3rd gen VQ35DE Full ECU Swap Progress Thread
05-12-2009, 06:01 AM
#684
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Congrats Aaron.
After all the hours spent wiring, it is certainly a wonderful feeling turning the key for the first time and having the motor fire right up.
The 4G speed sensor will work fine with the 5.5G cluster. One terminal of the sensor connects to pin 15 on the cluster and the other one should be grounded.
However, the vehicle speed output, from the cluster, is a much higher frequency on the 5.5G than on the 4G.
After all the hours spent wiring, it is certainly a wonderful feeling turning the key for the first time and having the motor fire right up.
The 4G speed sensor will work fine with the 5.5G cluster. One terminal of the sensor connects to pin 15 on the cluster and the other one should be grounded.
However, the vehicle speed output, from the cluster, is a much higher frequency on the 5.5G than on the 4G.
05-12-2009, 06:34 AM
#685
Congrats Aaron.
After all the hours spent wiring, it is certainly a wonderful feeling turning the key for the first time and having the motor fire right up.
The 4G speed sensor will work fine with the 5.5G cluster. One terminal of the sensor connects to pin 15 on the cluster and the other one should be grounded.
However, the vehicle speed output, from the cluster, is a much higher frequency on the 5.5G than on the 4G.
After all the hours spent wiring, it is certainly a wonderful feeling turning the key for the first time and having the motor fire right up.
The 4G speed sensor will work fine with the 5.5G cluster. One terminal of the sensor connects to pin 15 on the cluster and the other one should be grounded.
However, the vehicle speed output, from the cluster, is a much higher frequency on the 5.5G than on the 4G.
Dave, I haven't looked into it yet, but do you think the speed signal coming the cluster won't work for the TCM? That's what I did.
But step one is to get my speedometer working today and the alternator connected and charging the battery.
05-12-2009, 07:04 AM
#686
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It will not "like" any signal it gets from the cluster due to the increased frequency.
I drove around for a few months with a 5.5G cluster installed with a 4G ecu before I started my swap. I had my Auterra hooked up one day and I found that it indicated a speed that was roughly four times what my cluster was showing.
In my case, the only drivability problem it created was a "soft" speed limiter at about 70 mph. If I approached 70 in fifth and slowly tried to accelerate, it would not go any faster. If I backed off to about 65, dropped it into 4th and hammered it, it would sail past 70 and keep accelerating with no problems.
Once I swapped in the 5.5G engine and ecu, that issue disappeared. I attributed it to the difference in the cluster speed signal frequencies.
05-12-2009, 07:15 AM
#688
I do not have a 3G manual, but I thought the TCM derived the vehicle speed from the revolution sensor.
It will not "like" any signal it gets from the cluster due to the increased frequency.
I drove around for a few months with a 5.5G cluster installed with a 4G ecu before I started my swap. I had my Auterra hooked up one day and I found that it indicated a speed that was roughly four times what my cluster was showing.
In my case, the only drivability problem it created was a "soft" speed limiter at about 70 mph. If I approached 70 in fifth and slowly tried to accelerate, it would not go any faster. If I backed off to about 65, dropped it into 4th and hammered it, it would sail past 70 and keep accelerating with no problems.
Once I swapped in the 5.5G engine and ecu, that issue disappeared. I attributed it to the difference in the cluster speed signal frequencies.
It will not "like" any signal it gets from the cluster due to the increased frequency.
I drove around for a few months with a 5.5G cluster installed with a 4G ecu before I started my swap. I had my Auterra hooked up one day and I found that it indicated a speed that was roughly four times what my cluster was showing.
In my case, the only drivability problem it created was a "soft" speed limiter at about 70 mph. If I approached 70 in fifth and slowly tried to accelerate, it would not go any faster. If I backed off to about 65, dropped it into 4th and hammered it, it would sail past 70 and keep accelerating with no problems.
Once I swapped in the 5.5G engine and ecu, that issue disappeared. I attributed it to the difference in the cluster speed signal frequencies.
That's what my DynoScan software is showing and my throttle plate physically appears to be open slightly less than 100%. Did you look at your throttle plate position with your eyes?
