How To Go Faster in your Auto Magic! Testing!
05-21-2001, 04:35 AM
#1
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 807
Ok, I ran over 14 times at the track this last Friday, and 10 more the Friday before. So lots of testing was done for you guys 
OK, for my self, but hey…I’m sharing.
I always figured, just putting it in D and flooring it with a good reaction time would be best. Boy was I wrong. I was also getting depressed as the POP intake didn’t seem to help much, Figured that one out too!
On the track, Power Shifting gave me 4 to 4.7 tenths of a second faster with OD off then just D and OD on, repeatedly and consecutively! Sounds crazy, but is true! I ran over 14 times, and tested equal number of times in just D.
It does shift about a half a second to a second after you actually move the lever, so give your self a white line or two before red line when you up shift, and it will shift right on red without hitting the limiter, which will cause the car to jerk a little, cut fuel, and loose some time. Do a few runs and you'll get it just right and see what I'm talkingn about. The few extra hundred RPM helps a lot!
Second. Stock, as far as intake setup, I found just flooring it was faster then torque braking a lot or even a little. So when I got my JWT POP intake, I did the same thing, and it ran slower? So after numerous times, I have found that if you have an intake, and an Auto, Torque braking very slightly above 1000RPM gave the best times. Even though doing this with the stock intake box didn’t help, and was a little slower. Again I tried all these things over and over.
So, because launching higher then idle was better, I tried 1.8 to 1.9K torgue braking (Hard on your brakes) but it ran much slower, over 3 tenths. It wasn’t a traction issues as I have the Viscous and it didn’t spin out much more doing this, just something in the car makes it slower when launching an AutoMagic that high. Guess I have to leave that high RPM launch to the manual boys : ) Tried 1.1K again, and found much better results over and over as I did before.
My guess is with the extra volume of the Intake, you want to charge it slightly with incoming air right before take off, and this is why launching at 1 to 1.2K worked best, but nothing higher, maybe due to computer intervention or other issues making luaching any higher not helpful?
So, for optimal times in an AutoMagic with a POP or CAI, Turn OD off, shift down to first, throttle brake to 1.1 to 1.2K, take off and hold on! Shift up to second a tick or two before red line, and the same for 3rd. Everyone at the track was shocked to see me drop almost 5 tenths without doing anything to car, and wondered what was up! Needless to say the difference made me very happy.
OK, for my self, but hey…I’m sharing. I always figured, just putting it in D and flooring it with a good reaction time would be best. Boy was I wrong. I was also getting depressed as the POP intake didn’t seem to help much, Figured that one out too!
On the track, Power Shifting gave me 4 to 4.7 tenths of a second faster with OD off then just D and OD on, repeatedly and consecutively! Sounds crazy, but is true! I ran over 14 times, and tested equal number of times in just D.
It does shift about a half a second to a second after you actually move the lever, so give your self a white line or two before red line when you up shift, and it will shift right on red without hitting the limiter, which will cause the car to jerk a little, cut fuel, and loose some time. Do a few runs and you'll get it just right and see what I'm talkingn about. The few extra hundred RPM helps a lot!
Second. Stock, as far as intake setup, I found just flooring it was faster then torque braking a lot or even a little. So when I got my JWT POP intake, I did the same thing, and it ran slower? So after numerous times, I have found that if you have an intake, and an Auto, Torque braking very slightly above 1000RPM gave the best times. Even though doing this with the stock intake box didn’t help, and was a little slower. Again I tried all these things over and over.
So, because launching higher then idle was better, I tried 1.8 to 1.9K torgue braking (Hard on your brakes) but it ran much slower, over 3 tenths. It wasn’t a traction issues as I have the Viscous and it didn’t spin out much more doing this, just something in the car makes it slower when launching an AutoMagic that high. Guess I have to leave that high RPM launch to the manual boys : ) Tried 1.1K again, and found much better results over and over as I did before.
