Poor acceleration ONLY after warming up (2003 Maxima)
04-11-2009, 07:24 PM
#121
In my experience knocking and pinging happen under load. Try reving it in neutral to see if you can still hear the pinging. You could have also heard pieces of cat material bouncing around in the exhaust. That can sound a lot like pinging but will do it even when reving in neutral.
If you can get under the car try this high tech test. Hit the exhaust (on both sides of the cat) with a rubber hammer or piece of wood. Listen for pieces rattling around inside the pipes. If you hear crap rattling around in there you know you have a problem. If not you may still have a problem. This wont rule out a bad cat but can confirm one if it's bad enough.
This mechanic that I took in today did the hitting of the exhaust with a hammer and said he couldn't hear anything wrong.
Should I tell the mechanic to leave the KS sensor alone and just to do the diagnosis to see what's wrong in full?
04-11-2009, 08:59 PM
#122
^ My timing was retarded at -1....just had my timing advanced today to 17...runs smoother and better throttle response as expected but i still get the feeling like im not producing the power i should be....did an acceleration test and from 60-75 was equal to or slightly less then a 6th gen with intake...while i have a slightly more modded engine and both autos *note not racing just hard acceleration comparison
Fix the problem at the root so you can let the Maxima Soul freeeee to perform as nature intended...and then tell me how you did it so I can fix mine
04-11-2009, 09:02 PM
#124
I sent you an e-mail immediately after this post but I think It may be in your auto-junk folder, can you please send me those instructions that would be great, thank you.
04-11-2009, 09:24 PM
#125
what do you mean by "absolutely"? does a bad knock sensor cause engine to ping or not?
04-11-2009, 10:29 PM
#126
^ My timing was retarded at -1....just had my timing advanced today to 17...runs smoother and better throttle response as expected but i still get the feeling like im not producing the power i should be....did an acceleration test and from 60-75 was equal to or slightly less then a 6th gen with intake...while i have a slightly more modded engine and both autos *note not racing just hard acceleration comparison
Under full throttle the computer uses a different loop and advances the timing differently.
It's still a great mod since it improves driveability and economy. I saw an improvement of two MPG with the timing advance.
04-11-2009, 10:43 PM
#128
A working knock sensor keeps it from pinging asuming everything else is working properly. There are conditions that can cause it to ping even with a functioning knock sensor. What I'm saying is that pinging doesn't guarantee a bad knock sensor.
04-12-2009, 11:30 AM
#130
" A working knock sensor keeps it from pinging...">Derrick2k2SE
04-12-2009, 02:54 PM
#131
What I said was "A working knock sensor keeps it from pinging asuming everything else is working properly." The fact that it's pinging means it's not the KS.
You've got some problem causing the pinging and the KS can't compensate enough to stop it. You need to find the true cause of the pinging and fix it.
There are a lot of things that can cause pinging. Dirty MAF, bad o2 sensor, Lean fuel mix, a bad ECU or any number of other things. If you haven't tried cleaning the MAF that's something you can do your self.
Once you fix what's wrong the pinging will stop and your power will come back.
04-12-2009, 09:36 PM
#133
You've got some problem causing the pinging and the KS can't compensate enough to stop it. You need to find the true cause of the pinging and fix it.
There are a lot of things that can cause pinging. Dirty MAF, bad o2 sensor, Lean fuel mix, a bad ECU or any number of other things. If you haven't tried cleaning the MAF that's something you can do your self.
Once you fix what's wrong the pinging will stop and your power will come back.
Pinging stopped, I did not hear it as I passed ~2,000 RPMs anymore while driving.
I then performed my trick which usually brings up MAJOR PINGS which is holding down brake while accelerating to ~2,000 RPMs and no ping and engine was hot.
The lack of power is still there in fact it seems like now the car is having an even harder time accelerating...
This is the first time I tried an octane booster as part of the troubleshooting and I don't know what the results mean and how can I use that towards my benefit in troubleshooting this issue?
Should I ignore the KNOCK SENSOR theory and just have my car examined tomorrow top to bottom to see what the problem is by this new local tech. I found that seems to know what he's doing?
Does this tech. sound legit.? He mentions that he wants to do all kinds of crazy *** back-pressure tests all over all the CATs and everywhere, take out the O2 sensors, bla bla?
