rguida

iTrader: (1)

i tried searching a bit, but couldn't find a direct answer, so hopefully some of you guys will help me a bit. (skip down for questions)

I have noticed while driving my 03 SE (6spd) that, it has more oversteer than i am really comfortable with. (used to have a 96 max SE and 04 accord and they were...better in that regard). I have the FSTB to stiffen up the front a bit, and a RSB as well in the garage ready to go on....I read that the RSB will ENHANCE the oversteer even more, but "makes the car more stable".

1. are there any parts I can buy that will directly minimize this oversteer?

2. I planned on getting H&R and tokiko blues (if available) for my car, can anyone speak on whether this has effected oversteer on their car?

If this has been covered before I am terribly sorry. thanks for any assistance you can give me.

DrKlop

iTrader: (3)

stock maxima should not oversteer. (if you are not confusing it with understeer)

Check if there are any loose or bent suspension parts (including worn out bushings) and take it to an alignment shop. If your car was not in a major accident and the frame was not damaged the above should salve the problem.


Edit: I would not recommend installing RSB if the car oversteers already. If you can't fix the problem using "normal" methods, you could try stiffening up your front by installing urethane bushings and LTB.

sciff5

iTrader: (1)

ohh jeesh.. time to do some research

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

A stock maxima understeers heavily. Even with the RSB, there is only slight oversteer, which can easily be counteracted in various ways by stiffening up the front end (bushings, struts, springs, LTB, etc).

In your case though, you should be getting moderate understeer, stock with just a FSTB. I can't think of anything that could cause a stock + FSTB Maxima to oversteer, unless of course you're running 50lbs of air pressure in the rear tires and 25 in the front...that *might* do it.

If you are truly diagnosing oversteer correctly, the way to push it more towards understeer would be:
- stage 1/2 lower tie bar
- poly bushings in the LCA and front sway bar
- stiffer springs
- adjustable struts at stiffer settings
- higher tire pressures up front compared to back (35 front, 29 back, for example)
- adjustment of toe angle
- camber plates (camber adjustment)

rguida

iTrader: (1)

Just to make sure I got this correct:

understeer = the car is unable to turn because there is too much power in the front? (high torque FWD for instance)

over steer = the back end of a vehicle is breaking loose on a turn (towards the outside of the corner)

Yes i understand that those are NOT the definitions of over/under however thats the best way I can describe it, for my particular vehicle, on corners i take it feels like the back end is going to slide out (and yes my tires are at LEAST ok, though i am putting on new ones to make sure) AND in one instance it actually did slide out which caused me to go sideways into a mailbox. I never had that type of reaction out of a car ever... (and yes when i hit the mailbox i was not driving like a banshee out of hell. I do believe i might have been doing 5 over the speed limit or so?)

DrKlop

iTrader: (3)

was it always like that?

Hoooper

if you dont drive in the dirt it should be hard to get the back end to swing out. maybe the back wheels bearings are bad or your parking brake is partially engaged, maybe theres something out back making the rear tires want to stop turning and therefore making it more likely to slide. you need to check everything out, it should not be that way.

rguida

iTrader: (1)

I got the vehicle earlier this year and thats the first thing i noticed about it, and I thought thats the way the vehicle was. Yeah I know it sounds weird that it feels like its going oversteer all the time...but thats the best way i can describe it..

sciff5

iTrader: (1)

I think you could only meen understeer. I have eibach springs with the shocks set to full stiff, and a RSB set to full stiff and I still dont get over steer except for when I am going around quick transitions and the back end steps out ever so slightly. Its a GREAT feeling

rguida

iTrader: (1)

understeering = the backend wants to fly out? as far as i can feel i don't feel anything wrong with the front end going into turns, its the backend that feels like it wants to break loose and make me spin out.

sciff5

iTrader: (1)

Ok if the backend is breaking loose than you've got it right, your experiencing oversteer. Understeer is when you are coming into a corner too fast and you turn the wheel and the car just keeps sliding in the same direction without turning the way you want it to.

I just have no idea how you're experiencing oversteer. I wish I had some more oversteer. I cant even make my car snap over steer by loading up the suspension going one way and than switching directions as quickly as possible. Have you checked if your rear tires are bald?

DrKlop

iTrader: (3)

Unless the car was in a serious accident and the oversteer is caused by a deformed chassis, you should be able to fix a problem.

If you ganna take it to an alignment shop tell them to check rear suspension alignment specs. You can't change alignment in the rear (it's a solid beam) but those spec should help you identify the problem.

CCS2k1Max

iTrader: (2)

Wow, never heard of a nearly stock max "loose" (picked that up in Neckar...). What tires are on the car? Are the tires wearing evenly? What pressures are they set at?

