Cattman cat-back exhaust for 6th Gen
07-15-2005, 02:53 PM
#42
Originally Posted by Davidx34
Looks nice, really good...But cant any aftermarket exhaust shop bend a 2inch/3inch pipe with no crimps and put on some manaflow or flowmaster mufflers? I had a guy this to my 300z, 240, and 280 back in day. I'm thinking about purchasing the y-pipe and mufflers and leting him do the remaining work....Thoughts anyone?
You'll look a long time before you find an exhaust shop that can make mandrel bends (only way to make crimpless). Its too big and expensive a piece of quipment, and you have to keep it busy constantly to make it pay. You'll typically only find them in production, rather than service, facilities.
I'll also add that if it was that easy to make up a quality exhaust at any corner exhaust shop, we wouldn't be in the exhaust business. Design is a major component as well - if you don't have the expertise, you can't make a decent system. Again, not something you find in the typical exhaust shop. Most exhaust shops don't even carry stainless tubing.
You get what you pay for, in terms of materials, subcomponents, fabrication methods and design. I've seen a number of exhaust shop custom catbacks, and a few are good, but most range from poorly executed to an absolute nightmare. Some of the people who bought them were sold a bill of goods that is nothing but the most outrageous BS.
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
07-15-2005, 03:04 PM
#43
Originally Posted by Davidx34
Using any 2/3inch pipe with proper equipment can produce a system with no crimps, from there it is just a matter of picking what type of mufflers, and tips you want, a shop with the proper equipment can do this for about 250/450.00.....Stainless steel, is just that, a stainless steel.... pipe..you can polish it also...
Its not just a matter of being "stainless". I've heard a lot of comments to the effect of "I don't need stainless because we don't have winter weather here and my pipes will never rust out", but that's shortsighted.
Many assume the only difference is corrosion protection, but it goes way beyond that. S/S thermal transfer is a fraction of mild steel - its as good or better than mild steel with a ceramic coating. This keeps heat out of the engine compartment and inside of the tubing so that exhuast velocity does not suffer. This translates as horsepower. Additionally, S/S has far better ductility - less likely to crack than mild steel.
For an excellent not-too-technical article on the advantages of stainless steel in performance parts, check out the Burns Stainless website - http://burnsstainless.com/TechArticl...s_article.html
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
07-15-2005, 06:54 PM
#45
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Originally Posted by Cattman
I anticipate the retail price to be about $850.
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
07-15-2005, 09:45 PM
#47
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The system is turnkey. Like I stated in an earlier post, it will bolt right in. Also, each section is flanged for ease of installation and greater flexability. The system does bolt up to the stock locations. Again, the details make a big difference.
07-18-2005, 02:41 PM
#51
Originally Posted by Mystery
Great feedback. Any chance we'd be able to have a choice of tips, oval or cicles like what was tested. I'd love to buy your system, especially if i could get the oval tips as an option. I'm sure there would be a few more people interested in oval tips if available. Let us know when you get a chance.
Right now, we are purchasing the muffler with the tips integrated because we like the look, and to keep the cost down in ways that don't affect quality or performance. We originally looked at oval tips in this line of mufflers, and thought that would look good too, but the manufacturer tells us that project did not go forward and they won't have the oval version at this time.
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
07-18-2005, 03:00 PM
#53
Originally Posted by RHMax
$850 for a dual-muffler system isn't bad, but Greddy SPII on Ebay is about $650. Will there be an introductory price, or group buy?
I will be offering an introductory special price of $799 for the first 20 units, but with that said...
We go up against the Greddy's every day with the 95-99 and 00-03 Cattman catback exhausts. Ours are $600 and theirs go for under $500 but we still sell quite a few because its generally recognized in the Maxima community as a better exhaust. Our customers know they'll get more power, and they prefer the sound (volume and tone).
The Greddy's not a bad exhaust, but its not made to the standards that we make ours. Those who want the best will spend the additional money. I'd also point out that the Greddy is basically an Altima V6 catback (one tip per side). It actually costs a fair bit more to have 4 tips rather than two, but IMHO, but we thought it was worthwhile because it looks a lot better on the car.
I'm not familiar with Greddy's 04+ version, but in the case of Greddy exhausts for 95-03 Maximas, many owners have found that the volume increased and the tone deteriorated quite a bit when they installed either a performance y-pipe or headers, apparently due to an undersized resonator (I'm not making this up, we sell replacement catbacks to these people and they tell us why they want something different).
