Good question. Maybe someone else can chime in, but I got nothing...

 

KSports are ON!!!

The install was fairly straightforward. The car is LOW. Fender heights: LF - 26 3/8" RF - 26 1/2" LR - 25 1/4" RR - 25 3/4"

I'm basically a half inch too low on the driver's side, but it really is negligible.

I'm VERY surprised that the car's alignment is as good as it is. There's VERY little pull to the right, if any. I have it 1.5 turns from full soft, and it's a great feel for a DD.

So yeah, they're on, and I'm a happy camper. No squeaks, rattles, clicks, or noises as of yet. I can't wait to crank them to full stiff, to see how dramatic the change is. On my DD setting, the car is like a gokart... a BIG gokart, but a gokart, nonetheless.


--Evan


ps... I'll get pics when it's a little warmer out, and the car is clean. The Lady is a dirty b!tch right now. It figures though... I wash the car on monday, it rains like a motherf*cker yesterday. Dah!

 

For what it's worth, full stiff is enough to rattle your teeth out.


Full stiff = handling like a rollercoaster. It's I N C R E D I B L E.


I seriously can not believe how dramatic of a change this product was for my car... it's still understeer-happy, but as soon as the rear sway bar starts loading up, and the rear shocks start working in synchronicity with the fronts, WOW. It's 100% predictable, tight (like a tiger), and the handling is simply amazing. From a driver's standpoint... more specifically, a competitive driver's standpoint... this is by far, the best investment for the money.

 

It's always good to have competent feedback. I'm also glad to hear from someone who has a RSB. A lot of people seem to still be chanting the "RSB is bad if you're lowered" mantra without realizing that no one who says that from experience has coilovers...

 

Oh BTW, in case anyone cares, I just noticed on Ksport USA's website that they switched oil seal manufacturers as of October of last year. It could be for quality reasons, or it could just be that they got a better deal. I doubt we're ever going to find out for sure one way or the other, but there it is...

 

I wanted an RSB but apparently i'll have 'unpredictable oversteer' and spin out.....this is judging by what i've been reading.....i had a feeling that most of these people are just talking out of their azz, and now i'm just going to get the RSB and see for myself. Next mod: rsb, then ltb2 in another month....inside i knew i couldnt stop modding....

oh yeah dood, i ended up not getting those softer springs. When it warmed up over here for about a week, the ride improved and it wasn't THAT bad anymore...its back to cold now and its hard as hell but o well, it should warm up soon again.

 

Springs aren't nearly as sensitive to temperature as the viscosity of the oil in the struts is, so the difference in ride quality comes almost entirely from the difference in damping. You'd still notice a temperature-based difference in ride quality with the softer springs.


Norm

 

Thanks, Norm.


About the RSB, this has been something I have been trying to debate intelligently with .org members and I think I can count on one hand the number of people who have actually kept their facts straight (Norm, Bejay, Nealoc, etc.). The thing is that most people who lower their cars just have spring-and-damper combos (Eibach/AGX, H-Tech/Illumina, etc.), which means they have progressive-rate springs with rates that are roughly equal front-to-rear or higher in the rear. By contrast, most coilover kits for the Maxima have high-linear-rate springs with rates that are much higher in front. That is a night-and-day difference as far as handling behavior, and a RSB will make very different contributions in each case.

Here is what I suspect -- maybe Norm can chime in here: Aftermarket spring kits are specifically designed to reduce understeer bias, so adding a RSB to such a setup can leave too little understeer bias for most people to feel comfortable with. The progressive spring rates make the amount of understeer bias different under different circumstances because the spring rates change under compression, which would make the setup less "predictable". Since coilover kits like the Ksport Kontrol Pro have much higher spring rates in front than in back, they actually increase understeer bias (although you're less likely to see that understeer because the limits of grip are higher), and they give much more consistent handling behavior because the spring rates are linear. Adding a RSB to that setup will still leave you with a safe amount of understeer bias and won't produce "unpredictable" behavior.

 

Although it does have something to do with the spring rate ratio f/r, I think it has more to do with the design of the rear beam.

If we had IRS, I would say run whatever sway bar you want, but with the beam if you have a RSB and stiff springs, there is no allowance for give. How many 3 wheeling maximas do you see in autocrosses pictures. In the more advanced suspension tuning and driving skill/techniques many of you in here, it may not be an issue or you can tune it to where it was not noticable. But I think most maxima people should just know that throwing a RSB on will change the way the car drives, possibly for the worse.

