C MAX

iTrader: (4)

i have a simple solution that wont cost anything. run a ground from the battery to the transmission casing and starter and hopefully this should solve the problem.

|Bijan|

iTrader: (12)

Looks like

me
mishmosh
crazy97


are all in the same boat

|Bijan|

iTrader: (12)

I tried that, nothing changed.

tavarish

iTrader: (27)

add me to that list, my car's been starting crappy ever since my 5spd swap...well, a few months later..

C MAX

iTrader: (4)

geez, i had the same exact problem after a clutch install and nissan told me that i broke the grounding to the tranny. they told me to ground out the tranny and it worked fine, hope it works for some of you.

tavarish

iTrader: (27)

i'll try that out...where's the grounding to the tranny? i know there's one wire disconnected, which I thought was a ground, but it was a very tiny cable, and it doesnt reach all the way to the spot where it needs to go....(used to be auto)

Where did you ground your tranny?

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

There's a 14 ga (or so) cable that goes from the body to the tranny (via clip). I already tried to re-ground that to the battery and things didn't change.

C MAX

iTrader: (4)

i used some ground battery cable from autozone and mounted one end to the neg battery terminal and the other end to the transmission bolt anyone will do and did the same for the starter. went from the battery to one of the bolts that mount the starter and it worked right away. nissan said something about the alignment of the tranny and it not seating properly to connect the ground i hope this works for some of you.

crazy97

iTrader: (1)

I think I'll be making a trip to napa today for some wires

crazy97

iTrader: (1)

I fixed my car! I fixed my F****ng car!!!

I used C MAX's advice. Went and got some 14 gauge wire(later upgaded to 10 and then to 8 gauge) from Napa and some connectors. Ran a wire from the Neg terminal to one of the bolts that holds the starter on(the 14mm one) and ran a wire from the Neg terminal to one of the bottom 12mm tranny bolts(one next to the nuetral/park switch).TRANNY GROUND NOT REALLY NESSESARY-The starter IS on that side of the tranny anyway.

Car starts like a dream now, I also noticed my negitive cable is really bad where it runs along the bottom of the battery.

Thanks to all of the help from people on here and I'll be hoping every one else has good results with this too.

UPDATE: My car started to pause a little again, not real bad but I ended up adding more ground wires to the starter to fix this. Heavy gauge wire would not be overkill, it may be nesessary. I have 4 wires running to the starter, 3 8ga and a 10ga wire. I also have 2 12ga wires running to the bottom of the tranny. I should have just went with 0ga or 4ga or 6ga wires from the start.


Edit: This will also help-

http://forums.maxima.org/showpost.ph...15&postcount=1

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

hahaha, I bought a bunch of 6 gauge ground wires for 'lawn and garden equipment' at wally world for a total of like $6, I haven't even had a chance to put them on yet but it's great to know that it's going to work. I geuss you guys are pissed you didn't listen to that guy that said early on that he made like 7 grounding points and it instantly went away.

IlyaK

iTrader: (47)

Change your fuel pump.

pocketrocket

iTrader: (1)

I am definitely following this ... my car also does this. 95 SE auto, 112k miles, starter replaced 2 years ago, tranny rebuilt about 1.5 yrs ago.

Cold weather is worse .... when cranking, it will "hiccup" for a split second. Getting more frequent, started about a year ago. I'll have to wait until it's warm to mess with it.

KRRZ350

iTrader: (29)

HAHAHAHA!!!!!!!!!!!! Problem fixed!!!!!!!!!! You guys are the shiznit!!! I only used two of them, ran one to a bellhousing bolt, ran another to a starter bolt, then I bolted the ends of both of them to the body ground underneath the battery tray!! Mine starts like a wet dream also!! Thanks a bunch, I would have been scratching my head over this one for awhile!!! To bad the starting problem turned my muffler into a bomb!!

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

Yup, if yours hiccups/stutters/pauses (once or even a few times) during the cranks, I think you are in the same boat. This is different from people who have long but continuous cranking.

I just got done doing two 4ga grounding cables to the 14mm starter bolt and to a 12mm tranny bolt near the front--both to the engine block ground nearby.