My guess is with the extra volume of the Intake, you want to charge it slightly with incoming air right before take off, and this is why launching at 1 to 1.2K worked best, but nothing higher, maybe due to computer intervention or other issues making luaching any higher not helpful?
So, for optimal times in an AutoMagic with a POP or CAI, Turn OD off, shift down to first, throttle brake to 1.1 to 1.2K, take off and hold on! Shift up to second a tick or two before red line, and the same for 3rd. Everyone at the track was shocked to see me drop almost 5 tenths without doing anything to car, and wondered what was up! Needless to say the difference made me very happy.
05-21-2001, 08:46 AM
#4
Originally posted by TexMaximum
Ok, I ran over 14 times at the track this last Friday, and 10 more the Friday before. So lots of testing was done for you guys OK, for my self, but hey…I’m sharing.
I always figured, just putting it in D and flooring it with a good reaction time would be best. Boy was I wrong. I was also getting depressed as the POP intake didn’t seem to help much, Figured that one out too!
On the track, Power Shifting gave me 4 to 4.7 tenths of a second faster with OD off then just D and OD on, repeatedly and consecutively! Sounds crazy, but is true! I ran over 14 times, and tested equal number of times in just D.
It does shift about a half a second to a second after you actually move the lever, so give your self a white line or two before red line when you up shift, and it will shift right on red without hitting the limiter, which will cause the car to jerk a little, cut fuel, and loose some time. Do a few runs and you'll get it just right and see what I'm talkingn about. The few extra hundred RPM helps a lot!
Second. Stock, as far as intake setup, I found just flooring it was faster then torque braking a lot or even a little. So when I got my JWT POP intake, I did the same thing, and it ran slower? So after numerous times, I have found that if you have an intake, and an Auto, Torque braking very slightly above 1000RPM gave the best times. Even though doing this with the stock intake box didn’t help, and was a little slower. Again I tried all these things over and over.
So, because launching higher then idle was better, I tried 1.8 to 1.9K torgue braking (Hard on your brakes) but it ran much slower, over 3 tenths. It wasn’t a traction issues as I have the Viscous and it didn’t spin out much more doing this, just something in the car makes it slower when launching an AutoMagic that high. Guess I have to leave that high RPM launch to the manual boys : ) Tried 1.1K again, and found much better results over and over as I did before.
My guess is with the extra volume of the Intake, you want to charge it slightly with incoming air right before take off, and this is why launching at 1 to 1.2K worked best, but nothing higher, maybe due to computer intervention or other issues making luaching any higher not helpful?
So, for optimal times in an AutoMagic with a POP or CAI, Turn OD off, shift down to first, throttle brake to 1.1 to 1.2K, take off and hold on! Shift up to second a tick or two before red line, and the same for 3rd. Everyone at the track was shocked to see me drop almost 5 tenths without doing anything to car, and wondered what was up! Needless to say the difference made me very happy.
Ok, I ran over 14 times at the track this last Friday, and 10 more the Friday before. So lots of testing was done for you guys
OK, for my self, but hey…I’m sharing. I always figured, just putting it in D and flooring it with a good reaction time would be best. Boy was I wrong. I was also getting depressed as the POP intake didn’t seem to help much, Figured that one out too!
On the track, Power Shifting gave me 4 to 4.7 tenths of a second faster with OD off then just D and OD on, repeatedly and consecutively! Sounds crazy, but is true! I ran over 14 times, and tested equal number of times in just D.
It does shift about a half a second to a second after you actually move the lever, so give your self a white line or two before red line when you up shift, and it will shift right on red without hitting the limiter, which will cause the car to jerk a little, cut fuel, and loose some time. Do a few runs and you'll get it just right and see what I'm talkingn about. The few extra hundred RPM helps a lot!
Second. Stock, as far as intake setup, I found just flooring it was faster then torque braking a lot or even a little. So when I got my JWT POP intake, I did the same thing, and it ran slower? So after numerous times, I have found that if you have an intake, and an Auto, Torque braking very slightly above 1000RPM gave the best times. Even though doing this with the stock intake box didn’t help, and was a little slower. Again I tried all these things over and over.
