Introducing: BlehmCo 12.6" Big Brake Kit!!
11-23-2003, 03:16 PM
#41
Originally Posted by IceY2K1
Any chance these fit under 5th gen. OEM SE 17" rims(6-spoke)?
Do you have a guesstimate on how much weight the heavier rotor/lighter 300Z caliper adds over stock?
Do you have a guesstimate on how much weight the heavier rotor/lighter 300Z caliper adds over stock?
I'm trying to get a person to do a test-fit on a 5th gen with stock 17" wheels this week. I'm not holding my breath on it fitting.
As for weight, the aluminum calipers are several pounds lighter than the OE, but the rotors are quite a bit heavier.
I'm not sure the actual weights on the whole kit, but if I were to guess, they are going to be a few pounds heavier than the OE stuff. But the improvement in braking performance will dramatically outweigh the weight penalty.
11-23-2003, 04:45 PM
#43
that's the ol' bait-n-switch for ya... 
I redid some of the numbers after I made that page and before I posted here.. forgot to change it both places. I've fixed the page so they're both the same. Sorry bout that.
I redid some of the numbers after I made that page and before I posted here.. forgot to change it both places. I've fixed the page so they're both the same. Sorry bout that.
11-23-2003, 08:15 PM
#45
'04 rotor dimensions are 12.6 x 1.1" (320 x 28mm)
5th gen rotors are 11 x 1" (280 x 26mm)
3rd and 4th gen are 11 x 0.86" (280 x 22mm)
Pretty substantial increase in heat capacity there!
5th gen rotors are 11 x 1" (280 x 26mm)
3rd and 4th gen are 11 x 0.86" (280 x 22mm)
Pretty substantial increase in heat capacity there!
11-24-2003, 02:55 PM
#47
I'm working on the 2-piece setup now. As soon as of my legal BS paperwork comes through so I can get dealer pricing, I'm going to send them an '04 rotor and have them make a 2-piece version of it, as well as a 12.375" rear rotor in 1 and 2 piece.
I'm warning you now, they won't be cheap... but will be very much worth it to have the 2-piece rotors. I've been running some on my car for about 6 months, and the rotors still look brand new, even after going through three sets of track pads and almost a full set of set of street pads on them. haven't had to turn them yet. VERY high quality stuff.
I'm warning you now, they won't be cheap... but will be very much worth it to have the 2-piece rotors. I've been running some on my car for about 6 months, and the rotors still look brand new, even after going through three sets of track pads and almost a full set of set of street pads on them. haven't had to turn them yet. VERY high quality stuff.
for the rears...
11-25-2003, 03:59 PM
#50
Thank you very much for the reply. I'll be keeping an eye on how the 17" rim fitting turns out.
I think the 2-piece rotors up front and 1-piece on the rear is the way to go to keep unsprung weight down for us SLOW 17" 5th gens.. We already know how much hp/tq we've lost from 24lb wheels, so adding any additional weight to the rotors would really hurt acceleration. However, warped rotors every 12K-24K is a PITA and probably worth the weight penalty.
Can't win! Additional high speed braking power would be my main interest though.
Awesome job Matt!
I think the 2-piece rotors up front and 1-piece on the rear is the way to go to keep unsprung weight down for us SLOW 17" 5th gens.. We already know how much hp/tq we've lost from 24lb wheels, so adding any additional weight to the rotors would really hurt acceleration. However, warped rotors every 12K-24K is a PITA and probably worth the weight penalty.
Can't win! Additional high speed braking power would be my main interest though.Awesome job Matt!
Originally Posted by Matt93SE
I'm trying to get a person to do a test-fit on a 5th gen with stock 17" wheels this week. I'm not holding my breath on it fitting.
As for weight, the aluminum calipers are several pounds lighter than the OE, but the rotors are quite a bit heavier.
I'm not sure the actual weights on the whole kit, but if I were to guess, they are going to be a few pounds heavier than the OE stuff. But the improvement in braking performance will dramatically outweigh the weight penalty.
As for weight, the aluminum calipers are several pounds lighter than the OE, but the rotors are quite a bit heavier.
I'm not sure the actual weights on the whole kit, but if I were to guess, they are going to be a few pounds heavier than the OE stuff. But the improvement in braking performance will dramatically outweigh the weight penalty.
