RollinLow

OK guys,

I bought a 2000 SE auto 12 days ago.

Noticed the slipping from 1st to 2nd, brought it back to dealership. Received the good old "operating as designed" from the service guys.

Researched .org and found the TSB (thanks). Brought it back today and took a service guy for a ride. He acknowledged the problem, and pulled the tranny pan. They showed it to me, and the magnets were covered with debris (metal).

They tell me I need a new tranny.

I have a 50/50 warrenty, but I told them that I was not willing to pay anything and that I would give the car back first. (Obviously I was ****ed)

What I want to know is if I have any kind of recourse with this dealership that apparently sold me a car with a pre-existing condition. I test drove it twice and did not notice the slipping, but they had warmed it up for me both times. I told the sales manager that I think they had dirty tactics in selling me this car since the slipping doesn't happen when its warm (it just seems like a soft shifting tranny).

They currently have my car and are seeing what they can do about a tranny for me. They don't seem to be too helpful especially because they made like no money on the car and it has 97k miles on it. (I bought it for $9k)

I guess I should have known it was too good to be true.

Any suggestions on manipulating a dealership in Socal would be great. I wasnt sure if there were any Lemon Laws that pertain to used cars that I havent found yet. I am new to this state and do not know many of the laws.

Thanks.

realtor

Take the TSB and the car to another Nissan stealer and don't mention anything about the first stealer. Good luck.

Larrio

iTrader: (10)

whats this 50/50 warranty?

i usually go to wondries nissan in alhambra for warranty work. they are pretty good at fixing things. did my p0420 ecu thing twice of two different 5th gens that i brought in for free

RollinLow

50/50 warranty is when they take care of 50% parts and 50% labor...

The thing is that it is only valid at that dealership because its a dealership warranty...
If I bring this to another dealership, they will not give me any kind of coverage as far as I know...

Isn't a tsb just a notice to tell them how to fix a prob? It's not like a recall so its not free. And if the car needs a tranny, I dont want the car. I'll find another one somewhere else.

This royally sux.

RollinLow

BTW, what is up with this?

<----------------

Zero Deuce SE

It's what everybody goes through when we first start posting here. There is a sticky thread on Frequently asked questions (FAQ) that has a lot of scoop in them.

RollinLow

Ya I know, I read a bunch of them, I just thought I posted something stupid that I missed and was being shown that I missed it...

Thanks

BrandonSE

iTrader: (1)

RollinLow... You have a 30 day return policy. A car can be sold to you faulty if you signed the "As-Is" paper. As far as i know Nissan has a 30 day per-owned. Straight from their website "Nissan Certified Pre-Owned Vehicles are protected by a 72-month/100,000-mile limited warranty from the vehicle's original in-service date. This represents at least 12 months/12,000 miles of extended coverage, and often, even more. And in order to give you the best selection, Nissan Certified Pre-Owned vehicles are available in a variety of models, with a wide range of colors and options. See your nearest Nissan dealer to find the Certified Pre-Owned Vehicle that's right for you."


Hope this helps. Listen they won't do anything unless you *****. YOU GOTTA *****.



brandon

RollinLow

Hopefully it will, as far as I know this was not a certified vehicle... I assume I would know if it was because they usually make a big deal about that.

I will be searching the web high and low for anything I can use to get this taken care of.

Thank you guys for the help, and if anyone else has any info for me feel free to voice it

2k2kev

how did you pay? Can you cancel the payment? That would get their attention.

SEmy2K2go

iTrader: (10)

Dealerships when selling used cars will offer a 30 day warranty which should cover issues such as this. Before the 30 days run out, I would speak with them about that. You should actually have some sort of documentation about the 30 day warranty. A few questions about your car though...did you buy it from a Nissan dealership? Was it considered a "Nissan Certified Used Car"? Also, did they offer it "As Is"? These are a few questions that can help with giving you some more suggestions on how to handle this issue.