So, because launching higher then idle was better, I tried 1.8 to 1.9K torgue braking (Hard on your brakes) but it ran much slower, over 3 tenths. It wasn’t a traction issues as I have the Viscous and it didn’t spin out much more doing this, just something in the car makes it slower when launching an AutoMagic that high. Guess I have to leave that high RPM launch to the manual boys : ) Tried 1.1K again, and found much better results over and over as I did before.
My guess is with the extra volume of the Intake, you want to charge it slightly with incoming air right before take off, and this is why launching at 1 to 1.2K worked best, but nothing higher, maybe due to computer intervention or other issues making luaching any higher not helpful?
So, for optimal times in an AutoMagic with a POP or CAI, Turn OD off, shift down to first, throttle brake to 1.1 to 1.2K, take off and hold on! Shift up to second a tick or two before red line, and the same for 3rd. Everyone at the track was shocked to see me drop almost 5 tenths without doing anything to car, and wondered what was up! Needless to say the difference made me very happy.
05-21-2001, 11:04 AM
#6
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: NJ
Posts: 5,630
I hate to say this but i do not agree on this. Out of the past 6 months of dragging. I have gotten better times when i leave my car in "D". I do also have the VB mod. There is more lag when you manually shift vs letting the car shift on its own. I do leave OD off though.
As far as not power braking it. I have better results when i launch at 1.8k-2rpm vs just romping on it. I have tested this a few times too. I have seen up to a .4 dropped off my time.
This is just what i have noticed from taking notes at the track during test and tune. You may not agree but i figured someone from a diff opinion should step up. BTW< i am not trying to flame.
With NOS, i ahve yet to test this. I will ahve to see within the next 2 weeks.
As far as not power braking it. I have better results when i launch at 1.8k-2rpm vs just romping on it. I have tested this a few times too. I have seen up to a .4 dropped off my time.
This is just what i have noticed from taking notes at the track during test and tune. You may not agree but i figured someone from a diff opinion should step up. BTW< i am not trying to flame.
With NOS, i ahve yet to test this. I will ahve to see within the next 2 weeks.
05-21-2001, 12:02 PM
#7
Originally posted by Synki
I hate to say this but i do not agree on this. Out of the past 6 months of dragging. I have gotten better times when i leave my car in "D". I do also have the VB mod. There is more lag when you manually shift vs letting the car shift on its own. I do leave OD off though.
I hate to say this but i do not agree on this. Out of the past 6 months of dragging. I have gotten better times when i leave my car in "D". I do also have the VB mod. There is more lag when you manually shift vs letting the car shift on its own. I do leave OD off though.
05-21-2001, 12:26 PM
#8
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 1,915
Yes... talking about 5th gen here, not 4th gen. I don't think shifting an auto helps on a 4th gen. That 5th gen intake makes more power on top and the tranny shifts before you hit that power range.
Originally posted by Weasel
Remember though, the 5th gen's intake manifold gives it far better power at high rpms than the 4th gen. While the auto tranny shifts at the same rpm for both, in the 4th gen its right in the meat of the powerband. In a 5th gen, the car makes a lot of power above where the tranny would ordinarily shift due to the revised breathing. That's why the shift points make more sense in a 4th gen than a 5th gen.
Remember though, the 5th gen's intake manifold gives it far better power at high rpms than the 4th gen. While the auto tranny shifts at the same rpm for both, in the 4th gen its right in the meat of the powerband. In a 5th gen, the car makes a lot of power above where the tranny would ordinarily shift due to the revised breathing. That's why the shift points make more sense in a 4th gen than a 5th gen.
05-21-2001, 12:41 PM
#9
Senior Member
Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 807
Anyhow, thought I'd share. I've tried so many times, that I promise, if you have a 5th gen Auto, you will run faster this way. I never tried it in a 4th gen Auto.Not sure if this is bad for the tranny, but I figure this is why I have 5 year coverage.
