Should I purchase a intake system?
Originally posted by akrus
You're my kind of guy, Cobymoby. I love a good debate.
First off, since I asked in my original post, do you have any dynos of your intake vs. stock? I am not being confrontational what-so-ever, as a matter of fact if Steve and yourself agree I have a proposition to make. I don't know Steve from Jobe and I most definitely don't owe him anything. I bought his intake based on posts that I read. Your intake, admittedly came out a little late for me to include in my decision, so that's one reason why I didn't pick the Berk.
Let me spell my proposition out for both you and Steve:
Sell me your intake at your asking price as Steve did, I will pay for dyno time to cover FC to Berk to stock intake runs. The catch is this, whichever one I decide to return, is just that - returned for a refund. I am willing to even pay for the shipping charges, so clearly I am going to be on the losing end of all this financially. I am simply offering to be an impartial judge in all of this.
If the 2 of you agree that this is fair, let's get this rolling.
Cobymoby, your reasoning that you are in 'sunny Southern California...' doesn't really tell me much. As far as I know, the Pacific Ocean has plenty of salt in it. You've got plenty of salt in your area. Arguably as much salt as I would see in the winter in Southern Ontario. The salt contamination that passes through a quality air filter such as the K&N is of such a microscopic size that it will evaporate within the shortest of measurable times. These intakes are not being run under a 'shower' of salt water. If this were the case, true CAI's would never be sold anywhere except the 'Sahara'.
Even aluminum will oxidize. It's not rust but it is a whitish residue that is caused by the same culprits that create rust: salt, moisture and oxygen. The Dead Sea is the saltiest place on earth, yet there are steel hulled boats floating on it. The salt encrusts itself and actually becomes a barrier to rust, albeit a very heavy barrier. Aluminum oxidation is every bit a problem that rust is.
So, are you and Steve willing to accept the challenge that I give to you both? Steve has my money, so he has no real reason to go along with this. You can gain another sale, that's about it. One of you has pride to retain whereas the other will have to go 'back to the drawing board'. Will both of you agree to buy back whichever one loses?
Albert
You're my kind of guy, Cobymoby. I love a good debate.
First off, since I asked in my original post, do you have any dynos of your intake vs. stock? I am not being confrontational what-so-ever, as a matter of fact if Steve and yourself agree I have a proposition to make. I don't know Steve from Jobe and I most definitely don't owe him anything. I bought his intake based on posts that I read. Your intake, admittedly came out a little late for me to include in my decision, so that's one reason why I didn't pick the Berk.
Let me spell my proposition out for both you and Steve:
Sell me your intake at your asking price as Steve did, I will pay for dyno time to cover FC to Berk to stock intake runs. The catch is this, whichever one I decide to return, is just that - returned for a refund. I am willing to even pay for the shipping charges, so clearly I am going to be on the losing end of all this financially. I am simply offering to be an impartial judge in all of this.
If the 2 of you agree that this is fair, let's get this rolling.
Cobymoby, your reasoning that you are in 'sunny Southern California...' doesn't really tell me much. As far as I know, the Pacific Ocean has plenty of salt in it. You've got plenty of salt in your area. Arguably as much salt as I would see in the winter in Southern Ontario. The salt contamination that passes through a quality air filter such as the K&N is of such a microscopic size that it will evaporate within the shortest of measurable times. These intakes are not being run under a 'shower' of salt water. If this were the case, true CAI's would never be sold anywhere except the 'Sahara'.
Even aluminum will oxidize. It's not rust but it is a whitish residue that is caused by the same culprits that create rust: salt, moisture and oxygen. The Dead Sea is the saltiest place on earth, yet there are steel hulled boats floating on it. The salt encrusts itself and actually becomes a barrier to rust, albeit a very heavy barrier. Aluminum oxidation is every bit a problem that rust is.
So, are you and Steve willing to accept the challenge that I give to you both? Steve has my money, so he has no real reason to go along with this. You can gain another sale, that's about it. One of you has pride to retain whereas the other will have to go 'back to the drawing board'. Will both of you agree to buy back whichever one loses?
