 is on Eibachs and AGXs, if all goes well, I'll probably get SFCs for my 2k3 as well.

Smokin' X-press

The only thing that the shop told me was that the holes were not drilled in the Stage 1 plates to attach the Stage 2 (which basically bolts to the Stage 1). I called up Dallas and he said that they stopped doing that so people could drill where they wanted to position the stage 2 bars to clear the aftermarket midpipes. Other than that absolutely no problems/issues.

Smokin' X-press

I have a feeling that your handling will get even better with the JIC and the SFCs. After driving with the SFCs for a few days it feels that I could probably go with a stiffer set up.

I cannot explain how good the ride quality is after the SFC install. I've driven on really bad roads before and after and the difference is just amazing. It really feels like u're driving a much more expensive car and the chassis is now made to handle a stiffer set up.

Just to let you know that as JIC's are height adjustable, u may not be able to slam the ride all the way as the SFC will reduce ur clearance. If I had to guess the Stage 1 will reduce clearance by approx 3/4 - 1 inch.

Smokin' X-press

Dave B - I would also like to know a bit more before taking off the RSB.

Also, I have ordered the Lower Control Arm bar from GT Fabrications to test fit it on the A33 (2000+) chassis. I took the measurements and they seemed really close to what Culver at GT Fabrication said. I'm hoping to do this in the next week or so, so i'll keep u guys posted on that too.

Dave B

The stock 4th and 5th gen already have RSBs as stock. The .7" bar goes thru the middle of the beam and ties into the trailing arms. The beam is pretty much just a large RSB. Adding an aftermarket RSB does help the stock suspensioned Maxima because of the car's high center of gravity, weak tires, and softer suspension. However when you add quality springs and firmer struts, the car's center of gravity is lowered and the better spring/struts reduce a lot of excessive roll (ie sway). What ends up happening is the RSB starts causing suspension bind which keeps the beam from doing it's job and ultimately causes snap oversteer which isn't good. I installed my RSB when my suspension was stock and had it on there for 3 years including a set of 1.5" drop ST springs and then 1.9" drop Intrax springs. The more I researched and learned about Nissan's intended design of the 4th/5th gen beam and an article from Motor Trend comparing the handling times of the Stillen Max with and without the RSB installed (no RSB = better handling times), I decided to experiment and yank my Addco RSB off. The first thing I noticed was better ride quality which makes sense because I just removed 18lbs of unsprung weight from the beam. I noticed that the car did lean a slight bit more into turns, but it was far more stable and less twitchy. On tight lower speed turns, I could actually feel the car turn in quicker (something Nissan brags about with this particular beam setup). I also noticed some of the rocking of the rear of the Maxima over bumpy turns was reduced (less binding).

Now adding SFCs made the car handle even better because there is far less movement in the body of the car. Stiff chassis always equals better handling and better ride quality. There's a reason auto makers strive for the stiffest chassis. Stiff chassis also mean you can run softer suspensions and get good handling numbers. BMW typically runs very soft springs and firm struts in most of their cars because their chassis' are so stout. GM was able to run 25% softer struts and springs in the C5 because the chassis was so much more rigid.

The only vehicle you want to have a flexible chassis is a 4X4 rock crawler.

Dave

LithiuMax

SFC's? Someone please explain what those are, and where I can find more info on them. Thanks.

maximum_rpm_nyc

Sub
Frame
Connectors.

www.warpspeedperformance.com

Tie your unibody together, making for the rave reviews of taking handling to the next stage.

LithiuMax

Is it correct to say that the car will handle only as well as the tires will let it handle? As in, I probably shoudln't take turns meant for 30 mph at 60+mph if I have RSB, FSTB, and SFC's installed while riding on stock tires, correct? Or is this not dependant on tires at all?