I also would rather at least some front sway bar options if we were really serious about using a RSB. Honestly I think the best option is getting polyurethane bushing for the stock beam and FSB, either filling it custom or ES. Bending the beam for toe also would help get some more oversteer without causing the rear beam to become completely solid, which is something most people do not want.

 

I don't think that the aftermarket "lowering spring" kits are primarily aimed at reducing understeer. If that happens, it's incidental. Aside from ride height, they are more intended to maintain something close to the OE "flat ride" pitch behavior. Even the off-the-shelf GC kits are set up on this basis (I've looked into them for another car). Keep in mind that many (if not most) aftermarket spring sales are made on the basis of "appearance", and that it really is only a hardcore minority of drivers who will actively choose to live with a really stiff-legged ride on a daily basis, or a ride that may become slightly "pitchy" as the dampers deteriorate with age. Sales and "average customer satisfaction" are probably driving the OTS specs more than cornering performance does.

Very briefly, maintaining OE pitch behavior means that the rear suspension ride frequency is slightly higher than that up front, perhaps 15% or so (there are more involved calculation methods available). Pitch response is not something that you can estimate by simple comparisons of spring rates - it's also sensitive to weight distribution, wheelbase, speed, and damping. IOW, if you double the spring rates both front and rear and touch nothing else, your pitch response will not remain the same. If the springs contribute more roll stiffness than you lose to extra roll from having a roll center that drops faster than the CG, you'll end up with more favorable (less unfavorable?) front camber, gain a little front grip and lose a little front slip angle - and that's where part of any steady-state understeer reduction is going to come from.

That the front roll center drops fairly quickly (perhaps twice as fast as the front ride height at the front axle line) while the RC for most any beam axle linkage rarely drops more than half as fast as rear ride height means that the vehicle roll axis has been made steeper. If there were no other changes going on, this would be associated with a greater tendency to oversteer, as well as providing a livelier turn-in (it is possible that "livelier turn-in" is what's catching a few folks off-guard). IOW, this is part of the reasoning for how lowering can add to the effect of a RSB.

You may be able to tune around this to a certain extent by selecting relatively stiffer front springs or relatively softer rears, and this may be what some companies are doing.

Linear rate springs are certainly more predictable, which generally translates into greater driver confidence and quicker run/lap times.


Norm

 

I see. Thanks for the explanation, Norm. Very informative, as always.

I want to discuss this further but I'm out of time for now. I will be back...

 

I'm guessing it's because they got a better deal....



My right rear is blown already... after ~300 miles, and 3 days. The car still drives AMAZINGLY, but there's fluid all over the place on the pass. rear corner. I cut out part of the trunk liner, so that there would be easy access to the coilovers... I go and adjust them tonight, just for caca and giggles, and suprise.... there's KSport money shot all over the place. That's frustrating.

I'm aware that I'm WELL within warranty limits, but I'm just worried about turnaround time. Is it true they stopped doing advance replacements? I can't be without my vehicle... I literally drive 80+ miles every day, all highway. Hopefully KSport Support and I can work out something.

 

There's fluid on the inside of the trunk? That's odd... I don't recall a blown damper ever doing that...

Jack the car up, pull the wheel, and slide the dustboot up so you can see the top of the damper body. There should be a sticker around where the dustboot sits that says "warranty void if seal removed" or something. If that sticker is broken and there's oil on it, that's a blown damper. If the sticker is intact and that area is dry, the stuff in your trunk is from elsewhere.

If you do call Ksport, could you do us a favor and ask them why it is that they switched to a new seal manufacturer? I'm starting to think they know me and my role in this thread by now so it might help to have a second angle on this.

 

Okay I'm kind of upset right now because I just found out my front driver side shock is blown. If felt blown when going over pot holes, but decided to take a look at it today. It's pouring shock fluid all over the place, and after jacking up the car I have a puddle on the ground. This sucks because I've had my Ksports for two years and last summer my rear shock blew. I got it fixed by KSports in the summer so I'm going to call them and demand they fix this one with a advance replacement.