Albert
Basically you're trying to argue that steel is as good of a material as aluminum to use for intakes. This is not true. I don't live near the ocean so my car is never exposed to salty air. None of our cars have barriers of salt on them but if you want to put a barrier of salt on your car to protect it, then be my guest. If you would rather have steel over aluminum then hey, that's your prerogative.
About that head to head dyno, we are working on it.
Originally posted by akrus
You're my kind of guy, Cobymoby. I love a good debate.
First off, since I asked in my original post, do you have any dynos of your intake vs. stock? I am not being confrontational what-so-ever, as a matter of fact if Steve and yourself agree I have a proposition to make. I don't know Steve from Jobe and I most definitely don't owe him anything. I bought his intake based on posts that I read. Your intake, admittedly came out a little late for me to include in my decision, so that's one reason why I didn't pick the Berk.
Let me spell my proposition out for both you and Steve:
Sell me your intake at your asking price as Steve did, I will pay for dyno time to cover FC to Berk to stock intake runs. The catch is this, whichever one I decide to return, is just that - returned for a refund. I am willing to even pay for the shipping charges, so clearly I am going to be on the losing end of all this financially. I am simply offering to be an impartial judge in all of this.
If the 2 of you agree that this is fair, let's get this rolling.
Cobymoby, your reasoning that you are in 'sunny Southern California...' doesn't really tell me much. As far as I know, the Pacific Ocean has plenty of salt in it. You've got plenty of salt in your area. Arguably as much salt as I would see in the winter in Southern Ontario. The salt contamination that passes through a quality air filter such as the K&N is of such a microscopic size that it will evaporate within the shortest of measurable times. These intakes are not being run under a 'shower' of salt water. If this were the case, true CAI's would never be sold anywhere except the 'Sahara'.
Even aluminum will oxidize. It's not rust but it is a whitish residue that is caused by the same culprits that create rust: salt, moisture and oxygen. The Dead Sea is the saltiest place on earth, yet there are steel hulled boats floating on it. The salt encrusts itself and actually becomes a barrier to rust, albeit a very heavy barrier. Aluminum oxidation is every bit a problem that rust is.
So, are you and Steve willing to accept the challenge that I give to you both? Steve has my money, so he has no real reason to go along with this. You can gain another sale, that's about it. One of you has pride to retain whereas the other will have to go 'back to the drawing board'. Will both of you agree to buy back whichever one loses?
Albert
You're my kind of guy, Cobymoby. I love a good debate.
First off, since I asked in my original post, do you have any dynos of your intake vs. stock? I am not being confrontational what-so-ever, as a matter of fact if Steve and yourself agree I have a proposition to make. I don't know Steve from Jobe and I most definitely don't owe him anything. I bought his intake based on posts that I read. Your intake, admittedly came out a little late for me to include in my decision, so that's one reason why I didn't pick the Berk.
Let me spell my proposition out for both you and Steve:
Sell me your intake at your asking price as Steve did, I will pay for dyno time to cover FC to Berk to stock intake runs. The catch is this, whichever one I decide to return, is just that - returned for a refund. I am willing to even pay for the shipping charges, so clearly I am going to be on the losing end of all this financially. I am simply offering to be an impartial judge in all of this.
If the 2 of you agree that this is fair, let's get this rolling.
Cobymoby, your reasoning that you are in 'sunny Southern California...' doesn't really tell me much. As far as I know, the Pacific Ocean has plenty of salt in it. You've got plenty of salt in your area. Arguably as much salt as I would see in the winter in Southern Ontario. The salt contamination that passes through a quality air filter such as the K&N is of such a microscopic size that it will evaporate within the shortest of measurable times. These intakes are not being run under a 'shower' of salt water. If this were the case, true CAI's would never be sold anywhere except the 'Sahara'.
Even aluminum will oxidize. It's not rust but it is a whitish residue that is caused by the same culprits that create rust: salt, moisture and oxygen. The Dead Sea is the saltiest place on earth, yet there are steel hulled boats floating on it. The salt encrusts itself and actually becomes a barrier to rust, albeit a very heavy barrier. Aluminum oxidation is every bit a problem that rust is.
So, are you and Steve willing to accept the challenge that I give to you both? Steve has my money, so he has no real reason to go along with this. You can gain another sale, that's about it. One of you has pride to retain whereas the other will have to go 'back to the drawing board'. Will both of you agree to buy back whichever one loses?