He says he's going to jump so in depth into the car to try to figure out the problem that he wants 2 hours labor @ ~$80/hour just for the troubleshooting.
Should I let him do it or will this be another stealer-ship type of event where I'll be told that it's impossible to figure out without replacing a bunch of things?
Last edited by capframe; 04-12-2009 at 09:45 PM.
04-13-2009, 08:38 AM
#135
I bought a bottle of NOS Octane booster and put it in the tank along with a complete fill of the best Mobil 1 gasoline.
Pinging stopped, I did not hear it as I passed ~2,000 RPMs anymore while driving.
I then performed my trick which usually brings up MAJOR PINGS which is holding down brake while accelerating to ~2,000 RPMs and no ping and engine was hot.
The lack of power is still there in fact it seems like now the car is having an even harder time accelerating...
This is the first time I tried an octane booster as part of the troubleshooting and I don't know what the results mean and how can I use that towards my benefit in troubleshooting this issue?
Should I ignore the KNOCK SENSOR theory and just have my car examined tomorrow top to bottom to see what the problem is by this new local tech. I found that seems to know what he's doing?
Does this tech. sound legit.? He mentions that he wants to do all kinds of crazy *** back-pressure tests all over all the CATs and everywhere, take out the O2 sensors, bla bla?
He says he's going to jump so in depth into the car to try to figure out the problem that he wants 2 hours labor @ ~$80/hour just for the troubleshooting.
Should I let him do it or will this be another stealer-ship type of event where I'll be told that it's impossible to figure out without replacing a bunch of things?
Pinging stopped, I did not hear it as I passed ~2,000 RPMs anymore while driving.
I then performed my trick which usually brings up MAJOR PINGS which is holding down brake while accelerating to ~2,000 RPMs and no ping and engine was hot.
The lack of power is still there in fact it seems like now the car is having an even harder time accelerating...
This is the first time I tried an octane booster as part of the troubleshooting and I don't know what the results mean and how can I use that towards my benefit in troubleshooting this issue?
Should I ignore the KNOCK SENSOR theory and just have my car examined tomorrow top to bottom to see what the problem is by this new local tech. I found that seems to know what he's doing?
Does this tech. sound legit.? He mentions that he wants to do all kinds of crazy *** back-pressure tests all over all the CATs and everywhere, take out the O2 sensors, bla bla?
He says he's going to jump so in depth into the car to try to figure out the problem that he wants 2 hours labor @ ~$80/hour just for the troubleshooting.
Should I let him do it or will this be another stealer-ship type of event where I'll be told that it's impossible to figure out without replacing a bunch of things?
At this point I would say forget about trying to develop a theory. You should work on finding the right person to figure it out. Please don't take this the wrong way but you don't know enough about this stuff to have a solid theory and we can't develop one over the internet.
Here's what you need to look for in a mechanic shop.
* Do they have and can they use "onboard diagnostic equipment" to read the cars data stream while driving the car.
* Are they experienced with "driveability issues" on Import cars.
* Tell them that you've had people trying to "throw parts" at it and that you want a real diagnosis of the problem.
You might also look for a shop that specializes in modern European cars. Those guys usually have people that are good with Japanese cars and they'll have the right equipment to do the diagnosis.
Our shop fixes a lot of cars like this that have been to several shops with no results other than a bill. Here's what would happen if you brought it to us.
1st) Interview the driver. ASK QUESTIONS about the symptoms. When, where, how often etc... Also, what maintenance has been done.
2nd) Inspect the car for anything obvious. Unpluged wiring, burned connectors etc... Also, check for stored codes.
3rd) Go for a drive. Plug in the hand held scanner and have someone drive. The mechanic will have the driver accelerate, brake or try to recreate the symptoms. The mechanic will read and test the output of any systems he suspects. At this point he can either figure out what's wrong or at least rule out nearly everything else. This is where experience comes in since there are many reasons why sensors could be giving readings that are out of spec.
4th) Once the car is back at the shop he can inspect the car and confirm what he learned during the drive.
5th) Contact the customer with a quote and get permission to repair the car.
Also, do yourself a favor and don't share or sugest any theories with the mechanic. Stick to describing the symptoms and tell him what you've done so far. These guys spend years developing their skills and experience and don't need someone telling them how to do their job if you know what I mean. A good mechanic will always do his own diagnosis even if the car is sent to him by another shop.