11-27-2003, 07:55 AM
#51
the 2 piece rotors in the back will likely be lighter than 1-piece, but that depends on whether or not I will have to use steel mounting hats in the back or not. It's not recommended to use aluminum hats due to the parking brake and the possibility of warpage with the parking brake.
that's part of the fun part of the design process.. so many variables. trying to keep unsprung weight down, but reliability and warpage resistance.. always a tradeoff.
that's part of the fun part of the design process.. so many variables. trying to keep unsprung weight down, but reliability and warpage resistance.. always a tradeoff.
11-27-2003, 09:35 AM
#53
MaxRPM, you know...your comment is really not needed...I mean..if you can come up with a setup that is as economical as this while keeping the price down...please go to work, and we'll be expecting some results that are better than Matts. Funny thing is even if what you said is true (it might be) The braking will still improve on the max almost 4 fold.
11-27-2003, 10:30 AM
#55
Moderator who thinks he is better than us with his I30
iTrader: (8)
Join Date: May 2002
Posts: 9,335
Originally Posted by MaxRPM
Might be?, look at the picture, the proof is there. I'm just pointing out the obvious that no one else has seen.
Four fold? What is that based on? I want to see some facts not assumptions.
Four fold? What is that based on? I want to see some facts not assumptions.
11-27-2003, 11:31 AM
#57
"grabed like no other" spelling errors aside, it means nothing, it's all anecdotal evidence. How about some side by side comparisons with other professionally done kits, ideally at a race track like Willowsprings.
11-27-2003, 11:45 AM
#58
Looking at that picture closer worries me even more now. It's looks as if the pad and even the pistons hang over the rotor which would definately not be a good thing. Any pictures of a overhead view of the caliper?
11-27-2003, 02:51 PM
#60
Look at any oem rotor. The pad doesn't engage the whole rotor either. It just looks that way because the unused portion is rusted etc..
The pistons hit fine. If any of the pad overhangs, it only overhangs maybe 2mm max. Not a big deal.
You may HAVE a "real" BBK, but I don't know if you fully understand what this kit is all about.
You are right though. The 300z pads is not using as much as the rotor as it could BUT the 99% of the 300z pad is engaging the rotor.
The pistons hit fine. If any of the pad overhangs, it only overhangs maybe 2mm max. Not a big deal.
You may HAVE a "real" BBK, but I don't know if you fully understand what this kit is all about.
You are right though. The 300z pads is not using as much as the rotor as it could BUT the 99% of the 300z pad is engaging the rotor.
11-28-2003, 06:51 AM
#61
Originally Posted by MaxRPM
Like how the kit barely uses half the surface area of the rotor, what a hack job.
Just how the heck do YOU know the difference? can YOU put this "hack job" in numbers for me? Especially without even seeing the kit in person. Please quantify your "findings" from one or two pictures in real, concrete facts, instead of just blaspheming my hard work.
You're spouting useless comments about a minor issue-one that is on almost every BBK out there.
take a look at the kits offered out there, especially using real race parts.
Look at the caliper dimensions for the Wilwood superlite 6 caliper- one of the common calipers for a so-called 'professionally done' kit.
http://www.wilwood.com/products/cali...6/mounting.gif
Now look at the pads used on them:
http://www.wilwood.com/products/calipers/bsc6/pads.gif
Hmmmm.. what's this? the recommended rotors size from 11.75" to 13", yet they use the SAME PAD?!?! Oh No! there's going to be unswept surface area! I'll bet you consider that a hack job, no? (Then why does Wilwood spec the rotors to fit under there?!)
Let's look at an offering from Precision Brakes now. Since you know everything, I'm sure you don't need the link to their website, but here it is anyway. http://www.precisionbrakes.com/brake...lications.html You'd say these guys are pros, right? Heck, they'd better be. They're putting big brake kits on everything from $1000 beaters to Z06 Vettes.
Take a look at their Audi kits. Woah! They're using a 355mm rotor under a Superlite 6 caliper. (If you're metric-defficient, that's 14")
Under the Acura Legend list, they're using a 330mm rotor under a dynalite caliper. (That's 13" just in case your math is failing you right now.) again, they're using it on the Eclipse, Laser, and several other cars.
there's even a 355mm (14") rotor with a dynalite caliper on a Vette!
Now, since you know everything there is to know about brakes, these 'hack jobs' must be completely stupid and highly offensive to you, since simple math shows that they're using a 14" rotor on a caliper and pad that's SMALLER than the 300ZX caliper!! OH NO!!! why don't you go post blasphemous comments on their website, or in the Precision brakes threads here on .org.
Don't believe me about unswept area on these 'professionally done' kits?