Puppetmaster

iTrader: (48)

Check the tire pressure, if the front tires are higher pressure than the rear, there'll be a tendency to oversteer. Also check your front wheel camber, where more negative camber will cause oversteer.

Also are all 4 tires the same specs? Maybe you have shorter front tires.

02BBQ

Your situation is pretty darn weird especially in the max. Are you sure you just arent taking 90deg turns at or over the speed limit for the street? That just boggles me i've never had anything happen that would even represent me thinking that the rear was going to slide in the max. Maybe i just drive to slow. good luck on the problem though i hope it gets worked out.

rguida

iTrader: (1)

i've had the tires services before by a shop that "supposedly" put the correct tire pressure on the tires. all the tires are the same company and have maybe 10k miles left on them.

Mugen13

they might be the same company but are they the same tires? my maxima oversteers when i take a turn too aggresively but thats b/c my rear tires aren't all that great. I bought the car used so i can't really do anything about the different tires up front and in the back.

Puppetmaster

iTrader: (48)

Yes, but that doesn't mean they are all the same. If you have lower profile front tires for whatever reason, that will help oversteer too. And you should check the pressures again yourself now since you're having this oversteer "problem".

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

I don't necessarily agree there. Standard pressures up front (30-33) with higher pressures in the rear (36-37) will help the car oversteer....which is why I run my rears at mid-40s for autocross - to help the rear end "rotate" around the axis of the turn.

generally
-stiffen the front, you will increase understeer-
-soften the rear, you will increase understeer
-stiffen the rear, you will increase oversteer
-soften the rear, you will increase oversteer

Those are not always true, but in a general sense they are.



rguida - are you sure you're just not feeling the transition of the rear beam assembly "swinging down" on the center assembly? That sometimes gives the feeeling that the rear end is slipping, while it is actually gripping just fine. In autocross, I often feel this. Kind of wierd when you first feel it, but it's perfectly normal.

sciff5

iTrader: (1)

Actually I just thought of another thing. If hes running a really soft sidewall on his tires and usually shops only pump them up to 30-32 psi he could be experiencing the sidewall on the rear tires rolling on him a little which would make the back end get squirly for a second. Used to happen with my stock tires if I was being a little crazy in transitions.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

true that. double true.

CCS2k1Max

iTrader: (2)

Now you see where I was going....

Puppetmaster

iTrader: (48)

I disagree and still believe the opposite is true, but we can argue this all day and I'm too lazy to type it all out, so we'll save this for when we meet up or something.

CCS2k1Max

iTrader: (2)

so irish, whatever you do to the rear generally will increase AND decrease oversteer? You mean soften the rear, you will decrease oversteer.

irish44j

iTrader: (38)

yes...freudian slip DOH!

rguida

iTrader: (1)

well I kinda feel like.....not smart at the moment.

I remember checking my tires a couple of months ago...apparently this is what i did...

went outside checked fronts came back in...
went outside checked FRONTS AGAIN came back in...

I went to double check tire make and lo and behold..

the front are good year, and the rear are...... "masterforce" ?!?!??????

what the hell tire is masterforce i can't even find it on tirerack.... I'm going to do the swap asap for tires...thats gotta be it at this point.....



though the thread isn't completley wasted, while doublechecking i did find the error and learned some new stuff.


"rguida - are you sure you're just not feeling the transition of the rear beam assembly "swinging down" on the center assembly?"

in regards to this, I had a 96 max SE, wouldn't that suspension have acted the same way?

Y2k2maxse

iTrader: (1)

my car used to understeer too..when i put the kumho ecsta ASX on...i DEFINITLY NOTICE the same things..rear end feels a lot more loose...i have much less understeer more oversteer. I only have a FSTB. always had it. tires are all at 32 PSI.

sciff5

iTrader: (1)

Yeah the 4th gens act the same way. I think your quality rear tires are your biggest problem

ColdSHO

iTrader: (25)

on try pavement with decent tires(nankang ns1s) which i actually really like, if i toss her into a sharp turn, boom, rear end out.oversteer everytime. quite scary the first few times it happened. it would make sence if it was my jic's on a firmer setting along with a rsb that makes it do it. but honestly it did it stock, altho much less contorllably.

i can play with it quite a bit with my different shock adjustments. it really can be a totally different car depending on settings. even seemingly small ones

doublea

iTrader: (7)

With the D2 set to euhm quite stiff + 1 degree negative camber, a FSTB & RSB with all the ES Bushing, the car is on rail, but the down side is I dont know where is the breaking point. I can puch this car much more than it would have been possible when it was stock. As an example every day I drive to this road where there is a very sharp curve at the exit of a tunnel, when the car was stock I couldn't accelerate in the curve, the car would have move to the external lane and hit the wall, now I can accelerate in that curve and stay in the inside lane, the car feel planted in the ground so anyone that would be sitting beside me during the acceleration would be surprised or even scared.