Custommaxima FSTB
03-12-2010, 09:59 AM
#41
Racingline Performance. See Post #11, or my sig.
I chose that over Stillen because of better price, better aesthetics and better design... however, those last two are subjective opinions.
I chose that over eBay because I was wanting quality. Another subjective opinion.
If he were still making them, I would have bought the old Cattman Ti-bar.
I chose that over Stillen because of better price, better aesthetics and better design... however, those last two are subjective opinions.
I chose that over eBay because I was wanting quality. Another subjective opinion.
If he were still making them, I would have bought the old Cattman Ti-bar.
03-12-2010, 10:29 AM
#44
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Comparing CustomMaxima and Fleabay FSTB, there's not much difference. One uses a flat stock and the other a billet (round) bar.
The forces on a strut bar can be downward and upward. More on upward when you are turning. The whole body is leaning on the strut. This upward force is being transferred via the FSTB link to the other tower, making it rigid and one piece. Hence better handling. JM2C.
The forces on a strut bar can be downward and upward. More on upward when you are turning. The whole body is leaning on the strut. This upward force is being transferred via the FSTB link to the other tower, making it rigid and one piece. Hence better handling. JM2C.
If you have a net upward or downward force on something, it accelerates (moves). Since it stays attached to the car, there is no upward or downward force.
The bar goes into tension or compression.
I am guessing you are a very young engineer.....correct?
Last edited by vball_max; 03-12-2010 at 10:52 AM.
03-12-2010, 10:30 AM
#45
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Yeah, I like the look of the custommaxima one. I think I'll get it when I can afford it... I've heard that custommaxima uses pretty decent materials. I've heard nothing but good things about them since ownership changed. I'll be ordering their Cat-back exhaust + cat/test pipe as soon as I have the funds. Then FSTB...
03-12-2010, 10:49 AM
#46
03-12-2010, 11:03 AM
#47
Huh??? Upward or downward????
If you have a net upward or downward force on something, it accelerates (moves). Since it stays attached to the car, there is no upward or downward force.
The bar goes into tension or compression.
Just so you know, bolts can break to. Welds typically crack under fatigue loading. In this case, I would think a welded connection would be stronger, because the bolt is so small and the weld electrode is typically very high strength. And also, the welded connections provides more rigidity, which is the main goal here. However, the bolt is required for the adjustability factor.
I am guessing you are a very young engineer.....correct?
If you have a net upward or downward force on something, it accelerates (moves). Since it stays attached to the car, there is no upward or downward force.
The bar goes into tension or compression.
Just so you know, bolts can break to. Welds typically crack under fatigue loading. In this case, I would think a welded connection would be stronger, because the bolt is so small and the weld electrode is typically very high strength. And also, the welded connections provides more rigidity, which is the main goal here. However, the bolt is required for the adjustability factor.
I am guessing you are a very young engineer.....correct?
would the car really be put under enough stress to break the welds? would it happen with normal driving or would it take something extreme like auto-x?
B
03-12-2010, 11:37 AM
#48
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I was thinking the same thing. I figured all one piece steel bar would be much better that steel brackets and Aluminum bar. might be heavier but again the added strength of the steel and the welds would be a good compromise
would the car really be put under enough stress to break the welds? would it happen with normal driving or would it take something extreme like auto-x?
B
would the car really be put under enough stress to break the welds? would it happen with normal driving or would it take something extreme like auto-x?
B
Making it one piece might create some problems with installation. I think the strut towers are tilted inwards a slight bit, so dropping the brackets over both sides at the same time might cause some issues. Thats probably another reason that they are typically made with the brackets bolted to the bar with some adjustability.
To answer your question about the weld strength, it depends on the size of the weld (throat thickness and length). The force that goes through the strut bar is dependent on the rigidity of the cars frame vs. the rigidity of the strut bar. Its pretty much impossible to calculate without a lot more information so no one can really tell you what the force is and whether or not it will break the weld. However, I have never heard of anyone breaking a weld on their strut bar. The bolt would probably slip before the weld would break.
03-12-2010, 11:46 AM
#49
Personally, i would go with aluminum if you have it available to you and you have some experience welding aluminum. The strength to weight ratio of aluminum is much greater than steel.
Making it one piece might create some problems with installation. I think the strut towers are tilted inwards a slight bit, so dropping the brackets over both sides at the same time might cause some issues. Thats probably another reason that they are typically made with the brackets bolted to the bar with some adjustability.