05-12-2009, 07:34 AM
#689
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Oh ok thanks. Did you have any issues with the throttle position only being 85% on the Auterra software?
That's what my DynoScan software is showing and my throttle plate physically appears to be open slightly less than 100%. Did you look at your throttle plate position with your eyes?
That's what my DynoScan software is showing and my throttle plate physically appears to be open slightly less than 100%. Did you look at your throttle plate position with your eyes?
I actually hooked up the ecu and my pruned harness to the engine before I even touched the vehicle to make sure everything would work. The throttle plate would open as close to parallel as I could tell by eye when I pressed the pedal to the limit of its travel.
05-12-2009, 07:46 AM
#690
I do not recall ever monitoring TPS with my Auterra. The sampling was so so slow, I always monitored the minimum number of parameters when doing any testing.
I actually hooked up the ecu and my pruned harness to the engine before I even touched the vehicle to make sure everything would work. The throttle plate would open as close to parallel as I could tell by eye when I pressed the pedal to the limit of its travel.
I actually hooked up the ecu and my pruned harness to the engine before I even touched the vehicle to make sure everything would work. The throttle plate would open as close to parallel as I could tell by eye when I pressed the pedal to the limit of its travel.
As for the revolution sensor, the stock VE TCM receives a signal from both the VSS and the Rev sensor. Right now, the rev sensor is connected probably just like it would be stock. The VE Cluster gets the VSS signal first, then sends it to the TCM. That is how I wired it up on my 3rd gen. I let it pass through the 5.5G cluster first. I may have to split the wires and send the VSS signal to the cluster and TCM.
05-12-2009, 07:53 AM
#691
Sick Aaron! Nice work man. And it sounds very stout with the components you have. Get's me excited to see the results of my own build. btw, Maxus is probably going to be out of the question for me this year. Aside from the build not being completed in time, I have so other obligations outside the car realm that I need to tend to.
I'll have to roll over with Darren however at some point to check that beast out.
In for more vids.
I'll have to roll over with Darren however at some point to check that beast out.
In for more vids.
05-12-2009, 08:03 AM
#692
I just uploaded the 1.9 GB High Def 19 minute video. I'm sorry, but I do not have any way to reduce the quality or shorten the video length right now.
This is the video of the real initial startup. Then is the VERY first time I ever turned the engine over!
A very fast internet connection will be needed. If you have a 1.5meg connection, it will probably take you 4-6 hours to download. If you are able to download at 500kb/s, it will only take an hour.
Right click, Save as...
http://www.nwpengineering.com/forum/...20Original.MOV
Edit: I'm sorry guys. I had to take the video down since I was reaching my bandwidth limit. The full video will be available in reduced quality on Youtube sometime tomorrow.
This is the video of the real initial startup. Then is the VERY first time I ever turned the engine over!
A very fast internet connection will be needed. If you have a 1.5meg connection, it will probably take you 4-6 hours to download. If you are able to download at 500kb/s, it will only take an hour.
Right click, Save as...
http://www.nwpengineering.com/forum/...20Original.MOV
Edit: I'm sorry guys. I had to take the video down since I was reaching my bandwidth limit. The full video will be available in reduced quality on Youtube sometime tomorrow.
Last edited by Aaron92SE; 05-12-2009 at 09:17 PM.
05-12-2009, 08:27 AM
#695
Gotcha. Looking at EL-124(2k2), when the speedo doesn't work it is the ABS.
Check page EL-125 on how to test. Jack it up the car and drive it at 12mph and then measure the voltage at pin 15. it should be from 0-5v
Check page EL-125 on how to test. Jack it up the car and drive it at 12mph and then measure the voltage at pin 15. it should be from 0-5v
05-12-2009, 09:39 AM
#697
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The speed sensor is wired the same as on an 01 with TCS (EL-116)
The test is still valid though.
Last edited by eng92; 05-12-2009 at 09:42 AM.
05-12-2009, 09:45 AM
#698
I just got the speedo working and now it shifts into 2nd gear. I just gotta hook up my alternator so I can confidently leave my driveway without the battery dying on me. My battery is weak and very old.