I haven't even seen a picture, so I don't know what sort of resonator Greddy is using on their 04+ system, but we may advise customers who plan to install y-pipes or headers to purchase our resonated version, which will be designed to keep things at a reasonable volume and maintain a quality tone. I really won't know how necessary that will be until we get the first few systems on the road, we've only heard it on the rack at this point, not under load.
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
07-18-2005, 03:15 PM
#54
Originally Posted by Glude
Any word on the headers Brian?
We'll roll right into the 04+ headers as soon as we get this darned 95-03 headers into production. The 95-03 proto is complete, and they should be shipping by the first week of August.
We've got a good 04+ design prototype already from New Zealand, but it won't fit the North American cars so we'll carry those dimensions into a system that's made around a N Am-spec car.
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
07-18-2005, 03:48 PM
#55
Originally Posted by Cattman
We'll roll right into the 04+ headers as soon as we get this darned 95-03 headers into production. The 95-03 proto is complete, and they should be shipping by the first week of August.
We've got a good 04+ design prototype already from New Zealand, but it won't fit the North American cars so we'll carry those dimensions into a system that's made around a N Am-spec car.
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
We've got a good 04+ design prototype already from New Zealand, but it won't fit the North American cars so we'll carry those dimensions into a system that's made around a N Am-spec car.
Brian C Catts
Cattman Performance
07-19-2005, 09:13 AM
#57
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Join Date: Jun 2005
Posts: 230
Originally Posted by newmax5
Very nice product sounds good too. Too loud for me though.
I didn't think it sounded loud at all, and don't forget that there will be a "touring" version that will be quieter than this one coming out soon.
07-19-2005, 05:31 PM
#58
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And dont forget, the mufflers were not welded in place but atck wleded for fitment purposes ONLY. The production version will be quieter. Ill post audio when aI gte the exhaust on my car.
07-20-2005, 03:54 AM
#60
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Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 15
Originally Posted by darrinps
Hello local Max owner!
I didn't think it sounded loud at all, and don't forget that there will be a "touring" version that will be quieter than this one coming out soon.
I didn't think it sounded loud at all, and don't forget that there will be a "touring" version that will be quieter than this one coming out soon.
07-29-2005, 08:53 AM
#63
Originally Posted by DeusExMaxima
I think Cattman said it would be released sometime in August. Its gonna be good. I think Brian Catts is on vacation until Aug 3. Id ask him after he gets back.
07-29-2005, 09:24 AM
#64
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Originally Posted by Team Falken
Sup man just dropping a line to say i saw you yesterday morning in upland/ontario on the 10fwy West on my way to work..nice max..
08-03-2005, 10:11 PM
#66
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Originally Posted by 20"by10"
Just a question that may sound dumb, but here it goes anyway.. I didn't like the look of the Greddy SP2 mufflers, So I bought Stillens. Can Cattman's cat-back system be bought with out the mufflers?
08-03-2005, 10:21 PM
#67
Originally Posted by 20"by10"
Just a question that may sound dumb, but here it goes anyway.. I didn't like the look of the Greddy SP2 mufflers, So I bought Stillens. Can Cattman's cat-back system be bought with out the mufflers?
08-03-2005, 11:07 PM
#69
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Not a dumb question. The y pipe is bought separately. Here is the order or exhaust. You have the headers which bolt onto the engine. Then the y-pipe connects the two headers into one pipe. That pipe connects to the pipe containing the resonator. The resonator pipe connects to a straight pipe which branches off into two again. Those then connect to the mufflers.
I bought my y pipe from CE. But I imagine Cattman will have one made at some point.
I bought my y pipe from CE. But I imagine Cattman will have one made at some point.
08-03-2005, 11:30 PM
#70
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Join Date: Feb 2005
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Originally Posted by DeusExMaxima
Not a dumb question. The y pipe is bought separately. Here is the order or exhaust. You have the headers which bolt onto the engine. Then the y-pipe connects the two headers into one pipe. That pipe connects to the pipe containing the resonator. The resonator pipe connects to a straight pipe which branches off into two again. Those then connect to the mufflers.
I bought my y pipe from CE. But I imagine Cattman will have one made at some point.
I bought my y pipe from CE. But I imagine Cattman will have one made at some point.
Now, is it pointless to just buy the y-pipe and not the rest of the exhaust? What about an exhaust without the y-pipe??
While I'm at it, what exactly are the headers for?