 

I have been a supporter of KSports for almost two years now. I bought a set for my 96 Maxima back in August of 2005. I've loved them since the day I put them on my car. I was the lowest Maxima in Connecticut. KSport offers a one year warranty period. I had a rear shock blow within the first eight months and I got it replaced by KSport with an advanced replacement. Okay, no problem, but when will the next shock blow? Because I'm hearing all these horror stories from people in this thread. It will blow on my next car...

Now it's April of 2007 and my front driver's shock is blown. I now own a 98 Maxima and installed my Ksport coilovers on it still slammed. Within the past week, I noticed my front driver's side shock getting louder and stiffer. Fluid is pouring out of the shock and the shock rumbles over bumps. I called KSport and there is NOTHING they can do for me because I am out of the one year warranty period, except sell me a new shock for $120. Now I am fed up this company and their service. Who knows, next year another shock will probably blow.

I talked to a representative at KSport and he said they do not do an advanced replacements anymore. I was arguing that this is my second shock and demanded an advanced replacement. I care don't about putting a deposit as long as they refund it. He said alright, but you need to send me a reciept of when you bought the KSports. I bought mine form Jinsu back in 2005, so there is nothing they can do.

I might be selling my KSports and buying some Boss Chens. Here is the damage:

2 years, 2 shocks blown



I'll probably type more as I think of it, but I do not recommend KSports anymore.

 

Here is the conversation I had with KSport via computer:

Me: Did you guys change the design of the shock to be stronger in resisting failure?
ksportsupport: we are constantly upgrading the quality of the products
Me: And lowering the prices.
Me: So I paid more for a lesser quality part.
ksportsupport: no, we actually raised them

 

Stop whining. You bought a budget suspension kit from a new-ish company with high spring rates, you drove it year-round on rough roads in the Northeast, and something broke. Well no sh*t. Now, since you're well beyond the terms of the one year warranty that you knew Ksport had when you bought the kit, they won't cover you. No sh*t again. Man up, take your licks, tell us about it if you want, and move on. If you think you'll have better luck with Boss Chens, go for it and check back in with us a year and a half from now to tell us how they're holding up. But complaining that Ksport won't cover you when you're out of warranty and then telling us all about how you tried to bully them about it is a childish waste of space.

I'm all for reporting blowouts when they happen (although I wonder why no one has taken me up on my offer to keep records of failures), but this thread is in serious danger of turning into a support group. That's not helpful to anyone.

 

I would just like to give some of my input on this particular situation and would like to be as subjective as possible on this.

1) Ksport clear states that the warranty is for 1 year after purchase. Anything beyond 1 year period is no longer cover under warranty.

2) Both ksportusa and Jinsu-power sales recoard shows that you purchased the kit in August 2005, however, when you emailed ksport your copy of paypal invoice, the invoice show August 2006. I am not sure what happened there.

3) I would like to know how were you setting the coilover for ride height? were you turning the spring perch or the shock mount?

4) How often do you clean and lube your coilover? full coilovers often requires monthly mantainance of cleaning and lubing for street use to make sure no road debris gets into the seals.

 

Thank you Jinsu for responding.

1) I understand the one year warranty period they have standard. KSport is a relatively new company, but I don't know one person with KSports that doesn't have at least one blown shock. It's cool that they will replace them within the first year, but I can pretty much guaranty that one will blow every year after that. I actually think one of my rear shocks is on its way out too. I asked for an extended warranty and they do offer one.

2) I did e-mail a copy of my PayPal invoice which was edited to show that I bought them within the past year. The invoice I sent actually said June of 2006. I was just frustrated because I spent a lot of money on the suspension and said they couldn't do anything. The representative at KSport that I talked to on Friday said I could get an advanced replacement if I bought it within the past year, now they are saying they can't do anything at all because I attempted fraud. Seems like they are using my mistakes as an excuse not to help me anymore.

3) I am positive I installed my KSports correctly and kept them in good shape. I have installed them three times and have done other suspension installs. I followed the directions in this thread and tip from other people to keep zero pre-load on the spring. I basically hand tighten the spring perches, but finish them with a hammer to make sure the spring doesn't move. I do not adjust ride height with the spring. If I wanted to do that I would get Tein Coilovers. I adjust ride height on my KSports with the bottom shock/strut mount. Both of my cars have been set to lower around 3".

I am sorry if I hurt your business in anyway Jinsu. I appreciate the deal you gave me for the KSports back in the day. I am basically out of luck on this situation.