I grounded my 4th gen VSS to the body. The resistance between that ground point I chose and the battery was around 40 ohms (very high). So I just changed that ground point to the intake manifold and it's much better.
But I also found out that b/c I switched cluster face panels, my speedometer sticks between 0mph and 15mph. So, I don't know if I was going fast enough yesterday for the speedo to register or my VSS ground wasn't sufficient. But, I got the tranny to shift into 2nd gear when the front tires were off the ground. It wouldn't shift until around 20-25mph though, even at VERY light throttle. Like Capecadaver mentioned, I don't have a TPS signal going to my TCM and in order to get proper part throttle shifting, it appears I will need this signal.
Thanks Jared for pointing out that the APP signal is similar to the VE TPS signal. I may just use it. I didn't want to research anything last night since I deemed the entire day a success (engine fired up) and I didn't want to do any more research. It was the first evening that I actually relaxed and watched TV in the past 3 months! That's how busy I've been with this 3.5 project lately.
Oh yeah, and last night, I ran up to the gas station and got some fresh 93 octane and dumped it in my tank. Yesterday, when I drove the car, the throttle response was REALLY bad and inconsistent when I gave it a little gas. The gas that was in the tank was from late Sept 08. But when I just now drove my car down the driveway with the fresh gas, it felt a whole lot better. I'll post later after I get a chance to drive the car over 30 mph on the road and see how it shifts without a TPS signal.
I grounded my 4th gen VSS to the body. The resistance between that ground point I chose and the battery was around 40 ohms (very high). So I just changed that ground point to the intake manifold and it's much better.
But I also found out that b/c I switched cluster face panels, my speedometer sticks between 0mph and 15mph. So, I don't know if I was going fast enough yesterday for the speedo to register or my VSS ground wasn't sufficient. But, I got the tranny to shift into 2nd gear when the front tires were off the ground. It wouldn't shift until around 20-25mph though, even at VERY light throttle. Like Capecadaver mentioned, I don't have a TPS signal going to my TCM and in order to get proper part throttle shifting, it appears I will need this signal.
Thanks Jared for pointing out that the APP signal is similar to the VE TPS signal. I may just use it. I didn't want to research anything last night since I deemed the entire day a success (engine fired up) and I didn't want to do any more research. It was the first evening that I actually relaxed and watched TV in the past 3 months! That's how busy I've been with this 3.5 project lately.
Oh yeah, and last night, I ran up to the gas station and got some fresh 93 octane and dumped it in my tank. Yesterday, when I drove the car, the throttle response was REALLY bad and inconsistent when I gave it a little gas. The gas that was in the tank was from late Sept 08. But when I just now drove my car down the driveway with the fresh gas, it felt a whole lot better. I'll post later after I get a chance to drive the car over 30 mph on the road and see how it shifts without a TPS signal.
Last edited by Aaron92SE; 05-12-2009 at 09:48 AM.
05-12-2009, 10:32 AM
#700
I just got the speedo working and now it shifts into 2nd gear. I just gotta hook up my alternator so I can confidently leave my driveway without the battery dying on me. My battery is weak and very old.
I grounded my 4th gen VSS to the body. The resistance between that ground point I chose and the battery was around 40 ohms (very high). So I just changed that ground point to the intake manifold and it's much better.
But I also found out that b/c I switched cluster face panels, my speedometer sticks between 0mph and 15mph. So, I don't know if I was going fast enough yesterday for the speedo to register or my VSS ground wasn't sufficient. But, I got the tranny to shift into 2nd gear when the front tires were off the ground. It wouldn't shift until around 20-25mph though, even at VERY light throttle. Like Capecadaver mentioned, I don't have a TPS signal going to my TCM and in order to get proper part throttle shifting, it appears I will need this signal.
Thanks Jared for pointing out that the APP signal is similar to the VE TPS signal. I may just use it. I didn't want to research anything last night since I deemed the entire day a success (engine fired up) and I didn't want to do any more research. It was the first evening that I actually relaxed and watched TV in the past 3 months! That's how busy I've been with this 3.5 project lately.
