E-manage Ultimate Rev limiter
#1
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Joined: Aug 2004
Posts: 5,437
From: Montreal, Qc, Canada
E-manage Ultimate Rev limiter
I am trying to raise the rev limiter but from revving it in neutral, and datalogging on the spot (no WOT runs on the street since my laptop has no battery), the fuel cut is actually 5948 RPMs. I suspected something was off because you know how our Tachometers are off? To go to 6500 you actually need to go to around 6800-6900 on the tach.
Well because of the Z33 6-speed tranny I have no speed sensor. Maybe that affects it? Even when driving around, the rev limiter feels very cut short, it makes sense that my cut is around 5950 because it seems to kick in around 6300-6400 on the tach. Ever seen anything like that? I have a 95 5-5speed Fed spec ECU, and like I said no speed sensor at all.
Because of my cams, the car is probably peaking around 6200-6400 or so. So the ECU is actually cutting the fuel BEFORE my power peaks! Feels very cut short.
I dont want to rush this and I want to understand it not to blow the motor. Like I said I have the WB hooked up and it runs a little on the rich side which I like since its safer. At any RPMs it will always be between 12.5:1 and 12.9:1.
The I/J input duration reads 13.4 ms at 5948 BTW. Those are 3.5 270 cc injectors (3.0 bar), but fuel pressure is at 50 psi so they are more like 330 cc. I could simply add 14.0 ms (a little extra to be safe, since I am probably peaking AFTER hence need a little more fuel).
So I need to raise the rev limiter to around 7000. My idea is a soft cut (i.e gradually pulling fuel from 7000 to 7300 or so). Ive followed DandyMax's writeup and it says to use the I/J Adj map. And it says it uses 50 rpm increments, but there is only a box for each 500. That doesnt sound right. There is obviously something I missed.
How can I start adding, say 14.0 ms at 5900 or 5950 exactly?
Well because of the Z33 6-speed tranny I have no speed sensor. Maybe that affects it? Even when driving around, the rev limiter feels very cut short, it makes sense that my cut is around 5950 because it seems to kick in around 6300-6400 on the tach. Ever seen anything like that? I have a 95 5-5speed Fed spec ECU, and like I said no speed sensor at all.
Because of my cams, the car is probably peaking around 6200-6400 or so. So the ECU is actually cutting the fuel BEFORE my power peaks! Feels very cut short.
I dont want to rush this and I want to understand it not to blow the motor. Like I said I have the WB hooked up and it runs a little on the rich side which I like since its safer. At any RPMs it will always be between 12.5:1 and 12.9:1.
The I/J input duration reads 13.4 ms at 5948 BTW. Those are 3.5 270 cc injectors (3.0 bar), but fuel pressure is at 50 psi so they are more like 330 cc. I could simply add 14.0 ms (a little extra to be safe, since I am probably peaking AFTER hence need a little more fuel).
So I need to raise the rev limiter to around 7000. My idea is a soft cut (i.e gradually pulling fuel from 7000 to 7300 or so). Ive followed DandyMax's writeup and it says to use the I/J Adj map. And it says it uses 50 rpm increments, but there is only a box for each 500. That doesnt sound right. There is obviously something I missed.
How can I start adding, say 14.0 ms at 5900 or 5950 exactly?
#3
It's strange, the limiter being that low. To do the rev limiter it's better to be in gear so you have an actual load on the car though. I wouldn't as a rule recommend doing it in neutral.
And IMO you don't need to add 14ms, if you're already at 12.x AFR at 5948 then all you need to enter is 13.4 minus whatever your input duration is AFTER the stock limiter (let's call this number X, it will probably be about 12.x) Study the screen shots in the writeup, and the example I/J map I gave, particularly the input/output duration lines before/after the cut.
To get to 50 rpm intervals, use the change scale button and then type in new rpm points, you don't have to use the default (every 500).
As for the rev limiter, I'd suggest adding "X" in at around 100 rpms, maybe 50, before the stock cut. So at 5850 or 5900. It's safer than creating a small lean spot after the stock limiter and (for the cars I've tuned) seems to produce a smoother result.
Also, if you used the AutoTune to get your AFR dialed in elsewhere, and you're happy with it, then turn that feature off while you do the rev limit. I'd leave it off too once I got the tune in place, no need to have it continually adjusting on you. If you add a mod or a change and need to retune then use it again at that point.
And IMO you don't need to add 14ms, if you're already at 12.x AFR at 5948 then all you need to enter is 13.4 minus whatever your input duration is AFTER the stock limiter (let's call this number X, it will probably be about 12.x) Study the screen shots in the writeup, and the example I/J map I gave, particularly the input/output duration lines before/after the cut.
To get to 50 rpm intervals, use the change scale button and then type in new rpm points, you don't have to use the default (every 500).
As for the rev limiter, I'd suggest adding "X" in at around 100 rpms, maybe 50, before the stock cut. So at 5850 or 5900. It's safer than creating a small lean spot after the stock limiter and (for the cars I've tuned) seems to produce a smoother result.
Also, if you used the AutoTune to get your AFR dialed in elsewhere, and you're happy with it, then turn that feature off while you do the rev limit. I'd leave it off too once I got the tune in place, no need to have it continually adjusting on you. If you add a mod or a change and need to retune then use it again at that point.
#4
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From: Montreal, Qc, Canada
Originally Posted by DandyMax
It's strange, the limiter being that low. To do the rev limiter it's better to be in gear so you have an actual load on the car though. I wouldn't as a rule recommend doing it in neutral.
