Conversation with a Camry 5spd Guy
12-28-2000, 07:37 PM
#83
Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 79
guys guys guys, there is no need to get upset. However i am happy to see you all sorting this out.
I have wathed the progress of this post and i thought its time to add what i have experienced on the roads, cause thats where it really matters.
I have raced three camry's(all stock vs stock)in my 95max. I'd have to say they all whent very differently. two of the three were easy victories (both at highway speeds) however when i raced one of the line, we were neck and neck up untill about 80mph where i started pulling.
The fact of the matter is that cars arent all the same. ( and different cars have different strong points)
I recently had a ride in my friends camry and i have to say i was impressed. It gives a smooth ride and the tranny is very good.
It is by no means impossibel for a "quick" camry to beat an ordinary max.
however i think that the 14.9 1/4 mile is pretty out there, though not impossible ,with A VERY GOOD LAUNCH.
i actually ran a flat 12 with an intake and cat back. (hehehe)
I have wathed the progress of this post and i thought its time to add what i have experienced on the roads, cause thats where it really matters.
I have raced three camry's(all stock vs stock)in my 95max. I'd have to say they all whent very differently. two of the three were easy victories (both at highway speeds) however when i raced one of the line, we were neck and neck up untill about 80mph where i started pulling.
The fact of the matter is that cars arent all the same. ( and different cars have different strong points)
I recently had a ride in my friends camry and i have to say i was impressed. It gives a smooth ride and the tranny is very good.
It is by no means impossibel for a "quick" camry to beat an ordinary max.
however i think that the 14.9 1/4 mile is pretty out there, though not impossible ,with A VERY GOOD LAUNCH.
i actually ran a flat 12 with an intake and cat back. (hehehe)
12-29-2000, 12:26 AM
#84
Member
Join Date: Dec 2000
Location: RI
Posts: 110
Hmm
"I doubt the Camry's powertrain is more efficient.. the basic design is virtually identical to the Maxima's. It's scary how similar these two cars really are.
I think the Camry's engine just makes slightly more power. Probably because of the higher compression ratio. (10.5:1 versus 10.0:1.)"
I've been doing some research on drivetrain efficiency lately. It seems that the japanese 4 cylinder FWD coupes seem to run 11% parasitic loss, based on dynoed power vs net hp. http://edmunds.com/edweb/editorial/f...er/toyota.html
That Celica GT-S looses only 12%. Pretty low. What is important for these dyno runs (you may know this) is to perform them in the 1:1 gear (4th for the maxima). Does your 160 wheel hp number reflect a run in 4th, or another gear? Note that other gears will be less efficient.
Even the 328i is at 15%, and that's RWD: http://edmunds.com/edweb/editorial/f...power/bmw.html
Perhaps there are two general numbers - fwd and rwd (manual), and anybody under the number (percentage power loss) has conservatively rated their engine. Those above are a bit optimistic. Is this possible?
Interestingly, the Focus ZX3 has fairly "poor" drivetrain efficiency (21% loss). Perhaps this is due to Ford's slight over-rating of the net HP. http://edmunds.com/edweb/editorial/f...ower/ford.html
Taking this new information into account, that would simply suggest that the Camry's apparently more efficient drivetrain means it's actually just developing a bit more HP than the Maxima. It is entirely possible that they are the same efficiency...
I think the Camry's engine just makes slightly more power. Probably because of the higher compression ratio. (10.5:1 versus 10.0:1.)"
I've been doing some research on drivetrain efficiency lately. It seems that the japanese 4 cylinder FWD coupes seem to run 11% parasitic loss, based on dynoed power vs net hp. http://edmunds.com/edweb/editorial/f...er/toyota.html
That Celica GT-S looses only 12%. Pretty low. What is important for these dyno runs (you may know this) is to perform them in the 1:1 gear (4th for the maxima). Does your 160 wheel hp number reflect a run in 4th, or another gear? Note that other gears will be less efficient.