05-21-2001, 01:30 PM
#10
Originally posted by Synki
I hate to say this but i do not agree on this. Out of the past 6 months of dragging. I have gotten better times when i leave my car in "D". I do also have the VB mod. There is more lag when you manually shift vs letting the car shift on its own. I do leave OD off though.
As far as not power braking it. I have better results when i launch at 1.8k-2rpm vs just romping on it. I have tested this a few times too. I have seen up to a .4 dropped off my time.
This is just what i have noticed from taking notes at the track during test and tune. You may not agree but i figured someone from a diff opinion should step up. BTW< i am not trying to flame.
With NOS, i ahve yet to test this. I will ahve to see within the next 2 weeks.
I hate to say this but i do not agree on this. Out of the past 6 months of dragging. I have gotten better times when i leave my car in "D". I do also have the VB mod. There is more lag when you manually shift vs letting the car shift on its own. I do leave OD off though.
As far as not power braking it. I have better results when i launch at 1.8k-2rpm vs just romping on it. I have tested this a few times too. I have seen up to a .4 dropped off my time.
This is just what i have noticed from taking notes at the track during test and tune. You may not agree but i figured someone from a diff opinion should step up. BTW< i am not trying to flame.
With NOS, i ahve yet to test this. I will ahve to see within the next 2 weeks.
05-21-2001, 01:51 PM
#11
Not DAVEB the parts guy
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 8,555
Have you guys ever tried "flash stalling" the convertor? Powerbraking is very bad for your tranny because you build ton of heat in the tranny and in the engine. Flash stalling is much better on the tranny and usually nets much better ets. Powerbraking stalls up the converter too long. Flash stalling stall the converter quickly and almost a rubber-like effect. It also generates much less heat.
Flash stalling is this. Once you stage put your foot on the brake and put your foot over the gas, but not touching it. Right before the 2nd amber, mash the brake hard, mash the gas, and let go of the brakes. This should take no more than 1 second to do. Should see your rpms jump. The hard part is finding the right amount of gas to use at first.
Dave
Flash stalling is this. Once you stage put your foot on the brake and put your foot over the gas, but not touching it. Right before the 2nd amber, mash the brake hard, mash the gas, and let go of the brakes. This should take no more than 1 second to do. Should see your rpms jump. The hard part is finding the right amount of gas to use at first.
Dave
05-21-2001, 02:31 PM
#12
Yup!!!
I tried flas stalling at the track a few months back, took .3-.4 off my previous time! I just stomp it and let it fly, with just an intake and "flash stalling", my VG auto went from 17.1 to a 16.7....it might still be high 16's but for a VG auto I call that results!! 
Originally posted by Dave B
Flash stalling is this. Once you stage put your foot on the brake and put your foot over the gas, but not touching it. Right before the 2nd amber, mash the brake hard, mash the gas, and let go of the brakes. This should take no more than 1 second to do. Should see your rpms jump. The hard part is finding the right amount of gas to use at first.
Dave
Flash stalling is this. Once you stage put your foot on the brake and put your foot over the gas, but not touching it. Right before the 2nd amber, mash the brake hard, mash the gas, and let go of the brakes. This should take no more than 1 second to do. Should see your rpms jump. The hard part is finding the right amount of gas to use at first.
Dave
05-21-2001, 03:20 PM
#13
Senior Member
Join Date: Sep 2000
Location: NJ
Posts: 5,630
I guess you guys are right. I have never dragged a 5th gen so you would know about that better then me. Sorry Ten, i didnt realize you had a 5th gen. I was reading too fast, i was on break and trying to read as much as possible.
Dave B-thanks for the tip, i will def try that next time. I always brake torque.
Costco-Yes, i run with my chrome rims. The have been running consistent 15.5's@88.xx mph with my chromies, spare, and CAI. BTW, i am auto. Havent dragged with the new toys yet.
Dave B-thanks for the tip, i will def try that next time. I always brake torque.
