Streetzlegend goes to the darkside (3.5!)
You know, I think that'll buff right out.....
Seriously, that sux. Have you looked at the inside of the engine yet? I had a nitrous backfire on the last 3.0 I had, and the entire side of a piston was melted away.... and blew the screen on the MAF into the Ingen air filter - and it was wadded up into a ball.. Truly weird.
Do you suppose this nitrous stuff is really dangerous to use?
Seriously, that sux. Have you looked at the inside of the engine yet? I had a nitrous backfire on the last 3.0 I had, and the entire side of a piston was melted away.... and blew the screen on the MAF into the Ingen air filter - and it was wadded up into a ball.. Truly weird.
Do you suppose this nitrous stuff is really dangerous to use?
LOL
Nah I havent torn the heads off yet because am using the drivetrain to mock up the turbo stuff. Im pretty sure the cyl walls are ruined though #1 piston looked like someone took a ball peen hammer to it & there were pools of oil on each intake valve. Yeah the backfire bent the pftb plate 180 & blew out 1 of the maf screens.
Nah. nitrous is safe its the user that is dangerous.lol
Nah I havent torn the heads off yet because am using the drivetrain to mock up the turbo stuff. Im pretty sure the cyl walls are ruined though #1 piston looked like someone took a ball peen hammer to it & there were pools of oil on each intake valve. Yeah the backfire bent the pftb plate 180 & blew out 1 of the maf screens.
Nah. nitrous is safe its the user that is dangerous.lol
Nitrous is bad... Mmmkay?
No seriously...
I have seen too many things go wrong with good ole "NOS". Ive seen people run it for years without a problem. Ive seen people blow their stuff up on the first hit. I'd rather go lean on boost or N/A before I go lean on N2O. Whats especially dangerous is the folks who insist on heating their bottles up using torches. Remember this http://www.enhancedhealth.com/nitrousexpress.htm ???
Ouch... anyway... Carry on!
No seriously...
I have seen too many things go wrong with good ole "NOS". Ive seen people run it for years without a problem. Ive seen people blow their stuff up on the first hit. I'd rather go lean on boost or N/A before I go lean on N2O. Whats especially dangerous is the folks who insist on heating their bottles up using torches. Remember this http://www.enhancedhealth.com/nitrousexpress.htm ???
Ouch... anyway... Carry on!
Last edited by jaydubb; Apr 5, 2009 at 06:10 PM.
In every nitrous incident I've heard about, it ALWAYS stems from the user doing something wrong. Nitrous is safe to use if you do it properly.
My goal is not to break anything while I'm making my car go fast.
My goal is not to break anything while I'm making my car go fast.
LOL! That is true! So true!
I dont hate Nitorus. I would even consider running it. But freak accidents happen. With N2O and FI. I know someone who had their BRAND NEW Walbro FP decide to die during a N2O pass. Poor engine.
Sure that kinda thing can happen with FI but with N2O, it happens SO FAST that you usually dont have time to shut down the N2O before damage occurs.
If I was running N2O, I would have a low fuel pressure safety switch, low oil pressure saftey switch, a WOT switch (unless its a 5.5 gen and above), RPM window switch(es), progressive controller (if available), bottle warmer, etc.
I know all of that sounds expensive but in my opinion, its worth it since the object is to prevent/lessen engine damage should something go wrong.
Didnt mean to change the topic of the thread... Sorry.
I dont hate Nitorus. I would even consider running it. But freak accidents happen. With N2O and FI. I know someone who had their BRAND NEW Walbro FP decide to die during a N2O pass. Poor engine.
Sure that kinda thing can happen with FI but with N2O, it happens SO FAST that you usually dont have time to shut down the N2O before damage occurs.
If I was running N2O, I would have a low fuel pressure safety switch, low oil pressure saftey switch, a WOT switch (unless its a 5.5 gen and above), RPM window switch(es), progressive controller (if available), bottle warmer, etc.
I know all of that sounds expensive but in my opinion, its worth it since the object is to prevent/lessen engine damage should something go wrong.