Edit: So far so good!!!!!

vj72ct

well gotta say ive been having the same problem as crazy97,and also had the car at the dealer twice and also a electrical specialty shop that flat out gave up!!almost 6 months ive been going with this until it stopped even starting unless i pop started the car!!went out this morning and put a new ground wire on the lower trans. bolt.i cleaned it up with an air gasket cleaner,the cookie style one so it would be a real good ground and hooked that right to the battery.then i hooked one from the throttlebody to the battery cable.next i took the original ground from the battery to the body right below the battery or behind on that flat spot and ground that down with the cookie tool until bare metal showed also.and then cleaned the ground that bolts near the top left of the tranny down to bare metal also.hooked everything up car fired right up no hesitation at all!!kept starting over and over trying to see if it fails again but no problems yet.ive restarted car about 20 times with no problems.i have to tell ya ive changed everything crazy97 has and a few more things too.i even talked to a master nissan tech who said to make a ground from one of the starter bolts to the battery he has had this problem before and that sometimes works but not this time until i added the one from the lower trans bolt!!i think the grounds have to be to bare metal cause these werent until this morning.god i hope this does it cause this isnt even my car its my best friends 97 and he has been driving one of my cars while we figured it out.hope this info helps some of you guys.....VJ

crazy97

iTrader: (1)

The more grounds the better! I am adding more grounds today Trans to Engine, Engine to Body. I bought a tool to put on a drill that will help grind down the metal on the body to get a good contact. I am also replacing the negitive battery cable.

xlr8r

Excellent sluething guys! I've been following this one for days scrating my head. The forum works!!!

C MAX

iTrader: (4)

im glad to see it works now i can sleep ,lol.

crazy97

iTrader: (1)

Car is starting great. Everytime I go to start it I get that nervous feeling and then I turn the key and I am so relieved that it starts that I could almost blow a load right there!

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

LOL! I am exactly the same way. Thankfully, every start has been super fast since the grounding. I really think this time that this is THE fix! A big THANK YOU to all who contributed to this thread.

White Shadow

iTrader: (11)

Well boys, I too have been having the same problem recently but apparently not as badly yet as some of you guys have. She has never failed to start but I have the intermittent hesitation during cranking and then it fires right up. I searched a bit and finally came across this post and after enough reading to make my eyes cross it sems as if the problem has been diagnosed. I can't wait until tomorrow to get out there and fix a problem that cost some of you guys many hours and many hundreds of dollars by using stuff I already have in my garage. I'll post results to let you know if it's the miracle cure for me too. Thanks once more to all of you who put in the work and shared the technical knowledge with all of us here to get this thing resolved. This post alone makes the donation required for the search functon more than worth the money.

SVI30

They should make this one a sticky.

Juicey

Right on guys! If they don't make it a sticky I'll still stay subscribed to it because you never know when this will happen as wide spread as it is.

crazy97

iTrader: (1)

I would have to agree with a spot in the stickies for this since this problem is more common as our 4th gens get older.

About 18 degrees this morning and she fired right up. I think this thing might have cracked me a little. I find myself waiting for people to walk by so I can show off how good the engine starts. Before I had people stopping to see if my car was dead when it would sit there and crank and crank unevenly.

C MAX

iTrader: (4)

you know the thing is nissan knows about this problem(i had this problem in 1997) they are just too slick to get your money. my best friend is the main head machanic and this is the first thing he told me to do without hesitation and it worked first try. crazy thanks for the shout out when you fixed it i wish i would of read this earlier could of saved you a fortune but at least she's fixed now .

SVI30

Yes, car companies don't want you to fix your old car. They want you to buy a new one. I have a Toyota Prius. The main battery for it cost $4000. So they don't want you to keep the car.

ptatohed

iTrader: (12)

This is great. My '96 started getting TERRIBLE starting problems 3+ years ago. I tried countless attempts and I don't even want to think of the money I have spent (over $2000). I brought it to 2 Nissan dealers, 2 speed shops and another recommended mechanic (not to mention all the stuff I bought/installed myself). No one could figure it out! So I gave up on the car completely, bought my '99 and transfered the supercharger and everything else I could transfer. My old '96 has been sitting in my garage for 3 years now (I painfully start her over and drive her here and there but it isn't even registered or insured). I can't wait to buy ground wire and try this. If this solves my problem, I will be tempted to fly out to New York and give C Max a big smootch!