Albert
FLAT OUT, aluminum is a far superior choice in this application. But again, if you prefer steel, it's your prerogative.
About a head to head run I've already begun to set this up. But my 02's won't be out for another month.
Originally posted by cobymoby
If I get another server busy and I lose my message I'm going to go nuts. So you get the short version.
Basically you're trying to argue that steel is as good of a material as aluminum to use for intakes. This is not true. I don't live near the ocean so my car is never exposed to salty air. None of our cars have barriers of salt on them but if you want to put a barrier of salt on your car to protect it, then be my guest. If you would rather have steel over aluminum then hey, that's your prerogative.
About that head to head dyno, we are working on it.
If I get another server busy and I lose my message I'm going to go nuts. So you get the short version.
Basically you're trying to argue that steel is as good of a material as aluminum to use for intakes. This is not true. I don't live near the ocean so my car is never exposed to salty air. None of our cars have barriers of salt on them but if you want to put a barrier of salt on your car to protect it, then be my guest. If you would rather have steel over aluminum then hey, that's your prerogative.
About that head to head dyno, we are working on it.
I am not arguing that steel is every bit as good as aluminum. Each has it's own strength and weaknesses. I was taking to issue the fact that you claimed the steel intake will rust. I have lived in Southern Ontario for 34 years now. I've seen what salt will do and I was just explaining my point of view that the possibility of rust forming in an intake that is under the hood of a car, even in 'salt laden' Ontario, is a non-issue. The salters that the highway crews use up here in Ontario are not made of aluminum, they are made of steel. Painted, yes, but those trucks are salt covered all winter. Why aren't they made of aluminum?
Why not make the intake out of plastic? Since you don't have a dyno comparison and apparently aren't interested in my impartial proposition (made in my previous post - and still standing) tells me that you are basing your decision on the material used is what makes a better intake. If this is so, the factory plastic job should be the best as I'm positive it will never rust nor will it oxidize. On the other hand, as Steve has proven, by dyno, his design is more effective in producing horsepower and torque over the factory unit. I am going to dyno the FC and factory unit this Saturday in front of about 15-20 other org members.
Steve's intake works on the following simple principles:
1) a straighter air path is more effective;
2) a larger filter surface area will provide more air, which will improve a vehicles breathing characteristics.
I am certain that your intake will follow these criteria as well. Neither yourself or Steve are Sorcerer's (I don't think) so I'm sure nothing mystical is happening.
Your entire reasoning that your unit is the better because it's made of aluminum does not convince me that it's the way to go. Being that I live in 'salt laden' Ontario, the material should be a bigger concern for me than for many people that aren't in a comparable environment. I would be very interested in seeing how many ppm of salt is in the air around where you live on average and compare it to what my car has seen. We don't have salt water working against us in the middle of July. It very well may be a minor amount, or maybe non existent for you. In this case, rust inside the intake will be....... A NON ISSUE.
Looking forward to seeing the dynos of your intake. Good luck with your venture. It sounds like you've got some happy customers.
Albert
Originally posted by akrus
I feel for you on the 'server busy' thing, it's what made me give up on the org last night and forced me to head off to the bar
I am not arguing that steel is every bit as good as aluminum. Each has it's own strength and weaknesses. I was taking to issue the fact that you claimed the steel intake will rust. I have lived in Southern Ontario for 34 years now. I've seen what salt will do and I was just explaining my point of view that the possibility of rust forming in an intake that is under the hood of a car, even in 'salt laden' Ontario, is a non-issue. The salters that the highway crews use up here in Ontario are not made of aluminum, they are made of steel. Painted, yes, but those trucks are salt covered all winter. Why aren't they made of aluminum?
Why not make the intake out of plastic? Since you don't have a dyno comparison and apparently aren't interested in my impartial proposition (made in my previous post - and still standing) tells me that you are basing your decision on the material used is what makes a better intake. If this is so, the factory plastic job should be the best as I'm positive it will never rust nor will it oxidize. On the other hand, as Steve has proven, by dyno, his design is more effective in producing horsepower and torque over the factory unit. I am going to dyno the FC and factory unit this Saturday in front of about 15-20 other org members.
