Lease rates
12-29-2004, 08:54 AM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 100
Lease rates
I would like to know what some of the forum members are paying for there leased Maximas.
This is my deal and i am not real sure if it is good or not
2005 Max SE
Elite package
Automatic
Nav system
chrome wheels
$542.00 a month
15,000 miles per year
36 months
Thanks,
Automon
This is my deal and i am not real sure if it is good or not
2005 Max SE
Elite package
Automatic
Nav system
chrome wheels
$542.00 a month
15,000 miles per year
36 months
Thanks,
Automon
12-29-2004, 09:24 AM
#3
542/mo for a Max is insane. After only 3 yrs of ownership you'll have made $19,512 in payments. A brand new Max nicely equipped can now be bought for mid 20's.
A 3-yr old loaded Max with 36K mi costs around 15 grand. You are so much better off by buying your car now and getting 36 mo loan+1 baloon payment. After 36 mos you can trade in and your car's value will exceed the amout of baloon payment required for pay off so you put a few grand in your pocket.
A 3-yr old loaded Max with 36K mi costs around 15 grand. You are so much better off by buying your car now and getting 36 mo loan+1 baloon payment. After 36 mos you can trade in and your car's value will exceed the amout of baloon payment required for pay off so you put a few grand in your pocket.
12-29-2004, 10:48 AM
#4
Originally Posted by Automonjama
I would like to know what some of the forum members are paying for there leased Maximas.
This is my deal and i am not real sure if it is good or not
2005 Max SE
Elite package
Automatic
Nav system
chrome wheels
$542.00 a month
15,000 miles per year
36 months
Thanks,
Automon
This is my deal and i am not real sure if it is good or not
2005 Max SE
Elite package
Automatic
Nav system
chrome wheels
$542.00 a month
15,000 miles per year
36 months
Thanks,
Automon
so why didnt you just get a 2005 Mercedes SL600 instead?
12-29-2004, 11:44 AM
#5
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 880
Originally Posted by Y2KMaxGXE-R
542/mo for a Max is insane. After only 3 yrs of ownership you'll have made $19,512 in payments. A brand new Max nicely equipped can now be bought for mid 20's.
A 3-yr old loaded Max with 36K mi costs around 15 grand. You are so much better off by buying your car now and getting 36 mo loan+1 baloon payment. After 36 mos you can trade in and your car's value will exceed the amout of baloon payment required for pay off so you put a few grand in your pocket.
A 3-yr old loaded Max with 36K mi costs around 15 grand. You are so much better off by buying your car now and getting 36 mo loan+1 baloon payment. After 36 mos you can trade in and your car's value will exceed the amout of baloon payment required for pay off so you put a few grand in your pocket.
A brand-new loaded Maxima cannot be had for mid-twenties. His Elite with Nav and other extras had to list for close to $37,000. I'm sure the invoice on it was close to $33,000, so you ain't gonna get that car for any mid-twenties.
One other point about balloon notes - by their very nature, the amount of the balloon payment at the end (which equates to the residual under a lease) is generally inflated to reduce the payments, and you aren't likely to come out at the end of one with "a few grand in your pocket". In fact, you almost never can get as much at retail as the amount of that payment.
So, using your own numbers ... $19,512 in payments + $15,000 in residual = $34,512 total cost. Figure a good $4,000 or more of that is interest, and it's a pretty darn good deal. Same as buying the car for $30k and he has no trade-in woes and isn't upside-down at the end of the 3 years.
On the other hand, if he bought that same car at 5% add-on interest, he'd pay $4,950 in interest ($33,000 x .05 x 3 years), his payment would be $1,054/mo. ($33,000 + $4,950 divided by 36 months). He'd then have a 3-year-old car worth about $15,000 that you already think he bought for $25,000 or so, and you ain't about to give him $15,000 for it. And he'll play hell getting even $12,000 for it as a trade-in, since they give you wholesale.
So, he has spent $37,944 in payments over the 36 months, and all he has to show for it is a $12,000 trade-in. That means he has spent $25,944 net out-of-pocket when he could have leased the car and spent only $19,512. Sounds better all the time.
And one last thing: where are you getting balloon notes on Maximas? I expected to get one, but was told Nissan doesn't offer them and the dealer had no outside sources for them either!
Mike
12-29-2004, 12:00 PM
#6
Originally Posted by Mike_TX
I agree $542 is a little strong, but your numbers are wonky, too.
A brand-new loaded Maxima cannot be had for mid-twenties. His Elite with Nav and other extras had to list for close to $37,000. I'm sure the invoice on it was close to $33,000, so you ain't gonna get that car for any mid-twenties.