RollinLow

I did purchase it from a Nissan dealership.

It was not a certified car.

There was a 30 warranty, but as I stated before it only covers 50%.
50% of $3200 is still more than I currently have sitting around for misc vehicle repairs. And having to dump money into a car I bought 12 days ago is a joke.

I am just going to have to make them see it my way, or they get a car back...


I would have cancelled the check but it has already gone through (the downpayment), the rest is financed.

I still think that they knew about the situation, and am arguing that fact.

limsandy

iTrader: (1)

It's the thing with used car. You get what you paid. Sorry bro.


~limsandy

RollinLow

Yeah well, we will see...

I will be fine with just giving the car back and heading over to another Nissan dealership and buying a certified car

I found a little tidbit though...

On the 50/50 warranty it says "Under state law, 'implied warranties', may give you more rights."

So I went searching for implied warranties and came up with this...

"WHAT ARE IMPLIED WARRANTIES?
Two kinds of warranties are implied by law. These implied warranties, when present, create buyer's rights and seller/manufacturer obligations in addition to those under any express warranty.

An implied warranty of merchantability (general fitness) is an implied promise that the product is fit for the ordinary purposes for which it is used (i.e., "This car is fit for passenger transportation.") This implied warranty is present in sales of most new and used products by merchants (not private sale). Under Song Beverly this warranty is present in all sales of new consumer goods and those sales of used goods which come with a written express warranty.

An implied warranty of fitness for a particular purpose is an implied promise that the product is fit for the particular purpose of the buyer (i.e., "This paint will adhere to the sample surface you provided.")

WHAT ARE MY REMEDIES UNDER THE UCC?
Remedies include rejection of the nonconforming goods, revocation of acceptance of nonconforming goods, deduction of damages from the unpaid balance of the purchase price, and recovery of incidental and consequential damages (i.e., repairs, towing, loss of use, loss of business, rentals, etc.)"

I found this on law.freeadvice.com

What do you guys think? I figure if I go in there moaning about "what my lawyer said" and rattle this stuff off.... They might change their tune.

I hope that you guys don't think I'm just whining about this. I just moved from New Hampshire to California, and really don't have the money to be throwing down on fixing something I bought 12 days ago. If I had that kind of money I would have bought a new car!

Larrio

iTrader: (10)

call the dealership and pretend you are the lawyer

RollinLow

Now that is a killer idea!

I'm going to go in there first... and if they stonewall me, I'll think about it.

Or maybe I'll just call my old lawyer in NH.

2k2kev

if you're not a lawyer you shouldn't pretend to be one. If they engage in any conversation they'll figure out real quick you're not really a lawyer and then you'll lose credibilitiy in this argument.

I'd walk in today (unannounced) and ask for all the paperwork they have on your car. Go to the front office, the service dept, if they have any other "shops" in the back. See if there's any paperwork that indicates they knew. Then start tracking back where the car came from.

Then file in small claims for $3200 and have them served with papers for court...

SoonerFan

iTrader: (5)

small claims court is only for amounts up to $2,000

SC02Max

Just be ready to walk from the car.

SoonerFan

iTrader: (5)

ok it is $5K in california
"You cannot ask for more than $5,000 in a claim."
http://www.consumeraffairs.com/consu.../small_ca.html

desperado_45

You can get enough from small claim to get a tranny taken care of. Try small claims court, but tell them your going to do if first and see what they say. They would have to get a lawyer $$$$$, and it may cost them more $$$$ than just fixing your tranny.

fishhouse

iTrader: (1)

maybe contact your finance company. they may have some advice and/or suggestions on how to get out of it (if any). just a thought.

simpleMax

Hey, to save $1600 (your 50%) if might be worth a $100 or $200 consultation with a lawyer, who could probably handle something like this in his sleep.

Alternatively, does the jurisdiction you live in have a consumer affairs office? They should help.