04-13-2009, 10:23 AM
#136
Everything you said makes perfect sense.
I am going to just take my car in this week to the best tech I know and can get a hold of and report back.
I am going to just take my car in this week to the best tech I know and can get a hold of and report back.
Last edited by capframe; 04-13-2009 at 02:43 PM.
04-14-2009, 08:17 AM
#138
Junior Member
Join Date: Apr 2007
Posts: 35
i have huge hesitation and lack of power to my 00 max i cant even burn out and i had a race with a honda civic single cam vtec and almost got bet so i no that there is somthing realy wrong with my car i change almost everything the next is to buy a tranny,i was told that the tork converter is locking up
04-14-2009, 08:41 AM
#140
Yeah, put some thin bicycle tires on your Maxima and see how easy you'll burn out!
No just kidding, you need to do what I'm going to do with my power-less Max, you need to take it to a really really good & motivated technician that can fully check out your car and see what's wrong with it instead of throwing parts at it especially not an expensive part like a transmission.
You might think that any technician will do because they're all MOTIVATED by money but that's WRONG, most technicians are LAZY *** *****, they'd rather sit on their buts and do the easy stuff then spend time racking their slow brains over a highly complex vehicle such as your Max.
...and then you can tell the geniuses in this forum what your Tech wants to do and why and they can tell you if it's bull$hit or not.
No just kidding, you need to do what I'm going to do with my power-less Max, you need to take it to a really really good & motivated technician that can fully check out your car and see what's wrong with it instead of throwing parts at it especially not an expensive part like a transmission.
You might think that any technician will do because they're all MOTIVATED by money but that's WRONG, most technicians are LAZY *** *****, they'd rather sit on their buts and do the easy stuff then spend time racking their slow brains over a highly complex vehicle such as your Max.
...and then you can tell the geniuses in this forum what your Tech wants to do and why and they can tell you if it's bull$hit or not.
Last edited by capframe; 04-14-2009 at 08:44 AM.
04-14-2009, 09:37 AM
#141
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Tolland, Connecticut
Posts: 347
We have torque converters so we can't burn out lol...you could over inflate your tires a little because more psi=less grip but I STRONGLY advise again this since it's UNSAFE and can cause blowouts...burnouts are overrated anyway lol, it's literally like burning money
04-14-2009, 04:16 PM
#142
i have huge hesitation and lack of power to my 00 max i cant even burn out and i had a race with a honda civic single cam vtec and almost got bet so i no that there is somthing realy wrong with my car i change almost everything the next is to buy a tranny,i was told that the tork converter is locking up
You need to check your spelling....you almost got bet and something is realy wrong?
04-14-2009, 06:11 PM
#143
We have torque converters so we can't burn out lol...you could over inflate your tires a little because more psi=less grip but I STRONGLY advise again this since it's UNSAFE and can cause blowouts...burnouts are overrated anyway lol, it's literally like burning money
Last edited by Derrick2k2SE; 04-14-2009 at 06:13 PM.
04-14-2009, 06:23 PM
#144
Newbie - Just Registered
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: FL
Posts: 3
Ok, I'm going the complete other direction and I'm sorry but my 5th gen (2k) has the exact opposite problem. From a cold start, it runs horrible. When I back down the driveway and put the car in drive, it acts like it's getting no fuel. I've had a fuel system cleanse when I got my last oil change but that didn't help. My engine light reads "fuel system too lean". It also effects my freeway driving, (ie my passing gear). When I gun it, my rpm's skyrocket but the car doesn't go any faster. I let off the gas and slowly accelerate. My car is a 2000 SE W/ 99k. What could be the problem? Maybe a clog in the fuel filter? Sometimes it also makes a chugging sound when accelerating slowly. When it does happen, it's a constant sound until I let off the accelerator. I'm going in to get my 100.000 (i know should have been 90.000) so hopefully they will find the problem but any suggestions?
04-14-2009, 08:34 PM
#145
Ok, I'm going the complete other direction and I'm sorry but my 5th gen (2k) has the exact opposite problem. From a cold start, it runs horrible. When I back down the driveway and put the car in drive, it acts like it's getting no fuel. I've had a fuel system cleanse when I got my last oil change but that didn't help. My engine light reads "fuel system too lean". It also effects my freeway driving, (ie my passing gear). When I gun it, my rpm's skyrocket but the car doesn't go any faster. I let off the gas and slowly accelerate. My car is a 2000 SE W/ 99k. What could be the problem? Maybe a clog in the fuel filter? Sometimes it also makes a chugging sound when accelerating slowly. When it does happen, it's a constant sound until I let off the accelerator. I'm going in to get my 100.000 (i know should have been 90.000) so hopefully they will find the problem but any suggestions?