Oh yeah, and last night, I ran up to the gas station and got some fresh 93 octane and dumped it in my tank. Yesterday, when I drove the car, the throttle response was REALLY bad and inconsistent when I gave it a little gas. The gas that was in the tank was from late Sept 08. But when I just now drove my car down the driveway with the fresh gas, it felt a whole lot better. I'll post later after I get a chance to drive the car over 30 mph on the road and see how it shifts without a TPS signal.
I grounded my 4th gen VSS to the body. The resistance between that ground point I chose and the battery was around 40 ohms (very high). So I just changed that ground point to the intake manifold and it's much better.
But I also found out that b/c I switched cluster face panels, my speedometer sticks between 0mph and 15mph. So, I don't know if I was going fast enough yesterday for the speedo to register or my VSS ground wasn't sufficient. But, I got the tranny to shift into 2nd gear when the front tires were off the ground. It wouldn't shift until around 20-25mph though, even at VERY light throttle. Like Capecadaver mentioned, I don't have a TPS signal going to my TCM and in order to get proper part throttle shifting, it appears I will need this signal.
Thanks Jared for pointing out that the APP signal is similar to the VE TPS signal. I may just use it. I didn't want to research anything last night since I deemed the entire day a success (engine fired up) and I didn't want to do any more research. It was the first evening that I actually relaxed and watched TV in the past 3 months! That's how busy I've been with this 3.5 project lately.
Oh yeah, and last night, I ran up to the gas station and got some fresh 93 octane and dumped it in my tank. Yesterday, when I drove the car, the throttle response was REALLY bad and inconsistent when I gave it a little gas. The gas that was in the tank was from late Sept 08. But when I just now drove my car down the driveway with the fresh gas, it felt a whole lot better. I'll post later after I get a chance to drive the car over 30 mph on the road and see how it shifts without a TPS signal.
05-12-2009, 09:06 PM
#702
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Congrats buddy. I watched all 20 minutes - it was nice to spend quality time with you finally lol.
... and I thought my exhaust cutout was obnoxious. Will be nice to hear when you have the beast sewn up, and see it hustling down the road... in the next video (hint).
... and I thought my exhaust cutout was obnoxious. Will be nice to hear when you have the beast sewn up, and see it hustling down the road... in the next video (hint).
05-12-2009, 09:11 PM
#703
I didn't drive it to the gas station. I brought 5 gallons to the Maxima. but I did drive it up the road a little bit today. I now have 1.4 miles on the trip odometer.
I didn't go fast enough to shift into OD, but at least I got it to shift into 2nd and 3rd.
05-12-2009, 09:15 PM
#704
Originally Posted by hadman
Congrats buddy. I watched all 20 minutes - it was nice to spend quality time with you finally lol.
... and I thought my exhaust cutout was obnoxious. Will be nice to hear when you have the beast sewn up, and see it hustling down the road... in the next video (hint).
... and I thought my exhaust cutout was obnoxious. Will be nice to hear when you have the beast sewn up, and see it hustling down the road... in the next video (hint).
Thanks a lot. Obnoxious? I am thinking about keeping the open headers all the time. lol It sounds really good in person. But I will start trying to find a capable exhaust shop tomorrow. I will have to do some major cutting of the RH control arm to make room for the Ypipe. I don't care. The engine is running! It's just now starting to sink in after I actually drove it on the street this afternoon. More fun will come tomorrow!
Last edited by Aaron92SE; 05-12-2009 at 09:19 PM.
05-12-2009, 09:22 PM
#705
I've been following this thread for a little while. This is a really cool build! I admire the effort you've put into this. I can't wait to see it all put together. What happened to the vid on your website? I tried downloading it but it says not found on the server.
05-12-2009, 09:41 PM
#706
I took down the 2gb video cause I was reaching the bandwidth limit on the NWP Engineering website. I can't afford that website to go down.
I should have the same full video in reduced quality on YouTube sometime tomorrow.