Here's a picture of MY 13" rotors with Dynalite calipers.. Keep in mind, this 'professional' company is selling kits with bigger rotors and the same calipers.
http://www.mattblehm.com/pics/car/br...s/im000404.jpg
No unswept area there.
Here's just a couple more pics for you for some parting thoughts.
My 13" rotors after a full day of racing on a 1.8 mile road course that requires HEAVY braking. Notice how the iron is blued along the edges? yeah, they got warm. but what's that I see?! unswept area there too! Must be a hack job. so then I wonder what explains the fact I was outbraking modded M3s and spec Miatas all day.... in 110 degree heat!
http://www.mattblehm.com/pics/car_sh...3/im000418.jpg
and one more parting thought.. here's my OEM brakes still on the car.
http://www.mattblehm.com/pics/car/brakes/1.jpg
Woah! Lookie! Unswept area! I guess the engineers at Nissan are hacks too.
Good day, sir. Please don't post unsubstantiated insults in my thread again.
11-28-2003, 10:33 AM
#64
Jeff92se - Thanks for being mature and with your response.
I30tMikeD - No thanks for your silly useless comments, come back when you can bring some tech.
Matt93SE - Don't get your panties all tied up in a knot, learn to take some criticism.
Sorry but I still see your brake kit as a hack job. You took a bunch of miss matched parts had a bracket made to "fit" them together though not very well in my opinion and not very well thought out. My only positive view on them is that they're are not crossed drilled and the fact that they are bigger rotors will help.
The way I see it is, if you are going to go through the trouble of upgrading to bigger rotors why not use most of the surface area rather then what appears to only be 50-60% of it. Using all the area and thus a bigger pad will reduce pad wear and allow them to handle the heat much better then a smaller pad. It's great that you used the bigger 2004 Maxima rotor, nice and cheap and I know that is your goal with this kit. But you matched it with a 15+ year old caliper that was designed for 11" rotors and obviously does not cover as much of the rotor face as it should.
Furthermore as Jeff said, the pad overhangs the rotors, sorry but that is not "ok", to me this all equals hack job. Get a different caliper that uses most of the surface area and doesn't leave the pad overhanging the rotors and it will be acceptable, ya ya know it defeats your purpose. Here's an idea, why not use the 2004 caliper as well, I hardly think anyone on the board who never goes to the track (who's gone?, me then you and Cheston) will notice a difference between the two. Ahh wait no bling factor, the all important factor in braking performance.
As for Precision Brakes, no I don't consider them professionals. Anyone can start a company and piece together parts and make brake kits, and you proved it. When I think brakes I think AP Racing, Alcon and Stoptech. When I see Precision being used by in racing series like Speed's World Challenge then I'll be impressed by them, until then they're just another bling bling company.
As for M3 and Miatas at the track compared to your Maxima, ha what ever nice try. First off you were not "racing" you were lapping, completely different so don't even try to compare them. As for you out braking spec Miata race cars, nice try, should we go over to the spec Miata board and discuss your out braking with them? If you can out brake a Miata then you must be lapping them or at best staying with them, prove it and I'll give you my brake kit or buy you anew of your choice.
Next time you go to the track go when there are some races on and talk to the teams about what they think of Superlites, I'm sure you'll gets answers such as they're crap, they flex too much, maybe you'll get a they're ok but my new calipers (insert Stoptech, AP Racing, Alcon) are much better. while you are there check out to see who's brakes only use half the the rotor.....
For everyone else, go ahead buy the kit if you like, I am sure it will work, maybe even better then your stock ones. That doesn't mean they are worth the money. Hell this kit isn't even legal. Think of this, if the brakes fail and cause you to be in an at fault accident who is liable? You! And your insurance will not cover you. Does Matt have insurance to cover a multimillion dollar law suit and will it cover your a$s?.
Here are some pictures of real brake kits that show the way things should be....
http://web.ukonline.co.uk/pikeynet/s...era/brakes.jpg
http://www.thinkingdigital.com/maxrp...1/DSCN4099.JPG
http://www.2002bmw.com/rims/f355-brakes.jpg
http://www.spooky-brakes.nl/web_graphics/brakes.gif
Edit: Images changed to links.
I30tMikeD - No thanks for your silly useless comments, come back when you can bring some tech.
Matt93SE - Don't get your panties all tied up in a knot, learn to take some criticism.
