Apparently the priests are too

 

and with that, the thread is officially over... thanks jeff.

I am going to come to your house tonight and key your car.

(disclaimer, if for some reason, your car is keyed tonight, it wasn't me. it was the one armed man.)

 

Taken out of context. It's in Sprite context, which is in another dimension in itself.

You don't want to key may car.

 

hahahahhahaha eh don give it up you and jon argue about this everythime i see you guys. im surprised mr. nismo is in here spreading knowledge.

love my 4th gen

loved my 3rd gen

love maximas end of story for me.

 

 

Yeah I actually personally think Donald is taking this VE / VQ thing overboard. They're both the same family, and the VQ design I'm sure is a progession of the VE. Personally, I love teh VQ because it's mad mid-range punch, the smoothness and quietness, and the pretty even power band. Yeah the power does fall off at the end, but that's been proven to be directly related to the intake manifold. The VQ however has this insane midrange power that the VE doesn't.

 

**** poor taste, Jeff.

 

That is not right, this is what I mean. So now the VE doesnt have midrange? Brian, I dont mean to get all nutty, but look at my other post going on the west coast, I just replied to my reason behind all this, and I will talk at Dromo 1, you know things get misunderstood over the internet.

 

You know, I would be open for discussion regarding the suject but none of the posters have access to the off-topic discussion area.

 

Ok, so is the VQ30DE-K included in the VQ classification people keep throwing around?

If so, the -K(5th gen) intake manifold is variable and that is why 5th gens. pull ALL THE WAY to redline(6400rpms).

BTW, does anyone have links to a STOCK VE dyno chart? Thanks.

 

Probably, but then you gotta wonder about the validity or usefulness of comparing engines that were born ~10 years apart. Of course, you gotta wonder about the point of this whole thread...

With enough imagination and speculation, anything is possible!

-Jacob

 

Donald, I didn't say the VE lacked midrange, you opulled that out of my words. The VE is still a natural V6, of course it's going to have an awesome midrange, but it's unarguable that the VQ has a stronger midrange while the VE has a stronger highend (not including the vq-k).

George owns both the VQ and the VE, I think his input would be tangible as someone who drives both cars every day, and they both happen to be auto's.

 

I think 5-sp versions of both would be best. As the auto VE engine doesn't feature the varible volume intake manifold that the 5sp VE version does.

 

Good idea. I will see if I can test drive a 4th gen today (if I can find one for sale of course) and see what I think. Was gonna look at '02 Pathfinders anyway...

-Jacob

 

To each his own. Trying to convince a VE owner that the VQ is "better" (better being an open term), and vice versa, is like trying to tell a Jew that Christianity is "better". You can't change someone's mind if they already have their mind set before the discussion even begins. This discussion boils down to, the VE is better because I own one, or the VQ is better because I own one.

 

Well we have heard his opinion, and it does not stack up in the VQ's favor.

 

so the auto 92 94 SEs had a ve motor but no varible intake?

 

yes, varible cam timing but no varible volume intake manifold.

 

Any VE dynos? I want to see what all the top-end hoopla is about!

Couldn't MOST of these debates of whether the VE/VQ/VQ-K is better be solved with stock DYNO plots?


Some fuel for the fire:
Supposedly the 4th gen is faster than the 5th gen(VQ30DE-K), but that's ONLY in the 1/4-mile. Is that because they are lighter or better geared down low? Past 100mph, the VQ-K will pull on them due to the VIAS/variable manifold, but really, who compares 100+mph times?

 

I just got done burning into 3rd about 5 minutes ago

 

I'm suprised no one has posted this yet. The VQ30DE features not only forged parts but they are mirco polished and lightened. It also has slightly more displacement and a much lighter valvetrain. Basically the VQ30DE would make a better "NA" motor than a VE would due to the fact that the internals have less friction. This allows the engine to turn higher rpm before the internals destroy themselves. However I would say the VE would make a "better" engine to boost, its closed deck design and strong rods/crank should support 300-400whp before breaking. BTW I found out that the VE's bottom end is basically the same as the VG30DETT's is minus the oil squirters. Since the VE30DE has VTC and a higher flowing IM it would make "better" power given the same size turbo on a VQ30DE. But I do have to say that a 00+ VQ30DE is better than a VE30DE. It has a simular higher flowing IM + all the improvements the VQ made over the VG series.

 

Thread hijacking ended olice:

 

i'm going out on a limb to assume VQ upper motor parts arent even close to interchangable w/VE parts? i'm going for a straight up budget NA buildup w/my graduation money. nismo87se, i'll be hassling you for VE valvetrain info on AIM soon enough

 

VE valvetrain has varible cam timing. The VQ does not.

 

Dyno plot..

