Nitrous Discuss dry, wet, and direct port nitrous setups. How many shots can you handle?

Something I'm thinking about doing...

Old 06-15-2010, 04:10 PM
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I can do 9-5!
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Old 06-16-2010, 07:20 AM
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Originally Posted by SonicDust187 View Post
I can do 9-5!

OK - 9 PM to 5 AM needs covered, so that can work. Only thing, that's a hella commute for you - and I don't pay mileage..

After listening to you guys, I feel ever so much better about parking my trailer there again.
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Old 10-30-2010, 06:50 PM
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Some more elbow spray..

I did install the complete elbow spray stage. Here are some pix.



Before purge line was installed:



Front plugs after some street spraying. 91 octane - looks weird.



Purge outlet.

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Old 10-30-2010, 06:58 PM
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Some work on a direct-port installation

Parts are from Inductions solutions - the annular injector and mounting bungs, at this point.












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Old 10-30-2010, 11:01 PM
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Looks good man!

When are you taking it to KID? lol
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Old 10-31-2010, 04:53 AM
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whats the bar going across the uim
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Old 10-31-2010, 02:53 PM
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Originally Posted by t6378tp View Post
whats the bar going across the uim
I was hoping someone would ask.... when I install the direct-port stage(s), that is where the distribution blocks and solenoids will mount. Six nozzles require 12 hard lines, 12 jets, 2 6-port distribution blocks, and three solenoids - and the feed hoses.

Expanding to 2 stages means doubling everything except the purge solenoid. Since I intend to be able to remove the UIM with nitrous intact, I want everything to mount somewhere on the UIM. It will take some trial and error to get everything to fit, since there is only about 1/2" hood clearance at the UIM.

Just tuning a stage with the required NOS jets, say changing the fuel jets up one step, will cost $60. Having a cross section of different jets sizes will be ...more.



Some days I wish I had a Chevy...

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Old 10-31-2010, 02:57 PM
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Originally Posted by krazy6 View Post
Looks good man!

When are you taking it to KID? lol
The next import shootout, I hope. Got a lot to do first, though. Are you going back there this season?
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Old 10-31-2010, 04:32 PM
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Wow!! Lots of progress!

And I'm glad you bumped this up so I could get a chance to see Jime's calculations for N/F and Meth. But I might have to make some alterations since I'm running a 3gph nozzle at 250PSI. I just recently resumed tuning via jet for the nitrous and have the A/F in the mid-11s. Buddy of mine thinks on meth that 11.9-12.3 should be fine but I'm keeping it safe for the time being. Might up to a 5gph nozzle and start running it leaner. Meth FTMFW!

Also spark plugs look interesting. But as long as there isn't any spotting on the center electrode piece then that's fine. A/F ring looks kind of rich. I can't see the timing mark, but I'm guessing that it's in a "good" range? Only thing I'm concerned is the ground strap is way white. Might be the flash though. And I don't know if it's the camera or what.. but is the spark plug in the 6th slot disintegrating?

Also! I'm following in your foot steps and upgrading to -6AN lines/fittings! Sure it might be overkill for a 150 shot but I just want to keep the nitrous pressure up for as long as possible.

Last edited by 2002AltimateV6; 10-31-2010 at 04:35 PM.
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Old 10-31-2010, 07:25 PM
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Originally Posted by 2002AltimateV6 View Post
Wow!! Lots of progress!

And I'm glad you bumped this up so I could get a chance to see Jime's calculations for N/F and Meth. But I might have to make some alterations since I'm running a 3gph nozzle at 250PSI. I just recently resumed tuning via jet for the nitrous and have the A/F in the mid-11s. Buddy of mine thinks on meth that 11.9-12.3 should be fine but I'm keeping it safe for the time being. Might up to a 5gph nozzle and start running it leaner. Meth FTMFW!

Also spark plugs look interesting. But as long as there isn't any spotting on the center electrode piece then that's fine. A/F ring looks kind of rich. I can't see the timing mark, but I'm guessing that it's in a "good" range? Only thing I'm concerned is the ground strap is way white. Might be the flash though. And I don't know if it's the camera or what.. but is the spark plug in the 6th slot disintegrating?