-MO-
08-04-2005, 03:50 AM
#71
As of now there are no aftermarket headers for the 6th gen. If you buy the CE y-pipe tell then you are a member of the org. and you won't have to pay shipping. I hope this helps. Warren
Exhaust Manifolds and Headers
The exhaust manifolds which come on a vehicle from the manufacturer are usually made of cast iron and have a different design criteria than the performance consumer desires. The vehicle manufacturer designs exhaust manifolds to remove the exhaust gases as economically as possible. They look at how quickly and easily the manifolds can be installed on the engine and how easily the engine, with the manifolds installed on the engine, will install into the vehicle. The performance aspect of the exhaust manifold is of minor importance in its design. As a result of these factors the standard exhaust manifolds usually consist of a common runner with each cylinder having a short runner that connects it to the exhaust port on the cylinder head. The exhaust header has a completely different design criterion. Performance is the main factor in the design of exhaust headers. An exhaust header utilizes individual tubes to extract the exhaust gases from the engine as efficiently as possible. The use of individual tubes presents some challenges to the designer. A quality header must be as efficient as possible and at the same time fit into the confines of the engine compartment, as well as providing ease of installation and maximum clearances to any heat sensitive accessories. Exhaust headers are manufactured using mild steel, or stainless steel tubing. The choice of the material to be used is determined by the application it will be used on. Later model vehicles, equipped with catalytic converter must use thick wall 14 gauge mild steel or stainless tubing in order to survive the heat that is generated by the engines exhaust.
Why Headers Improve Performance
Exhaust headers utilize their tube size and length, which is specific for each engine, to efficiently remove all the exhaust from the cylinder thus reducing pumping losses. As mentioned earlier, a pumping loss is the power required to move the pistons through the strokes that are not producing power. When you have an inefficient exhaust manifold the exhaust cannot flow out of the engine as fast as necessary. This lack of flow results in exhaust backpressure. This backpressure adds to the pumping loss that an engine experiences when equipped with standard exhaust manifolds. The amount of exhaust backpressure has been measured to be as high as 8 PSI. The addition of headers, along with a free flow exhaust system, relieves the backpressure, which reduces pumping losses. Another benefit in the reduction of backpressure is better scavenging of the exhaust gases, which results in less contamination of the fresh air-fuel mixture entering the cylinder for the next cycle to begin. This not only gives a power increase, but also allows the engine components to run cooler.
Header Design
There are basically two header designs on the market, 4-tube and Tri-Y. The basic difference between these designs is where they produce their power and torque. The Tri-Y design tends to give an engine more midrange torque, which relates to increased pulling power. 4- tube headers are usually supplied for higher RPM horsepower, but in some cases, where room is available; a long 4- tube design will also give good midrange torque numbers. Tubing diameter and length has a great effect on the performance of headers. The designer of the header uses certain formulas and experience to select the proper tube size and length for particular applications. Basically, increasing the tubing diameter tends to move the power band higher in the RPM range and making the tubes longer tend to move the power lower in the RPM range.
Exhaust Manifolds and Headers
The exhaust manifolds which come on a vehicle from the manufacturer are usually made of cast iron and have a different design criteria than the performance consumer desires. The vehicle manufacturer designs exhaust manifolds to remove the exhaust gases as economically as possible. They look at how quickly and easily the manifolds can be installed on the engine and how easily the engine, with the manifolds installed on the engine, will install into the vehicle. The performance aspect of the exhaust manifold is of minor importance in its design. As a result of these factors the standard exhaust manifolds usually consist of a common runner with each cylinder having a short runner that connects it to the exhaust port on the cylinder head. The exhaust header has a completely different design criterion. Performance is the main factor in the design of exhaust headers. An exhaust header utilizes individual tubes to extract the exhaust gases from the engine as efficiently as possible. The use of individual tubes presents some challenges to the designer. A quality header must be as efficient as possible and at the same time fit into the confines of the engine compartment, as well as providing ease of installation and maximum clearances to any heat sensitive accessories. Exhaust headers are manufactured using mild steel, or stainless steel tubing. The choice of the material to be used is determined by the application it will be used on. Later model vehicles, equipped with catalytic converter must use thick wall 14 gauge mild steel or stainless tubing in order to survive the heat that is generated by the engines exhaust.