Didnt mean to change the topic of the thread... Sorry.
LOL! That is true! So true!
I dont hate Nitorus. I would even consider running it. But freak accidents happen. With N2O and FI. I know someone who had their BRAND NEW Walbro FP decide to die during a N2O pass. Poor engine.
Sure that kinda thing can happen with FI but with N2O, it happens SO FAST that you usually dont have time to shut down the N2O before damage occurs.
If I was running N2O, I would have a low fuel pressure safety switch, low oil pressure saftey switch, a WOT switch (unless its a 5.5 gen and above), RPM window switch(es), progressive controller (if available), bottle warmer, etc.
I know all of that sounds expensive but in my opinion, its worth it since the object is to prevent/lessen engine damage should something go wrong.
Didnt mean to change the topic of the thread... Sorry.
I dont hate Nitorus. I would even consider running it. But freak accidents happen. With N2O and FI. I know someone who had their BRAND NEW Walbro FP decide to die during a N2O pass. Poor engine.
Sure that kinda thing can happen with FI but with N2O, it happens SO FAST that you usually dont have time to shut down the N2O before damage occurs.
If I was running N2O, I would have a low fuel pressure safety switch, low oil pressure saftey switch, a WOT switch (unless its a 5.5 gen and above), RPM window switch(es), progressive controller (if available), bottle warmer, etc.
I know all of that sounds expensive but in my opinion, its worth it since the object is to prevent/lessen engine damage should something go wrong.
Didnt mean to change the topic of the thread... Sorry.
..
LOL! That is true! So true!
I dont hate Nitorus. I would even consider running it. But freak accidents happen. With N2O and FI. I know someone who had their BRAND NEW Walbro FP decide to die during a N2O pass. Poor engine.
Sure that kinda thing can happen with FI but with N2O, it happens SO FAST that you usually dont have time to shut down the N2O before damage occurs.
If I was running N2O, I would have a low fuel pressure safety switch, low oil pressure saftey switch, a WOT switch (unless its a 5.5 gen and above), RPM window switch(es), progressive controller (if available), bottle warmer, etc.
I know all of that sounds expensive but in my opinion, its worth it since the object is to prevent/lessen engine damage should something go wrong.
Didnt mean to change the topic of the thread... Sorry.
I dont hate Nitorus. I would even consider running it. But freak accidents happen. With N2O and FI. I know someone who had their BRAND NEW Walbro FP decide to die during a N2O pass. Poor engine.
Sure that kinda thing can happen with FI but with N2O, it happens SO FAST that you usually dont have time to shut down the N2O before damage occurs.
If I was running N2O, I would have a low fuel pressure safety switch, low oil pressure saftey switch, a WOT switch (unless its a 5.5 gen and above), RPM window switch(es), progressive controller (if available), bottle warmer, etc.
I know all of that sounds expensive but in my opinion, its worth it since the object is to prevent/lessen engine damage should something go wrong.
Didnt mean to change the topic of the thread... Sorry.
That's also why I like the wet shot for the Maxima. It doesn't strain your injectors. And if an injector dies or if you hit the rev limiter, you may still be able to keep your engine. But if the fuel pump dies without a cheap $40 fuel pressure cutoff switch, then you are in trouble. I don't have one, but I haven't done too much nitrous testing. I've only gone through a few bottles with the 75 shot at a safe AFR. Also, if your fuel solenoid fails to open, that's where the AFR safety switch comes in handy. That's what I plan on having. And it also is a good idea to take apart your solenoids every now and then to inspect them. It's very cheap and easy to replace the teflon seal in the solenoids and make sure there isn't any debris caught in there that could make a solenoid stick open. That's why I have an inline nitrous filter that I take apart to inspect and clean often.
Just know that you're taking a chance with nitrous if you don't have all the safety measures taken. But you shouldn't have to break your engine in order to spray 150+ shot. If the engine can handle the large amount of sudden torque and stress and you have all the safety measures taken that I mentioned above, your engine may last for quite a while even when something does fail.