Even the 328i is at 15%, and that's RWD: http://edmunds.com/edweb/editorial/f...power/bmw.html
Perhaps there are two general numbers - fwd and rwd (manual), and anybody under the number (percentage power loss) has conservatively rated their engine. Those above are a bit optimistic. Is this possible?
Interestingly, the Focus ZX3 has fairly "poor" drivetrain efficiency (21% loss). Perhaps this is due to Ford's slight over-rating of the net HP. http://edmunds.com/edweb/editorial/f...ower/ford.html
Taking this new information into account, that would simply suggest that the Camry's apparently more efficient drivetrain means it's actually just developing a bit more HP than the Maxima. It is entirely possible that they are the same efficiency...
12-29-2000, 02:06 AM
#85
Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 79
hey dude, you say you are running mobil 1, is that the 103 ron plane fuel?? if it is then be carefull because u probably dont have a cat anymore, that fuel burns out your cat!!!! Anyway u probably new that.
12-29-2000, 09:25 AM
#86
Member
Join Date: Nov 2000
Posts: 281
Camrys and Maximas..the drama continues!! :D
Damn i thought this thread was over with already..
So if Tiems car is magically faster how come we both have gotten 14.9s (his bone stock mine slightly modded) Like Andi said, the differences are so small that anything can change the equation.
Like i have a carbon fiber hood, but i'm six 2 and weigh 255 lbs so a smaller driver still has an advantage. My car isnt as light as Tiems either, mine is the LE and it weighs 3,175 lbs stock ( probably more since i have side airbags ) I still got a 14.9 with an intake as the only engine mod.
Maybe my next mod will be the Atkins Diet!!
And you guys need to stop quoting magazines times. In one mag they had supercharged solaras getting 15.0 and in another 14.5! And there are still kids out there getting better times than both with equal mods.
So if Tiems car is magically faster how come we both have gotten 14.9s (his bone stock mine slightly modded) Like Andi said, the differences are so small that anything can change the equation.
Like i have a carbon fiber hood, but i'm six 2 and weigh 255 lbs so a smaller driver still has an advantage. My car isnt as light as Tiems either, mine is the LE and it weighs 3,175 lbs stock ( probably more since i have side airbags ) I still got a 14.9 with an intake as the only engine mod.
Maybe my next mod will be the Atkins Diet!!
And you guys need to stop quoting magazines times. In one mag they had supercharged solaras getting 15.0 and in another 14.5! And there are still kids out there getting better times than both with equal mods.
11-30-2002, 03:43 PM
#87
This's an interesting thread...my 1st time reading it (sorry for bringing it back). My friend has a 99 Camry LE v6 auto with lightweight 17" rims. I'm still all bare-bone stock in terms of performance and handling. When we're done with finals, hopefully he'll join the SoCal max people over @ Fontana.
Jae
Jae
12-01-2002, 12:16 AM
#88
Senior Member
Join Date: Aug 2000
Posts: 2,807
This is an illegal use of archiving 
.
You =
. You =
Originally posted by ThurzNite
This's an interesting thread...my 1st time reading it (sorry for bringing it back). My friend has a 99 Camry LE v6 auto with lightweight 17" rims. I'm still all bare-bone stock in terms of performance and handling. When we're done with finals, hopefully he'll join the SoCal max people over @ Fontana.
Jae
This's an interesting thread...my 1st time reading it (sorry for bringing it back). My friend has a 99 Camry LE v6 auto with lightweight 17" rims. I'm still all bare-bone stock in terms of performance and handling. When we're done with finals, hopefully he'll join the SoCal max people over @ Fontana.
Jae
12-01-2002, 01:45 AM
#89
Originally posted by Nismo87SE
I have no doubt that the camry is just as fast as the maxima is. Magazine times aside, both cars are of simular weight, power, gearing, torque. Basically the driver will make the difference. Lets not forget that MT tested a SMX maxima with stillen bolt ons it ran the 1/4 in 15.1 vs the 15.2 of the stock car. Even with the supercharger it still did a 14.4. Also using magazine times for racing instead of as a general idea of what cars run is crazy. I have seen 1/4 times for the 5spd 4th gen from 15.2-15.7 and 15.7-16.5 for auto's. Don't assume just because you see a 15.5 in a magazine that the car will run that all the time. After all only MT was able to get a quicker 1/4 from the 5th gen max vs the other mags. I would even go so far as to say given the same bolt ons my se-r could beat a 4th gen. With just an intake I run even with modded 4th gen 5spds from 1st to 3rd gear. Stock 5spds would see my tail lights.