Also! I'm following in your foot steps and upgrading to -6AN lines/fittings! Sure it might be overkill for a 150 shot but I just want to keep the nitrous pressure up for as long as possible.
I don't know anything about spraying water/meth, or how that works with nitrous. Figuring out the A/F could be interesting, plus I'm planning on doing nitrous with E98 instead of race fuel, to get a feel for it. If it works, then methanol. I stayed around 12:1 with the old 175-shot setup. I'll start there.
Two direct-port stages with methanol is still the goal.

Those plugs are new, 1 step colder, and run with pump 91 octane - there is no damage on them, but all ground straps show the white fuzzy stuff and there is no heat ring on the ground - this looks wrong to me - maybe it's crappy pump gas.

The -6AN lines made a difference at the top end for me - the car pulled harder at the top than before - plus you get a more impressive purge plume with the larger line.
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Old 10-31-2010, 08:04 PM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
The next import shootout, I hope. Got a lot to do first, though. Are you going back there this season?
When is the next import shootout?

The only day left on the schedule for KID is the turkey drags. After that, the season is over.
I will be there for the turkey drags trying to hit 12s.
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Old 11-01-2010, 09:08 AM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
I don't know anything about spraying water/meth, or how that works with nitrous. Figuring out the A/F could be interesting, plus I'm planning on doing nitrous with E98 instead of race fuel, to get a feel for it. If it works, then methanol. I stayed around 12:1 with the old 175-shot setup. I'll start there.
Two direct-port stages with methanol is still the goal.

Those plugs are new, 1 step colder, and run with pump 91 octane - there is no damage on them, but all ground straps show the white fuzzy stuff and there is no heat ring on the ground - this looks wrong to me - maybe it's crappy pump gas.

The -6AN lines made a difference at the top end for me - the car pulled harder at the top than before - plus you get a more impressive purge plume with the larger line.
E98 is way out of my league.

But trust me! Meth is awesome! I love it!

Plugs look fine other then the ground straps. Check the center white porcelain and ensure there isn't any black spotting. If there's no detonation, you're fine. The ground mark should usually be around the middle of where it bends over. But since you've cut down the ground that may no longer be the case. The thing I'm worried about is that typically the color of the ground strap determines whether or not the plug is too cold or too hot for the setup. The lighter the metal the hotter it's running. But the white could also be from the nitrous. I noticed a similar occurrence on the very tip of my ground strap after spraying. Where is your timing set at? I don't know if it's oil or whatever but I noticed a little brown spotting on the far left plug. That might be an indication of detonation. Need better pics next time! Lol. But from my own lack of knowledge I would say take it down one degree and run it again.

Last edited by 2002AltimateV6; 11-01-2010 at 09:32 AM.
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Old 11-01-2010, 07:41 PM
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Originally Posted by krazy6 View Post
When is the next import shootout?

The only day left on the schedule for KID is the turkey drags. After that, the season is over.
I will be there for the turkey drags trying to hit 12s.
Look here for the schedule. They'll have the 2011 schedule up around New Years.

I see the Turkey Drags are Nov. 11-13. Hummm...


http://www.importfaceoff.net/

Gurlz!
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Old 11-01-2010, 07:50 PM
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Originally Posted by 2002AltimateV6 View Post
E98 is way out of my league.

But trust me! Meth is awesome! I love it!

Plugs look fine other then the ground straps. Check the center white porcelain and ensure there isn't any black spotting. If there's no detonation, you're fine. The ground mark should usually be around the middle of where it bends over. But since you've cut down the ground that may no longer be the case. The thing I'm worried about is that typically the color of the ground strap determines whether or not the plug is too cold or too hot for the setup. The lighter the metal the hotter it's running. But the white could also be from the nitrous. I noticed a similar occurrence on the very tip of my ground strap after spraying. Where is your timing set at? I don't know if it's oil or whatever but I noticed a little brown spotting on the far left plug. That might be an indication of detonation. Need better pics next time! Lol. But from my own lack of knowledge I would say take it down one degree and run it again.
Naw... E98 comes in cans at Ace Hardware - denatured alcohol, which is almost pure ethanol and doesn't require flushing the system after use. Remember, I intend to spray nitrous and E98 together - not a water-methanol mixture.

