engine surges when braking
08-15-2005, 10:17 PM
#1
engine surges when braking; idle @ 900rpm
Ever since I got te throttle body replaced, the car now idles high at 900rpm. The car is louder and nosier. And when I apply the brakes, it slows smoothly like normal BUT when it reaches down to 1k rpm...the rev bounces up and down from 900-1200 rpm and it makes the car lurges/rocks back and forth slightly. It's happening all the time (when braking) and it is not the brakes because I can see the rev needle bounces and can hear the engine power surges (similar to symtoms of a bad MAF but during braking not acceleration). Nissan claims it is the MAF and a new one is on the way. Idle air learning has been done and the SES light turned off after ECU reset. But it didnt help anything. Oh yea, I have timing advanced to 17 btdc a while back. Any thoughts?
08-16-2005, 03:35 PM
#2
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Location: Lakeland, FL
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extra air has to be getting in to create that surge. did the dealer replace the t/b? if so, they need to fix it. if theyre calling it the MAF, then wait til it comes in. might be agood idea to throw it in neutral at the lights... was the throttle angle learning done?
08-16-2005, 03:49 PM
#3
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my 2002 civic i used to drive did the same thing....i always thought that it was just the O/D turning off to help in braking or something! lol..
and btw, nice wheels!
(wish i could afford them)
and btw, nice wheels!
(wish i could afford them)
08-16-2005, 06:54 PM
#6
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Originally Posted by Mass_Media
Could it possibly be something as simple as maybe just your cars transmission shifting in to a lowergear?
08-16-2005, 08:46 PM
#7
Originally Posted by rbrown81
Not to get off topic, but how the hell do you fit those 255/40/18's under there? I want to know 
08-16-2005, 08:51 PM
#8
Originally Posted by maxilvr06
that's what i was thinking too...either that or the O/D switching off or something...cuz i got the same EXACT thing in that civic and i finally just noticed that the tach would jump ~200 rpms when i was around 30mph...
08-17-2005, 10:25 AM
#10
Originally Posted by Shogunsc4
I dont think it is the OD because it bounces up and down a few time not just once and it happens only when you are slowing/stopping the car as it reaches down near at around 5-10mph (1k rpm). On the highway it is fine like normal.
08-17-2005, 01:56 PM
#12
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Originally Posted by Shogunsc4
the throttle body has just been replaced last week...I'll wait until they install the new MAF tomorrow and see what is up.
08-18-2005, 02:58 PM
#14
UPDATE: SES light came back on today right when I was driving to the dealership...they replaced the MAF and installed the stock airbox. SES light would not go off so dealer replaced ANOTHER throttle body due to "Open Circuit". With all suspected parts replaced...the problem STILL EXIST!!! Abnormal High idle (900rpm) and engine surges when braking...the rev bounces all over the place (engine sounded like as if it was choking). It leads to to think it is the ECU...possible? The SES light turned off after the throttle body was replaced. The service manager told me to bring to car back Monday so they can figure out the problem and will get me a loaner car for the day. The entire things started when the throttle body was replaced the first time....what is wrong with my max?
08-18-2005, 03:36 PM
#15
My car does that, surges when you are at very low speeds and braking for a light or stop sign. It isn't the tranny downshifting as it already is in the lowest gear. Mine starting doing this after I cleaned the TB. Got the idle thing fixed and all but this "surging" still occurs. It sucks, but not bad enough to pay out of the pocket for a new TB. I thought they were around $400-$500 but might be able to find one cheaper.
08-18-2005, 04:14 PM
#17
Originally Posted by Shogunsc4
Throttle body is $903...$1070 installed at the dealership. the surging is enough for the driver to be like WTF...so I guess my problem is worst and I think it's bad for the tranny and engine.
08-18-2005, 05:07 PM
#19
Have they taken a look at your IACV? Idle Air Control Valve is the prime suspect of a jumpy car. Eventually when the problem gets really bad it'll happen all the time and you'll just see your RPM needle climb up and down repeatedly (whether your idle, parked, or driving). If the valve isn't the problem then it could be an ECU issue where the ECU and the idle air control valve refuse to work together, so the throttle body is essentially choking from an inconsistent flow of air.