maximum_rpm_nyc

I already tied up the front end up w/ FSTB and lower tie bar. I used to work as a mechanical engineer so I tried the radius arms, I'm still playing with heim joints but the lower tie bar made my turn in so much quicker. the JICs made the car incredible handler, but I want more. The RSB is useful if you know how to control the car. RSB makes for more 'oversteer' (<--understeer-neutral-oversteer-->) The lower tie bar made it more neutral, but the SFCs should give me the edge and ride comfort I may want.
I've had eibachs, teins, and GCs. Hands down JICs were worth every dime. As for height, I'm not interested in how low, but I want a stance where the car looks even and I have more than 1.75" of suspension travel. My 2k3 ride is punishing compared to the JICs. Suspension travel around NYC is important.
My FX35 is excellent, what I'm hoping to achieve in how the chasis feels when going thru a sweeper. VDC has saved me on more than one occassion. Sometime I feel my FX35 handles better than my 2K on JICs, cause of the chasis feeling and the feedback I get from the steering wheel in the FX35.
I'll know in a few weeks, since I just started at Nissan, big career change, but it was time for me to change things up. I actually looked up my last name under Nissan's database, and between my family and I, we've had 9 Nissan products in 7 years.
My winter project is to tie up the rear end (trunk) of the car after my friend showed me his CUSCO RSTB in his WRX. I lose pass thru, but what a difference. Felt stock, and my friends WRX has the full STi lower link package, Prova end links and STi suspension. After the CUSCO RSTB, he controls his car so much better, thru tight sections, he can apply throttle mid corner to break the rear loose and literally add small counter steer motions to perform a flawless turn. The actual drift capability on the right roads is unreal, even an accidental 4 wheel drift made me think, what a sick ride.
Note: It's official, G35-350Z ProCharger fits the FX35.
http://forums.maxima.org/attachment....ntid=952&stc=1

LENINGRAD

What about stage 3, is it worth any money?

Nealoc187

iTrader: (23)

So you noticed significant oversteer out there as well eh? My car get's pretty twitchy out there and I've got some good video of me drifiting turn 10 in it's entirety and I did an even bigger drift through almost all of turn 9 which I didn't catch on video unforunately. Fun and challenging but not the fastest way around the track. Although this was done on brand new Toyo T1-S in the front whereas the tires in back were worn down to the wear bars, so that has to do with it too. Next spring I am going to start moving my Stillen RSB to a less aggressive position (it's currently directly below the stock beam) and see if that reduces the oversteer some with my R compounds.

BTW my friend greg was out at gingerman this weekend, he was there with a red Z06 on race rubber for sure, and possibly a pair of Lola race cars, possibly a totally custom framed yellow mustang, a 67 Shelby GT350, etc. Not sure what cars his dad decided to haul out there this weekend.

maximum_rpm_nyc

I took off the RSB today. Moved it to my 2K3. My 2K feels more 'tossable' no more twitchiness.
I'm currently on Falken 512s for A/S sakes. I started playing with the rear upper tie bar. Strut top mounts were easy, its finding the right locations to mount it all up.

VMaximus02

iTrader: (1)

You're right with that statement since the tires are the footprint of the vehicle. Sure, the tires do play an important role with the handling of any vehicle. However, the suspension components such as springs/shock, structure/chassis are designed to maximize the pavement contact of the tires. Beside the suspension components, the design of vehicle weight distribution (front/back), aerodynamic also contribute to the handling performance of the vehicle).

The RSB/FSTB/SCF's, so called bracings, will enhance the chassis (creating less flexing/weight shifting especially under spirited manuvering/corning) making the whole car feels more balance/stable/solid which will maximizing the performance ANY tires.
A good set of performace tires will greatly produce a better handling results!

Tony Fernandes

Although I don't have SFCs yet, I too noticed a little more unpredictabilitiy and oversteer when I added the RSB. However, as it stands now, the trade off between that and body roll isn't worth taking the RSB off. When I am able to afford SFCs I will re-evaluate the effectiveness of my RSB.

I believe you can adjust the RSB by moving the bushings closer to the middle of the car? I assume this makes the rear end less stiff and will reduce (to what degree I am not sure) the car's tendency to oversteer. I would think trying this first, before completely removing it, would be preferable. If it doesn't work, then you can remove the RSB altogether.

Tony

VMaximus02

iTrader: (1)

Please do 'cause I am interested in buying it too!

Smokin' X-press

Did you notice any body roll in turns after taking off your RSB?