And IMO you don't need to add 14ms, if you're already at 12.x AFR at 5948 then all you need to enter is 13.4 minus whatever your input duration is AFTER the stock limiter (let's call this number X, it will probably be about 12.x) Study the screen shots in the writeup, and the example I/J map I gave, particularly the input/output duration lines before/after the cut..
To get to 50 rpm intervals, use the change scale button and then type in new rpm points, you don't have to use the default (every 500).
As for the rev limiter, I'd suggest adding "X" in at around 100 rpms, maybe 50, before the stock cut. So at 5850 or 5900. It's safer than creating a small lean spot after the stock limiter and (for the cars I've tuned) seems to produce a smoother result.
Also, if you used the AutoTune to get your AFR dialed in elsewhere, and you're happy with it, then turn that feature off while you do the rev limit. I'd leave it off too once I got the tune in place, no need to have it continually adjusting on you. If you add a mod or a change and need to retune then use it again at that point.
And IMO you don't need to add 14ms, if you're already at 12.x AFR at 5948 then all you need to enter is 13.4 minus whatever your input duration is AFTER the stock limiter (let's call this number X, it will probably be about 12.x) Study the screen shots in the writeup, and the example I/J map I gave, particularly the input/output duration lines before/after the cut..
To get to 50 rpm intervals, use the change scale button and then type in new rpm points, you don't have to use the default (every 500).
As for the rev limiter, I'd suggest adding "X" in at around 100 rpms, maybe 50, before the stock cut. So at 5850 or 5900. It's safer than creating a small lean spot after the stock limiter and (for the cars I've tuned) seems to produce a smoother result.
Also, if you used the AutoTune to get your AFR dialed in elsewhere, and you're happy with it, then turn that feature off while you do the rev limit. I'd leave it off too once I got the tune in place, no need to have it continually adjusting on you. If you add a mod or a change and need to retune then use it again at that point.
Originally Posted by DandyMax
It's strange, the limiter being that low. To do the rev limiter it's better to be in gear so you have an actual load on the car though. I wouldn't as a rule recommend doing it in neutral.
Right now I cant ride around with the laptop its gotta be plugged into a wall. Best I can do is on the lift so its actually driving the wheels, but not a load AKA on the street pulling the weight of the car.
Originally Posted by DandyMax
And IMO you don't need to add 14ms, if you're already at 12.x AFR at 5948 then all you need to enter is 13.4 minus whatever your input duration is AFTER the stock limiter (let's call this number X, it will probably be about 12.x) Study the screen shots in the writeup, and the example I/J map I gave, particularly the input/output duration lines before/after the cut..
#5
Originally Posted by JClaw
The autotune will continue to apply the same AF after the stock rev limiter?
Originally Posted by JClaw
Why? Once I have succesfully advanced the rev limit all I need to watch out for is the AFR right? As long as the AFR stays in the 12s - if it leans out a bit at the stock rev limit will I see it on the WB while running the car? Just a slit second?
Right now I cant ride around with the laptop its gotta be plugged into a wall. Best I can do is on the lift so its actually driving the wheels, but not a load AKA on the street pulling the weight of the car.
Right now I cant ride around with the laptop its gotta be plugged into a wall. Best I can do is on the lift so its actually driving the wheels, but not a load AKA on the street pulling the weight of the car.
Originally Posted by JClaw
My point is that with the aftermarket cams set to immitate VTCs at full retard, and the short ram 2k2 intake (like krismax), I am definately peaking past 5950. It has to be 6200-6300 or so. So I need to add perhaps a little more. The worst it can do is cause me to run rich after, which the Autotune will take care of. Does the autotune AF override whatever additional fuel I add when raising the rev limit?
#6
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From: Montreal, Qc, Canada
Well it looks like I was wrong the rev limit is around 6500-6550 if you really romp on it which I dont like to do in neutral. But now the duration sometimes goes up to 28 ms Ive even seen 35 ms (for a split second). Even though I only add 12.0 from 6400 up. There are some spikes where it goes above 20 ms. But even when it spiked to 28 & 35 ms the AF was still above 10 (10.3-10.6 or so).
Does this have anything to do with setting the injector size into the EU. I wrote in FROM 259 cc TO 330 cc since fuel pressure is at 50 psi. Should I write in 259cc to 270 cc instead, regardless of fuel pressure?
Does this have anything to do with setting the injector size into the EU. I wrote in FROM 259 cc TO 330 cc since fuel pressure is at 50 psi. Should I write in 259cc to 270 cc instead, regardless of fuel pressure?
#7
Originally Posted by JClaw
Does this have anything to do with setting the injector size into the EU. I wrote in FROM 259 cc TO 330 cc since fuel pressure is at 50 psi. Should I write in 259cc to 270 cc instead, regardless of fuel pressure?
Just go buy a DC-AC power inverter for your car/laptop and do some road tuning... get a load on that engine.
#9
Originally Posted by JClaw
Well it looks like I was wrong the rev limit is around 6500-6550 if you really romp on it which I dont like to do in neutral. But now the duration sometimes goes up to 28 ms Ive even seen 35 ms (for a split second). Even though I only add 12.0 from 6400 up. There are some spikes where it goes above 20 ms. But even when it spiked to 28 & 35 ms the AF was still above 10 (10.3-10.6 or so).
Originally Posted by JClaw
Does this have anything to do with setting the injector size into the EU. I wrote in FROM 259 cc TO 330 cc since fuel pressure is at 50 psi. Should I write in 259cc to 270 cc instead, regardless of fuel pressure?
#10
Originally Posted by jmeister
Just go buy a DC-AC power inverter for your car/laptop and do some road tuning... get a load on that engine.
These work well...
http://www.powerstream.com/dc6.htm
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