Only mod was a CAI at this time, so it's as close to stock as you're probably gonna get.
http://www.ee.utulsa.edu/~mblehm/pic...eline_dyno.jpg

 

so Don... how do the VTCs work on YOUR Maxima? hehe TICK TICK TICK ghetto rigged on and off? hahahaha j/p

remember after the canyon run your footage included your VEs wild tapping ticking clacking banging noises "What is that sound" hehe

Tick Tick Bang Kaboom clackety clack= VE

 

Weird... My VE sounds nice and smooth. What does a bad one sound like? I guess I will find out one day, but untill then...

-Jacob

 

92s are the only ones with the ticking problem hehe

I'm jus baggin on Don the VE is a great engine just makes some funny noises

 

ummm, actually all VE's have the problem, if the original owner did not take care of them. Just like the 2k2's will have the problem someday, if not maintained properly.

 

Alright, until I see slip for a NA modded VE hitting 95+mph in the 1/4 mile or getting low to mid 14s in the 1/4 with NA mods, I'll never agree that the VE is a "top end" killer. I looked over Matt93SE's dyno plot and my VQ peaks EXACTLY at the same rpm as his VE. My power falls off at the same pace just like his VE. He's making 150fwhp at 6300rpms and I'm making 152fwhp at 6300rpms. I'm making a ton more torque and HP from 2000-5500 rpms over his VE. I do need to note that I do have a Y-pipe, UDP, and B-pipe.

The 3rd gen Maxima weighs about 80-100lbs more than a 4th gen. The VQ is 90lbs lighter than the VE. That's pretty significant, especially in the handling department (front end push). "On paper" the 4th gen is a better handler. The beam is a little bumpy, but put it on a relatively flat surface a 3rd gen would be hard pressed to get away from a 4th gen. The 95-01 VQs are severely restricted by their y-pipes. We all know how significant an aftermarekt Y-pipe is on the VQ. The VE/VG just doesn't gain the same kind of power because it doesn't have a very restrictive y-pipe. Mod for mod, the VQ just seems to make more power. No VTC and no variable manifold, yet the VQ makes more useable power and out accelerates the VE. Is the VQ a better motor overall? IMO, yes. Is the VE turbo ready? Yup. Is the VE a sweet motor and is the 3rd gen sweet looking? Yep.


Dave

 

I think my VQ does

 

VQ,VE,VG all have extremely stupidly designed Y pipes. They all show big gains with aftermarket y pipes.

 

In short then, you are saying the VQ and the 4th gen is better as a whole? I can live with that myself since cars are touted to be new and improved in every new year. I would hope they would be better.

I don't agree about the suspension though - I mean yeah, a beam axle is better in one particular area (glass smooth surface), but where I live (planet Earth) there aren't too many of those. Not even on autox or road courses. If you are talking about a Camaro on a dragstrip - then yeah, the beam axle is great. I'm gonna go ahead and agree with what all the car mags said about the 4th gen - yeah it's cheaper and you can probably fit more luggage in the trunk now, but... The Maxima is supposed to be a sports sedan, etc.

You quoted some numbers - VQ being 90lbs lighter than the VE, 4th being 80-100lbs lighter, 4th gen out-accellerating the VE car. Sources? I ask because I would really like to know, not because I doubt you. I parked my '93 SE 5spd on a truck scale in my area - with a full tank of gas, power leather seats, everything on board (even CDs in the changer) it said "3100" on the readout. Anyone have some actual from-a-scale weight of a similarly equipped 4th gen?

Please keep in mind all of this from me is curiousity and the desire to know more about Maximas. I am pretty happy with my car, but I don't think it's superior to any other or anything. I also think 4th gens are pretty cool. Haven't gotten used to the 5th gens yet tho...

-Jacob

 

Even as a former VE owner and a current VQ owner, I will have to say that engine wise the VQ is better, at least in my case. My VE gave me numerous problems, it was also more noisy and no where near as smooth as the VQ, the low end in my VQ is just crazy.. I've driven quite a few VEs, good and bad conditions and they simply don't compare.

The 92-94 SEs and just all 3rd gens may have been better built as cars, talking about the built quality of materials and plastics etc.. They also handle better stock for stock compared with the 4th gens and some argue they look better... BUT, the VQs do not face the bs problems that the 3rd gen owners go through with their VTCs, ****ty automatic transmissions that are bound to fail prematurely, exhaust studs etc.. I spent almost 3 grand in repairs alone on my VE in a year worth ownership. My VQ? = about 100$ for tune-up parts.. Ofcourse it can be said that my VE was obviously in bad shape, it's still well known the 4th gens are more practical and more reliable, and faster The fastest N/A VE is 14.3 with some engine work if i'm not mistaken. Second fastest is who? JonnyMax with 14.6?.. the fastest N/A VQ is 14.0 flat so far. With a whole lot of others in the low 14s with regular bolt ons, not even all of them.. The 3rd gen has it's good things which i still miss to this day, handling, looks and interior quality are all superior to the 4th gen, but the 4th gen has it's perks as well.