I have no doubt that the camry is just as fast as the maxima is. Magazine times aside, both cars are of simular weight, power, gearing, torque. Basically the driver will make the difference. Lets not forget that MT tested a SMX maxima with stillen bolt ons it ran the 1/4 in 15.1 vs the 15.2 of the stock car. Even with the supercharger it still did a 14.4. Also using magazine times for racing instead of as a general idea of what cars run is crazy. I have seen 1/4 times for the 5spd 4th gen from 15.2-15.7 and 15.7-16.5 for auto's. Don't assume just because you see a 15.5 in a magazine that the car will run that all the time. After all only MT was able to get a quicker 1/4 from the 5th gen max vs the other mags. I would even go so far as to say given the same bolt ons my se-r could beat a 4th gen. With just an intake I run even with modded 4th gen 5spds from 1st to 3rd gear. Stock 5spds would see my tail lights.
if a 5spd 4th gen runs 15.7, he/she may as well take some driving lessons or get an auto. that is just pathetic.
the fastest stock 4th gen ran 14.7, i'd say average is 15.1, no higher than 15.3 with decent driving.
i went to the track, and none of us (5 maxima's) could get a decent launch, im pretty sure the track was slippery cause of the muscle car burnouts. nevertheless i ran 15.0@93 with a popcharger only, which doesn't do jack **** other than add noise. i know 5hp is good for nothing in the 1/4 mile, 0.1 improvement is even pushing it.
and that run was with a 2.4 60'. so just with a good launch or better tires, i'd be in the 14's.
also, i find camry's to be very similar to maxima's, so stop hating on them. we both have boats, they can't handle if your life depended on it, similar hp, displacement, looks pretty much the same, so just be happy with what you got and try not to put others down. if anything, solve this at the track, where there will be no excuses.
10-27-2003, 06:28 PM
#90
Member
Join Date: Feb 2002
Posts: 120
i gotta comment on this camry thread....
wow very interesting thread. i have the same car as gloks but a 00' v65 speed camry le model loaded with leather.
with a cold air and a greddy exhaust and a trd short shifter i was busting out 14.8's at 92.9 with a 2.2 60 ft.
i am now running a trd superharger at 7psi , ignition, full 3" exhaust , and clutch/flywheel combo. the result? 13.5 at 107.2 all day long with a 2.2 60ft. i dont think thats too bad for a camry.
so i guess you can put me on the list as the third guy to run high 14's with minor mods on a 4th gen camry and now officially the fastest camry in the country trapping out at 107+ with room for improvement. my next car will be a 4th gen max with a 100 shot and 3" exhaust
with a cold air and a greddy exhaust and a trd short shifter i was busting out 14.8's at 92.9 with a 2.2 60 ft.
i am now running a trd superharger at 7psi , ignition, full 3" exhaust , and clutch/flywheel combo. the result? 13.5 at 107.2 all day long with a 2.2 60ft. i dont think thats too bad for a camry.
so i guess you can put me on the list as the third guy to run high 14's with minor mods on a 4th gen camry and now officially the fastest camry in the country trapping out at 107+ with room for improvement. my next car will be a 4th gen max with a 100 shot and 3" exhaust
10-27-2003, 06:33 PM
#91
Guest
Posts: n/a
FASTEST camry in US keep dreaming. Also stop bringing this old crap back. This isn't camry.org...
10-27-2003, 07:22 PM
#94
Dyno plot says I have the most area under the Administrator curve
Join Date: Jul 2001
Posts: 7,060
y'all ought to read this. there's a lot of good information and comparative data in here. 