At the moment, I'm still using the stock ECU, but my Greddy EU is here in the box and the wiring is about 1/2 finished. I've had fuzzy plugs twice before, when using Sunoco 104 I bought at a track. That stuff made yellow fuzzy stuff on the ground straps! VP Racing 109 burns very clean, so I'll go back to it.

Lots to do,,,,
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Old 11-01-2010, 09:10 PM
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Have you considered going with an independent fuel supply for the nitrous system?
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Old 11-02-2010, 09:25 AM
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Originally Posted by 2002AltimateV6 View Post
Have you considered going with an independent fuel supply for the nitrous system?
Oh yeah, a 2-Qt junior dragster fuel cell with Walbro 255lph HP pump and Aeromotive FPR is the plan. It will fit once I move the radiator overflow tank. Haven't bought the tank yet - the rest is in the garage.
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Old 11-02-2010, 01:21 PM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
Oh yeah, a 2-Qt junior dragster fuel cell with Walbro 255lph HP pump and Aeromotive FPR is the plan. It will fit once I move the radiator overflow tank. Haven't bought the tank yet - the rest is in the garage.
Just so you know, you're my nitrous hero.
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Old 11-02-2010, 05:52 PM
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Originally Posted by 2002AltimateV6 View Post
I just recently resumed tuning via jet for the nitrous and have the A/F in the mid-11s. Buddy of mine thinks on meth that 11.9-12.3 should be fine but I'm keeping it safe for the time being. Might up to a 5gph nozzle and start running it leaner. Meth FTMFW!
Contrary to popular belief you can run nitrous cars pretty damn lean. Timing is what is usually the killer. You could go way leaner than mid 11s.
Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
I stayed around 12:1 with the old 175-shot setup. I'll start there.
He has the idea!
Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
Look here for the schedule. They'll have the 2011 schedule up around New Years.

I see the Turkey Drags are Nov. 11-13. Hummm...


http://www.importfaceoff.net/

Gurlz!
Come on out for the turkey drags, I want to see you make some passes.
We can show people what maximas can do.
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Old 11-02-2010, 06:11 PM
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Originally Posted by 2002AltimateV6 View Post
Just so you know, you're my nitrous hero.
Well, I am good at passing teh gas !!!
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Old 11-02-2010, 06:24 PM
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Originally Posted by krazy6 View Post

Come on out for the turkey drags, I want to see you make some passes.
We can show people what maximas can do.
I was thinking of watching you, instead, if I'm free that weekend. I'm not going to track the car until I get some issues resolved, so I don't break something big. Right now, just N/A, the motor gets to fuel-cut so quick that it pounds on the transmission until it shifts. I set the ShiftFast to 6000 and that's not low enough to complete a shift before fuel-cut.
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Old 11-02-2010, 06:35 PM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
I was thinking of watching you, instead, if I'm free that weekend. I'm not going to track the car until I get some issues resolved, so I don't break something big. Right now, just N/A, the motor gets to fuel-cut so quick that it pounds on the transmission until it shifts. I set the ShiftFast to 6000 and that's not low enough to complete a shift before fuel-cut.
Damn, that seems like a long drive for you to just watch. I'll put on a good show for you though.

That sucks about the tranny. Maybe try setting the controller really low and see if it even makes a difference. Like 4,000rpm.
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Old 11-03-2010, 08:13 AM
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Originally Posted by krazy6 View Post
Damn, that seems like a long drive for you to just watch. I'll put on a good show for you though.