04-14-2009, 09:18 PM
#146
Senior Member
Join Date: Mar 2008
Location: Tolland, Connecticut
Posts: 347
I'm kinda having a similar power loss once warm but I have a 2000. I noticed one day when I had the hood popped that when the engine was cold, the VIAS linkage would engage when I hit the throttle. However if I tried it when it was warm it wouldn't engage. Anyone experience this or could someone try it on their car to let me know if this is normal.
04-15-2009, 05:51 PM
#147
Little did I know that opening up this threat was going to lead to nowhere land.
This local tech. (not Technosquare) that I had an appointment with today because he expressed an enthusiasm to diagnose the issue and perform all kinds of tests on it apparently gave up the morning I went to drop off my car.
I go to drop off my car and the assistant is like " yeah, I was told to tell you to go to the dealer cuz that would be your best bet "
Apparently the guy got busy and realized that he didn't want anything to do with a driveability probem after all especially not one without a dumb dumb check engine light.
From my experience so far, other than a few exceptions which are really hard to locate, most car techs. are lazy and stupid.
Trying to locate a capable car tech. is a full time job apparently and since I already have a full time job my 2003 Maxima will have to suffer until it gets worse or check engine light comes on so some dumb idiot can read the code and hopefully replace/fix the correct part.
This local tech. (not Technosquare) that I had an appointment with today because he expressed an enthusiasm to diagnose the issue and perform all kinds of tests on it apparently gave up the morning I went to drop off my car.
I go to drop off my car and the assistant is like " yeah, I was told to tell you to go to the dealer cuz that would be your best bet "
Apparently the guy got busy and realized that he didn't want anything to do with a driveability probem after all especially not one without a dumb dumb check engine light.
From my experience so far, other than a few exceptions which are really hard to locate, most car techs. are lazy and stupid.
Trying to locate a capable car tech. is a full time job apparently and since I already have a full time job my 2003 Maxima will have to suffer until it gets worse or check engine light comes on so some dumb idiot can read the code and hopefully replace/fix the correct part.
Last edited by capframe; 04-15-2009 at 05:57 PM.
04-17-2009, 03:35 PM
#150
What are you talking about? A torque converter is torque multiplier. I can smoke my tires so hard the car immediately shifts into 2nd gear.
capframe-put a vacuum gauge on your car and then have someone slowly rev the engine (SLOWLY) and if the vacuum starts dropping off through the midrange, you have excessive back pressure, which would point to the pre-cats, main cat, muffler or possibly collapsed exhaust pipe.
capframe-put a vacuum gauge on your car and then have someone slowly rev the engine (SLOWLY) and if the vacuum starts dropping off through the midrange, you have excessive back pressure, which would point to the pre-cats, main cat, muffler or possibly collapsed exhaust pipe.
04-17-2009, 03:45 PM
#151
What are you talking about? A torque converter is torque multiplier. I can smoke my tires so hard the car immediately shifts into 2nd gear.
capframe-put a vacuum gauge on your car and then have someone slowly rev the engine (SLOWLY) and if the vacuum starts dropping off through the midrange, you have excessive back pressure, which would point to the pre-cats, main cat, muffler or possibly collapsed exhaust pipe.
capframe-put a vacuum gauge on your car and then have someone slowly rev the engine (SLOWLY) and if the vacuum starts dropping off through the midrange, you have excessive back pressure, which would point to the pre-cats, main cat, muffler or possibly collapsed exhaust pipe.
04-17-2009, 05:22 PM
#152
Newbie - Just Registered
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 12
My 00GLE had similar issues. Great suggestion for the fuel fitler! I'll do that to my car this weekend and give you guys an update after that!
I think it's something to do with fuel...when my BMW's fuel filter got really old/clogged it was doing the exact same thing...car ran great when cold, and it was really slow once it warmed up. During open loop operation the car runs very rich, which means more fuel is being injected per cycle. If there is clogging going on, the vacuum system that your fuel runs on will be able to push the fuel more efficiently through the lines/injectors, giving your car a better combustion. When it switches to closed loop, it starts to pull fuel in order to lower emissions. By doing this, the amount of vacuum pushing the fuel through the lines is decreased and can't easily get by whatever is blocking the line, and you'll get less fuel to burn, which means the car will run like crap.