One other point about balloon notes - by their very nature, the amount of the balloon payment at the end (which equates to the residual under a lease) is generally inflated to reduce the payments, and you aren't likely to come out at the end of one with "a few grand in your pocket". In fact, you almost never can get as much at retail as the amount of that payment.
So, using your own numbers ... $19,512 in payments + $15,000 in residual = $34,512 total cost. Figure a good $4,000 or more of that is interest, and it's a pretty darn good deal. Same as buying the car for $30k and he has no trade-in woes and isn't upside-down at the end of the 3 years.
On the other hand, if he bought that same car at 5% add-on interest, he'd pay $4,950 in interest ($33,000 x .05 x 3 years), his payment would be $1,054/mo. ($33,000 + $4,950 divided by 36 months). He'd then have a 3-year-old car worth about $15,000 that you already think he bought for $25,000 or so, and you ain't about to give him $15,000 for it. And he'll play hell getting even $12,000 for it as a trade-in, since they give you wholesale.
So, he has spent $37,944 in payments over the 36 months, and all he has to show for it is a $12,000 trade-in. That means he has spent $25,944 net out-of-pocket when he could have leased the car and spent only $19,512. Sounds better all the time.
And one last thing: where are you getting balloon notes on Maximas? I expected to get one, but was told Nissan doesn't offer them and the dealer had no outside sources for them either!
Mike
A brand-new loaded Maxima cannot be had for mid-twenties. His Elite with Nav and other extras had to list for close to $37,000. I'm sure the invoice on it was close to $33,000, so you ain't gonna get that car for any mid-twenties.
One other point about balloon notes - by their very nature, the amount of the balloon payment at the end (which equates to the residual under a lease) is generally inflated to reduce the payments, and you aren't likely to come out at the end of one with "a few grand in your pocket". In fact, you almost never can get as much at retail as the amount of that payment.
So, using your own numbers ... $19,512 in payments + $15,000 in residual = $34,512 total cost. Figure a good $4,000 or more of that is interest, and it's a pretty darn good deal. Same as buying the car for $30k and he has no trade-in woes and isn't upside-down at the end of the 3 years.
On the other hand, if he bought that same car at 5% add-on interest, he'd pay $4,950 in interest ($33,000 x .05 x 3 years), his payment would be $1,054/mo. ($33,000 + $4,950 divided by 36 months). He'd then have a 3-year-old car worth about $15,000 that you already think he bought for $25,000 or so, and you ain't about to give him $15,000 for it. And he'll play hell getting even $12,000 for it as a trade-in, since they give you wholesale.
So, he has spent $37,944 in payments over the 36 months, and all he has to show for it is a $12,000 trade-in. That means he has spent $25,944 net out-of-pocket when he could have leased the car and spent only $19,512. Sounds better all the time.
And one last thing: where are you getting balloon notes on Maximas? I expected to get one, but was told Nissan doesn't offer them and the dealer had no outside sources for them either!
Mike
Mike, noone pays MSRP for a Maxima these days, once the model is in production over a year, you pay a grand over invoice at max, for some hard-to-find color etc. You are using the 5th gen trade-in values for your reference, but don't forget the 6th gen is now in a different class, thus it is reasonable to expect the trade in values to be a bit higher. Third, you don't go through Nissan but work with your bank to finance your car. I am sure they will work with you as long as the outstanding amount is not outrun by depreciation, the bank does not want you to own on a car more than its worth.
We're comparing a loss of nearly 70% of original value over 3 yrs of ownership. Bottom line is that you will never loose 19 grand (principal and interest) in 3 years if you buy a Nissan Maxima and put only 36k mi on it.
12-29-2004, 02:13 PM
#7
Member
Join Date: Sep 2004
Posts: 41
I pay $239/month with a sick down payment. After offering a large down payment, my dealership was willing to give me the vehicle for near invoice (SL DPP,Sunroof, Floormats, Splash Gaurds $28,800 if I remember correctly). I went w/ the large down payment because I can afford it now w/ only a wife no kids, and I didn't want to be stuck with a $400+ payment after I started a family. Also, Nebraska has some crazy registration and plate fees for new vehicles, which I was able to avoid by leasing.
My lease is 15,000/year for 39 months, and my residual value is about $16,500. If I purchase the vehicle at residual value then yes, I did pay more than if I bought it. However, after a couple of problems, my dealership has no chance of me buying the car unless they take off $2000, and give me the extended warranty for free or almost free. I might have some unreasonable demands, but at least I have the option of telling them that I won't purchase the car and move on.