Just one question. Could you guys please explain exactly where on the transmission you grounded the wire? Pictures?

Thanks C Max and crazy97 and everyone else!

2 Da Max

iTrader: (2)

dam for real? i have the same problem, except mine pops

vettefever5

this is a big tease. finally it seems as though a solution has been figured out, but it just so happens that my non starting car is parked under about 20" of snow as of saturday. now i have to wait til i have time to unbury it before i can try out this grounding method... but it definitely sounds promising!

i'm with ptatohed... does anyone that ran these wires successfully want to post any pictures of the grounding locations? just for reference, might be very helpful..

C MAX

iTrader: (4)

the most strategic spots are anyone of the tranny bolts that hold in the tranny, and the starter bolt either one that holds the starter in.

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

I used the upper 14mm starter retaining bolt for one ground cable and for the other, in the pic below, chose an accessible 12mm bolt near the front of the tranny which I loosened and stuck in a spade termination. (orientation: tranny mount upper right, fork boot upper left, black cable going down to neutral pos sensor)



Both cables can be 19" 4ga cables you find in the Walmart car battery section if you ground them to the neighboring engine ground shown below (12mm nut).



I still can't believe this simple solution worked! Much appreciated CMAX!!! I have heard it said before to improve grounding, but some have said to buff the engine-tranny mating surfaces which was too much work for me to gamble on. I had never thought to just bolt cable to the starter retaining bolt and the tranny case. Although I have suffered these last 1 1/2 years and ended up installing a big laundry list of parts, at least I can say I didn't go to the dealer, end up spending just as much or more and still not have the problem fixed. Always nice too to finally get results doing it yourself! Bless this Org!

ptatohed

iTrader: (12)

Well said. Thanks for the pics Mish.

enforcer

Guess what,
Mine was working perfectly.
Went to gym, came back, it just wont startup.
The battery is fine.
It could be the alarm immobiliser.

I have a gut feeling that its the starter motor. Cant be the alternator.

I did get it push-started. It ran fine, no prob etc.
I did notice a screech sound for 2-3 seconds but thats about it.
however, i couldnt start it again this morning.
Had to leave for work, didnt have time or space to push start.

What do you guys think? Its a 96 2L V6 Nissan Cefiro (Maxima).
It has been making the screeching noise at startups for about a year+ now.

I will check the Starter motor and the Cable Grounding, then go from there.
thanks.

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

Enforcer,
If your starter makes screeching noises at startup, more than likely the gears need to be regreased. If that has been going on for some time, it might be well time for a new/rebuilt starter. For most of us with the grounding problem, the car is hard to start BUT the car will always start up. If your turn the key and don't get cranking, definitely look into the battery, the starter, and the ignition switch. If you do end up replacing your starter, no question I would add the grounding cables. I now wonder if some people with hard starting problems that were cured by a new starter maybe just got better grounding with the new starter they just installed instead of it being the starter.

crazy97

iTrader: (1)

Here's the way I did it-

I don't have a camera but I'll use some pictures from around the web. First, here's the stuff I bought. Napa has all this stuff close together. Other stores may be the same.

Connectors-


I bought some small ones that fit over the bolt on the negative battery terminal. I had to take the nut all the way off while sliding these onto the bolt. The metal on these are flexible so you can bend them to make them fit on the terminal a little better.

I also bought some more of the same kind of connectors, but bigger, 3/8 size to fit over the bigger starter bolt and tranny bolt.

Make sure these connectors are compatible with the wire you are using. It will say right on the box what gage wire the connectors will work with.

I used 14 gage wire, but 10 or 12 gage may be better. A roll of that was about $5.

You will need one of these crimpers- Less than $10


Disconnect the Negative battery terminal first. Remove air intake and lower part of the air filter box.