05-12-2009, 10:00 PM
#707
Here is a quick test drive I took today to make sure the tranny changes gears:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJxVh3J0Gg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJxVh3J0Gg
05-12-2009, 10:16 PM
#708
Here is a quick test drive I took today to make sure the tranny changes gears:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJxVh3J0Gg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJxVh3J0Gg
05-13-2009, 01:18 AM
#710
Here is a quick test drive I took today to make sure the tranny changes gears:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJxVh3J0Gg
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UdJxVh3J0Gg
05-13-2009, 06:14 AM
#711
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Thanks a lot. Obnoxious? I am thinking about keeping the open headers all the time. lol It sounds really good in person. But I will start trying to find a capable exhaust shop tomorrow. I will have to do some major cutting of the RH control arm to make room for the Ypipe. I don't care. The engine is running! It's just now starting to sink in after I actually drove it on the street this afternoon. More fun will come tomorrow!
05-13-2009, 06:21 AM
#712
Haha no. I want to though. I will keep it under 4K rpm for the next 75 miles or so for camshaft break in. And I won't go WOT until I can monitor AFR and have a Ypipe.
That was me blipping the throttle. Instant throttle response!
It shifts by itself in D. Manually shifting does not force it to shift sooner than it normally would. All that will do is hold the shift from happening until you are above the normal shift point.
The tranny feels great. No slipping. I just blipped the throttle just a hair to feel the raw power and to see how fast the engine responds. I have to say, the throttle response is MUCH faster than my VE. It's definitely a pretty mean engine build.
I want to though. I will keep it under 4K rpm for the next 75 miles or so for camshaft break in. And I won't go WOT until I can monitor AFR and have a Ypipe. Instant throttle response!It shifts by itself in D. Manually shifting does not force it to shift sooner than it normally would. All that will do is hold the shift from happening until you are above the normal shift point.
It does sound good at idle. It's actually quite similar sounding to when I have the cutout open, but at high speed it becomes a bit much. Just watched your other video. Good to see you crack a smile. Hey, so what was that sudden spiking sound? It almost sounded like a slipping tranny, but judging by your reaction in the video that doesn't appear to be the case.
05-13-2009, 06:39 AM
#713
You've done a remarkable job. Kudos to you, and Spray It as soon as possible!
.
05-13-2009, 06:53 AM
#714
You gotta love the 3.5 - it's a torque beast compared to any previous Maxima motor. Is the queasy feeling in the pit of your stomach gone yet? There's nothing like the feeling of relief when things start to work right.
You've done a remarkable job. Kudos to you, and Spray It as soon as possible!
.
You've done a remarkable job. Kudos to you, and Spray It as soon as possible!
.
I need to wire up the illumination lighting on the cluster so it comes on when the headlights are on. And I will wire in my high beams light on the cluster as well. All the gear selection indicator lights are wired up too and working.
And just yesterday, I finished wiring the alternator. For some reason, I couldn't get it to charge the battery. I decided to connect the wire for the battery light on the cluster and viola, it started charging!
05-13-2009, 07:25 AM
#715
Thanks. Yesterday when I drove it on the street for the first time, I actually started to smile a little bit. I haven't gotten on the gas or anything. I have no idea what this engine will do at WOT above 4K rpm. I will drive it easy for now though.
I need to wire up the illumination lighting on the cluster so it comes on when the headlights are on. And I will wire in my high beams light on the cluster as well. All the gear selection indicator lights are wired up too and working.
And just yesterday, I finished wiring the alternator. For some reason, I couldn't get it to charge the battery. I decided to connect the wire for the battery light on the cluster and viola, it started charging!
I need to wire up the illumination lighting on the cluster so it comes on when the headlights are on. And I will wire in my high beams light on the cluster as well. All the gear selection indicator lights are wired up too and working.
And just yesterday, I finished wiring the alternator. For some reason, I couldn't get it to charge the battery. I decided to connect the wire for the battery light on the cluster and viola, it started charging!