08-18-2005, 05:35 PM
#20
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e-throttles dont use IACs 
i expected better from you, aah-NULD...
anyway... shogun, it looks like you might have yourself a case here. i want you to put the car back to stock, or at least the intake. since we now know that the MAF AND THROTTLE BODY WERENT BAD (roofles), your intake didnt cause the failure (because there wasnt one).
OMG this is ****ing great. put your intake back on, if the problem still persists, they have to fix it, your warranty is not void, you deserve a refund for the t/b and maf AND the labor..
theyll warranty the stuff, so its no big deal to them...
you are still under 36K, right?
omg they are in sooo much deep **** i bet theyre PRAYING you dont know what im telling you.
i expected better from you, aah-NULD...
anyway... shogun, it looks like you might have yourself a case here. i want you to put the car back to stock, or at least the intake. since we now know that the MAF AND THROTTLE BODY WERENT BAD (roofles), your intake didnt cause the failure (because there wasnt one).
OMG this is ****ing great. put your intake back on, if the problem still persists, they have to fix it, your warranty is not void, you deserve a refund for the t/b and maf AND the labor..
theyll warranty the stuff, so its no big deal to them...
you are still under 36K, right?
omg they are in sooo much deep **** i bet theyre PRAYING you dont know what im telling you.
08-18-2005, 06:32 PM
#22
Originally Posted by Epacy
Price at dealership. You can obviously get it cheaper elsewhere. How is it bad for the tranny and engine for the car to bump up like 200 rpms at low speeds?
08-18-2005, 06:48 PM
#24
Originally Posted by BewstAdd1ct
e-throttles dont use IACs
i expected better from you, aah-NULD...
anyway... shogun, it looks like you might have yourself a case here. i want you to put the car back to stock, or at least the intake. since we now know that the MAF AND THROTTLE BODY WERENT BAD (roofles), your intake didnt cause the failure (because there wasnt one).
OMG this is ****ing great. put your intake back on, if the problem still persists, they have to fix it, your warranty is not void, you deserve a refund for the t/b and maf AND the labor..
theyll warranty the stuff, so its no big deal to them...
you are still under 36K, right?
omg they are in sooo much deep **** i bet theyre PRAYING you dont know what im telling you.
i expected better from you, aah-NULD...
anyway... shogun, it looks like you might have yourself a case here. i want you to put the car back to stock, or at least the intake. since we now know that the MAF AND THROTTLE BODY WERENT BAD (roofles), your intake didnt cause the failure (because there wasnt one).
OMG this is ****ing great. put your intake back on, if the problem still persists, they have to fix it, your warranty is not void, you deserve a refund for the t/b and maf AND the labor..
theyll warranty the stuff, so its no big deal to them...
you are still under 36K, right?
omg they are in sooo much deep **** i bet theyre PRAYING you dont know what im telling you.
Funny thing is that the power surges/high idle problem didnt exist UNTIL after the dealer replaced my throttle body (1st time). The dealer then CLAIMED it was my 2k1 MAF malfunctioning. Then today, they installed the stock airbox along with the new 2k3 MAF in it and the SES light would not turn off...they then proceed to install ANOTHER new throttle body and finally the SES light turned off but problem still exist. Very weird. The paper stated this TB was replaced due to "open circuit". Let say if it is the ECU...am I still under warantee? I have have hyperground wires, should I take them off before I enter the dealer again?
08-18-2005, 07:07 PM
#26
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 201
Are you sure it's caused by hitting the breaks and not just letting off of the gas? I had the exact same problem after I cleaned my TB. My gas milleage also went way down. The dealership replaced the TB under warranty and now everythings back to normal. That little jump of the tach needle every time I took my foot off of the gas drove me nuts. I thought it might be from pushing the breaks too, until I realized that almost everytime I take my foot off of the gas it goes onto the break. Good luck.
