Derrick2k2SE

iTrader: (3)

I've seen a 2 MPG increase since having the timing advance done. I was getting around 19 to 20 MPG and now get 21 to 22. My driving includes a good amount of stop and go or it would be higher.

NYPD-Arnold

iTrader: (8)

Highly, highly doubt it's that little.

Larrio

iTrader: (10)

why would you think its even more?

technosquare significantly advances timing and I haven't seen any clear signs through dynos or track times to show an improvement (on 5th gens)

we did do back to back runs on a dyno with a 4th gen stock ECU vs. TS ecu and it gain 17 lbs. of tq in the mid range

Kevlo911

iTrader: (36)

Until I see dyno of it make 10 hp, I will not believe it. I know some things and tried some things that prove otherwise, I cannot say these things until it's working 100%

Kevlo911

iTrader: (36)

http://forums.maxima.org/showthread....light=jwt+data

4th gen idle is also at 15, JWT adds 5 to that. So according to some of those posts, JWT ecu adds atleast 5 degrees of timing. JWT adds up to around 15hp. Doing the math I can't see 1 degree being 5hp, it would have to be closer to 2-3hp.

Larrio

iTrader: (10)

i have the dyno, lemme see if I have it linked up

sloppymax

iTrader: (8)

butt dynos are inconclusive but i would have felt 10hp when i had my timing and i did not. i just felt more pull in lower rpms. i have seen a few people suggest that since it does not increase at WOT that you should not notice a difference on the dyno. also that past a certain rpm, the advance is pulled. i remember feeling the most difference below 4k. i could buy 2-3 per degree of advancement. mpg should increase with all else equal since the motor is running more efficiently.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Anyone in an auto 3.5L have this besides me?

vsamoylov

it is still horsepower and plus its cheaper then getting a aftermarket ecu like jwt. as i remember there is a ecu upgrade for 2k2 and 2k3 maximaright? wasnt it like technosquare? do they raise timing also?

NYPD-Arnold

iTrader: (8)

Actually, I forgot that my stock timing was at 13. So I felt a much larger gain than everybody else.

whazzzzuup

iTrader: (22)

Why was yours at 13 degrees?

vsamoylov

i am guessing that somebody lowered his timing from 15 degrees to 13 degrees for some reason. adn then he raised it back to 17 degrees.

dextterity

doesn't our ecu change accordingly to the type of gas we put in? I'm pretty sure if you have your timing at 17 and you start filling up with 87 octain, it'll lower it for specific reasons so the car can run better. like the note on my dealerships reciept in post 25 i think it is.

vsamoylov

i dont think our ecu are that smart yet. if they are like that, then why does nissan program to a specific setting like 15 degrees?

dextterity

well they have it set at something specific because it has to of course start somewhere and also each cars manual recommends a specific type of gas (octain rating) which the car should be filled with right?

this is the note on my reciept from the dealership after the timing was done:

(note: ecu will alter all engine specifications in accordance with sensor inputs. (including "detonation" sensor which is affected by fuel octane.)

I don't think the ecu will ever advance settings/timing because if you put in 93 octain when it's at 15 degrees all the computer can tell is that it's being fed with what it needs to function properly, but can't tell if it's 91 or 93, know what i mean? but if it is set for atleast 91 to function "correctly" and you're filling your car with 87, i assume that note means the sensors understand that something needs to be changed in order for the car to function "correctly" and the timing decreases.

This is just an ASSUMPTION, but it would be nice if someone can verify this for me and everyone else.

vsamoylov

yeah that makes sense. but when i fill my max up with cheap gas, it detonates and my timing is 15 degrees still. so i am guessing that if timing is advanced to 17 degrees, it will detonate even more on cheap gas? well after i heard it pinging, i stopped putting cheap gas in and only put premium and the problem went away. but i do understand what you saying that nsisan had to start somewhere but everybody uses different type of gas with different octain rating so i think 15 degrees was in the perfect even though like i said it still detonates on cheap gas. i never had a owners manual but doesnt it say i nthere that premium gas has to be used?

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

My reciept doesn't say that, and I've also heard and seen that the 00-01's do in fact go back, but it's been debated on here before.

dextterity

what i meant about nissan had to start somehwere is i mean that they still have to decide what the timing should be to begin with, even if the computer is capable of deciding whats best, needs to start somewhere, hope thats more clear.

Also I'm almost pretty sure that our manual says atleast 91 octain should be used, but i haven't looked in my manual for a long time, i'll have to check again unless someone can verify before i look. My car is cali emissions like most and cali doesn't have 93 so i assume the timing is set for 91. which is why the car must have ran like crap on lower octain gas, but i guess if you put in 93 octain and want to take full advantage of it, bumping up the timing 2 degrees is the way to go.

dextterity

the reciept is made up of course from two different dealerships, service desks, mechanics, i may have just gotten lucky enough to have someone to give me that extra information. my dealership said i was the first one to ever ask for this to be done

NYPD-Arnold

iTrader: (8)

My car either came 13 from the factory (some Maximas did) or bad gas may have once been used and the ECU retarded the timing to prevent ping.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

The one I went to stated they do it all the time to 350z's as well as Altima/Maximas. These are also 2 different model year vehicles we are talking about as well.

