I sent a question into SeaFoam support this morning about how long to leave it in the crankcase, and I got a not so useful reply. Here it is FYI:


Your question is easy.

The rule of thumb is " Change the oil when it is dirty "

The use of a gum / varnish melter ( Parts solvent ) in the oil will tend to make the oil dirty faster.

Because Sea Foam is a 100% pure petroleum product, you can put it in the crankcase ( only about 1/4 to 1/3 of the can - put the rest in the fuel ) and you can leave it there - but change it when it gets dirty.


A little vague - because "dirty" means they are going purely by the color of the oil...

 

Yes pretty vague as they can't just pick xxx miles. As all cars and all engines for that matter are a bit different.

 

Ok ill admit i havent used it in about 6 months when i fed it through the brake booster.
However if my memory served me correctly it was green in color and quite thin almost similar to the viscosity of water. I could be wrong on that and if its thicker let me know.

Im not saying that this will kill your engine and ruin your car. It actually may help a fair amount with your problem.

Why is this not all over the net? Theres no proof without UOA's and on the three boards i frequent i've never seen a UOA of a car with SF, or a VOA of SF.

Could you use this in your oil? of course. Will it help your problem? most likely it will.
Will it cause higher levels of wear in your engine? I would say yes, but i could be wrong.

My main point here is that although seafoam may help with your problem, there are, in my opinion, better options AutoRX would do the trick nicely i bet and since this isnt too much varnish 1 or mabye 2 treatments would fix the problem nicely i bet. However if it doesnt...Get your money back... Lube control may be able to do the same, If you choose to use LC there are a variety of routes you could use
1) LC Flush as detailed on Lubecontrol.com in the lab report(this would not be my choice as it would be comparable to a seafoam flush) However i would reccomend this over seafoam just based on the knowledge that i know more about this product and i trust it more.
2) This is what i would most likely do. I would buy a HEDO(Heavey duty engine oil) usually avaible in 40 weights. I would bet Delo or Delvac would be good choices. But if your serious about doing this i can check on BITOG for there reccomendations. I would use this and a good filter at your next oil change. i would also add 2,3,or 4 ounces of LC per quart of oil. also add 2 or 3 ounces per 1000 miles of driving. Change this after 3k miles(and mabye do the filter after 1500 or so) Im not really sure how many of these treatmants would be needed to get the engine nice and shiny again but you could take a look after each oil change under the oil cap. I wouldnt reccomend this for the winter, however depending on how much you drive you might be done by then or you could just go back to a good 30 weight with similar doses of LC. for the winter and back to HDEO for summer.

One question, does this engine burn oil? if so there is only one reccomendation i can make. AutoRX.

theres my reccomensations

 

I could care less about the cold viscosity its the operating viscosity that matters to me.(30wt-20wt is a big deal to me)

 

Thats a quite vague response......unless you do a UOA every few hundred miles you cant tell when your oil is dirty.........

 

I agree with you on this. There is no way they can give a fixed number. Too many variables.

 

However if you combine this info with the back of the can saying "WORKS AND PERFORMS INSTANTLY" then wouldnt that mean you should change you oil right away??

 

your right, however i would expect a range, for instance somthing like 5-20 minutes of idiling, or 100-200 miles of driving or 1000-3000 miles... somthing to use as reference

 

I also contend that seafoam won't reduce a viscosity of the operating either. If it probably won't reduce a 5 to a 0, then why mention a 30 to a 20?


Look, if you have some reference to documented damage from either the net or Bitorg, fine. But SF has been around for sometime. Bitorg as been around for some time. I would think Bitorg would have crutinized this product at least once or twice and that would have given you ample examples to make your case.

 

You won't see 5-20 of idling. That is an engine flush interval. Which SF is not and has been stated as not being as such.

 

BITOG may very well have some thread proving my point or dis proving my point, im just not going to look around for it. im also assuming theres a reason why it is pretty seldomly reccomended on BITOG......FRAM has been around a long time too... enough said.

 

When does the AutoRX work? 10 min after pouring it in? 10 miles? 50 miles?

 

I never said it wouldnt make a 5w into a 0w or somthing along those lines, it may very well do that, what i said is that i dont care if it does that. There is a large belief on BITOG that no oil is thin enough on start up, so again i could care less about the cold viscosity, its the operating temp viscosity that concerns me.

 

Where there you go. I'll just contend that you really have no basis for your opinion.