To answer your question about the weld strength, it depends on the size of the weld (throat thickness and length). The force that goes through the strut bar is dependent on the rigidity of the cars frame vs. the rigidity of the strut bar. Its pretty much impossible to calculate without a lot more information so no one can really tell you what the force is and whether or not it will break the weld. However, I have never heard of anyone breaking a weld on their strut bar. The bolt would probably slip before the weld would break.
Making it one piece might create some problems with installation. I think the strut towers are tilted inwards a slight bit, so dropping the brackets over both sides at the same time might cause some issues. Thats probably another reason that they are typically made with the brackets bolted to the bar with some adjustability.
To answer your question about the weld strength, it depends on the size of the weld (throat thickness and length). The force that goes through the strut bar is dependent on the rigidity of the cars frame vs. the rigidity of the strut bar. Its pretty much impossible to calculate without a lot more information so no one can really tell you what the force is and whether or not it will break the weld. However, I have never heard of anyone breaking a weld on their strut bar. The bolt would probably slip before the weld would break.
when you say great strength to weight ratio...do you mean that if i have a certain piece of Al and a certain piece of steel with the same strength rating that the Al will weight less? Wouldnt that mean that i would need a larger amount of Al seeing as steel is denser or am I wrong?
thanks for all the input by everyone. this is great info and a lot of help
B
03-12-2010, 12:10 PM
#50
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when you say great strength to weight ratio...do you mean that if i have a certain piece of Al and a certain piece of steel with the same strength rating that the Al will weight less? Wouldnt that mean that i would need a larger amount of Al seeing as steel is denser or am I wrong?
B
B
The tensile yield strength of structural steel is typically between 36,000-50,000 psi and it weights about 490 lbs./cu.ft.
The tensile yield strength of good aluminum alloys typically range from 30,000-40,000 psi and weighs about 165 lbs./cu.ft.
So generally speaking, you can get the same performance out of a lighter piece of metal using aluminum.
Last edited by vball_max; 03-12-2010 at 12:12 PM.
03-12-2010, 12:26 PM
#51
It depends on what you mean by "strength rating"......
The tensile yield strength of structural steel is typically between 36,000-50,000 psi and it weights about 490 lbs./cu.ft.
The tensile yield strength of good aluminum alloys typically range from 30,000-40,000 psi and weighs about 165 lbs./cu.ft.
So generally speaking, you can get the same performance out of a lighter piece of metal using aluminum.
The tensile yield strength of structural steel is typically between 36,000-50,000 psi and it weights about 490 lbs./cu.ft.
The tensile yield strength of good aluminum alloys typically range from 30,000-40,000 psi and weighs about 165 lbs./cu.ft.
So generally speaking, you can get the same performance out of a lighter piece of metal using aluminum.
basically what i wanted to accomplish was create something like the blehmco LTB of course for the top side. I figured the extra rigidity of the all steel on piece construction would offer better benefits over the pieced FSTB's. Theoretically it makes sense but applying that is the obvious problem.
B
03-12-2010, 12:58 PM
#52
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kgallerie,
"I am guessing you are a very young engineer.....correct?"
Unfortunately not my friend.
Anyway, as I have seen on my friend's ES330, the strut bar is roll formed steel, punched, 1 piece. Now that's good except for the weight. No bolts, no weld. Can take all the compressive, torsional loads.
"I am guessing you are a very young engineer.....correct?"
Unfortunately not my friend.
Anyway, as I have seen on my friend's ES330, the strut bar is roll formed steel, punched, 1 piece. Now that's good except for the weight. No bolts, no weld. Can take all the compressive, torsional loads.
03-12-2010, 01:09 PM
#53
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torsional loads? I dont think strut bars see torsion, but sway bars do.
03-12-2010, 01:18 PM
#54
like i said the steel is free and i have a large selection to chose from. free materials and labor to weld, cant really beat that to experiment
B
03-12-2010, 01:25 PM
#56
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Roll formed into flat channel. The ends might be welded, we'll see the pics, soon, but I thought they were punched formed, too.
03-12-2010, 01:36 PM
#59
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I would say a pipe. In tension, the shape doesnt typically have a huge effect, however in compression, a round pipe is the most effective shape. But with the clearance issues, you might run into trouble using a pipe. Something flatter might fit better.
03-12-2010, 04:30 PM
#60
B
03-12-2010, 05:45 PM
#61
03-16-2010, 08:07 AM
#66
For a FSTB to be most effective, it should solid and one piece preferably, like this one:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ULTRA...Q5fAccessories
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ULTRA...Q5fAccessories
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