Steve's intake works on the following simple principles:
1) a straighter air path is more effective;
2) a larger filter surface area will provide more air, which will improve a vehicles breathing characteristics.
I am certain that your intake will follow these criteria as well. Neither yourself or Steve are Sorcerer's (I don't think) so I'm sure nothing mystical is happening.
Your entire reasoning that your unit is the better because it's made of aluminum does not convince me that it's the way to go. Being that I live in 'salt laden' Ontario, the material should be a bigger concern for me than for many people that aren't in a comparable environment. I would be very interested in seeing how many ppm of salt is in the air around where you live on average and compare it to what my car has seen. We don't have salt water working against us in the middle of July. It very well may be a minor amount, or maybe non existent for you. In this case, rust inside the intake will be....... A NON ISSUE.
Looking forward to seeing the dynos of your intake. Good luck with your venture. It sounds like you've got some happy customers.
Albert
I feel for you on the 'server busy' thing, it's what made me give up on the org last night and forced me to head off to the bar
I am not arguing that steel is every bit as good as aluminum. Each has it's own strength and weaknesses. I was taking to issue the fact that you claimed the steel intake will rust. I have lived in Southern Ontario for 34 years now. I've seen what salt will do and I was just explaining my point of view that the possibility of rust forming in an intake that is under the hood of a car, even in 'salt laden' Ontario, is a non-issue. The salters that the highway crews use up here in Ontario are not made of aluminum, they are made of steel. Painted, yes, but those trucks are salt covered all winter. Why aren't they made of aluminum?
Why not make the intake out of plastic? Since you don't have a dyno comparison and apparently aren't interested in my impartial proposition (made in my previous post - and still standing) tells me that you are basing your decision on the material used is what makes a better intake. If this is so, the factory plastic job should be the best as I'm positive it will never rust nor will it oxidize. On the other hand, as Steve has proven, by dyno, his design is more effective in producing horsepower and torque over the factory unit. I am going to dyno the FC and factory unit this Saturday in front of about 15-20 other org members.
Steve's intake works on the following simple principles:
1) a straighter air path is more effective;
2) a larger filter surface area will provide more air, which will improve a vehicles breathing characteristics.
I am certain that your intake will follow these criteria as well. Neither yourself or Steve are Sorcerer's (I don't think) so I'm sure nothing mystical is happening.
Your entire reasoning that your unit is the better because it's made of aluminum does not convince me that it's the way to go. Being that I live in 'salt laden' Ontario, the material should be a bigger concern for me than for many people that aren't in a comparable environment. I would be very interested in seeing how many ppm of salt is in the air around where you live on average and compare it to what my car has seen. We don't have salt water working against us in the middle of July. It very well may be a minor amount, or maybe non existent for you. In this case, rust inside the intake will be....... A NON ISSUE.
Looking forward to seeing the dynos of your intake. Good luck with your venture. It sounds like you've got some happy customers.
Albert
you saved me a lot of typing.
Originally posted by cobymoby
Okay Steve, after this lets drop this issue. Nails rust because they are galvanized steel and that galvanizing doesn't hold up very well in harsh conditions. A fence isn't submerged in water but you'll see plenty of rust stains on that wood just from the moisture in the air and/or rain. With intakes, 6061 aluminum or 304 stainless is the proper choice as neither will rust. Aluminum is best because it's light, looks the better than anything else when polished, and will NEVER rust. Every single top intake manufacturer (AEM, Akimoto, etc.) use 6061 aluminum like I do.
But......let's be done with this. I think I've proved my point.
Okay Steve, after this lets drop this issue. Nails rust because they are galvanized steel and that galvanizing doesn't hold up very well in harsh conditions. A fence isn't submerged in water but you'll see plenty of rust stains on that wood just from the moisture in the air and/or rain. With intakes, 6061 aluminum or 304 stainless is the proper choice as neither will rust. Aluminum is best because it's light, looks the better than anything else when polished, and will NEVER rust. Every single top intake manufacturer (AEM, Akimoto, etc.) use 6061 aluminum like I do.
But......let's be done with this. I think I've proved my point.
no hard feelings or nothin
-peace
Originally posted by silentbuzz
Ok, I want a intake that wont rust, so whitch one should I get?