Sorry but I still see your brake kit as a hack job. You took a bunch of miss matched parts had a bracket made to "fit" them together though not very well in my opinion and not very well thought out. My only positive view on them is that they're are not crossed drilled and the fact that they are bigger rotors will help.
The way I see it is, if you are going to go through the trouble of upgrading to bigger rotors why not use most of the surface area rather then what appears to only be 50-60% of it. Using all the area and thus a bigger pad will reduce pad wear and allow them to handle the heat much better then a smaller pad. It's great that you used the bigger 2004 Maxima rotor, nice and cheap and I know that is your goal with this kit. But you matched it with a 15+ year old caliper that was designed for 11" rotors and obviously does not cover as much of the rotor face as it should.
Furthermore as Jeff said, the pad overhangs the rotors, sorry but that is not "ok", to me this all equals hack job. Get a different caliper that uses most of the surface area and doesn't leave the pad overhanging the rotors and it will be acceptable, ya ya know it defeats your purpose. Here's an idea, why not use the 2004 caliper as well, I hardly think anyone on the board who never goes to the track (who's gone?, me then you and Cheston) will notice a difference between the two. Ahh wait no bling factor, the all important factor in braking performance.
As for Precision Brakes, no I don't consider them professionals. Anyone can start a company and piece together parts and make brake kits, and you proved it. When I think brakes I think AP Racing, Alcon and Stoptech. When I see Precision being used by in racing series like Speed's World Challenge then I'll be impressed by them, until then they're just another bling bling company.
As for M3 and Miatas at the track compared to your Maxima, ha what ever nice try. First off you were not "racing" you were lapping, completely different so don't even try to compare them. As for you out braking spec Miata race cars, nice try, should we go over to the spec Miata board and discuss your out braking with them? If you can out brake a Miata then you must be lapping them or at best staying with them, prove it and I'll give you my brake kit or buy you anew of your choice.
Next time you go to the track go when there are some races on and talk to the teams about what they think of Superlites, I'm sure you'll gets answers such as they're crap, they flex too much, maybe you'll get a they're ok but my new calipers (insert Stoptech, AP Racing, Alcon) are much better. while you are there check out to see who's brakes only use half the the rotor.....
For everyone else, go ahead buy the kit if you like, I am sure it will work, maybe even better then your stock ones. That doesn't mean they are worth the money. Hell this kit isn't even legal. Think of this, if the brakes fail and cause you to be in an at fault accident who is liable? You! And your insurance will not cover you. Does Matt have insurance to cover a multimillion dollar law suit and will it cover your a$s?.
Here are some pictures of real brake kits that show the way things should be....
http://web.ukonline.co.uk/pikeynet/s...era/brakes.jpg
http://www.thinkingdigital.com/maxrp...1/DSCN4099.JPG
http://www.2002bmw.com/rims/f355-brakes.jpg
http://www.spooky-brakes.nl/web_graphics/brakes.gif
Edit: Images changed to links.
11-28-2003, 11:22 AM
#65
Senior Member
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 193
All MaxRPM is expressing is his own opinion why is that such a big deal? You guys do have freddom of speech on this board right??? Ya okay so then let him speak his mind cause god knows he's letting you guys speach yours. As for the owned on maxima.org 
Be intelligent when responding to someone don't act like your four years old cause you'll only be viewed as a four year old. I understand that this is something that your are proud of accomplishing and I do give you credit for actually doing it but I would like to see a comparison or some states before I buy into this. Words are cheap action is everything. I have said my peice...
Be intelligent when responding to someone don't act like your four years old cause you'll only be viewed as a four year old. I understand that this is something that your are proud of accomplishing and I do give you credit for actually doing it but I would like to see a comparison or some states before I buy into this. Words are cheap action is everything. I have said my peice...
11-28-2003, 11:33 AM
#66
My panties are not in a wad. You came onto this forum and started attacking work that I have done, which is in turn a personal attack on me. would you respond jovially to someone that was publicly blasting you and your efforts?
I see your point on the quality factor, and will give you the fact that StopTech, AP, Alcon are MUCH better products than anything that is OE on a street car- but surprise, they're also >10x the price. You're getting what you pay for.