That sucks about the tranny. Maybe try setting the controller really low and see if it even makes a difference. Like 4,000rpm.
But I likes to watch..... I don't think the problem is so much what RPM the tranny is told to shift at, but how long it takes for the shift to start and complete. Once the engine reaches over 4500 it hits fuel-cut almost immediately - at least it seems that way - I'm usually just hanging on at that point. Untuned, this engine has no low-end power - with a LSA of 104*, I'm not surprised. This one was intended to live at the high end of the tach.

The solution that I see is installing my EU and extending the rev limit to 8K and getting a fully-built transmission installed. Then a NA dyno so I know what I have.

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Old 11-03-2010, 09:17 AM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
But I likes to watch..... I don't think the problem is so much what RPM the tranny is told to shift at, but how long it takes for the shift to start and complete. Once the engine reaches over 4500 it hits fuel-cut almost immediately - at least it seems that way - I'm usually just hanging on at that point. Untuned, this engine has no low-end power - with a LSA of 104*, I'm not surprised. This one was intended to live at the high end of the tach.

The solution that I see is installing my EU and extending the rev limit to 8K and getting a fully-built transmission installed. Then a NA dyno so I know what I have.

Your motor definitely needs an extended rev limit. I bet it will make power to at least 8,000rpm.

What parts are you going to use to build the trans?
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Old 11-03-2010, 11:39 AM
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Originally Posted by krazy6 View Post
Your motor definitely needs an extended rev limit. I bet it will make power to at least 8,000rpm.

What parts are you going to use to build the trans?
The Cosworth valve train is rated to 10,000 RPM and the rest of the engine will handle 8K - but until I can dyno, I have no idea what the power curve will look like. Probably weird.....

I'm going to ship a transmission core to IPT (unless Level 10 makes me a better deal) in New Jersey for a complete race build. That will happen over this winter.

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Old 11-03-2010, 02:22 PM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
The Cosworth valve train is rated to 10,000 RPM and the rest of the engine will handle 8K - but until I can dyno, I have no idea what the power curve will look like. Probably weird.....

I'm going to ship a transmission core to IPT (unless Level 10 makes me a better deal) in New Jersey for a complete race build. That will happen over this winter.

Impressive, how much is the trans build gonna cost you?
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Old 11-03-2010, 04:59 PM
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Originally Posted by krazy6 View Post
Contrary to popular belief you can run nitrous cars pretty damn lean. Timing is what is usually the killer. You could go way leaner than mid 11s.

He has the idea!

Come on out for the turkey drags, I want to see you make some passes.
We can show people what maximas can do.
But most see the best gains in the 11.8-12.0 range on bottle. Which is basically where I'm at with a .02 larger n2o jet. But that goes against the rules because I would have NO idea what HP shot I'm running then. Lol..

Last edited by 2002AltimateV6; 11-03-2010 at 05:49 PM.
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Old 11-03-2010, 07:26 PM
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Try this calculator.
Seems pretty good to me.

I used this calculator for my camaro.
The calculator said I would gain 124.72whp with a 57 jet. I gained 125whp on the dyno with a 57 jet.
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Old 11-04-2010, 06:42 AM
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Originally Posted by krazy6 View Post
Impressive, how much is the trans build gonna cost you?

All together, about $4K...... plus whatever the new Edge TC costs...


Oh, I checked with my "appointment secretary", and my wife reminded me that we have a concert to attend on the 13th, so I guess I'm not going to see any turkeys at KID.

Last edited by grey99max; 11-04-2010 at 06:48 AM.
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Old 11-04-2010, 01:16 PM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
All together, about $4K...... plus whatever the new Edge TC costs...


Oh, I checked with my "appointment secretary", and my wife reminded me that we have a concert to attend on the 13th, so I guess I'm not going to see any turkeys at KID.
Damn! That thing better handle anything you throw at it.

That sucks, but have fun at the concert.
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Old 11-04-2010, 05:05 PM
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Sent you a PM about KCIR this sunday.
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Old 11-07-2010, 08:24 PM
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Some Old Direct-port pixs plus bonus..