Ok, I want a intake that wont rust, so whitch one should I get?
Ok, can this question be answered. Is this Berktech intake stainless steel? Is it internally better then the others? The pipe on the Franken intake looks thicker from the back of the filter to the plenum. That extra air makes sense. But, is this berktech one similar in design as the stillen and that other company that I cant remember.
For 74.50, the berktech is a good upgrade.
For 74.50, the berktech is a good upgrade.
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Re: Should I purchase a intake system?
Originally posted by silentbuzz
Hey guys, Im prolly gunna get a 2002 or 2003 once spring time hits. But, I really want to MOD my 2001 5spd AE. I already have a SMC shifter and K&N drop in, but I want more. If I wasn't getting married, I would of put in super charger by now. So im looking around, and apparently some of these intake systems are interchangable between the 2001 & the 2002+. Do you think I should go ahead and mod this untill I get the new one....if I do?
Hey guys, Im prolly gunna get a 2002 or 2003 once spring time hits. But, I really want to MOD my 2001 5spd AE. I already have a SMC shifter and K&N drop in, but I want more. If I wasn't getting married, I would of put in super charger by now. So im looking around, and apparently some of these intake systems are interchangable between the 2001 & the 2002+. Do you think I should go ahead and mod this untill I get the new one....if I do?
short throw shifter and how much did you pay for it? Thanks
Senior Member
Joined: Apr 2001
Posts: 583
Originally posted by rubman
I'd seriously recommend the y-pipe before anything else. I did the intake first, felt little to no improvement. Y-pipe made the car feel significantly stronger. You'll love it.
I'd seriously recommend the y-pipe before anything else. I did the intake first, felt little to no improvement. Y-pipe made the car feel significantly stronger. You'll love it.
Originally posted by silentbuzz
Ok, I want a intake that wont rust, so whitch one should I get?
Ok, I want a intake that wont rust, so whitch one should I get?
Albert
Originally posted by dmbmaxima88
i still maintain that my intake will make more power then just a cone filter and it WON"T RUST. don't worry. mine also sounds better.
i still maintain that my intake will make more power then just a cone filter and it WON"T RUST. don't worry. mine also sounds better.
Originally posted by MichaelAE
What is that in response too? I'm curious...I honestly haven't followed the thread all too closely...are saying "more power" referring to just the Stillen Hi-Flow or are you comparing it to the Berk at that point?
What is that in response too? I'm curious...I honestly haven't followed the thread all too closely...are saying "more power" referring to just the Stillen Hi-Flow or are you comparing it to the Berk at that point?
Originally posted by dmbmaxima88
i'd say to both, right now the berk is just a cone, nothing more.
i'd say to both, right now the berk is just a cone, nothing more.
Originally posted by silentbuzz
yes, cause its wider.
yes, cause its wider.
Originally posted by MichaelAE
And your claim of additional power is...the added length of your intake? The wider diameter of the overall piping since you replace more of the stock unit?
And your claim of additional power is...the added length of your intake? The wider diameter of the overall piping since you replace more of the stock unit?
Ran the Frankencar intake on the dyno today. Check it out in the dyno-fest thread located in the Canada forum http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....threadid=95767
Proof is in the numbers. Good job Steve. Your intake does what you claim.
Albert
Proof is in the numbers. Good job Steve. Your intake does what you claim.
Albert
Originally posted by akrus
Ran the Frankencar intake on the dyno today. Check it out in the dyno-fest thread located in the Canada forum http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....threadid=95767
Proof is in the numbers. Good job Steve. Your intake does what you claim.
Albert
Ran the Frankencar intake on the dyno today. Check it out in the dyno-fest thread located in the Canada forum http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....threadid=95767
Proof is in the numbers. Good job Steve. Your intake does what you claim.
Albert
Originally posted by silentbuzz
Yeah, it was quite loud, but this issue with the different filters with the different power #'s only confused what I want to do. Regardless, the #'s were very good. Ill take 10hp anytime.
Yeah, it was quite loud, but this issue with the different filters with the different power #'s only confused what I want to do. Regardless, the #'s were very good. Ill take 10hp anytime.
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