The kit I've put together offers >90% of that performance, for a fraction of the price. It's not intended for serious racers, but will still get the job done when needed for lapping days, auto X, street use, etc.. If people are that serious about racing, they won't be looking to me for affordable brakes. The market I'm working with is one that's looking for greater performance than the stock brakes, a larger rotor to fill up the wheel gap (bling factor.. oh ****, I'm a sellout. sue me), affordable, and easily maintainable. I'd like to see you try to find brake pads for an AP kit when you're 500 miles from your race shop and need new pads today. ain't gonna happen.
as for the Wilwoods, no they're NOT the best out there and I freely admit that. what they ARE is a quality product designed for someone who wants performance, but not the $3000 price tag. Are they good enough for what 99.9% of the people out there are doing with them? YES. Do you see them on 'real' race cars? Yes. I've seen them on everything from weekend autoXers to Winston Cup cars.
I would also venture to say that the Z32 calipers are in fact stronger and flex less than the wilwoods.. there's certainly a lot more structural material in them than the Wilwoods. The size and mass is more comparable to the Brembo, but the pad area, piston size, and other aspects could stand for improvement. I'm not a mechanical engineer, but I'm also not an idiot. I've used the Z32 calipers on other projects with good success and see no problems using them here.
I wouldn't try to market something that I didn't feel was a good product or unsafe for use. I've used a similar setup on my car for a couple of years under VERY heavy use without failure. I drive this car harder than 99% of the other members looking to buy this. If it works for me, it'll work for them. If it won't, then I will suggest they look somewhere else.
I would sincerely appreciate you taking any more of your 'concerns' to PM or email if you wish to discuss these with me further.
I see your point on the quality factor, and will give you the fact that StopTech, AP, Alcon are MUCH better products than anything that is OE on a street car- but surprise, they're also >10x the price. You're getting what you pay for.
The kit I've put together offers >90% of that performance, for a fraction of the price. It's not intended for serious racers, but will still get the job done when needed for lapping days, auto X, street use, etc.. If people are that serious about racing, they won't be looking to me for affordable brakes. The market I'm working with is one that's looking for greater performance than the stock brakes, a larger rotor to fill up the wheel gap (bling factor.. oh ****, I'm a sellout. sue me), affordable, and easily maintainable. I'd like to see you try to find brake pads for an AP kit when you're 500 miles from your race shop and need new pads today. ain't gonna happen.
as for the Wilwoods, no they're NOT the best out there and I freely admit that. what they ARE is a quality product designed for someone who wants performance, but not the $3000 price tag. Are they good enough for what 99.9% of the people out there are doing with them? YES. Do you see them on 'real' race cars? Yes. I've seen them on everything from weekend autoXers to Winston Cup cars.
I would also venture to say that the Z32 calipers are in fact stronger and flex less than the wilwoods.. there's certainly a lot more structural material in them than the Wilwoods. The size and mass is more comparable to the Brembo, but the pad area, piston size, and other aspects could stand for improvement. I'm not a mechanical engineer, but I'm also not an idiot. I've used the Z32 calipers on other projects with good success and see no problems using them here.
I wouldn't try to market something that I didn't feel was a good product or unsafe for use. I've used a similar setup on my car for a couple of years under VERY heavy use without failure. I drive this car harder than 99% of the other members looking to buy this. If it works for me, it'll work for them. If it won't, then I will suggest they look somewhere else.
I would sincerely appreciate you taking any more of your 'concerns' to PM or email if you wish to discuss these with me further.
11-28-2003, 11:45 AM
#67
Some more pictures for reference of how things should be on a properly designed brake system.
http://www.thinkingdigital.com/maxrp...3/DSCN4801.JPG
http://www.shotimes.com/Conv99/wilwood-coilover.jpg
http://www.coloaudio.com/Erik/pics/d60axle3.jpg
http://www.deltabaymustang.com/images/wilwoodF.jpg
Edit: images converted to links again.
http://www.thinkingdigital.com/maxrp...3/DSCN4801.JPG
http://www.shotimes.com/Conv99/wilwood-coilover.jpg
http://www.coloaudio.com/Erik/pics/d60axle3.jpg
http://www.deltabaymustang.com/images/wilwoodF.jpg
Edit: images converted to links again.
11-28-2003, 12:04 PM
#68
Matt, thanks for the more mature response, much better then your first one. Mr I30 could learn from this rather then acting like a 15yr old cheerleader.
I wasn't attacking you, don't be so insecure. Never did I say this system will not work, is not better then stock. I was just pointing out the obvious and calling it as I see it. I think it's cool that you did this, but there is still a lot of room for improvement. As I said the stock 04 calipers are probably a better idea as long as good pads can be found for them.
Your potential customers who may not know better, deserve to have things like this pointed out to them, we do live in a fair, open and just society right? It's no different then a car magazine pointing out things in a review of a car, granted they're more biased due to advertising, I'm not being biased.