You have a "cookie cutter" problem - they sold you a car that now needs repairs, 12 days later. There should be a simple solution - you're screwed, because it was sold as is; they have to fix it for free because they sold you defective merchandise; or, they gave you a 50/50 warranty, and the tranny should be fixed under the warranty. A lawyer or consumer action office could tell you where you fall.

RollinLow

Well guys, I'm still working on it...

I really appreciate all the help and suggestions!

I'll let you know how stuff turns out.

Hey, any of you NJ/NY guys know a Nissan dealership in Brooklyn called Bay Ridge Nissan? I was just wondering if its a big dealership or not... A member of my family used to own it, and I am told he still has friends high up in Nissan itself. I figure its worth a shot.

Thanks again guys for all the advice!

TXT-1

iTrader: (1)

I dont wanna sound like the bad guy in this thread, but remember all that paperwork you signed before you took delivery of the car? That's the dealership covering its @ss. I sympathize with your situation, but the reality is, you don't really have much legal recourse. The car was not certified, if Cali uses similar paperwork to NJ, you probably signed a warranty disclosure explaining the 50/50 warranty. Granted it was in confusing legalese, but you still signed it. Did you take the car to your mechanic before signing? The fact that the dealership showed the car to you all warmed up will not stand up in court because it's your word against theirs. And you would have to prove that they did this to hide the tranny problem.

Here is a thought though: In NJ anyway, most dealerships selling cars that are not sold "as is" guarantee that the car will pass state inspection for safe operation. After you get your registration and tags and you go to get the car inspected, and it fails, the dealership has to pay for any and all repairs needed for the car to pass state inspection. If Cali operates in the same way, than you could argue that the car will not pass inspection with a bad tranny. It's a long shot, but just a thought for you. Again, sorry about your luck.

cheetor

This is what's really going to cover it or not:
http://caag.state.ca.us/consumers/general/lemon.htm

Some lawyers who specialize in this in CA:
http://www.california-lemon-law.net/faq.htm#q5

paralyse

Just wanted to add a couple of things:

When you buy a used car, in most states, it comes AS-IS! There is no "3 day rule" or the like, and 30 day return policies, unless you have it in writing, are tough luck situations. As a used car salesman my manager always stressed the critical importance of the AS-IS forms and of making sure you don't make any oral statements regarding the car (its mechanical soundness, etc.) for CYA purposes. It's kind of sleazy but unfortunately most dealers operate under similar dubious "standards."

I would have had the car inspected by a mechanic before I purchased it, especially with close to 100k miles on it. Preferably I would have kept the car overnight to observe its cold-start and warm-up operation...

But what's done is done. So what can you do?

I'd go straight to the general manager of the dealership. If it is a group dealership I would seek out the company president and write him a letter (not email) sent via certified, registered mail with return and delivery receipts required. Tell them exactly what happened. Explain that you are very unhappy and give them some options as to how they can fix the situation! Let them know you are being reasonable and fair.

Cheat: If you wrote a check or used a credit card for a down payment, you might be able to place a stop order on it, if it hasn't cleared, which will upset the deal. In such cases the dealership will usually have to take the car back and return your trade (you couldn't get financed, after all.)

A reputable dealership will (usually) spend a little bit of money on a customer rather than risk getting a bad reputation and/or a legal battle. When I sold a car, if it had problems within the first few days, our sales manager almost always covered them 100% even though he was not required or legally obligated to do so.

Rule #1 of sales: If you don't ask for it (business, service, sales) the answer is a guaranteed 100% no. If you do ask for it, the WORST that can happen is a "no"...

RollinLow

First response,

CA does not work like NJ. There is no inspection, just smog (as far as I have been told) otherwise I would try it.