Larrio

iTrader: (10)

here are the dynos

97 maxima plus bolt ons (TS ecu vs. stock ecu) IIRC MEVI not working
back to back runs
same day, time, etc

horsepower


torque

panda_1

iTrader: (4)

where exactly did u guy feel the power? i have done this mod and i dont know if i feel ne diff.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

Why can't you do this to the 4th gen at the factory.

NmexMAX

iTrader: (22)

3.5L owners seem to feel this more than DEK folks.

joebangaa

iTrader: (3)

another question, if you take it to the dealer to have it done do you have to be stock?

sloppymax

iTrader: (8)

that should be irrevelant. some have complained of pinging even using 93 on stock timing mostly on 3.5 so some dealers were retarding the timing to decrease the chance of pinging. if you use lower octane gas then the knock sensor will let the ecu know to pull timing. mine was set at 14-15 and was adjusted to 17-18. i only use 93 brand name gas and have never had an issue of pinging.

GreenSeMax

What dealership did you have it done at? I am thinking of going to Middletown but I've heard stories of them giving people **** about their mods, and if that's true they def. won't like my car..........just wanna get it done no questions asked.......damn stealership

sloppymax

iTrader: (8)

might be a long shot but check the phonebook for local repair shops that are nissan/infiniti specific. i found a small shop outside of charlotte that specializes so they had a consult 2 that they purchased from a dealer. they let me use it and only charged me 20 bucks.

doublea

iTrader: (7)

I drop my 2k1 to the dealer this morning, the IAC valve need to be change for the 2nd time in a month, while the car is being working on I've asked the technician to advance the timing to 17 degree, he said it cannot be done like dialing 17 instead of 15, he said when they bump the timing it is approximately around 2 degree well I said then go for it and I'll see what it does, anyway I'm only running the car with 92 + octane gas so I dont think the car will ping, anyway let's wait and see.

As for people who get $hit from the dealer because of their mods, well then it's time for you guys to put your pant on and tell them who's the owner of the car, dont let anybody talk to you like they'd owned you, show them who's the real boss cuz there is many dealer that want your business and if your actual dealer doesn't respect you then why should you give them your money ???

Cheers to all.

AA

theMax

The "high altitude" package on some cars reduces the timing because the octanes are lower (Bought my first car in Colorado, regular was 85 octane). Not sure if this is the reason some cars are set at 13.

unrealii

iTrader: (8)

I would say that could be it, because there are a lot of factors which affect how the car burns fuel and environmental ones are significant.

dextterity

I go to Miller Ford/Nissan in fairfield, it's right off exit 24 (blackrock turnpike) on I-95. They could care less if your car is modded. I don't have much done for performance but a berk intake and a warpspeed y-pipe and custom b-pipe. fstb, rsb, progress springs and tokico illumina struts. anyway, when you get an oil change they check a lot of stuff and have a sheet checking good/fair/poor (as an example) and one mechanic was putting extra stuff like "NICE" under suspension, !! under my horn since i have the tripple tone air horn heh, and other things, anyway i'm pretty happy with miller.
Any other questions you can PM me

maximapitko

there was a tremendous difference in my car after I advanced the timing. You can feel it mostly after 60 mph. From 0-60 i can't really tell...My mpg haven't changed a bit. I consistently get 450 miles for a full tank(70% highway). I have a VG though...

IceY2K1

iTrader: (3)

VGs advance the whole timing curve...

Advancing VQs base IDLE timing only effects <2000rpm, which really only matters on automatics punching it out of the hole. By 2000rpm, I've logged >20-degrees with the stock advance curve lightly feathering the gas/clutch and when you really throttle it, it advances much further.

You guys need your butt dynos calibrated again.

dextterity

i can probably agree with that, i'm auto and can't really say that i felt anything that different at high rpms but my car seemed to want to pull more than normal at lower rpms going around my back roads

MaxArt

Been playing with the base timing on Max's since the early 90's(and various 'merican stuff for over 40 years). Lots of theories out there, but 5 and 5.5 gen Max's can handle 2 or 3 degrees nicely. Again, the factory compromises a little on the safe side - so 15 degrees is the safe setting in case it's set a little off . Don't get carried away, especially with winter fuel, because the knock sensing is likely to defeat you at the most inopportune times. You're looking to get the plug to fire at the optimum number of degrees of crank rotation before top-dead-center of the piston travel to get maximum burn time for the down power stroke (remember the higher octane makes the fuel less "volatile" slowing the burn and prolonging the "push" on the piston). Too soon and the fuel explosion will hit the piston on the way up causing a "knock" or "ping." Too late and the piston has started to travel down and some push opportunity has been lost. The nice thing here is that this easy mod will not only get you a little more power and engine breaking, - but for the guy who asked, you'll probably get a little better gas mileage because of the efficiency. Unless you're constantly pounding the accelerator to verify the extra power. Ol' timers would tell you that a little knock was the sound of power and economy, so they were always playing with the timing and advance curves - they just didn't do it with Consults and ECU's.

NYPD-Arnold

iTrader: (8)

Us 5th gens can go up to 18 without the ECU reseting right? Would you advise against it? I've been at 17 for a bit now, and was thinking maybe 18 would be ok since since 17 restricts you to using 91+, meanwhile I solely use 93. What do you think?

Komax

no one answered the question about the possible negatives (if any) of advancing the timing to 17. anyone?

joebangaa

iTrader: (3)

hm so only under 2k rpms...makes it less attractive but i guess its something for my automagic