Just know that you're taking a chance with nitrous if you don't have all the safety measures taken. But you shouldn't have to break your engine in order to spray 150+ shot. If the engine can handle the large amount of sudden torque and stress and you have all the safety measures taken that I mentioned above, your engine may last for quite a while even when something does fail.
On my 3.5, I sprayed a combined 175-shot more than once when my fuel delivery system was having a mysterious problem, showing over 18:1 A/F on the PLX, and the only damage was a shattered plug insulator. If I did that to a 3.0, there would be major damage - in my experience.
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Yes, it will live. Incidentally, the 3.5 is much more forgiving of nitrous abuse than the 3.0 - in my experience.
On my 3.5, I sprayed a combined 175-shot more than once when my fuel delivery system was having a mysterious problem, showing over 18:1 A/F on the PLX, and the only damage was a shattered plug insulator. If I did that to a 3.0, there would be major damage - in my experience.
.
On my 3.5, I sprayed a combined 175-shot more than once when my fuel delivery system was having a mysterious problem, showing over 18:1 A/F on the PLX, and the only damage was a shattered plug insulator. If I did that to a 3.0, there would be major damage - in my experience.
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well my 3.0 lived through one of those times when the fuel pump decided not to flow when i was spraying a 100 shot. i killed two plugs, the center cylinders on both banks. it scared the crap out of me, because i had just shifted into third, the car sputtered, i let out pushed the clutch in and the car died. wouldn't restart for about 15 minutes. car still runs today, but i no longer have the nitrous kit. that incident didn't scare me away from nitrous, because it was my fault for not double checking my fuel pressure. i love nitrous. i'm going to use it on the mustang i build. trying for high 11's on motor with a 351, and then plan on using either a 150 shot or 200 shot to get to mid 10's. should be fun.
But:
"if you ain't breakin' sumthin', you ain't racin', boy"
Senior Member
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 763
From: Oklahoma City, OK
grey he's just ****ing with me, my first name is harold, but i go by blake.
also i know about breaking stuff. i'm on my second motor, third trans, third clutch, second set of axles, and a lot of small parts that i seem to never throw away even though they are bad. oh and none of big stuff i replaced was because of nitrous, that all happened on motor.
also i know about breaking stuff. i'm on my second motor, third trans, third clutch, second set of axles, and a lot of small parts that i seem to never throw away even though they are bad. oh and none of big stuff i replaced was because of nitrous, that all happened on motor.
you guys have sabotaged my thread lol. speaking of nitrous, as some of you know I was a big fan of nitrous and still am, I abused the crap out of it when i had it, didnt even have a wideband back then and never had any issues. Only knocking (back then i just thought i was going over rocks and was hitting my firewall lol), when i went boost i realized the sound i heared was knocking/pinging lol, yet the engine still managed to handle 2 years of boost plus nitrous the 1st year, and even at 15psi putting mid 300's in hp. Im a big fan of the 3.0 as far as abuse, never failed on me, except for the blowby which even with major blowby smoking everywhere it will still pull very hard on 15psi, but going with the 3.5 was a no brainer considering there are way more options for internals and anything actually. for the 3.0 its harder to come across parts.
WOT switch, working fuel pump, proper jetting, and proper bottle pressure is key. I dont believe in the fuel pressure switch, if there is a sudden drop in fuel pressure while your spraying 100shot, you most likely already did damage. Thats from my experience as I never had that problem, I did however open the bottle once and noticed the nitrous solenoid was stuck open (good thing car was off), thats when i took it all out and sold the kit to get more boost stuff
WOT switch, working fuel pump, proper jetting, and proper bottle pressure is key. I dont believe in the fuel pressure switch, if there is a sudden drop in fuel pressure while your spraying 100shot, you most likely already did damage. Thats from my experience as I never had that problem, I did however open the bottle once and noticed the nitrous solenoid was stuck open (good thing car was off), thats when i took it all out and sold the kit to get more boost stuff
Detonation damage does occur quickly. But, if you start losing fuel pressure, it will kill the nitrous before you go too lean. Without a fuel pressure safety switch, you would have stayed in it for several more seconds before you noticed your wideband reading lean. I don't know how you don't like fuel pressure safety switches. There aren't any negative aspects to it.