My lease is 15,000/year for 39 months, and my residual value is about $16,500. If I purchase the vehicle at residual value then yes, I did pay more than if I bought it. However, after a couple of problems, my dealership has no chance of me buying the car unless they take off $2000, and give me the extended warranty for free or almost free. I might have some unreasonable demands, but at least I have the option of telling them that I won't purchase the car and move on.
12-29-2004, 06:10 PM
#10
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 342
Automonjama,
I personally wouldn't lease a car unless you owned a business. That way you can right off your lease payments. My brother lease both toyota landcruiser and M5 for
business use. He get all his payments back from IRS. If you insist on getting a lease
vs payments make sure you know all the tricks of leasing. Good luck
Mike
I personally wouldn't lease a car unless you owned a business. That way you can right off your lease payments. My brother lease both toyota landcruiser and M5 for
business use. He get all his payments back from IRS. If you insist on getting a lease
vs payments make sure you know all the tricks of leasing. Good luck
Mike
12-30-2004, 07:48 AM
#11
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 880
Originally Posted by Y2KMaxGXE-R
Mike, noone pays MSRP for a Maxima these days, once the model is in production over a year, you pay a grand over invoice at max, for some hard-to-find color etc. You are using the 5th gen trade-in values for your reference, but don't forget the 6th gen is now in a different class, thus it is reasonable to expect the trade in values to be a bit higher. Third, you don't go through Nissan but work with your bank to finance your car. I am sure they will work with you as long as the outstanding amount is not outrun by depreciation, the bank does not want you to own on a car more than its worth.
We're comparing a loss of nearly 70% of original value over 3 yrs of ownership. Bottom line is that you will never loose 19 grand (principal and interest) in 3 years if you buy a Nissan Maxima and put only 36k mi on it.
We're comparing a loss of nearly 70% of original value over 3 yrs of ownership. Bottom line is that you will never loose 19 grand (principal and interest) in 3 years if you buy a Nissan Maxima and put only 36k mi on it.
MSRP? If you read my long post, you'll see that I said the MSRP was probably close to $37k, and I figured everything on $33k. That's 4 grand off list.
For trade, I'm using an estimate based on lease residuals and historical values. (I've been buying cars for over 40 years now, and have a little experience at this game. Oh, and I also used to be a new car salesman.) If you back out certain of the extras the original poster has, the figures I used were a roughly 50% residual after 3 years, which is realistic for this class of vehicle. As for the wholesale price, I was trying to make a point, but check back in three yeras and see what some folks are getting for their trades ...
On the balloon note issue - The first thing I did before I got my Maxima was to go to my bank (Chase, who incidentally introduced the balloon note concept to the car industry in 1990). They confirmed that they offer that plan only through auto dealers, and no one does balloons direct to individuals. I wish they did.
Lastly, "losing" 19 grand over 3 years on a new car isn't that strange. As I've illustrated, buy your car and then add up your downpay and your 36 months of payments, subtract your tradein value and see what you lose. $33k purchase price (for the Elite w/nav the poster has) for 36 months at 5% = $37,950, divided by 36 = $1,054.16/month. Even if you got lucky and sold your 3-year-old car for $18,000 (don't count on it), that's still $19,950 out of your pocket in pincipal and interest for the pleasure of driving that car for 3 years.
It ain't cheap to own a car!
Mike
12-30-2004, 07:59 AM
#12
Senior Member
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 880
Originally Posted by mikelly
Automonjama,
I personally wouldn't lease a car unless you owned a business. That way you can right off your lease payments. My brother lease both toyota landcruiser and M5 for
business use. He get all his payments back from IRS. If you insist on getting a lease
vs payments make sure you know all the tricks of leasing. Good luck
Mike
I personally wouldn't lease a car unless you owned a business. That way you can right off your lease payments. My brother lease both toyota landcruiser and M5 for
business use. He get all his payments back from IRS. If you insist on getting a lease
vs payments make sure you know all the tricks of leasing. Good luck
Mike
But a lease makes a lot of sense for people who want to keep cars for only 3 years or so and then get a new one. Lease payments are usually only about 40% of "purchase" payments, and when the lease ends, you just walk away and get another new car with no trade hassles.
In fact, tying up your money in a car purchase is really bad money management. You'll end up paying roughly the same net amount as leasing, but in the meantime the extra money you pay each month is sitting in the lender's bank instead of yours. And then you have the grief of wrestling with a dealer to get a fair tradein value for your used car. In a lease, the tradein value is agreed to up front (the residual value).
If you drive more than 15,000 miles a year or want to keep your car more than 3 years of so, a lease may not be the best way to go. Otherwise, it's a good deal.
Mike
12-30-2004, 08:03 AM
#13
Mike, I never doubted your credentials or experience. We have had numerous discussions here on .org about the benefits of leasing vs. ownership. Having said that, the $542/mo can be put to a better use than the lease on a 6th gen Maxima.