10-27-2003, 07:35 PM
#96
Junior Member
Join Date: Sep 2002
Posts: 24
I cant believe people are actually argueing over which is faster. I really can't believe I heard Maxima, Camry and fast in the same sentence. Neither one is fast. They are friggin 15 second 1/4 mile family sedans. They are anything but fast. I love my Max, but I am not about to claim its anything more than a slow sedan. Can't even call it a sports sedan, its wrong wheel drive and handles like crap.
This thread is like argueing who would win in a fight, Steven Hawking or Chris Reeves.
This thread is like argueing who would win in a fight, Steven Hawking or Chris Reeves.
10-27-2003, 07:53 PM
#98
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: San Bruno, CA (SF Bay)
Posts: 3,747
chris reeves would wheel over and try to own him, and steven hawking would pull a darth vader and choke him with his mind
10-27-2003, 07:59 PM
#100
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: San Bruno, CA (SF Bay)
Posts: 3,747
Originally Posted by buss95max
maximas are fast
camrys are fast
...how come people on this board, think camrys are slow?...they not..they fast..
camrys are fast
...how come people on this board, think camrys are slow?...they not..they fast..
i have a 98 gxe maxima, as well as a 98 xle camry in my family. the camry has a better stereo and fully leather, and is a torque BEAST. People...its not a slow car, especially when ur sitting around comparing it to a max
10-27-2003, 08:10 PM
#101
Guest
Posts: n/a
This thread is pointless. no matter what, everyone knows that the max is an overall better car than the camry.
Camry is like an *******, anyone out there has 1. people rangin from 15 to 80!
and if u say that ur camry runs 14.9 stock, well then good for u cuz no1 here gives a ****.
id take the max over any camry any day. and as far as the saying goes
M A X I M A. Cars like it: 0
that speaks for itself and its just groovy baby
Camry is like an *******, anyone out there has 1. people rangin from 15 to 80!
and if u say that ur camry runs 14.9 stock, well then good for u cuz no1 here gives a ****.
id take the max over any camry any day. and as far as the saying goes
M A X I M A. Cars like it: 0
that speaks for itself and its just groovy baby
10-27-2003, 08:15 PM
#102
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: San Bruno, CA (SF Bay)
Posts: 3,747
Originally Posted by DoGGy
This thread is pointless. no matter what, everyone knows that the max is an overall better car than the camry.
10-27-2003, 08:17 PM
#103
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by SXN
bs... everyone knows that? i tend to disagree. i think in my case, its equal to my car, and in its nicer trim, my xle is a much nicer car than my gxe
LOL ur comparing the topped out camry with the base model max?
yea i drove a gxe few days ago and i couldnt believe that there is soooooooo much difference between a 99 GXE and my topped out 98 se
10-27-2003, 08:18 PM
#104
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: San Bruno, CA (SF Bay)
Posts: 3,747
obviously u didnt read that too well. i think in its lesser state its an equal, then topped out camry is by far better
10-27-2003, 08:20 PM
#105
Guest
Posts: n/a
sorry but camry is just one of those cars that i hate the most. 
10-27-2003, 08:24 PM
#106
Supporting Maxima.org Member
Join Date: Jul 2003
Location: San Bruno, CA (SF Bay)
Posts: 3,747
Originally Posted by DoGGy
sorry but camry is just one of those cars that i hate the most.
10-27-2003, 08:26 PM
#107
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by SXN
also, the maxima models change, but the 98 engines are the same, and the camry is pretty torquey and fast. dont get me wrong, i chose the max over the camry when given the option. i personally hate all those oceans of new mustangs, especially base model v6 ones, or the stupid auto GTs and stupid
1234
10-27-2003, 08:29 PM
#108
Supporting Maxima.org Member
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Join Date: Mar 2003
Location: Beaverton, Oregon
Posts: 735
Originally Posted by DoGGy
This thread is pointless. no matter what, everyone knows that the max is an overall better car than the camry.