Fram has been around for a long time. BUT it's also been well documented that their standard filters are inferior. I can go right in this section and pull up a crappy Fram filter cutaway. But you cannot do the same with SF correct? Still enough said?

 

Sorry i was just throwing numbers out there, i meant to put 30k-50k in there at the end to show extremes of both sides, i just wanted to give examples of what they could've said

 

But didn't you contend that thin oil is bad? So thin oil is good during startup but not during operating temp conditions? You are not quite making sense.

I know what you mean. BUT what you are stating is not correct.

 

What you should be stating is no oil is thin enough AND still maintains the proper film thickness during start up.

 

Hard to answer question but i would bet total for a case like this combining all phases and using 2 bottles which may not be necessary in this case it would be about 7,000 miles, for a 1 bottle appilication it would be about 3500 miles.

 

So it takes 3500 miles for it to start working? Or does it start to work "instantly" after pouring it in?

 

Im not going to say thin oil is bad, i just dont like it in VQ's it has it uses but our engines like thicker 30 weights or thinner 40 weights.

Yes, during start up thin oil is good so it can flow quickly from the bottom of the pan to all the parts of the engine. If it was thick at start up all of the parts would be running for a longer time with the minimal protection that the film of oil left on parts provides..... this is why they make xW-x0 weight oils, so they are thinner on start up.........


And yes i know my wording probally sucks i tend to talk as if everyone knows what im talking about when not to many do......

 

yes i forgot to say "to a certain extent" like i always do when saying thicker is better, the same goes for thinner on start up.

 

How do you know the VQ likes a particular weight of oil??

 

It is constantly working but it works much slower than any other cleaner i know of. The real cleaning will be recognized in the rinse phase which is after 1500 miles. at the 1500 mile point you change the oil and put in a regular non synthetic oil and new filter w/o RX and you let the crap begin to come out of your engine..

 

UOA's UOA's UOA's UOA's and reccomandations.

 

Which you happen to have correct? I can't see how a minor difference in viscosities (especially broken down within the same viscosity class) could be consistantly shown to have a measurable benefical effect on all VQs of varing mileage and condition.

 

I specifically asked when it STARTS working.

 

got me ask frank..id bet the seccond its put in

 

A 30 weight oil could be a SAE30 or a SAE39 or anywhere in between either way it qualifies as a 30 weight.

 

May I see some data that supports that one particular specific viscosity is better than another? Especially if it's falls under the same 30 weight label?

 

Feel free to search BITOG esspescially in the UOA library try using "VQ" as your search.

Also in the main oil forum theres been a bunch of reccomendations saying that the VQ's like heavier oils....Most have been in reference to the VQ35 but the same general rule holds true for VQ30's as well
There was also a past thread on this site where somone (I believe silver 00 max) mentioned that VQ's would like GC because it is thicker

Please post any links you find if you dont mind.......

 

I was the one asking you.

 

I ran "seafoam" though their search engines. Couldn't find any real evidence of Seafoam being bad. The ONLY reference I saw was from Frank which didn't actually specifiy nout using seafoam but just suggested using products with the same chemcials as AutoRX.

There WERE comments that said Seafoam was bad. But again, they were mostly opinion and were unfounded. ie.. mixing up Seafoam and engine flush.

I even saw YOU post directly in a thread discussing Seafoam.

 

Not suprising, i've posted in many threads there

 

Asking me to find information for you?? my current rate is $175 an hour, however it is negotiable, let me know what works for you.

 

Again inocorrect. I was asking you to back up your statements.

 

Fair enough i suppose...
http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/...=002950#000000

Seccond post down.

I wont say i told you so......or will i

 

the whole thread is worth reading

 

Um yes. "bunch of Seafoam". How very scientific.

 

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/...=002896#000000

http://theoildrop.server101.com/ubb/...=002854#000000


Theres many more on there i just really dont feel like looking

The above quote from user "Darkdan" sums it all up in my view.

If he was talking about somthing to suck up with the intake to clean valves and such id reccomend either seafoam or distilled water, but thats what hes asking...

 

Copper and lead 3x normal averages???????????????????????????
Thats scientific enough for me. Mabye he added a little too much or somthing there is a possibility of that but 3x the wear on the bearings is far to large of a chance for me(and others i hope)to take on a car as good as this, if this were a winter 350$ beater id say go for it with seafoam, but this car deserves better.