Detonation damage does occur quickly. But, if you start losing fuel pressure, it will kill the nitrous before you go too lean. Without a fuel pressure safety switch, you would have stayed in it for several more seconds before you noticed your wideband reading lean. I don't know how you don't like fuel pressure safety switches. There aren't any negative aspects to it.
Im waiting for the machine shop owner to come back next monday to turn in my block and parts to get balanced, redecked and file fit the rings.
yea, only if my damn car was running already. so freaking anxious to get the thing running. tomorrow HOPEFULLY i turn in the engine and parts to be balanced. its been sitting in a backyard like a month
just be patient streetz, you'll be up and running in no time.
No updates yet, its going to take to next week to get the engine hopefully.
I had a question, since I will have a lower compression, my tune is still that of when I took out the broken motor, maf, everything is same except the short block with lower compression. Will my a/f be lean, or rich once i turn it on with the new block? (obviously im going to retune it, but just curiosity on how comp will affect a/f). My logic tells me it will be leaner, because there will be more air with every stroke, but, more air will mean the maf will also be picking up on it making the ecu compensate for the new amount of air, so this means it will probably be the same a/f (out of boost) as with 10.5:1 compression? my new comp is 8.8:1
I had a question, since I will have a lower compression, my tune is still that of when I took out the broken motor, maf, everything is same except the short block with lower compression. Will my a/f be lean, or rich once i turn it on with the new block? (obviously im going to retune it, but just curiosity on how comp will affect a/f). My logic tells me it will be leaner, because there will be more air with every stroke, but, more air will mean the maf will also be picking up on it making the ecu compensate for the new amount of air, so this means it will probably be the same a/f (out of boost) as with 10.5:1 compression? my new comp is 8.8:1
No updates yet, its going to take to next week to get the engine hopefully.
I had a question, since I will have a lower compression, my tune is still that of when I took out the broken motor, maf, everything is same except the short block with lower compression. Will my a/f be lean, or rich once i turn it on with the new block? (obviously im going to retune it, but just curiosity on how comp will affect a/f). My logic tells me it will be leaner, because there will be more air with every stroke, but, more air will mean the maf will also be picking up on it making the ecu compensate for the new amount of air, so this means it will probably be the same a/f (out of boost) as with 10.5:1 compression? my new comp is 8.8:1
I had a question, since I will have a lower compression, my tune is still that of when I took out the broken motor, maf, everything is same except the short block with lower compression. Will my a/f be lean, or rich once i turn it on with the new block? (obviously im going to retune it, but just curiosity on how comp will affect a/f). My logic tells me it will be leaner, because there will be more air with every stroke, but, more air will mean the maf will also be picking up on it making the ecu compensate for the new amount of air, so this means it will probably be the same a/f (out of boost) as with 10.5:1 compression? my new comp is 8.8:1
TUNE TUNE TUNE!
You will definately have to retune. I dont know if its gonna be rich or lean (My guess would be rich... maybe bcuz the less compression=less cylinder pressure during power stroke=less fuel burned maybe?) but I do know your timing map will DEFINATELY need to be done over. Since you are lowering compression, you must intend on running higher boost (8.8:1... 15 tp 20 psi maybe?), which will require more fuel, new timing curve, etc.
TUNE TUNE TUNE!
TUNE TUNE TUNE!
What are you using for fuel/timing control?
Im not 100% up to speed on your car. I dont know much about Emanage (I come from the domestic world and yes, I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night... LOL ).
You are intercooled, right? My GTP has 17* of timing at full tilt (Iron heads, Eaton M90 blower, non-intercooled, 8.5:1 compression ratio, pump gas) and not a hint of KR (knock retard). The GTP's cylinder heads dont flow anywhere near what the VQ35 heads flow. And this thing STILL has stock cast-iron exhaust manifolds.