Why Headers Improve Performance
Exhaust headers utilize their tube size and length, which is specific for each engine, to efficiently remove all the exhaust from the cylinder thus reducing pumping losses. As mentioned earlier, a pumping loss is the power required to move the pistons through the strokes that are not producing power. When you have an inefficient exhaust manifold the exhaust cannot flow out of the engine as fast as necessary. This lack of flow results in exhaust backpressure. This backpressure adds to the pumping loss that an engine experiences when equipped with standard exhaust manifolds. The amount of exhaust backpressure has been measured to be as high as 8 PSI. The addition of headers, along with a free flow exhaust system, relieves the backpressure, which reduces pumping losses. Another benefit in the reduction of backpressure is better scavenging of the exhaust gases, which results in less contamination of the fresh air-fuel mixture entering the cylinder for the next cycle to begin. This not only gives a power increase, but also allows the engine components to run cooler.
Header Design
There are basically two header designs on the market, 4-tube and Tri-Y. The basic difference between these designs is where they produce their power and torque. The Tri-Y design tends to give an engine more midrange torque, which relates to increased pulling power. 4- tube headers are usually supplied for higher RPM horsepower, but in some cases, where room is available; a long 4- tube design will also give good midrange torque numbers. Tubing diameter and length has a great effect on the performance of headers. The designer of the header uses certain formulas and experience to select the proper tube size and length for particular applications. Basically, increasing the tubing diameter tends to move the power band higher in the RPM range and making the tubes longer tend to move the power lower in the RPM range.
08-04-2005, 03:55 AM
#72
Originally Posted by ramberg
Welcome to the org. How are you doing? Warren
[IMG]pic[/IMG]
[IMG]pic[/IMG]
thanks.
oh, and where did you get that good info^^^^? or is it to your credit?
08-04-2005, 04:29 AM
#73
Originally Posted by NismoMax80
please reduce the size of that pic. it seems you've been using it like a signature. so please treat it as so.
thanks.
oh, and where did you get that good info^^^^? or is it to your credit?
thanks.
oh, and where did you get that good info^^^^? or is it to your credit?
[
08-04-2005, 07:00 AM
#74
Donating Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 217
Originally Posted by ramberg
OK, I will work on the picture. The member asked a question and I searched for a answer and found this. Warren
[
[
Do you guys suggest buying the y-pipe now and just wait til the cattman exhaust comes out? Or do it all at once?
-MO-
08-04-2005, 12:02 PM
#75
Originally Posted by MObruin
Thanks a lot man, next time I will try to do more searching on my own. It just seemed appropriate to ask at the time.....plus it was midnight and I got lazy.
Do you guys suggest buying the y-pipe now and just wait til the cattman exhaust comes out? Or do it all at once?
-MO-
Do you guys suggest buying the y-pipe now and just wait til the cattman exhaust comes out? Or do it all at once?
-MO-
08-04-2005, 04:22 PM
#76
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Posts: 292
Originally Posted by Tek-Niq
it depends how much money you have at the time... y-pipe $300, cattman $800= $1100 total..
i agree.
$1100 is a lot of money for a cat back exhaust system. my friend purchased his hks hi power cat back system for his WRX for $529.
08-04-2005, 04:28 PM
#77
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The cat back part is about $800, since the CE y-pipe deletes the cat that is part of the stock y-pipe. The y pipe can be bought first since it replaces the stock piece and will bolt up to the stock exhaust or the CAtman exhaust. If you will buy headers, then u may want to hold off until they are made.
The WRX exhaust is probably cheaper due to the much higher demand for performance parts for WRX vs. the Max, which is too bad.
The WRX exhaust is probably cheaper due to the much higher demand for performance parts for WRX vs. the Max, which is too bad.
08-04-2005, 04:46 PM
#79
I'm actually getting a catback set up with the y-pipe eventually...
what I'm really waiting for is how that rear bumper Redmax is making going to come out, this will deside on what I get... cause if he makes a wide muffler opening I will go with the dual cattman, if he makes it with a round opening, I will do the greddy...
what I'm really waiting for is how that rear bumper Redmax is making going to come out, this will deside on what I get... cause if he makes a wide muffler opening I will go with the dual cattman, if he makes it with a round opening, I will do the greddy...
08-04-2005, 04:53 PM
#80
Senior Member
Join Date: Jul 2005
Posts: 137
Originally Posted by tototee999
i agree. but, $600 is a lot of difference...
Now the Greddy for starters is full stainless-steel. It also has two stainless mufflers. http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...50&postcount=9 From what I have seen so far, the Cattman will be the same setup, but probably better. See the difference in price. The HKS does not include a cat delete pipe, so the difference is really only $270. If you ask me, I'd pay that much for an extra muffler and FULL stainless-steel exhaust. Just my opinion.