whp on stock 2002 maxima
i dyno'd years ago on a dynojet and put down 218whp/228tq this was only with a WAI. i put the car on a dyno dynamics, and put down 244whp with i/h/e. i always heard that the dyno dynamics were feelings hurters...lol
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From: Ballwin, MO
I did 214whp/233wtq completely bone stock in my '02 6 speed..haven't seen numbers higher than that. This was also on a 21% loaded dynojet (typically 16% loaded). It reads 5% low compared to a typical dynojet..and that would put me well clear of any other stock cars..
Typically we see 205-210ish..
Typically we see 205-210ish..
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From: East Granby, Connecticut
A while ago (probably when the 5.5s were just coming out) there were a number of threads in the dyno forum with charts for the 5.5 gen. Few of them were stock, but of those I remember that were bone stock, I believe we saw about 206-212 FWHP on the 6 speeds and 196-201 FWHP on the autos.
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From: East Granby, Connecticut
It would also be worth mentioning at this point that the air box modification that is simple on those cars was good for up to 9 whp (Nmexmax dyno tested this on an automatic, though it was already heavily modified otherwise).
Well that answers a lot of questions of mine actually, I saw claims of 395 whp for a turbo kit on a 2002 3.5L Maxima. Just wanted to see how much we're actually gaining at that point for the price. Seems like a lot ^_^. I'll be buying a 2002 Maxima very soon. Can't wait to get back into one!
Other notes: 6-speed; only powertrain modification is a Stillen muffler section.
Typically Dyno Dynamics dynamometers measure less power than others. Although with any measurement system the instrument calibration and setup can have effects (sometimes intentional).
Typically Dyno Dynamics dynamometers measure less power than others. Although with any measurement system the instrument calibration and setup can have effects (sometimes intentional).
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From: East Granby, Connecticut
See, the funny thing is, every single person that I have known that has gotten their car dyno-tested (and I don't much about it, I admit) claims that the dyno they're on always reads lower than others.
WRXs, S2000s, M3s, Maximas, and G35s all seem to "read low" on the dyno.
I can't say that they don't, but I can't help but to feel like when someone that has a mid-heavily modified car is disappointed in their numbers, it's because the dyno "reads low".
Fortunately for me it's not all about the dyno numbers, I am rather happy with every aspect of the Maxima. I know they aren't the worlds fastest cars, but they have some kick to them and are very enjoyable to drive. 
Well that answers a lot of questions of mine actually, I saw claims of 395 whp for a turbo kit on a 2002 3.5L Maxima. Just wanted to see how much we're actually gaining at that point for the price. Seems like a lot ^_^. I'll be buying a 2002 Maxima very soon. Can't wait to get back into one!
rroderiques77 just had a turbo charger installed on his already-modified Maxima, and dyno'd at 382 whp, and that's with a mild boost.
http://forums.maxima.org/supercharge...hp-380wtq.html
Kind of scary what an aftermarket turbo can do to the 3.5.
In just case Hotshot is reading this, 300+ whp is the perfect justification for HLSD. 400+ whp is insane. I really can't imagine what that would be like in our cars, but people are doing it. Just look at Roy's latest mod.
http://forums.maxima.org/supercharge...hp-380wtq.html
Kind of scary what an aftermarket turbo can do to the 3.5.
In just case Hotshot is reading this, 300+ whp is the perfect justification for HLSD. 400+ whp is insane. I really can't imagine what that would be like in our cars, but people are doing it. Just look at Roy's latest mod.
See, the funny thing is, every single person that I have known that has gotten their car dyno-tested (and I don't much about it, I admit) claims that the dyno they're on always reads lower than others.
WRXs, S2000s, M3s, Maximas, and G35s all seem to "read low" on the dyno.
I can't say that they don't, but I can't help but to feel like when someone that has a mid-heavily modified car is disappointed in their numbers, it's because the dyno "reads low".
WRXs, S2000s, M3s, Maximas, and G35s all seem to "read low" on the dyno.
I can't say that they don't, but I can't help but to feel like when someone that has a mid-heavily modified car is disappointed in their numbers, it's because the dyno "reads low".
Oh and more notables from the dyno runs:
-I cannot recall the gear it was tested in (should've been third)
-6th gen BBK
-17x9 FN01R-C with 245/245 RE01-R
Perhaps I don't understand, why would the total output (power) increase?
I'd think (wheel) power would slightly decrease with extra parasitic losses due to increased rotational speeds. Engine output should remain constant regardless of gear; at least for this vehicle.