 

Not a problem, just trying to clear up things for everyone. It's just part of the game when it comes to car modifications. Some ppl has better luck and sometime things just don't work out. But feel free to contact me if you need anything and i will do what i can.

 

I don't understand the hostility d00df00d? Maybe I shouldn't be complaining about my blown shock situations, but come on it's annoying when a shock blows. I do think #1495 was valid because it might let someone decide if they want to buy KSports or not. Someone might not want a suspension that risks blowing a shock every 15k miles and the included maintenance. I think if there were 50 pages of this thread before I decided on KSports I wouldn't have bought them. I will not buy another set or shock from them until they fix their problems.

I am a television sales man (Wow! Cool job right? NO!). I know how this is first hand. People complain all the time when their television breaks after the warranty period is over. They as spending a lot of money on the televisions too. It's just human nature to argue or complain about the situation. I can offer customers extended warranties which will cover longer than the manufacturer. KSport does not. I think I wouldn't care as much if not as many people had problems with blown KSport shocks. To me it's a very common problem and yields an unsatisfactory product. Televisions do not seem to break this easy. Wait another year and we will see how many people still have KSports on their cars.

Maybe d00df00d just has a perfect set of coilovers and has never needed one replaced because one never blew? I am not kicking myself in the butt for buying them. They are awesome because they make my car look awesome and I like playing with them adjusting height and what not. I've learned a lot from them and were basically the only setup available two years ago. Boss Chens have come out and I won't buy them until I see more reviews after a longer period of time.

You have a very strong argument to support the failure rate of KSports. To me it's too high and since two of mine have blown it sucks even more. Even though I'm in Connecticut, I know a kid in Texas that has two of his blow. Climate does play a part but I think it's not that important. KSports should survive more than 1 winter.

 

Thank you Jinsu! Please let KSport know what's up. I don't want to create any more confusion and would rather not talk with them right now. But your right it is part of car modifications so nothing will be perfect. I'm just mad that so many of these shocks have or will blow quickly.

 

For the record, I've had five blowouts. I just don't complain because I've had them for 50k miles and two winters, hit a few bumps that literally left me wondering why my front end was still in one piece, and made some very stupid errors in the install at first. Only one of those five blowouts was clearly due to a defect in the damper and not my idiocy (it was a replacement damper that blew a month later), and Ksport went out on a limb and warranteed it even though I was several months out of warranty.

I didn't mean to be overly hostile. I just hate that this thread is turning into a support group for people who don't seem to realize that coilovers are not a mod you should do unless you're fully willing to take your car's reliability into your own hands. The fact that people are complaining that Ksport won't bend over backwards to cover them outside the terms of their very clear warranty -- which shouldn't even apply to them in the first place -- is absurd. The fact that they're being compared to televisions of all things just breaks my head.

I'm going to rehash this once more and once more only, because I'm getting tired of it.

People are treating these things like straight-up OEM replacement equipment and placing the same expectations on them, which is silly because they make drastic changes to the stresses your car sees. When you take your car this far outside the envelope of what it's designed for, you just can't expect it to work the same. You HAVE to pay attention to what you're doing because stuff is GOING to break and wear out quickly.

Also for the record, cold weather and rough roads are terrible on suspension even individually. Together, they're all-out murder. Next time you ride on your Ksports, watch cars in front of you go over dips and bumps in the road and pay attention to how slow their movements are. Then, when you go over the same dips and bumps, pay attention to how quick your car's movements are. In short, that's because your springs are so stiff that your suspension oscillates MUCH faster than it did before. Now, factor in that every one of those oscillations involves a few hundred pounds of unsprung weight moving up and down with thousands of pounds of car on top of it. Those masses combined with those velocities make for some pretty freakin' violent suspension motion. That's the kind of force that the oil seals in your dampers see. And when the weather gets colder, the metal shrinks, the oil gets thicker, and the rubber hardens and becomes brittle. You do the math on that and tell me if a low-single-digits annual failure rate in the Northeast still sounds bad.

And I'm not just talking about Ksport here. ANY coilover kit with super-stiff springs is going to be like that. Some will be better than others, but the principle is the same: they won't be remotely as reliable as stock or stock-style springs and dampers. JIC tells you straight up that you can't expect more than 2 years out of any of their coilovers before you need rebuilds. Even Progress coilovers, which are among the *****-out sturdiest you can get for the Maxima, have the same issue with blowing dampers in cold weather and over bad bumps. Let's do some more math now: Those are coilovers that cost hundreds more than Ksports, and most of them don't have the same degree of adjustability.