If you're intercooled, you should be able to give it more timing. 2 extra degrees is NOTHING considering you've lowered the compression ratio. I dont know what the compressor map for that turbo looks like but Im assuming that at 15 psi, you're in that 70% efficiency island.
With better heads and a more efficient engine, you should be able to add a wee bit more timing. An efficient engine needs less timing advance to make power.
Again, Im not familiar with the VQ35. I just drive one (slightly modded). Im sure the more experienced VQ35 guys will chime in and correct me...
Oh OK.
Im not 100% up to speed on your car. I dont know much about Emanage (I come from the domestic world and yes, I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night... LOL ).
You are intercooled, right? My GTP has 17* of timing at full tilt (Iron heads, Eaton M90 blower, non-intercooled, 8.5:1 compression ratio, pump gas) and not a hint of KR (knock retard). The GTP's cylinder heads dont flow anywhere near what the VQ35 heads flow. And this thing STILL has stock cast-iron exhaust manifolds.
If you're intercooled, you should be able to give it more timing. 2 extra degrees is NOTHING considering you've lowered the compression ratio. I dont know what the compressor map for that turbo looks like but Im assuming that at 15 psi, you're in that 70% efficiency island.
With better heads and a more efficient engine, you should be able to add a wee bit more timing. An efficient engine needs less timing advance to make power.
Again, Im not familiar with the VQ35. I just drive one (slightly modded). Im sure the more experienced VQ35 guys will chime in and correct me...
Im not 100% up to speed on your car. I dont know much about Emanage (I come from the domestic world and yes, I did stay at a Holiday Inn Express last night... LOL ).
You are intercooled, right? My GTP has 17* of timing at full tilt (Iron heads, Eaton M90 blower, non-intercooled, 8.5:1 compression ratio, pump gas) and not a hint of KR (knock retard). The GTP's cylinder heads dont flow anywhere near what the VQ35 heads flow. And this thing STILL has stock cast-iron exhaust manifolds.
If you're intercooled, you should be able to give it more timing. 2 extra degrees is NOTHING considering you've lowered the compression ratio. I dont know what the compressor map for that turbo looks like but Im assuming that at 15 psi, you're in that 70% efficiency island.
With better heads and a more efficient engine, you should be able to add a wee bit more timing. An efficient engine needs less timing advance to make power.
Again, Im not familiar with the VQ35. I just drive one (slightly modded). Im sure the more experienced VQ35 guys will chime in and correct me...
btw, thanx for the link you sent me, i will look into it.
Yea it is intercooled, as with the timing, I am going to go by what nealoc has shown me and couple others, make power with boost, not timing nor lean a/f. basically I am going to run a conservative timing (about 13-15, not too low cuz then EGT's go up), and make up for it with boost. This is my first built engine and I want to be as careful as possible keeping it well tuned. yea that turbo at 15psi is pretty darn efficient, I think at 20psi or so its when it starts reaching its limits (i believe so). I do have the option to increase the timing alot more, since I have meth/water injection as well, but I really dont want to depend on the injection for this engine. Although it never failed on me with my previous engine, I want to have a reliable setup and not depend on liquids for now, perhaps when I try to run a high boost dyno, then ill spray it, or on a high boost track run.
btw, thanx for the link you sent me, i will look into it.
btw, thanx for the link you sent me, i will look into it.
UPDATE! Kinda, got my engine back, need to have one more set of rings file fitted because Wiseco gave me one wrong set. but everything else is done. Balanced, Resurfaced, rods and pins installed. Oh and it was also re-honed. Pics below:
Lookin good! The shop didn't assemble the short block for you? I thought you bad it bored out. I could be wrong...lot of 3.5 work going on around here now.
Nah, im going to assemble it myself. I did have it bored out, but the guy that did rest of the work didnt like how the honing wsa done, said it will give me a problem breaking in my rings, so he rehoned it