I'd think (wheel) power would slightly decrease with extra parasitic losses due to increased rotational speeds. Engine output should remain constant regardless of gear; at least for this vehicle.
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4th gear is closest to 1:1 in our 6-speeds. Dynoing in a lower gear can make your power look higher than it is unless they compensate in settings.
What compensation can be made?
I can understand torque changing with gearing, but power should remain relatively constant; aside from my previous mention of parasitic losses. As the gear count increases, torque is reduced (less multiplication) but roll speed is increased and power is (approximately) constant.
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Why would power change?
What compensation can be made?
I can understand torque changing with gearing, but power should remain relatively constant; aside from my previous mention of parasitic losses. As the gear count increases, torque is reduced (less multiplication) but roll speed is increased and power is (approximately) constant.
What compensation can be made?
I can understand torque changing with gearing, but power should remain relatively constant; aside from my previous mention of parasitic losses. As the gear count increases, torque is reduced (less multiplication) but roll speed is increased and power is (approximately) constant.
F=ma
From force (F), we can calculate horsepower.
Dyno the car in a lower gear, and acceleration (a) goes way up, causing force (F) to go way up.
So by dynoing the car in the gear closest to the 1:1 gear ratio, we eliminate any acceleration advantage or disadvantage caused by the transmission, which gives us unskewed whp numbers.
Now that will be different on something like a mustang or dyno dynamics, as they use a load cell to measure roll force (the amount of force the tire is placing on the roller). Based on roll force and the radius arm going to the load cell, it measures roll torque. Then based on roll torque and roll speed, we can get horsepower. Due to it reading "force" like this, you will make the same power in any gear.
Last edited by sparks03max; Feb 15, 2010 at 03:33 PM.
The reason to dyno in the 1:1 gear ratio is due to the Dynojet. Dynojet mathematically creates a horsepower number based on mass (which is the known weight of the rollers) and acceleration (how fast the car is accelerating the known weight).
F=ma
From force (F), we can calculate horsepower.
Dyno the car in a lower gear, and acceleration (a) goes way up, causing force (F) to go way up.
So by dynoing the car in the gear closest to the 1:1 gear ratio, we eliminate any acceleration advantage or disadvantage caused by the transmission, which gives us unskewed whp numbers (even though Dynojet has a fudge factor in there which makes them skewed anyways and read high).
Now that will be different on something like a mustang or dyno dynamics, as they use a load cell to measure roll force (the amount of force the tire is placing on the roller). Based on roll force and the radius arm going to the load cell, it measures roll torque. Then based on roll torque and roll speed, we can get horsepower. Due to it reading "force" like this, you will make the same power in any gear.
F=ma
From force (F), we can calculate horsepower.
Dyno the car in a lower gear, and acceleration (a) goes way up, causing force (F) to go way up.
So by dynoing the car in the gear closest to the 1:1 gear ratio, we eliminate any acceleration advantage or disadvantage caused by the transmission, which gives us unskewed whp numbers (even though Dynojet has a fudge factor in there which makes them skewed anyways and read high).
Now that will be different on something like a mustang or dyno dynamics, as they use a load cell to measure roll force (the amount of force the tire is placing on the roller). Based on roll force and the radius arm going to the load cell, it measures roll torque. Then based on roll torque and roll speed, we can get horsepower. Due to it reading "force" like this, you will make the same power in any gear.
Although regardless of an inertial dynamometer (where as you mentioned tractive effort, force against the roll is calculated based upon acceleration and roll inertia) load and roll speed are used to calculate power. So in a lower gear the acceleration is higher, giving a higher tractive effort and torque, but the speed will be lower. Are the differences enough to produce equal power values? I cannot see why not.
Edit: because I like equations:
Last edited by 2slow; Feb 15, 2010 at 03:43 PM.
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This is one reason to only use eddy current (or other resistive load; i.e. AC/DC, water or hydraulic brake) dynamometers. The other is acceleration rate control and steady state operation (cannot always access all speed-load points while accelerating).
Although regardless of an inertial dynamometer (where as you mentioned tractive effort, force against the roll is calculated based upon acceleration and roll inertia) load and roll speed are used to calculate power. So in a lower gear the acceleration is higher, giving a higher tractive effort and torque, but the speed will be lower. Are the differences enough to produce equal power values? I cannot see why not.