Costco-Yes, i run with my chrome rims. The have been running consistent 15.5's@88.xx mph with my chromies, spare, and CAI. BTW, i am auto. Havent dragged with the new toys yet.
05-21-2001, 03:30 PM
#14
synki: you are reading too fast again! Tex has a 2nd generation I30 
I think the reason you can launch at high 1000 rpm is yr tires are too heavy so tehy don't spin much.For the rest of us with lightweight 15/16 low 1000rpm brake torque or flash stalling would do it.
I think the reason you can launch at high 1000 rpm is yr tires are too heavy so tehy don't spin much.For the rest of us with lightweight 15/16 low 1000rpm brake torque or flash stalling would do it.
05-21-2001, 06:02 PM
#15
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 807
Maybe its just me, but I don't see how this flash thing is much diff. then torque braking.
I don't sit there and hold it for the entire time, just right before green?
I'll try this and if I can tell what your talking about Dave
Yes, I raced with those rims, don't think these 17" alloys are that heavy though?
I don't sit there and hold it for the entire time, just right before green?
I'll try this and if I can tell what your talking about Dave
Yes, I raced with those rims, don't think these 17" alloys are that heavy though?
05-21-2001, 06:50 PM
#16
Originally posted by TexMaximum
Maybe its just me, but I don't see how this flash thing is much diff. then torque braking.
I don't sit there and hold it for the entire time, just right before green?
I'll try this and if I can tell what your talking about Dave
Yes, I raced with those rims, don't think these 17" alloys are that heavy though?
Maybe its just me, but I don't see how this flash thing is much diff. then torque braking.
I don't sit there and hold it for the entire time, just right before green?
I'll try this and if I can tell what your talking about Dave
Yes, I raced with those rims, don't think these 17" alloys are that heavy though?
05-21-2001, 06:53 PM
#17
Well....
brake torque= holding brake and giving it partial gas up to a certain RPM and then releasing the brake and pressing the gas fully--------> very bad for trans if RPMs are held too high, too long!!!!!
flash stall= hold brake, place foot OVER gas, but DO NOT press at all, when ready release brake and press gas SIMULTANEOUSLY---> a lot safer on the trans than torque braking
personally I've found that brake torquing gives too much wheelspin, and from my last track experience, the "flash stall and stomp" method yeilded better results!
flash stall= hold brake, place foot OVER gas, but DO NOT press at all, when ready release brake and press gas SIMULTANEOUSLY---> a lot safer on the trans than torque braking
personally I've found that brake torquing gives too much wheelspin, and from my last track experience, the "flash stall and stomp"
method yeilded better results!
Originally posted by TexMaximum
Maybe its just me, but I don't see how this flash thing is much diff. then torque braking.
Maybe its just me, but I don't see how this flash thing is much diff. then torque braking.
05-21-2001, 08:59 PM
#18
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Thread Starter
Join Date: Sep 2000
Posts: 807
Re: Well....
Ok, I tried it and understand now. I see how it can be safer, but how will it give greater performance other then traction? I get more wheel spin doing the flash thing then torgue braking? I noticed it revs up faster though, thus more power causing more wheel spin (ever so slightly) more, but how and why is my question if anyone knows. How does it make the car faster?
05-21-2001, 09:05 PM
#19
Yeah...
I think Dave also mentioned that you have to gauge how much gas you give it off the line when flash stalling....since your VQ's have way more torque than my VG so I guess it might result in more significant wheel spin.... 
Originally posted by TexMaximum
Ok, I tried it and understand now. I see how it can be safer, but how will it give greater performance other then traction? I get more wheel spin doing the flash thing then torgue braking? I noticed it revs up faster though, thus more power causing more wheel spin (ever so slightly) more, but how and why is my question if anyone knows. How does it make the car faster?
Ok, I tried it and understand now. I see how it can be safer, but how will it give greater performance other then traction? I get more wheel spin doing the flash thing then torgue braking? I noticed it revs up faster though, thus more power causing more wheel spin (ever so slightly) more, but how and why is my question if anyone knows. How does it make the car faster?
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