Yo Kev dont trip you know what your talking about...Im still waiting for my WI its taking 4eva! I have a question 4 joo. Do you think I should: 1) Smaller Pulley, WI, no NOS. 2) Leave the pulley, WI, 40shot. Just curious. By the way nice numbers all the way up. I would rather have a nice curve going straight up then lag and get a good top end.

 

so this wouldn't help a N/A car, what about with nos????

 

Actually this only helps cars with forced induction. Forced air + cooling equals denser air which produces more power. Nitrous is actually a cooler already so no that wouldn't help that set up.

 

I'm having a hard time fathoming why you can't grasp my point. I'm well awere of the point to having an intercooler bud. I think the numbers are great. But if you go with the normal boost loss, you are about 1.5 lbs low. You woun't at least argue that right? Ok so your not "giving it up" for lack of a better word we can call it,
"potential" power lost by so much boost drop, do you like that term better. Or your givng up potential power going on ave numbers. I'm not sure how else to phrase it. It's not just peak that im talking about you could gain that 17 hp anywhere in the band. Overall though I'd bet it pops up higher. I know you get what i'm saying I just don't know how else to explain it that you can be happy enough to exept it. Shoot if i end up droping 2 psi, i'll come on post the numbers and **** about the loss of so much boost.

"What would power be with 11 psi" with the intercooler cooling effeicnelty the same and a true 11 psi it would be more hopfully, kinda suck if it wasn't. I'm fully aware of the whole point of cooling via intercoolers and why power is gained, the fact remains by the law of ave, your giving up "potential" power do to so much boost loss. What other term would you like me to use?

I don't care about anybody's aproval on the tranny you brought that up. You want numbers? You say you car now revs 1 sec faster through 3rd, prove it? It's not just hp,tq numbers you know it. Or at least somtimes you appear to. How about holding the proper power band, traction, strenth, quick proper shifts, etc,etc. But thats beside the point. The point is simple you boost drop is major.

 

"trying to justify it", so does kev lube his car first or you? Damn dude. Front mounts vary via size and area (local), pipes so forth anywhere between 700-3000. Yes his is cheaper and works great, ive not tried to take away from that. Fact: He drops alot of boost, execivly. Now justify that. If he was, and granted he's not, but since everybody wants numbers, a real drag racer in say outlaw, and droped 2 psi, mechanics would work around the clock to fix it. Plain and simple.

 

his car is fast, the WI works, better then a IC for MUCH less i think, lay off him. KEV YOU DA MAN. get a pully for 60 bucks

 

[RANT]
First, your the one on the defensive. I'm just trying to pick YOUR and Kevs brain and it's just for the hell of it. Doubt I'll ever have a SC anyways.

Second, learn how to type, spell, use grammer, complete a sentence, or PLEASE at least proof read your posts. It hurts just trying to decipher your posts.

Third, so what if he lost 2psi and some "real drag racer" who has unlimited resources and money would think "that's a big deal". That's not even a valid comparison to anything we're talking about here. As long as Kev is putting down MORE hp/tq with vs. withOUT WI, a 2-psi drop doesn't matter as long as he changes pulleys and the NET BOOST is the same. Your only going to be able to handle a MAXIMUM amount of boost, so either method will top out at the same PSI. However, if WI is more efficent then an IC as "promised", WI WILL produce MORE power than the IC at the SAME PSI.

Never mind your apparently talking out you A$$ on half of the stuff you claim to know. Most of the time it sounds like your halfway repeating your mechanic/local shops' propaganda.

Are you actually installing any of this or are you just paying someone? Not that paying someone else is bad, but I'd believe someone who has installed and is maintaining an SC over someone who only knows what their mechanic is telling them.
[/RANT]

 

go ice boy go ice boy go go go go go

 

I'm on the defensive, because some (you) are on Kevs d**k. I never dogged what he did. The fact remains plain and simple, excessive loss in boost is present, if he's happy, good. But he says he wants more out of the car. I use the drag racer scenario, because that’s what people on here seem to relate to. Pick my brain. Fine, jump on anybody d*ck and I'll call you on it; it’s a bit gay. There is a lot of things that can be done. There’s advantages to the wic, I’ve flat out said that, what more do you want. But why if you could probably pretty easy gain another 20ish hp for FREE, would you not want to get it, after all people fight for 5 hp with intakes right?