Although regardless of an inertial dynamometer (where as you mentioned tractive effort, force against the roll is calculated based upon acceleration and roll inertia) load and roll speed are used to calculate power. So in a lower gear the acceleration is higher, giving a higher tractive effort and torque, but the speed will be lower. Are the differences enough to produce equal power values? I cannot see why not.
Since a majority of people do dyno on dynojets, the 1:1 ratio comment was and is both correct and relevant.
edit: and yes, you will make roughly the same power in any gear on a load cell dyno due to the difference in speed (which is used in the calculation) offsetting the increased torque.
I overly simplified it for... well simplicity. Your picking at specifics in what I said makes no sense honestly since we're saying the exact same thing.
Since a majority of people do dyno on dynojets, the 1:1 ratio comment was and is both correct and relevant.
edit: and yes, you will make roughly the same power in any gear on a load cell dyno due to the difference in speed (which is used in the calculation) offsetting the increased torque.
Since a majority of people do dyno on dynojets, the 1:1 ratio comment was and is both correct and relevant.
edit: and yes, you will make roughly the same power in any gear on a load cell dyno due to the difference in speed (which is used in the calculation) offsetting the increased torque.
Regardless, I think the 194 whp is within the healthy range for a manual transmission equipped (Maxima) VQ35.
Edit: added some words/content
Last edited by 2slow; Feb 15, 2010 at 06:38 PM.
I asked the dyno guy the same question, why is it so important to dyno at close to 1:1. He said it didn;t really matter what gear you are in, but if you dyno in say First gear you are only in that gear for a few short seconds and wham you have to shift to second. If you use 4th on our cars you get a nice long curve that you can study.
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From: Ballwin, MO
Despite the variances in readings on different dynos, there is an easy way to find out how well the car is running. Track it. Look at your trap speeds (provided you can somewhat get out of the hole). 194 whp sounds low to me, but take it out and see what it can do at the track. (convert your times if you are at a higher altitude i you want)
My dyno was low reading for a dynojet, and I think my track times show that the car is making every bit of 214+ whp..and it IS still stock..
My dyno was low reading for a dynojet, and I think my track times show that the car is making every bit of 214+ whp..and it IS still stock..
Despite the variances in readings on different dynos, there is an easy way to find out how well the car is running. Track it. Look at your trap speeds (provided you can somewhat get out of the hole). 194 whp sounds low to me, but take it out and see what it can do at the track. (convert your times if you are at a higher altitude i you want)
My dyno was low reading for a dynojet, and I think my track times show that the car is making every bit of 214+ whp..and it IS still stock..
My dyno was low reading for a dynojet, and I think my track times show that the car is making every bit of 214+ whp..and it IS still stock..
Off topic: will it create any problems to run a compression test with the IM off to access the rear bank (assuming the TB is connected)? I would think it may cause a CEL for no flow through the MAF.
I agree we are making similar points, but we differ in the main point. I asserted power will not change with across gears, and you claimed the opposite (as noted below). Unless the engine is calibrated based upon gear (like the Mazdaspeed 3) it will produce the same power regardless of gear, and should measure as such.
While testing in different gears will produce different acceleration rates, force and torque values (on an inertial dyno; some, but not all dyno jets) the power should not change. An exception to this would be if the dyno jet software has some weird correction factors which do not follow the science. I could believe this as at one time dyno jet would advertise their dyno would give higher power measurements than competitors which make a shop's customer's happier.
Regardless, I think the 194 whp is within the healthy range for a manual transmission equipped (Maxima) VQ35.
Edit: added some words/content
While testing in different gears will produce different acceleration rates, force and torque values (on an inertial dyno; some, but not all dyno jets) the power should not change. An exception to this would be if the dyno jet software has some weird correction factors which do not follow the science. I could believe this as at one time dyno jet would advertise their dyno would give higher power measurements than competitors which make a shop's customer's happier.
Regardless, I think the 194 whp is within the healthy range for a manual transmission equipped (Maxima) VQ35.
Edit: added some words/content
Good point, unfortunately I don't have any plans to visit a drag strip. The car feels quite strong, will likely revisit the dyno and may get a compression test (if it warms up and I can muster the enthusiasm).
Off topic: will it create any problems to run a compression test with the IM off to access the rear bank (assuming the TB is connected)? I would think it may cause a CEL for no flow through the MAF.
Off topic: will it create any problems to run a compression test with the IM off to access the rear bank (assuming the TB is connected)? I would think it may cause a CEL for no flow through the MAF.
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