I'm probably going to play around with the RSB settings before I completely take it off. I need to fix the oversteer as there's not much room for that at Waterford. Gingerman is forgiving, but I'll end up in the wall at waterford.

Also what's this lower front tie bar u mentioned in ur earlier posts? Is this sth similar to the GTFabrications bar lower arm bar? you can check it out under A32Maxima link at www.gtfabrications.com

Smokin' X-press

Yep! I'll keep you posted. It finally got shipped and should be here on Monday. I'm hope it fits the 00+ chassis.


Nealoc- Was your friend there on Saturday or Sunday. I went on Saturday. There were a couple Vettes, but I didn't see any Mustangs except a blue Mach 1.

maximum_rpm_nyc

got some body roll after removing rsb.

i have a STILLEN RSB, I had it way in front of the rear beam. dremeled out the notch where the brake line tie down nut was so the RSB bracket was over the nut. adjusted to the shortest it could be in relation to the bracket and bar.

Not even close to what GT makes.
Lowers ground clearance.
Even had 1/4" steel plate stock machined to sacrifice minimal ground clearance, accross cross member, attached to forward lower control arm via notched and welded washers.
1/4" plate stock machined to fit rear mounting points. If you have a tendancy to run over objects. ie aminals. bad idea. rusting out anyway. junked.
Now.
From control arm to cross member.
Thick washers tig welded to tubing, attaches to cross member via heim joint bolt+nut. Angled forward to attach to cross member in front of Y-Pipe. VHT Black, not as sturdy as 1/4" plate stock, but controls motions well enough.

However today, I got clipped in the front, about a few hours ago. 2am in NYC now, happened around midnight. Nothing major, just front bumper ripped off destroying one(1) PIAA 910 HID foglamp.[cha-ching]
Also broke my PIAA 959 ions as the bumper hit the floor nicely.[mo cha ching] Overall, I need a new bumper, $400 replacement PIAA 910 foglamp(Cost of ONE LAMP, not kit) and $180 set of PIAA 959 Ions.

Gotta wait at fresh green lights and assume the guy coming down the street will not try to blow the red.

Be safe.

PCGuRu2K

iTrader: (34)

What's up with you and accidents bro

__________________________________________________ ___________
°¨°º©[SuperCharged 2K1 5SPD Maxima GLE]©º°¨°
.::R.I.P. 7/26/03 - WRX STI/EVO VIII Coming Soon...::.
PMPN' 1994 Miata 5Spd - Turbo'd
F/S: Parting Out The Whole Car. Lots of Parts Still Up For Grabs!!!

ToYLeT902

iTrader: (12)

.... :attention

maximum_rpm_nyc

I did nothing wrong. 45th ave and Murray st. I just pulled out too fast. I was going to Cindy's house. 1 2k2 bumper ruined
Fai says its repairable. Just less lighting.

brian76

After checking out the WarpSpeed website, I'm definitely adding this to my list of upgrades to do. As I don't have any welding contacts, about how much should I expect to pay for the labor on this? And why do they suggest having the FSTB, FSB, and RSB prior to installing the SFC's?

Smokin' X-press

It took me a while to find a place that would do it for a reasonable price. Some places were quoting me $500. I went to MAACO and they started talking about taking out the seats and carpeting before they would weld anything to the chassis. I would suggest talking to a few body shops, muffler shops and performance shops in ur local area to do the install. The performance shop that did this had never ever before installed these on any car before and it took them 2.5-3hrs and that too because they had to drill the holes for the Stage II. I would definitely not pay more than 3 hrs of labor. Make sure you print out the instructions from Warpspeed's website and pictures. You can take those and show 'em to ur local speed shops and see how much they quote. Also take a can of 3M Undercoating spray (approx $7) at the time of install so they can spray on the undercoating to prevent the SFCs from rusting. As for ur second question, i'm not sure why they suggest that order. Best thing to do is call Dallas at Warpspeed and talk to him.

maximum_rpm_nyc

SFCs cometh on Wednesday.
350Z/G35/FX35 ATI ProCharger S/C cometh Friday.

Tiime to let the credit card cool down til x mas, no more mods.