Second, your right, I need to go back and read what I type, the problem is I tend to change things when I do that, I prefer to go with my first thoughts. I don't sugar coat things, I speak from the heart, and despite your thinking I'm not trying to dog Kev, I'm trying to get him to do more, and get the max out of what is already done, don't that make sense? By the way you have typing mistakes too.

I'm not talking out of my ***. Go look up some of the stuff I’ve said, damn even Kev said the loss was a lot of drop, in one sentence.

 

Kevs pressure drop is due to cooling from the water vapor being injected. Which is good. A pro racer would be happy about this.

A pressure loss from a FMIC is more related to the bends and pipe length. This is bad! A pro racer would not be happy about this.

The reason why Air to water intercoolers are prefered for SC's is because they usually require less piping and smaller cores wich gives less loss then a FMIC. On a Turbo this is no big deal because more boost dosent cost you power like it does on a SC.

 

I'm aware of all of this, but the pressure drop, from what I’ve seen is a lot, to me the car is not getting it's full potential of possible power. It could be better yet. Last I knew one other advantage too awic, is the minimum pressure drop; 2 psi is not minimum to me. That’s all I'm saying is wrong. If he only had a 1 psi drop, that I could at least so ok, o well, but a full 2? Whoa! Really I expected more like a .5 psi drop or even less. Maybe that’s too much to ask, but 2 is Whoa! Why not try to maximize Why is it so much drop anyway? Is it due to, too much of a cool down(past whats really needed)(optimum temp), too much water injected or what, you want to make a point here, good, educate me. I can't believe that there’s not some way to get some pressure back, without changeing the pulley first, and still have all of the advantages to the awic, and get every piece to function to it’s full potential. You paid for it right? Why give up? squeeeeeeeze it and get every last hp and tq (since you have no torque ) out of it.

 

Congratulations Kev, those are impressive numbers.

As far as an alcohol mixture for your water injection, use only an 80% water and 20% METHANOL alcohol mixture. Certain alcohols mess up the internals in the pump!
If you want, you can get a 3-5 gal plastic fuel cell from summit or jegs and mount it in the trunk and use an aquajet 12 v pump to keep the main pump primed. also get a 200 psi autometer oil pressure guage and run a line from it to the extra water outlet on the pump. This way you can see the main pump prime up to 125 psi and when the unit is on the pressure drops down to 80 psi, which is what squirts into the intake. You can also tee off the line that squirts into the intake and run it to a 100 psi guage and you will know if water is actually being injected and over a time if you get a clog, you'll see the pressure drop and you can fix it!

As far as the SC goes, You'll be better off having vortec upgrade your SC with a better impeller than going to smaller pullies. I personally wouldn't go below a 3" pulley.

I am running both water injection and a vortech air to water aftercooler and this seems to work very well.

You guys better be careful with your high boosting and adding N2O because it will be a lot more expensive to get a new engine then to drop the compression. Jim Wolf wouldn,t touch my car unless I lower the compression which I will be doing next week.
Good luck with your quest for more power, isn't it intoxicating??

 

I'm not tripping, Juan.... just trying to reason with Jayson. Where did you order the WI from?

I'm trying to stay away from NOS because of the automagic tranny. You on the other hand, could get away with addding it (don't over do it though).

MardiGrasMax did an excellent job integrating the two to work for him. Maybe he can help you out.

I'm opting for #1. The 3" has been laying around since Tuesday because I'm waiting for a metal idler pulley and a GReddy blow-off valve (needs welding) to arrive so I can do them all at once.

 

I understand your point, but you can't grasp PV=nRT.
http://www.google.com try searching.