Camry is like an *******, anyone out there has 1. people rangin from 15 to 80!
and if u say that ur camry runs 14.9 stock, well then good for u cuz no1 here gives a ****.
id take the max over any camry any day. and as far as the saying goes
M A X I M A. Cars like it: 0
that speaks for itself and its just groovy baby
Camry is like an *******, anyone out there has 1. people rangin from 15 to 80!
and if u say that ur camry runs 14.9 stock, well then good for u cuz no1 here gives a ****.
id take the max over any camry any day. and as far as the saying goes
M A X I M A. Cars like it: 0
that speaks for itself and its just groovy baby
10-27-2003, 08:31 PM
#109
Guest
Posts: n/a
Originally Posted by kenji
other than us enthusiast maxima owners, the maxima holds the same demographics as a camry, 80 year old ladies included.
ture but there are still 3 times more camry's out there than max's.
10-27-2003, 11:48 PM
#110
Originally Posted by gLok
Well i was gonna leave this site alone but now.....
Most of you are tired of hearing about camrys but its your guys that keep bringing it up, not us!
Tiems car is the ligher CE, mine is the slightly heavier LE (3,175 lbs) and i have run 14s with very little mods. Why is it so hard to believe. Do you think maximas are the only cars that are fast? You just cant swallow it that a camry is as fast as a maximuh huh?
I like maximuhs they are my favorite competition...I wish all you trash talkers lived in my area so we could have a friendly race and settle this petty ****ing contest.
Hey also, you believe everything magazines say?
Now thats comedy!
Most of you are tired of hearing about camrys but its your guys that keep bringing it up, not us!
Tiems car is the ligher CE, mine is the slightly heavier LE (3,175 lbs) and i have run 14s with very little mods. Why is it so hard to believe. Do you think maximas are the only cars that are fast? You just cant swallow it that a camry is as fast as a maximuh huh?
I like maximuhs they are my favorite competition...I wish all you trash talkers lived in my area so we could have a friendly race and settle this petty ****ing contest.
Hey also, you believe everything magazines say?
Now thats comedy!
10-27-2003, 11:51 PM
#111
WTF?!?! Stop arguing about subjects that you know nothing about. Glock and Tiem know their shat.
Originally Posted by meccanoble
for one, the lightest maxima is lighter than the lightest camry. Number 2, although the maxima isnt the fastest 4 door sedan out there, through experience of racing and actual seen time slips, we have more than reason to believe that the maxima is faster than the camry. Thirdly we refuse to believe that a "TOYOTA" 4 door sedan can keep up with a maxima. Hands down you'll get pwned.
10-28-2003, 12:00 AM
#113
I have raced a v6 5spd Camry I had Heavy @ss rims and the guys was tuned, Complete Catback sys, cai, and someother mods, Every time We raced he ran the line and I still beat him by atleast 2-4 cars, and My car is Auto. Show us some slips and then I can believe you. Your forgetting about Nealoc, He has all basic Bolt ons, and he runs 13.9 w/o slicks. OBTW does he have a MEVI?
10-28-2003, 12:11 AM
#114
He did post a timeslip.
Originally Posted by Ni_Nos_Maxima
I have raced a v6 5spd Camry I had Heavy @ss rims and the guys was tuned, Complete Catback sys, cai, and someother mods, Every time We raced he ran the line and I still beat him by atleast 2-4 cars, and My car is Auto. Show us some slips and then I can believe you. Your forgetting about Nealoc, He has all basic Bolt ons, and he runs 13.9 w/o slicks. OBTW does he have a MEVI?
10-28-2003, 12:16 AM
#116
You DO know this thread is older than crap and somone dug this stupid thread up from the dead RIGHT? Glok has run a 14.9 with minimal mods and has been around here ALOT longer tthan you. And knows quite a bit more about cars/engines than you also.
Originally Posted by Ni_Nos_Maxima
All I saw was a Box with a X in it, want me to Copy it?
10-28-2003, 12:23 AM
#117
Originally Posted by Jeff92se
WTF?!?! Stop arguing about subjects that you know nothing about. Glock and Tiem know their shat.
but I would think twice before racing one.
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