I see no need for PM, these public forums were made for discussions like this and not to hide it. No one here hides opinions on other products from other people or companies then why should it be any different for you just because you are a moderator?
Having said that, back to my liability issue, you better make sure you have insurance. You're ****ed if something happens. These are brakes and peoples lives are at stake, it's not a CAI. Someone could easily screw up get hurt and sue you. Even if you brakes were really not at fault since they are not certified for road use then can point the fingers at you! You should know better then I, your country is very litigious.
Cheers....
I wasn't attacking you, don't be so insecure. Never did I say this system will not work, is not better then stock. I was just pointing out the obvious and calling it as I see it. I think it's cool that you did this, but there is still a lot of room for improvement. As I said the stock 04 calipers are probably a better idea as long as good pads can be found for them.
Your potential customers who may not know better, deserve to have things like this pointed out to them, we do live in a fair, open and just society right? It's no different then a car magazine pointing out things in a review of a car, granted they're more biased due to advertising, I'm not being biased.
I see no need for PM, these public forums were made for discussions like this and not to hide it. No one here hides opinions on other products from other people or companies then why should it be any different for you just because you are a moderator?
Having said that, back to my liability issue, you better make sure you have insurance. You're ****ed if something happens. These are brakes and peoples lives are at stake, it's not a CAI. Someone could easily screw up get hurt and sue you. Even if you brakes were really not at fault since they are not certified for road use then can point the fingers at you! You should know better then I, your country is very litigious.
Cheers....
11-28-2003, 12:10 PM
#70
Originally Posted by slammed95
I don't doubt that this kit would increase stopping power, but I really don't think that it gives 90% of the performance as a Brembo or AP Racing kit. I think brake fade will still be an issue, and these rotors are smaller. I don't think the 300zx caliper pistons match the size of Brembo's or AP's either.
90% of the performance for 1/3 the price? I doubt it.
90% of the performance for 1/3 the price? I doubt it.
Piston size has NOTHING to do with fade resistance. Fade resistance is a combination of heat capacity of the rotor (metal mass), temp resistance capabilities (compound) of the pads, and cooling ability of the rest of the system. (brake ducts, rotor ventilation, etc).
Using straight-vaned rotors you're losing a lot of cooling capability there, but again, this is NOT an all-out track setup. I would have no problems bolting this onto my car and spending a day lapping at the local road course. that's what I've intended this kit to be used for, not to be used by a competent SpeedWorld Challenge car. It will do the job for 99% of the people on this board. the other 1% won't bother looking here.
11-28-2003, 12:22 PM
#71
That's real lame Matt, deleting my threads, real lame and cowardly, I just lot all respect for you trying to cheat Maxima.org people from the truth. Anything for money eh....
MaxRPM, please check your PM. I deleted those posts in order to remove the mud-slinging that was starting. I have no problem addressing the issues here and will gladly respond to any questions or comments you may have. I openly invite you to post any comments you have reguarding the kit, but I don't have the desire for the middle school attitude and responses that were starting.
11-28-2003, 12:29 PM
#72
Hey I'm the one who pointed out flaws in your kit and you and the other moderators are the ones who started slinging $hit at me just because you can't take criticism. You deleted 10 plus posts when only a few of them (from your fellow moderators) had silly comments on them.
11-28-2003, 12:46 PM
#73
there were only two posts from each of us in the ones that were deleted which were worth keeping. again, I invite you to bring those subjects up in a professional manner, rather than calling this a "hack job" and I will respond in kind.. you started off with a personal insult, which did nothing for professionalism on either end, and truthfully invited the responses from the other members. When you attack someone else or a product, you should expect nothing less than to be attacked in return.
11-28-2003, 01:00 PM
#74
Your main point in the previous posts was the failure of the caliper to sweep the entire rotor surface... that is a limitation of this kit, but it is not one that I see as a problem for the uses this kit is designed for.
I have used a very similar setup on my car for several years, with no problems at all. Had the rotor hat extended out further toward the caliper, as they do on the Skyline rotors or the kits you showed pictures of, you wouldn't have even brought it up. Because it doesn't extend much past the hub itself, it has become an issue, albeit a minor one.
The only problems that can be forseen in that case is the uneven rotor surface temperature.