Normal boost lost? The boost lost is related to temperature drop. Let me simplify the equation for you.
P = (nRT)/V
Pressure in atm = (mols in air * liter atmospheres per mole Kelvin * temperature in Kelvin) / Volume in Liters

So let's say
P1 is 11 psi (suppose to be in atm, but let's use psi)
P2 is 9 psi (suppose to be in atm, but let's use psi)
T1 is temperature @ 11 psi
T2 is temperature @ 9 psi
other variables haven't changed.

Since everything else hasn't changed, the equation can be simplified to say P1 = T1 for 11 psi and P2 = T2 for 12 psi (generic way of thinking about this).

Can you see it now? If pressure drop so was great, don't you think temperature drop was great as well?


I'm going on scientific fact, not on assumption.


You sound like you understand... somewhat.

Scientifically speaking, it should be.


Law of Averages? Do you know what you're talking about? Have you taken statistics in high school... not lower division stats, upper division?


I never brought it up, you did. Here is your exact words before we talked about your tranny. Don't think I didn't know what you were referring to:
I take nothing away from you being the first and experimenting with prebuilt parts, the only thing that ive come to be upset about is when people "drull" on you and kiss your ***, but when sombody does somthing really kewl that is not prebuilt or predone they ***** at them, I don't blaim you for that at all, it's just charecter of some.



I can back up what I say, so don't test me.


Haven't you been comparing hp and torque with boost loss all this time?


My boost drop is major, but my temperature drop has significantly decreased also.

 

Not trying to get personal, eh? When did Alex attack you? He hasn't, so stop it.

He was merely stating facts and you were going by assumptions... and you know what people say when they go by assumptions.....


Read my justification above concerning PV=nRT. If you want more, then go here: http://www.google.com/search?hl=en&i...9-1&q=pv%3Dnrt


Read my justification... don't go around in circles asking for answers.

 

Already have a pulley, but not for $60.


Alex has seen the light!

 

You're on the defensive because you wanted approval by your peers on the tranny project.

Please don't contradict yourself:
The vb mod you and many others stand by as making a huge diff. why is it then so hard for you to believe the all that I did isn't that much better. People come on here and say wow I can instantly tell a diff now. Yet when I do somthing big, they doubt. Come on, Get off my back. And that was not the only thing I was refering to. I will put the end numbers up when I have them and then we will all know. Heaven forbid sombody do somthing really kewl and people just look at it for that.


Again, I am happy the numbers are better all around at 9 psi than at 11 psi.


And I'm taking the steps in doing so.


I am not a drag racer... haven't even been to the track.


Stating facts in not jumping on someone's nuts. If you can show your tranny improvements, I'll be behind you 100%.


How are you getting free hp?


Have tact when you speak to people. You can speak from the heart, but if you don't know how to say it so people don't get offended then you need to learn a different approach. Most people would rather know the truth, but tell them nicely.

I am by no means offended by any of your comments. What we are trying to do is reason with the 2 psi drop issue you have.


Don't go by assumptions. See scientific calcuations again.

 

I had no doubt you understood what I was trying to point out.

 

kev check your PMs man.

 

Hey, thanks Ron.

Are you going with 80/20? We bought some denatured alcohol (the one that MardiGrasMax bought from Home Depot), which is alcohol mixed with methanol (or something like that).

I'm planning on getting the new indicator product that ERL hasn't released yet. It does exactly the same thing you mentioned.

Good luck with your compression project. Dyno that beast, ok?

Thanks for the advice.

 

3" isn't small enough

 

Don't tempt me.

 

<cough> 2.87 </cough>

 

The job you have done so far is very admirable keving.

keep up the good work

actually you need to slow the fock down so i can catch up.

 

Kev,
Yes I am using the 80-20 mixture. I have a 5 gal plastic fuel cell so I'll never (i hope) run out of water. I'm telling you, don't use anything but methanol and water, it is by far the safest and best. I forgot to mention that I have a float mechanism in the water tank that shuts down the main pump when the tank is empty so you don't run the main pump dry and fry it!