If no one is getting poor customer service and the failure rate is still in the low single digits, there is no reason to complain. People need to stop treating their coilovers as inocuous mods and start thinking of them like they'd think of a turbo kit: stuff WILL break, and if you don't set it up perfectly and use it perfectly then stuff will break SOON.

That said, please do not hesitate to tell us about your blown dampers. If Ksport's failure rate is worse than they say it is, we need to know. But please, for the love of all that is holy, stop whining. This thread could be used incredibly constructively, and we need to stop getting mired in the odd blown damper story.

 

I think i need some help setting up my shock settings. How do i know where to set it? Now it's 2 turns from hard on front and 1 turn from hard on back.

 

Start at full soft all around.

In general, if you get too much bouncing/wallowing, turn it up. If it hits too hard, turn it down. But if you get caught in a situation where one setting is too bouncy and the next one up is too hard, keep dialing it up. You might find a better one higher in the range. Don't be afraid to go all the way around the dial.

 

Ok. Thats what i did. Seems like its bouncy at every setting. I let my friend drive my car while i drove behind, and my rear was hopping up and down constantly. I'm sure there's a solution for this problem, but i don't know what it is.

 

Hopping as in kicking up when you hit a bump, or hopping as in bouncing up and down after a bump? The former is to be expected with your weight reduction. The latter might be due to damper settings.

 

Very nice reply d00df00d!

 

honestly i don't know because the car i was driving(stock SE) was perfectly smooth over the same road, and i saw my car going up and down everywhere. I think it kicks up when i hit a bump though. I saw an M3 driving on the same road today and his car was doign what my car was doing, except to a smaller extent, so i guess its kicking. Only way to fix this that i see is softer springs, which i was already about to do once but decided against it because i got used to the ride quality.

 

That definitely sounds like your rear springs are too stiff for how much your rear end weighs, at least as far as your tailbone is concerned.

 

Oh i'm used to the ride, thats not the problem here, the problem is that i want to make sure my shocks are set properly, just so that won't be the reason they fail. I'm assuming it's all good then. I'm starting to think softer springs will help my handling on these less than perfect roads. What do you think?

 

Softer springs will only help if you often find yourself skittering off when you hit bumps in mid-corner. If that's not the case, I'd say leave your current springs alone.

 

I've sent a few emails to KSport Support, with pictures of my blown rear shock, and copies of the PayPal receipt from when I bought them.... but have received no response as of yet. Literally, within the first 300 miles, it was blown. And factoring in I drive almost 80 miles a day, every day, miles keep racking up on a blown shock. I'm hoping to have the new one here before the first autoX of the season, on the 15th.... but if I don't get ahold of them, I'm in some poopoo.

 

Call them.

 

this has been a good read everyone. i have Tein SS's and was thinking about KSports as a possible replacement. i've had my Teins for two and a half years with no blow outs. i sent in my CO's to Tein USA once for a broken dampening adjustment *** which was replaced under warranty. i may still buy a set of KSports, but not to replace my Teins.

edit: forgot to mention, i've put 65k miles on the Teins which were used when i got them.

 

Chefasaurus - Call them at (480)829-8100. They have very good service over the phone or via AOL IM at ksportsupport.

 

IM or call is the best way to go. Ksport gets tons of email everyday so chance of them missing yours is very likely.

 

i went to get an alignment today because for some reason after installing my new motor it was all out of whack. toe was rediculous, camber was off too. Anyway, so i go to a shop who specializes in aftermarket suspension and this guy seemed knowledgable in what he was doing, i watched him the whole time. He didnt speak english extremely well so i didnt want to try to get in some awkward conversation where he explains this BUT......
when adjusting the camber he pushed my driver side pretty much as far as it would go towards the fender. The passenger side wasnt too far from the middle however. I know hte adjustment is there for a reason but what would cause the camber to be so biased towards that one side like that?
also, my control arm bushings are toasted.
also also, ksports + 3.5 = tire eating machine.

 

i installed my Ksports today but i have no clue what the top hats were i just installed them straight out of the box.. i got no problems the ride is great except for my steering wheel being like at 2 o clock when i drive straight

 

umm... how did you get the rears on w/o reusing the stock hats?