Due to the thickness of the rotor, that is not an problem, as there is more than enough material across that area to conduct heat away from the friction surface and disperse it evenly over the rotor.
when I have the 2-piece version of the rotor developed, I will address these issues and have the 'experts' voice their opinion on changing the construction of that particular rotor to suit the purpose better.
the other issue you pointed out is the piston/pad engagement on the rotor. You made comments as to a poor overlap of the rotor and pad, when in fact there is less than 0.5mm of the pad surface sticking over the top of the rotor- which will completely dissappear due to thermal expension as soon as the rotors are brought up to a temperature above normal street driving. It is an issue I have done my best to minimize, and feel this is more than suitable for 99% of the drivers out there.
the piston contact points are in the center of the friction material, and thus positioned well over the rotor surface. They do not extend past there and are not a problem.
May I also point out that the 13" VR-4 rotor upgrade used on the Z32 has not shown any problems with these issues, and the TTZ is even heavier and more merciless on the brakes than a Maxima. That is a worst-case possibility, and as long as they have no problems under such severe use as a tracked 300ZX, they will do more than fine on a Maxima.
I have used a very similar setup on my car for several years, with no problems at all. Had the rotor hat extended out further toward the caliper, as they do on the Skyline rotors or the kits you showed pictures of, you wouldn't have even brought it up. Because it doesn't extend much past the hub itself, it has become an issue, albeit a minor one.
The only problems that can be forseen in that case is the uneven rotor surface temperature.
Due to the thickness of the rotor, that is not an problem, as there is more than enough material across that area to conduct heat away from the friction surface and disperse it evenly over the rotor.
when I have the 2-piece version of the rotor developed, I will address these issues and have the 'experts' voice their opinion on changing the construction of that particular rotor to suit the purpose better.
the other issue you pointed out is the piston/pad engagement on the rotor. You made comments as to a poor overlap of the rotor and pad, when in fact there is less than 0.5mm of the pad surface sticking over the top of the rotor- which will completely dissappear due to thermal expension as soon as the rotors are brought up to a temperature above normal street driving. It is an issue I have done my best to minimize, and feel this is more than suitable for 99% of the drivers out there.
the piston contact points are in the center of the friction material, and thus positioned well over the rotor surface. They do not extend past there and are not a problem.
May I also point out that the 13" VR-4 rotor upgrade used on the Z32 has not shown any problems with these issues, and the TTZ is even heavier and more merciless on the brakes than a Maxima. That is a worst-case possibility, and as long as they have no problems under such severe use as a tracked 300ZX, they will do more than fine on a Maxima.
11-28-2003, 01:26 PM
#75
Originally Posted by Matt93SE
Your main point in the previous posts was the failure of the caliper to sweep the entire rotor surface... that is a limitation of this kit, but it is not one that I see as a problem for the uses this kit is designed for.
I have used a very similar setup on my car for several years, with no problems at all. Had the rotor hat extended out further toward the caliper, as they do on the Skyline rotors or the kits you showed pictures of, you wouldn't have even brought it up. Because it doesn't extend much past the hub itself, it has become an issue, albeit a minor one.
The only problems that can be forseen in that case is the uneven rotor surface temperature.
Due to the thickness of the rotor, that is not an problem, as there is more than enough material across that area to conduct heat away from the friction surface and disperse it evenly over the rotor.
when I have the 2-piece version of the rotor developed, I will address these issues and have the 'experts' voice their opinion on changing the construction of that particular rotor to suit the purpose better.
the other issue you pointed out is the piston/pad engagement on the rotor. You made comments as to a poor overlap of the rotor and pad, when in fact there is less than 0.5mm of the pad surface sticking over the top of the rotor- which will completely dissappear due to thermal expension as soon as the rotors are brought up to a temperature above normal street driving. It is an issue I have done my best to minimize, and feel this is more than suitable for 99% of the drivers out there.
the piston contact points are in the center of the friction material, and thus positioned well over the rotor surface. They do not extend past there and are not a problem.
May I also point out that the 13" VR-4 rotor upgrade used on the Z32 has not shown any problems with these issues, and the TTZ is even heavier and more merciless on the brakes than a Maxima. That is a worst-case possibility, and as long as they have no problems under such severe use as a tracked 300ZX, they will do more than fine on a Maxima.
I have used a very similar setup on my car for several years, with no problems at all. Had the rotor hat extended out further toward the caliper, as they do on the Skyline rotors or the kits you showed pictures of, you wouldn't have even brought it up. Because it doesn't extend much past the hub itself, it has become an issue, albeit a minor one.