Second response,

This car was not sold as is. It had a 50/50 warranty. I will end up paying the 50% if I have to, but am going to exhaust all other options first. There is a reason behind this. The Used Car Sales manager threatened me with lawyers when I told him I was going to seek legal advice. After that he accused me of racing the vehicle, then proceeded to make a comment about my driving record from years ago. None of this should ever be said to a customer. He attacked my integrity and basically called me a liar. This guy will lose his job either way I go about this (whether I pay the 50% or not). I am totally ****ed about this. It's not even about the car anymore. This guy will pay for acting the way he did to a customer.
I am in the process of getting in touch with the GM and the Owner of the dealership. A call has been placed to Nissan, and with the contacts that I have, more are being placed to people higher up in Corporate.

Third response,

As far as the legal aspect goes, check my posts above. ANY vehicle in the state of CA that comes with ANY kind of express warranty is also subject to the corresponding implied warranty. As far as I can figure this is a Song-Beverly type warranty (one which states a time limit and dealer responsibility), which will also include the UCC implied warranty. See above for what that states.

Fourth Response,

As far as cancelling or disputing the downpayment, I may do this. I am checking to make sure that my credit will not be hurt by doing this. I also have a call into the finance company to see what they say.


As you can see, I am hitting this from every possible angle. Like I said, this is not really about the car anymore. This guy will be held responsible for his actions. If I end up having to pay the money, then so be it. But rest assured that this guy will no longer be at this dealership.

The suggestions everyone has given me have been very helpful, and again I appreciate it. The criticism is noted, and also appreciated. I have withheld the info about the actual sales manager's comments until now because I was trying to keep with the legal aspect. But damnit I was shocked and p*ssed to the point where I almost dragged him across the desk. Luckily I kept most of my cool and told him that he had no right to talk about my driving record. At a slightly elevated volume unfortunately.

Sorry for the book, but I needed to vent.

Thanks again guys

PWRLFT

one suggestion:
Pay for the tranny fix with you credit card, and then call your credit card company to have the payment desputed. This gets your car back, gets your tranny fixed, and you can still fight them on the issue.

Better yet, you can call the credit card company first, and tell them the situation. I have found that things happen when a vendor gets a call from Mastercard, you know they have some fine lawyers!!

Sorry about the comments from the dealer thats low, but how did they find out about your driving record?

mikeI302k

hey RollinLow i live in brooklyn and yes bayridge nissan is a very big dealership. as a matter of fact bay ridge motors llc. owns the :

lexus, nissan, toyota, mitsu, and other dealerships in the area.

Colonel

As this might be an "idea" I would not recommend doing this. I think so far he is working this the right way on the "up and up" and would continue to do it that way.

The verbal attacks are uncalled for and I believe that they came do the the relentless persuit of RollinLow to get his car fixed. I be willing to bet a Chipotle Burrito they knew that the car had tranny issues prior to sale and hoped to pawn the car off.

I will continue to

190hpKiLLA

iTrader: (11)

YEs bay ridge Nissan is sort of big BUT unless you know(and I mean KNOW) people they are criminals and their service sucks, They just dont give a fock about you and want to rape you.

Listen to this:

My friend got an altenator recall done there for his 97 max. He wanted them to put a new belt on because it comes off as it is(but he will pay for the part). They said no but will look into it.

So after they were done with it, he asked them if they put in new belt.The response was like this.."ohh the mechanic didnt have to take it off sorry" WTF if u take the alty out YOU take the belt off.

RollinLow

As far as Bay Ridge is concerned.... My relative USED to own it. Sold it about 7-8 years ago. It sucks when a dealership is shady.

Colonel, I agree that that would not be a good idea due to the fact that the dealer could take the car and hold it till payment is taken care of. I flat out will not take the car back until this issue is resolved. I also agree that they probably knew about the problem.

With the driving record thing, I mentioned it to a salesman when he asked why I wasn't looking for another sports car (I was driving a 96 240sx). I mentioned that I had more speeding tickets than he could imagine.

Regardless of that, the used car manager has not seen my record, and the comment was not made to him. So its hearsay.