08-19-2005, 05:55 AM
#28
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 339
Originally Posted by Shogunsc4
Ever since I got te throttle body replaced, the car now idles high at 900rpm. The car is louder and nosier. And when I apply the brakes, it slows smoothly like normal BUT when it reaches down to 1k rpm...the rev bounces up and down from 900-1200 rpm and it makes the car lurges/rocks back and forth slightly. It's happening all the time (when braking) and it is not the brakes because I can see the rev needle bounces and can hear the engine power surges (similar to symtoms of a bad MAF but during braking not acceleration). Nissan claims it is the MAF and a new one is on the way. Idle air learning has been done and the SES light turned off after ECU reset. But it didnt help anything. Oh yea, I have timing advanced to 17 btdc a while back. Any thoughts?
Shogunsc4,
I had this problem a while back on my 2002 Max SE and I too thought it was the TB. I had all the problems that you indicated and I checked everything possible that I could think of checking and finally gave up and went back to stock to have the dealer look at it. Turned out that it was the ECU that had a stuck code that the dealer could not erase...P0507. It refers to "Idle speed control system RPM higher than expected". Do you still have the SES light on? Did the dealer pull this code for you? I'd bet that you have this code right now.
The ECU was replaced under the Emmissions Warranty since my factory warranty expired. My problem happened after I cleaned my TB and after spraying nitrous. I initially thought I messed up my TB by spraying but I've been spraying ever since the ECU got replaced and it's still running strong with no problems like before. So I suspect the initial problem was the cleaning of my TB.
I don't think this problem is directly related to the brakes. It's more of an issue with the TB and ECU communicating with each other when the engine reaches a certain RPM.
08-19-2005, 12:39 PM
#29
Originally Posted by fornimage
Shogunsc4,
I had this problem a while back on my 2002 Max SE and I too thought it was the TB. I had all the problems that you indicated and I checked everything possible that I could think of checking and finally gave up and went back to stock to have the dealer look at it. Turned out that it was the ECU that had a stuck code that the dealer could not erase...P0507. It refers to "Idle speed control system RPM higher than expected". Do you still have the SES light on? Did the dealer pull this code for you? I'd bet that you have this code right now.
The ECU was replaced under the Emmissions Warranty since my factory warranty expired. My problem happened after I cleaned my TB and after spraying nitrous. I initially thought I messed up my TB by spraying but I've been spraying ever since the ECU got replaced and it's still running strong with no problems like before. So I suspect the initial problem was the cleaning of my TB.
I don't think this problem is directly related to the brakes. It's more of an issue with the TB and ECU communicating with each other when the engine reaches a certain RPM.
I had this problem a while back on my 2002 Max SE and I too thought it was the TB. I had all the problems that you indicated and I checked everything possible that I could think of checking and finally gave up and went back to stock to have the dealer look at it. Turned out that it was the ECU that had a stuck code that the dealer could not erase...P0507. It refers to "Idle speed control system RPM higher than expected". Do you still have the SES light on? Did the dealer pull this code for you? I'd bet that you have this code right now.
The ECU was replaced under the Emmissions Warranty since my factory warranty expired. My problem happened after I cleaned my TB and after spraying nitrous. I initially thought I messed up my TB by spraying but I've been spraying ever since the ECU got replaced and it's still running strong with no problems like before. So I suspect the initial problem was the cleaning of my TB.
I don't think this problem is directly related to the brakes. It's more of an issue with the TB and ECU communicating with each other when the engine reaches a certain RPM.
08-23-2005, 03:16 PM
#30
UPDATE: Problem fixed...you guys were right...it was the ECU. It was replaced under warantee. Now the car drives like the way it is supposed to drive BUT after leaving the car at the dealer for 4 days...they scratched the **** out of my front bumper. I was pi$$ed. The service advisor offered me a free repair and a free timing advance which was cool. Also, got my alignment done twice in a week at the dealer and it still pulls to the right and they claimed it is dead on.
08-23-2005, 04:06 PM
#32
same thing happened to me after my tune up and i thought it was my tranny not enough fluid so i filled 1 more bottle and then it made engine light come on then i had to bring it to dealer and get it reflused and for an extra 88 bucks they resetted my ecu and no more jerking...so long story short ya it was the ecu haha
10-12-2005, 04:03 PM
#33
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jun 2004
Posts: 129
I'm having this problem now too. Reflashing the ECU isn't the same as replacing it right? I got a quote for about $90 to reflash. How much does it cost to replace it? Do you think reflashing would be enough to fix the problem?
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