The only problems that can be forseen in that case is the uneven rotor surface temperature.
Due to the thickness of the rotor, that is not an problem, as there is more than enough material across that area to conduct heat away from the friction surface and disperse it evenly over the rotor.
when I have the 2-piece version of the rotor developed, I will address these issues and have the 'experts' voice their opinion on changing the construction of that particular rotor to suit the purpose better.
the other issue you pointed out is the piston/pad engagement on the rotor. You made comments as to a poor overlap of the rotor and pad, when in fact there is less than 0.5mm of the pad surface sticking over the top of the rotor- which will completely dissappear due to thermal expension as soon as the rotors are brought up to a temperature above normal street driving. It is an issue I have done my best to minimize, and feel this is more than suitable for 99% of the drivers out there.
the piston contact points are in the center of the friction material, and thus positioned well over the rotor surface. They do not extend past there and are not a problem.
May I also point out that the 13" VR-4 rotor upgrade used on the Z32 has not shown any problems with these issues, and the TTZ is even heavier and more merciless on the brakes than a Maxima. That is a worst-case possibility, and as long as they have no problems under such severe use as a tracked 300ZX, they will do more than fine on a Maxima.
I have read the deleted posts and understood the points that MAXRPM was making, and points that you and the other mods were making, which until this post did not really made any sense.
Its ignorant to delete the message and write something in reply.
But overall I see your point about your brake kit which I do agree but I also agree on MAXRPM's final point about the 'what if' brake failure scenario.
Good luck!
Peter
11-28-2003, 01:53 PM
#76
I'll admit that deleting them was a mistake. I shouldn't have done it, and don't know what I was thinking when I did. (I'll blame it on the turkey. I'm still groggy from yesterday!)
the liability issue is something I am currently working on in setting up an LLC, and as with all other brake kits out there, they are provided as-is, with no warranties or guarantees.
http://www.fastbrakes.com/ordering/disclaimer.php
My website has a similar disclaimer, in layman's terms, until the legal paperwork is complete.
http://www.mattblehm.com/contact.html
the liability issue is something I am currently working on in setting up an LLC, and as with all other brake kits out there, they are provided as-is, with no warranties or guarantees.
http://www.fastbrakes.com/ordering/disclaimer.php
My website has a similar disclaimer, in layman's terms, until the legal paperwork is complete.
http://www.mattblehm.com/contact.html
11-28-2003, 05:35 PM
#78
the clearance depends HIGHLY on the wheel. I would venture to say that most 17s will have the diameter clearance, but the spokes may not.
same goes for 16s, but it's going to be even closer. I can tell you for a fact that my 16" Enkei RS-Evolution wheels won't fit.. but I can tell you that the Z32 wheels will fit at least for the diameter.
(Look at the site with the 13" VR-4 rotor upgrade on a Z32.. With 10mm spacers for spoke clearance, the kit fits under the 16" wheels.).
So I think I can safely say they'll fit under the diameter, but I can't make any definite assumptions on the spoke clearance until I try a wheel on the car to make sure.
I'd certainly like to say they will fit most 16s, but that's a very optimistic assumption.
I'll be very forgiving on returns in the case people want to try to fit them under their wheels..
same goes for 16s, but it's going to be even closer. I can tell you for a fact that my 16" Enkei RS-Evolution wheels won't fit.. but I can tell you that the Z32 wheels will fit at least for the diameter.
(Look at the site with the 13" VR-4 rotor upgrade on a Z32.. With 10mm spacers for spoke clearance, the kit fits under the 16" wheels.).
So I think I can safely say they'll fit under the diameter, but I can't make any definite assumptions on the spoke clearance until I try a wheel on the car to make sure.
I'd certainly like to say they will fit most 16s, but that's a very optimistic assumption.
I'll be very forgiving on returns in the case people want to try to fit them under their wheels..
11-30-2003, 05:22 PM
#79
Update: I'm finally back home from the Holiday... Undeleted all the mudslinging threads above, since I couldn't do it on my computer at Dad's...
As for the project: Brackets are at the machine shop again. should have the final prototype by the end of the week and have the kit running. Brake lines are in the mail. Should be here this week also. everything else is on-hand, and I plan to have it bolted together and running on the guinea pig by the end of the week.
As for the project: Brackets are at the machine shop again. should have the final prototype by the end of the week and have the kit running. Brake lines are in the mail. Should be here this week also. everything else is on-hand, and I plan to have it bolted together and running on the guinea pig by the end of the week.
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