Cut the wire to look like this(below) using the crimper. Use the slots on the crimper to do this. There are holes toward the bottom of the handle of the crimper that say 10, 12, 14, 16 gage. Put the wire in the correct slot on the crimper and squeeze hard and pull the wire till it rips the covering off and it should look like this-


Stick the end of the wire in the end of the connector and crush it together with the crimper. Use the end of the crimper to do this. When you crush it, make sure you are crushing the metal and not the plastic on the connector. I ruined the first one I did, cut it right in half.

See how long the metal in the connector is here verses how long the plastic cover is->


Starter to Neg terminal:

Put a 3/8 inch connector on the wire run it down to the starter and remove the 12mm bolt/ the one closest to the front of the engine on the starter. This is the bolt that fastens the starter to the engine. Slide the 3/8 connector onto the bolt and reinstall. Figure out how long you want the wire to be and cut the wire. Fasten an small connector on the other end of the wire to be attached later to the negative terminal.

Tranny Bolt to Negative battery terminal:

Fasten a 3/8 connector on to the roll of wire. Drop it down into the engine bay, get under the car and find a bolt on the tranny. Use one of the bottom bolts you see in the picture below. I used one of the shiny 12mm bolts to the lower left of the oil pouring out. This picture is looking at the trans from the drivers side. That hole is where the park/neutral position switch is supposed to be, there is a wire running from it usually.



Take one of those bolts out and slide the 3/8 connector onto the 12mm bolt and reinstall. Make sure it's tight but not too tight. Give the other bolts next to it a little tug on the wrench just to make sure they are still tight after you reinstall the bolt you removed. Make this wire long enough to reach the negative battery terminal and cut to size. Install the smaller connector onto the other end and slide both connectors on to the bolt of the negative battery terminal and reinstall the 10mm nut and tighten this over the connectors and with the negative terminal on the battery.

I am going to make more connections tranny to engine and engine to body in the near future just to be sure. Also make sure to inspect your negitive battery cable and replace it if you see the cable turning green down by the bottom of the battery.

Clean up as many grounding points as possible. I used a steel wire brush attatchment on a drill.


Reinstall air intake.

Cross fingers

Start car

crazy97

iTrader: (1)

More ideas and pictures in this thread-

In the links in this thread I'm noticing that people are using heavier wire such as 8, 6, 4, gage wire. I'm considering replacing my skinny 12 and 14 gage wires with something heavier.

http://forums.maxima.org/oldthread.p...ht=ground+wire

Juicey

Perhaps someone can explain to me how grounding helps this problem. Why two grounding points instead of one and why was there not a grounding wire in the first place to prevent this problem from happening?

Also what happens when salt and sand eventually erode that tranny wire?

Mishmosh

iTrader: (3)

I can't explain how this works--it is not clear to me if this affects the starter specifically or the electrical system in general. All I know is, it WORKS! It seems to me there is enough metal-metal surface to create a good ground already. Aluminum is a pretty good electrical conductor. Aluminum oxides are not. I think any time you remove the starter and/or tranny, that original good connection gets replaced by a lesser one, as aluminum oxidizes readily and rapidly. The tranny does have a ground cable already near the rear. It is a small one and held in somewhat loosely by a connector--probably just inadequate.

You should use two cables because the one to the starter is in direct contact with the starter casing but not the tranny. The second one can be attached to any of the bolts that will afford direct contact with the tranny case. If the bolt is "fresh" the metal underneath it should be clean and oxidation free. If you use one that had already been removed before (ie.bellhousing bolts to motor), I definitely would clean those up with a wire brush as suggested by Crazy.

C MAX

iTrader: (4)

well it seems that the tranny and starter work off existing grounds around it rather that a direct ground set up. when we remove our tranny cases or starter we break the ground somehow (similar to a gasket you cant use it over you have to replace it) and when reinstalling it doesnt seat properly therfore breaking solid contact for ground. if you use a 4 gauge or better theres no need to worry about it failing. also in a few other posts thats why we use a grounding kit because over the yrs our grounds start to suck and has a impact on our performance. i personally would recommend a grounding kit all around not just for the starter and tranny, i know its done wonders for my current and performance.