That's at least my theory...what I would start with if I were you would be replacing the fuel filter (it's about $25 and not difficult at all to replace) then getting the nissan fuel injector service done. I believe it's around $110 and they hook up a high pressure system to clean out everything leading to the injectors.
And just a little correction: engines are actually more efficient when they're warmed up, which is why the running temperature of modern engines is higher than old engines as we find new ways of keeping the engine as resistant to wear as possible (ie: the development of new materials). Your engine should not run better when your oil is cold, so there is definitely an issue that needs to be solved. Good luck!
That's at least my theory...what I would start with if I were you would be replacing the fuel filter (it's about $25 and not difficult at all to replace) then getting the nissan fuel injector service done. I believe it's around $110 and they hook up a high pressure system to clean out everything leading to the injectors.
And just a little correction: engines are actually more efficient when they're warmed up, which is why the running temperature of modern engines is higher than old engines as we find new ways of keeping the engine as resistant to wear as possible (ie: the development of new materials). Your engine should not run better when your oil is cold, so there is definitely an issue that needs to be solved. Good luck!
04-17-2009, 05:26 PM
#153
Newbie - Just Registered
Join Date: Apr 2009
Location: Minneapolis
Posts: 12
Looks easy to do. I'll try that also.
Give this product a shot http://www.seafoamsales.com/motorTuneUpTechGas.htm
I have a 2002 and I'll pull the vac line going to the brake booster which comes off the intake manifold. Dunk the hose with the engine on into a cup with a small amount of the seafoam, allow the suction to pick up the liquid, then immediately shut off the engine. Wait about 5-10 minutes with the engine off. Start engine and rev the engine a few times, you'll get smoke out of the tail pipe but your injectors/cylinders are clean(er) haha.
I have a 2002 and I'll pull the vac line going to the brake booster which comes off the intake manifold. Dunk the hose with the engine on into a cup with a small amount of the seafoam, allow the suction to pick up the liquid, then immediately shut off the engine. Wait about 5-10 minutes with the engine off. Start engine and rev the engine a few times, you'll get smoke out of the tail pipe but your injectors/cylinders are clean(er) haha.
04-17-2009, 07:08 PM
#155
http://www.international-auto.com/fi...uum-gauges.cfm
http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/186.cfm (scenario 14)
http://autorepair.about.com/cs/troub...a112401a_2.htm
Exhaust Back Pressure
Starting with the engine at idle, slowly increase engine speed to 3,000 RPM, engine vacuum should be equal to or higher than idle vacuum at 3,000 RPM. If vacuum decreases at higher engine RPM's, an excessive exhaust back pressure is probably present.
Starting with the engine at idle, slowly increase engine speed to 3,000 RPM, engine vacuum should be equal to or higher than idle vacuum at 3,000 RPM. If vacuum decreases at higher engine RPM's, an excessive exhaust back pressure is probably present.
Just remove a vacuum line and plug in the gauge.
04-17-2009, 07:09 PM
#156
You should be asking this in the "I'm new here but I have a question" sticky. We need to keep this thread on topic to help the thread starter.
04-17-2009, 08:02 PM
#157
Any auto parts store should have one. Sadly, vacuum gauge reading is slowly becoming a lost art but is a great way to find engine problems.
http://www.international-auto.com/fi...uum-gauges.cfm
http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/186.cfm (scenario 14)
http://autorepair.about.com/cs/troub...a112401a_2.htm
Just remove a vacuum line and plug in the gauge.
http://www.international-auto.com/fi...uum-gauges.cfm
http://www.secondchancegarage.com/public/186.cfm (scenario 14)
http://autorepair.about.com/cs/troub...a112401a_2.htm
Just remove a vacuum line and plug in the gauge.
04-17-2009, 08:54 PM
#158
The pinging between 1700-2000 rpm seems pretty typical for our cars, especially if you use oil between oil changes. Mine comes and goes, octane booster does help but other times I don't use it and no pinging. Go figure.
04-17-2009, 11:50 PM
#160
now I'm afraid my engine is even more messed up