Your wiring adventures reminded me again why I'll never convert to a later ECU - too many details, too little time. While we're sharing secrets, I found out why my last transmission only lasted 1 1/2 runs at the strip. When changing plugs sometime earlier this spring, I took off the vacuum hose from the MAP solenoid and I accidentally replaced it with a surplus solenoid's (ECU wants it - engine doesn't care) vacuum hose. The MAP sensor pretty much rules the ECU, so I was getting random error codes that didn't make any sense, like Solenoid A and 1105's and the car would occasionally go into SAFE mode and then die on the street. At the track, near as I can remember, on the second pass I made with the full 175-shot engaged, when the car shifted into 2nd gear, it started rev-limiting at 3000 and I rolled through the traps in the 80's. After I left the track and got to the return road, the engine died and I coasted to the timing booth and parked there. The car wouldn't restart - the battery was practically dead, so it was Trailer TIme.
Later at home I figured it out, but the damage was done - the tranny oil smells like burnt pancakes and has no reverse gear. I'll have to replace it - but now all the weird codes are gone. Shizzz happens. Stupid also happens...
05-13-2009, 08:11 AM
#716
It's amazing how a build project like this one will nag at you all the time - you wake up at night wondering if you actually tightened all the head bolts, and other random stuff...
Your wiring adventures reminded me again why I'll never convert to a later ECU - too many details, too little time. While we're sharing secrets, I found out why my last transmission only lasted 1 1/2 runs at the strip. When changing plugs sometime earlier this spring, I took off the vacuum hose from the MAP solenoid and I accidentally replaced it with a surplus solenoid's (ECU wants it - engine doesn't care) vacuum hose. The MAP sensor pretty much rules the ECU, so I was getting random error codes that didn't make any sense, like Solenoid A and 1105's and the car would occasionally go into SAFE mode and then die on the street. At the track, near as I can remember, on the second pass I made with the full 175-shot engaged, when the car shifted into 2nd gear, it started rev-limiting at 3000 and I rolled through the traps in the 80's. After I left the track and got to the return road, the engine died and I coasted to the timing booth and parked there. The car wouldn't restart - the battery was practically dead, so it was Trailer TIme.
Later at home I figured it out, but the damage was done - the tranny oil smells like burnt pancakes and has no reverse gear. I'll have to replace it - but now all the weird codes are gone. Shizzz happens. Stupid also happens...
Your wiring adventures reminded me again why I'll never convert to a later ECU - too many details, too little time. While we're sharing secrets, I found out why my last transmission only lasted 1 1/2 runs at the strip. When changing plugs sometime earlier this spring, I took off the vacuum hose from the MAP solenoid and I accidentally replaced it with a surplus solenoid's (ECU wants it - engine doesn't care) vacuum hose. The MAP sensor pretty much rules the ECU, so I was getting random error codes that didn't make any sense, like Solenoid A and 1105's and the car would occasionally go into SAFE mode and then die on the street. At the track, near as I can remember, on the second pass I made with the full 175-shot engaged, when the car shifted into 2nd gear, it started rev-limiting at 3000 and I rolled through the traps in the 80's. After I left the track and got to the return road, the engine died and I coasted to the timing booth and parked there. The car wouldn't restart - the battery was practically dead, so it was Trailer TIme.
Later at home I figured it out, but the damage was done - the tranny oil smells like burnt pancakes and has no reverse gear. I'll have to replace it - but now all the weird codes are gone. Shizzz happens. Stupid also happens...
05-13-2009, 08:37 AM
#717
New transmission, new engine, probably more "stupid" to come, but hey, it's the journey that counts for me. If I just want a consistent 10-sec street car, I can buy one. - but what fun is that?
.
05-13-2009, 09:00 AM
#718
"What doesn't kill you will make you stronger"... or something like that.
New transmission, new engine, probably more "stupid" to come, but hey, it's the journey that counts for me. If I just want a consistent 10-sec street car, I can buy one. - but what fun is that?
.
New transmission, new engine, probably more "stupid" to come, but hey, it's the journey that counts for me. If I just want a consistent 10-sec street car, I can buy one. - but what fun is that?
.
05-13-2009, 03:25 PM
#720
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I enjoy the opposite. Usually when some Civic or Corolla is riding my bumper in traffic when you clearly can't go any faster, and you try and create that gap to keep traffic moving, and they almost hit your bumper like 10 times because you aren't moving fast enough for them. When that bottle neck opens up... WOT - buh-bye.