I was just reviewing some Maxus 2006 (Dallas) pics and found these of an old direct-port install on one of those Maximas and one pix of Maximagirl..
This could have been the guy from Chicago...








MaximaGirl...




Last edited by grey99max; 11-07-2010 at 08:31 PM.
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Old 11-07-2010, 08:51 PM
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nice!!! the engine bay that is.
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Old 11-11-2010, 03:57 PM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
I'm not going to track the car until I get some issues resolved, so I don't break something big. Right now, just N/A, the motor gets to fuel-cut so quick that it pounds on the transmission until it shifts. I set the ShiftFast to 6000 and that's not low enough to complete a shift before fuel-cut.






potential/future world recold holder right here
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Old 11-17-2010, 01:17 PM
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Originally Posted by QNO_A32 View Post






potential/future world recold holder right here
+1, once he gets a tranny that will handle the power, this car will be nasty!
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Old 11-22-2010, 09:16 AM
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A quick test of shifting

Saturday I set the ShiftFast to change gears at 5700 and went out to play. On full throttle launches the transmission would make the 1-2 shift with a considerable delay both in shifting and how long it took to change gears, but the 2-3 shift was a BAM-I'm-in-the-next-gear-squeal-the tires thing. I never found enough highway room to test the 3-4 shift at WOT.

Right now I have the ShiftFast programmed to cut all nitrous for 1/2 second when shifts are triggered, which means that I have no nitrous for one full second when making a 1/4 mile run. I suspect the car would have been somewhat faster in the 1/4 mile if I could have sprayed straight through the shifts - and the transmission could survive that. Previous ones did not - and I suspect this one is failing on the 1-2 shift.

Yup, I need a real built transmission.
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Old 11-22-2010, 11:01 AM
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are you going to do a n/a pass before the track closes
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Old 11-22-2010, 12:37 PM
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Originally Posted by t6378tp View Post
are you going to do a n/a pass before the track closes
Me? No - no point in that, with the tranny acting weird.
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Old 11-29-2010, 02:41 PM
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Originally Posted by grey99max View Post
Saturday I set the ShiftFast to change gears at 5700 and went out to play. On full throttle launches the transmission would make the 1-2 shift with a considerable delay both in shifting and how long it took to change gears, but the 2-3 shift was a BAM-I'm-in-the-next-gear-squeal-the tires thing. I never found enough highway room to test the 3-4 shift at WOT.

Right now I have the ShiftFast programmed to cut all nitrous for 1/2 second when shifts are triggered, which means that I have no nitrous for one full second when making a 1/4 mile run. I suspect the car would have been somewhat faster in the 1/4 mile if I could have sprayed straight through the shifts - and the transmission could survive that. Previous ones did not - and I suspect this one is failing on the 1-2 shift.

Yup, I need a real built transmission.
During the slow 1/2 shift, was nitrous spraying?

Also, you think you'll need to go into 4th gear ( ~120mph with stock rev limit ) at the track? If not then I recommend not even testing the nitrous in 4th gear, ever. I never ever see 4th gear unless im cruising, and I dont get into 4th to prolong the life of the tranny since the 3-4 shift is pretty slugish even with a shiftkit + DR mod + cooler the size of life lol.
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Old 11-29-2010, 07:44 PM
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Originally Posted by streetzlegend View Post
During the slow 1/2 shift, was nitrous spraying?

Also, you think you'll need to go into 4th gear ( ~120mph with stock rev limit ) at the track? If not then I recommend not even testing the nitrous in 4th gear, ever. I never ever see 4th gear unless im cruising, and I dont get into 4th to prolong the life of the tranny since the 3-4 shift is pretty slugish even with a shiftkit + DR mod + cooler the size of life lol.
The slow 1-2 shift is obvious when driving N/A. When the nitrous gods were kind to me, I hit 4th gear before the traps fairly often. But you're right - after completing the shift, nothing much happens. With a shift point of 7500 or 8000, I can stay in third gear through the traps.
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Old 11-29-2010, 11:45 PM
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Damn even NA? didnt you recently put this auto in?
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