12-30-2004, 10:33 AM
#14
Senior Member
Join Date: Jun 2001
Posts: 342
Mike,
I agree with you wholeheartedly. I personally rather own a car since I put tremendous
amount of mileage on a vehicle by going to California and back to Colorado every year.
I like to drive the cars until the wheels fall off. I have an 87 Max since brandnew until
I traded in for an 02 max. I figure if I can keep this car for 10 to 13 Years, the price
I paid for the car was well worth it. So I guess my next car will be 2018 Nissan Maxima
with hover capability, seats 10 people, and 300 Mph land cruising speed.
Mike
I agree with you wholeheartedly. I personally rather own a car since I put tremendous
amount of mileage on a vehicle by going to California and back to Colorado every year.
I like to drive the cars until the wheels fall off. I have an 87 Max since brandnew until
I traded in for an 02 max. I figure if I can keep this car for 10 to 13 Years, the price
I paid for the car was well worth it. So I guess my next car will be 2018 Nissan Maxima
with hover capability, seats 10 people, and 300 Mph land cruising speed.
Mike
01-02-2005, 03:17 PM
#18
Senior Member
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 257
i have heard of people paying in the mid 400 range for a somewhat loaded max..he has elite package....i bet you couldnt get much better of a lease than that...max just doesnt lease cheap plain and simple.....you could do like me and pay cash for it......lot of money but when you pay 29,900 OUT THE DOOR for the driv.per pack i couldnt help it
01-03-2005, 05:20 AM
#19
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 100
Thanks for the input guys
The dealer is also getting me out of my 2002 Altima 5 months early @$423.00 per month as well as taking care of the 4000 miles I am over. so i really did not think it was a bad deal.
I could not get any other dealer to come close to this deal.
The company I work for pays me $550.00 per month car allowance so it really isn't any money out of my pocket.
Automon
The dealer is also getting me out of my 2002 Altima 5 months early @$423.00 per month as well as taking care of the 4000 miles I am over. so i really did not think it was a bad deal.
I could not get any other dealer to come close to this deal.
The company I work for pays me $550.00 per month car allowance so it really isn't any money out of my pocket.
Automon
01-03-2005, 10:21 AM
#20
Junior Member
Join Date: Mar 2003
Posts: 18
Sounds like you have got your answer and then some, but only one person actually leasing the car. I have a 2004 Max SE with the Bose stereo and CD-changer and I pay $399 mo with no money down. Mine was the first one out of the dealer in March of '03 so I probably paid a bit more than you could lease one now.
01-03-2005, 07:09 PM
#21
Newbie - Just Registered
Join Date: Dec 2004
Posts: 13
In my experience, leasing has always been the worse deal as compared to ownership. Ive leased several cars, and i refuse to lease anymore, simply because i don't want to get stuck with mileage at the end of the term (15c a mile is a killer when youre over by 6000 miles), and the cost to lease is actually higher than your cost to own.
I leased a 99 Sebring Convertible for 2 years for a total cost of over $13k. That was 50% of the car's sticker price, and the bank came out with a car they sold to the dealer for 18k. The bank took my 13k and pocketed the 4.5k sale differential from the dealer. All i had to show for it was no car at the end of 2 years.
I don't know if NMAC is still offering low rates. I picked up my 05 Max on 11/30 for 1% financing. 32,300 out the door (including the 6% sales tax, tags and $1000 rebate to the dealer). I paid zero down (true sign and drive) and my payments, while $552 a month, go to principal and very little interest. Only about 827 in interest over the five year note. After three years, I will owe 13k on the car, which I am hoping will be saleable for at least 16k.
I leased a 99 Sebring Convertible for 2 years for a total cost of over $13k. That was 50% of the car's sticker price, and the bank came out with a car they sold to the dealer for 18k. The bank took my 13k and pocketed the 4.5k sale differential from the dealer. All i had to show for it was no car at the end of 2 years.
I don't know if NMAC is still offering low rates. I picked up my 05 Max on 11/30 for 1% financing. 32,300 out the door (including the 6% sales tax, tags and $1000 rebate to the dealer). I paid zero down (true sign and drive) and my payments, while $552 a month, go to principal and very little interest. Only about 827 in interest over the five year note. After three years, I will owe 13k on the car, which I am hoping will be saleable for at least 16k.
01-03-2005, 07:25 PM
#22
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Nov 2004
Posts: 429
Originally Posted by jc53
2K4 SL loaded. 1K down. $438/mo. Company picks up $400/ mo! Not a bad deal ,huh! Driving a 2K4 Max for $38/ mo! Yahoo!
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