I will also have to agree with Sprint on something to an extent, not pointing fingers at anyone, but in general.. the 3rd gen guys seem to be always knocking on the 4th gens, making fun of the looks and such and boasting about the greatness of the VE/VG.. while essentially, they have much more problems and are not all that great as you guys make them out to be. Why are you going to mod your automatic VGs and even VEs for power when a STOCK VQ can hang and kick the *** of either one lol, just saying.. I mean they are great cars and all, but chill out guys, yes, there is potential for the car but how many of you have actually followed through on it? VE30DE, czar and maybe a very few others? Thats it.. Don't take this the wrong way, just pointing out some things i noticed.

 

I remember those days! man we both used to struggle together, me with my ****ty trans and you with basically every component on your car ...I know you were happy to step into the 4th gen!

 

oh yeesss. At the time i used to get paranoid quickly, everytime my car would downshift or upshift late, or rough I'd get the feeling my tranny is about to go, lol.. but when i sold it, the tranny felt the same way it did before it died the 1st time.. so I'm kind of glad i did it. But then again, I miss so many things about the 3rd gen, it's crazy.. everytime i ride over a bump the rear end of the car feels like it's riding rid on the wheels, no springs or struts, so ****ing stiff Both are nice cars, if not for the reliability issues I had with the 3rd gen, i'd still gladly be driving it and buy one again since the 4th gen cost me an arm and a leg.. If the 3rd gen is running well, keep it till the grave because the car isn't really worth much if sold anyways, so what the hell..

 

Controversy =

 

It sickens me to see others post about the advantage of the VQ Vs. VE and someone calls them a hater. Get off it already! Didn't we have this discussion before?

I'm actually going to have to agree with Sprint and Dave B. Sprint made a nice point about the post starter and him on his quest to find his precious VE superior in everyway to the VQ and Dave made a great point about the 1/4mile times of the VQ and the handling (On paper though) which shows its clearly better than the VE mod for mod, stock for stock, with equal drivers in acceleration and handling. BUT, we all know the 3rd gen will handle best whent he road is lumpy.

You guys talk about the VE having great top-end power. 190HP will only go so far. The first post discussed about the TQ curve of the VE where it peaks at some 4,000rpms and maintains that all the way to redline. Must we lie to make one self feel better? Where are the engine dyno's to prove that? The VQ30DE-K will pull all the way to redline, and doesn't quit around 6,000rpms like the VQ30DE. The VQ30DE engine has better low/mid range power which is why it will more than likely win a stoplight to stoplight match. Race a VQ30DE-K on a highway roll, and you'll both likely to be walked on.

Not being a VE "hater" Just stating some facts. Stop thinking that we're all haters if we state some facts. If you don't want to believe, then there's the door --->



Oh and VQ power

 

Hmm.. if there are no dyno's, and you seem to have no experience with the VE, what are you basing your assumptions on? **** you've heard on the board? Doesn't matter to me, I can respect the pro's and cons of each engine, and at the end of the day, its only a car? Oh well, its must be nice to know that the fastest Maxima is nor a VQ, nor a VE. Must our loathing of high technology be used to make one self feel better? LOL.

Darkside of Maxima modding soon to be revealed to ya'll by me?

















Don't count on it.

 

The beam axle isn't ideal, but it does get the job done. It can get a little frantic in a bump turn, but you've got to remember that this isn't a "live axle" (ie rwd). When you hit a bump with a beam axled fwd car, the rear end doesn't step out. Most road courses don't have potholes or ruts in the turns. The beam axle should be entirely fine for road racing. I've pushed my Max pretty hard into some bumpy turns and I never felt out of control. My 94 Z28, on the otherhand.

As far as I remember, the quickest mag time for the VE was along the lines of 15.5@91mph by MT, 6.7 0-60. The 95 SE in MT went 15.2@92mph, 6.6 0-60. Members within this org seem to post quicker and faster numbers with the modded NA VQs over the modded VEs. I believe Matt93SE best was a 15.0 around 92mph. He had a CAI, advanced timing, lightened flywheel and the typical track prep (gutted trunk). It was his first time racing this particular SE. He did quite well. For comparison, I was running 14.7s@95mph that day at the track. I believe our 60 foots were pretty close to one another, 2.3s.

As for weight, here's mine: 96 SE, 5 speed, Bose, full leather, power seat, moonroof, 1/2 tank gas, spare = 2,945lbs. My registration lists the car at 3002lbs. This makes sense assuming I had a little more gas, and the stock exhaust (an extra 20lbs or so).


Dave